I'm curious, how many Redskins games have you seen this year? Mike Shanahan has seen all of them, and he decided to bench McNabb in favor of Rex Grossman. Do you think Henne would be benched for Rex Grossman as well?
Because clearly one coaches decision is representative of all other coaching staffs. Oh wait it's not and Shanny is being ripped by a number of coaching staffs.
You are so full of baloney. They have overall a better receiving corps, especially considering Marshall has played like crap since midseason. Their 3-5 WRs are better and their TE is 10x better receiver. Ocho Cinco is still good WR.
Padre. What are you talking about sir? I don't mean to be rude, but have you watched a single Cinci game this year? Carson Palmer has 18 picks this year and not a single one is from a 15 yd out. Actually if you go back and look at his picks, of the 18, only 3 of his picks are on out patterns. 5 yds. 3 yds. 6yds. If a 5 yd out doesn't fit his style, then he's not an NFL QB. The other 15 have been on deep passes or over the middle. On top of that, he rarely throws these deep out patterns you've mentioned. Cinci's problems start with Palmer. He has a 45-50% completion rate in the first half. In games where they had the lead or within a score he has thrown countless picks and pick 6's. He has single handedly lost games they should have won. He has NO arm strength and terrible accuracy. 12-15 of his 21 TDs are due to the receiver making plays that Dolphins receivers don't. Palmer sucks man. If all you want is a QB who can put up monster numbers late in the game once the other team has given up, he is your man.
WHY WOULD ANYONE WANT THIS? Even if you aren't a Henne guy. Palmer is old, crappy, and will be overpaid. IF WE'RE CUTTING BAIT ON CHAD, FINE. DRAFT SOMEONE AND DON'T GIVE ME ANOTHER BANDAID, DAMMIT!
I've ripped Shanahan's handling of the team as well, and I never implied he was right or wrong. I simply asked, how many Redskins games have you seen this year? Would you been in favor of replacing Henne with Rex Grossman as well?
We already have a younger version of Carson Palmer and his name is Chad Henne. That aside, I can't believe how horrible CP has been this year. You can blame some on the team if you wish, but I have seen some really horrible decision making from Palmer this year. I have no idea what the deal is there, but yikes!!
Last 3 games for Benson: 41 19 49 Is that the centerpiece of the Bengals offense? Better Wr corps? Would you trade Brandon Marshall for Terrel Owens? How about Davone Bess for Jordan Shipley? Te's? Gresham 409 yds 4 tds Fasano 467 4 td's Chad Johnson? 795 yds Hartline 615 yds
Palmer is gone, and I want no part of him on this team. Orton I would look at, but aside from him there is nobody else out there that would upgrade us at QB. Palmer is an interception machine with horrific decision making. He's an older version of Henne. I have no idea why anyone is wanting to try and go down the Daunte Culpepper "attempt to resuscitate a sharply declining vet" road again. I would trade TO's year for Marshalls year without hesitation. Straight up? No, because TO is old and Marshall isn't. Ocho is miles ahead of Hartline. Bess is likely better than Shipley, but Shipley is no slouch. Gresham may not have the stats, but he is a bigger threat and better pass catcher than Fasano can ever hope to be. Benson is better than Ricky or Ronnie.
Eh, gave my reasons already. Shipley is a slouch, Benson is the sum of their running game, they do not split carries the way the dolphins do, and why wouldn't the logic behind gresham apply to Marshall?
If Shipley is a slouch then so is Hartline. Just sayin. Gresham is a playmaker. TO is a playmaker. Ocho is a playmaker. Benson is a playmaker compared to R&R. They have a 4.35 Andre Caldwell who caught 432 yards and 3 TDs in 09, but sees little action b/c he's now buried on their depth chart. Bengals fans don't like Palmer b/c he STINKS UP THE HOUSE now. It's pretty bad when he has tools like these at his disposal yet still can't be effective.
No, Gresham is not a "playmaker" pull your nose out of a "draft scout 2010" report, he doesn't make plays in that offense, Shipley is a slouch, he drops passes, Andre Caldwell could not play for a good team in the NFL. Johnson is a playmaker as play dooh figures are to art. R+R have outproduced Benson and did so easily, what one is missing is Benson "is" the Bengal running game, their second leading rusher has 177 yds.
