Pope Francis wishes Muslims a happy Ramadan

The Pope is a head of state and a chief priest. He represents all Catholics when he reaches out to all Muslims. He has bishops in the hierarchy he heads who are supposed to take care of the problem of pedophile priests. As head of the church, he doesn't get personally involved. He sets policy and gives his bishops marching orders.

His marching orders were to "act decisively" to root out and punish pedophile priests:

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york...ch-punish-pedophile-priests-article-1.1308895

I have a feeling that when the next scandal surfaces, either the priest responsible will find himself with very little support or the bishop will be called to Rome for "consultation."

 

If the next priest suspected pedophilia is not turned over to the police and defrocked when found guilty, then the Church has not yet learned its lesson.

 

This Pope is great IMO so far, exactly the way I believe.....he is cutting cost in the church on all levels, isn't flashy, genuinely cares about everybody, most importantly the poor....RESPECTS all religions....it is nice to see a more sensible, common sense approach to contemporary religion yet keep many of the traditions...

 

Amen, lets hope....

 

The RC is in a bind when it comes to priests as the process to install one takes 6 yrs and it's not as if there is a long line of single men willing to go through what amounts to a Master's education, complete it, then remain celibate for the rest of their lives.

I do think there are many things they can do such as raising the mandatory retirement age, that would make it far easier to boot out priests who transgress such a vital trust.

Other issue is, if the RC is in the forgiveness business, is child molestation unforgivable?

I'd say no, it's not, however that does not mean you keep them in office, it may be forgivable in a Christian sense, but not a Church sense. You can be forgiven, you cannot remain a priest or bishop or hold any office at all.

Basically, it makes them patently unfit to serve God in that capacity.

 

I love you Ohio, but the Catholic Church did not mistake anything. They knew those priests weren't cured, they were just trying to avoid scandal and save the name of the Church instead of its spirit.

 

Cynicism is to Atheism as Optimism is to Christianity.

 

Sorry padre. I say yes, it is.

Someone destroys a child's innocence and leaves them scarred for life, die in a fire.

 

Then no one can be redeemed Pagan, which is why I said what I said.

No one is beyond redemption, not yet.

I'm far from a unicorn and butterfly evangelist, no one is beyond redemption however on the other side one then suffers the consequences in this life for what one does do.

 

For myself OhioP, there will always be a war between the flesh and the higher self, what the classic Church demands of the Clergy virtually guarantees there will be transgressions.

One may have a heart full of love, we also have a body filled with biology.

I've spent more then a few moments sitting next to a youth pastor at a strip club to know of what I speak of on that one.

 

Good thing I'm not God then.

 

I'm not being argumentative, but how do you define redemption in the way you're using it?

 

I find the idea that all sins are equal to be one of the more peculiar tenants of christianity. Particularly, with how unevenly it seems to be applied. You have people in mixed fabric shirts quoting leviticus to denounce homosexuality. For me, there is no question that raping a child is unforgivable. Where as coveting, while unhealthy, isn't that big of a deal.

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Putting ones soul and mind into right relationship to the Divine FinD.

Internally, such a molester can be forgiven, that does not preclude external consequences.

For example, in my neck of the woods a couple took it upon themselves to start killing registered sex offenders in a neighboring county, literally just working down the list.

Such is not unexpected, like the defrocked priest Gaughan being killed while in prison, internally he could have made peace with God, externally is a different matter altogether.

 

They could just as easily quote Romans TT, but Leviticus has more of an old school/harsh wording.

Oddly enough, this pontiff said something along the lines of "who am I to judge gay people" and was a bit surprised it received no attention.

The commandment to forgive really is designed more for the person doing the forgiving then the person being forgiven, the way the mind works when bitterness enters into the mind it poisons everything henceforth.

 

No, I know you don't mean "secular redemption". What I'm asking is how you define redemption from your God?

For example, a convicted pedophile genuinely repents in prison, is redemption for him that he's going to heaven? Or is it he is not going to heaven but he's now ok with it and accepts his fate? Or something else entirely?

Also, Ohio, feel free to jump in here.

 

I chose leviticus because it also has strictures against mixing fabrics. And, I was more referring to all sins being equal under the eyes of god than forgiveness, but I think I should have been clearer. Not that I agree that forgiveness should be universal anyway. I can hate and be happy.



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That's because the church followed his statement up with, "but you're still going to hell." the same day. Which seems kind of judgmental to me.

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ESPECIALLY under the umbrella of a organization that is supposed to be doing EXACTLY the opposite......that makes it even more disgusting...those people arent men of God, they are gross filth put there by something other than God....

 

It would be both, he'd accept his current condition and be redeemed by Christ once he passes on.

 

Oh okay, I do not exactly follow what the RC does day to day.

 

To be fair, he also said that gays should not be marginalized in society. Which, upon reflection is a more profound and important sentiment. At least, I think it was the pope that said that.

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Ok, I just wanted to understand where you were coming from. I hope that gives you comfort then.

 

The next time society lets free a pedophile I'll blame non-Catholics.


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Hmmmmm. That's the same thing for sure.

 

I've never heard it put that way. Very interesting. Thank you.

 

Sure it is. Blaming all Catholics for individual actions is like blaming all non Catholics for individual actions. I assume you blame all Muslims for 9/11?


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I never blamed all Catholics. I blamed the Church. And I'm blaming them for covering up the pedophilia by their priests, the moving of child rapists from one perish to another endangering a whole new set of kids, and I'm also blaming them for strong arming and paying off families so these priests can avoid secular prosecution. All of that makes your analogy stupid.

Don't start crap in here.

 

^^ That.

 

Fair enough, but I also think its fairly common knowledge that non-Catholics refer to the hierarchy as "the Church", since that's how its referred to in the papers and media. That's why I think that was an attempt to start an argument in here.

 

I know, i was just explaining my thought process to you, so you understood my intent.