I would trade Ricky/Ronnie for Benson straight up without hesitation. The problem with their running game is that teams are jumping on them early, forcing them to rely on Palmer, and we see how that is working out for them. Palmer's meltdown is getting a lot of attention. Their defensive woes rival his however. They have been rather terrible and have forced the team away from a control offense like they played last year. Last year the defense was holding more, allowing the offense to run Benson more. Gresham is easily better than Fasano, again I would trade them straight up no question if given the chance somehow. Fasano is what he is at this point. Shipley a slouch? Drops passes? I guess our entire offense is full of slouches then. Shipley has 1 less TD than Bess. Bess has more yards and grabs, but nothing over 40, whereas Shipley has two over 40 yards and the same over 20 and a greater YPC. Not a rocking difference. As for Marshall, he is struggling this year. However his youth makes him more valuable than TO, even though TO is still playing at a high level. Bengals have more and better weapons than we do easily, but because their defense is playing much worse, and their QB's numerous errors, they are struggling. If we want an erratic mistake prone QB, why not stick with Henne and hope he can take a step up for a much cheaper price, than hanging your hat on Culpepper 2.0. Palmer hasn't been a good QB in quite some time, and even with all the weapons, and given chances to win games through the air he is failing badly. I think his peak these days is what he was at last year, playing under a run first, defensive team. Obviously you can argue that that is what we hope to become and thus Palmer is an ideal fit, but at some point you need the QB to win some games, and I don't think Palmer can do that anymore.
Palmer's numbers are on par with his 2009 numbers, he does have more int's 2010, and they won the AFC North in 2009: http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/P/PalmCa00.htm Difference is, in 09 he threw 466 passes all season, in 10 he is at 497 with 3 games to go. Stats wise by comparison, Palmer has had 1 season throwing less than 20 td's where he played the whole yr and that was his rookie season, the Dolphins have not had a single Qb throw for 20 td's since 2001.
Shipley's rookie production with 2 games left: 47 catches, 569 yards, 12.1 YPC, and 2 TDs. Bess's rookie production (entire season): 54 catches, 554 yards, 10.3 YPC, 1 TD. -Tell me you're not trying to use stats to make it seem like Fasano is a better receiving TE than Gresham. lol. Fasano's bags would be packed yesterday if Cincy offered us Gresham in a straight up trade. -AND DEFINITELY please tell me you're not comparing Hartline to one of the most productive WRs of the past decade. -Andre Caldwell had 400+ yards last year and kills anything we have at #4. Marshall can only hope he ends up having a career like TO. Owens is having a Pro Bowl caliber year; Brandon isn't.
Eh, when or if Palmer lands in Miami, do not be surprised. Caldwell is known as a "bust" maybe they sit TO so he can play, and Fasano for Gresham? Does Gresham realize "blocking" does not mean wearing a condom? And as I have pointed out, Palmer's "worst" season would be the best one a Phins Qb has had in terms of TD's since 2001? Oh but never mind that..do not let facts get in the way...
Won the AFC North and then offensively collapsed in the last game and the playoffs against a superior defense. Like I said, you can argue that Palmer could fit on a team that is run first and has a strong defense - you can get to the playoffs with a weak QB these days, but not the SB, your QB is gonna have to win games at some point in the playoffs, and Palmer isn't showing it. This year he has been abysmal despite a better offensive cast than Miami has. His stats this year are all put up in garbage time when teams are playing prevent. If you look at that then your not getting the whole picture. Stat monkeying can only get you so far.
One's memory is fuzzy, the Bengals were one of the teams that laid down for the Jets on their way to the playoffs. Odd, if Palmer is "abysmal" and outperforming Henne, what does that make Chad Henne? Henne has yet to throw more TD's than interceptions in his two years, Palmer has never thrown more int's than td's in about 6 full seasons.
You guys are missing the biggest factor....Palmers OL in Cincy is a joke, he is often hurried into poor throws, Henne sits back in the pocket and makes bad throws. If he is a FA and doesnt want 8+ mill a year then I welcome him with open arms. He is a top 5 TALENT at QB in this league and just needs to GTFO of Cinncy.
Yeah.... keep telling yourself that. I watched Gresham play; I don't need a f****** draft scout report. He was a 1st round pick and one of the top TEs of the past few years for a reason. Just b/c he doesn't "appear" to be a playmaker in that offense with Carson does NOT mean that he's not a playmaker. And by the way, his 47 receptions are 3rd MOST in the NFL for ALL ROOKIES regardless of position (He has 5 fewer than Mike Williams in TB). Fasano has yet to catch over 40 passes, and this is his 5th year in the league.
Call me when Henne throws more TD's than interceptions won't you? Henne should be way past needing a binky, and yet I hear he still does need one, good luck winning games with a Qb throwing for 28 net yds, or a QBR so poor if he had thrown the ball into the field he would have performed better.
He WAS a top 5 talent at QB. NOT ANYMORE. He's damaged goods--- mentally and physically. Nothing about him is the same, and it no longer has anything to do with his protection. He needed to GTFO of Cincy 3 years ago; now it's too late. He's had shoulder problems, a destroyed elbow, a shredded knee, a bad hip, high ankle sprain, injured foot, a broken nose, and a surgically repaired thumb. I don't even know if there are any concussions attached to that list. Palmer is held together by a piece of duct tape and some Hubba-Bubba. He is a waste of money to bring in here. Does anyone not learn from Smiley or Grove? Give me Logan Mankins and a stud at RB instead.
Your right, the Bengals did lay down, for two straight games. One that counted in a major way. As for Henne, he is a second year QB. And frankly I wanted Matt Ryan anyway. I would MUCH rather draft a QB than invest in Palmer. Unless Palmer comes cheap on a short term deal and we still draft a QB in the first then I want nothing to do with him. We have been trying to get by with second round picks and trash FA's ever since Marino left. Just pick a top prospect for once. Carson Palmer, Daunte's Inferno redux. Fine if he is a temp solution while a QB is developed, trouble if he is expected to be "the man."
So basically, you're saying Palmer doesn't suck, he just has a poor supporting cast. You OBVIOUSLY haven't been watching the Bengals this year.
If Henne had Cincy's surrounding cast and wasn't pulled out of the game for the ******ed Wildcat, then he would absolutely have more TDs than INTs. How often has Palmer been pulled out of the game in the redzone for a useless WC play?..... or how about a ridiculous half-back pass for an INT in the endzone?
Nope, my Palmer theory is he is being miscast, his skill set does not match what the Bengals OC is asking him to do. That is based on watching maybe 2 or 3 Bengals games this season out routes to Chad Johnson with the Cb sitting on them, forcing the ball into TO in bracketed coverage when TO did have separation. Stuff like that, toss in a miserable defense and there it is.
Palmer is an upgrade to Henne no question. Gresham IS better than Fasano. Marshall and T.O are similar. Ocho Cinco is more talented than Bess. Hartline is better than Shipley. Cinncy's pass blocking is much worse than Miami's. Ronnie and Cedric are pretty similar. Our OC is slightly worse than Cinncys. Palmer would be the best QB brought iin since Marino, but he isnt worth big $$$ due to his questionable health.
I would love to have the Palmer who played for the Bengals before his leg injury. Unfortunately he has never seemed to fully recover from that injury. He has also been bothered by an arm injury this season. While I don't think Henne is the answer for the Dolphins at QB. Carson Palmer hasn't shown by his play this season he would be much of an improvement for the Dolphins. At the right price. He might be worth the risk. But the Dolphins certainly should not offer him a huge contract to come to Miami.
LMAO. Really? TO is playing out of his mind this year. Their number 2 is better than our number 2 (Ochocinco). Their TE is playing better. The only player who has produced more for us is Bess over Shipley.
So why not fix it with Henne? Both look bad without a running game. Why not use the young cheap one? If both of them have the same problem, fixing them and bringing a QB one year older and still bad isn't going to bring a leap.
None of these Pete Carrol/USC Qbs have been worth a darn in the pro's. The only one that has ever looked passable has been Carson Palmer, but he's been terrible this year. In fact he hasn't looked very good since he got hurt a couple of years back in the playoffs against the Steelers. No, pass on Palmer too.
