New renovation gets approved, sunlife getting a facelift.

Structurally speaking, I don't know if it's possible to move the stands closer to the field. But, by adding seats in the lower bowl, couldn't that give the appearance of the seats being closer to the field? I mean, with all the pictures we've seen of the renovations over the years, the one common thing that they've shown is that it always looks like seats are closer behind the sidelines.


Today


2012


2009ish.

 

I think it will make for a nicer fan experience and an improved facility, but very little impact on the opposing team. Having some seats added closer to the field will add at most a few thousand voices, not having the entire stadium be closer to the field. I'm not even sure that is realistic; probably easier to build a new stadium.

 

Yeah so there will be seats closer to the field, and then some removed from the top corners for the video screens, etc.

I wish for the seats they would keeps those ones in that middle area orange and have the rest an aqua/teal color.

 

Actually having even a partial roof will help w/noise. Our crowd noise will keep a little longer as it will bounce off the canopy. But I do agree a brand new stadium would be easier & much better.

 

Better? Probably. Easier? I seriously doubt it. The amount of paper work and investigating and testing and scouting and prepping and planning for a new place to build a stadium would take years.

 

I don't think they are going to be able to just add rows to the sidelines. Both structures will probably be removed completely and reconstructed to maintain consistent sight lines. It also looks like they will be adding seats where the EZ tunnel is and removing 4-5 sections in the upper corners. I wouldn't be surprised if they actually gut the entire lower bowl and start over.

 

You're right, and wouldn't that make the sight lines from those lowest corner seats awful potentially?

 

Just passing this along, take it as you will:

http://www.miamidolphins.com/multim...pproval-/9cfa5c82-4b64-4228-87da-4608a7bcfa36

Of note, Tom Garfinkel said that some of the smaller projects will begin within the next few weeks, but the total project should take 2 years and the stadium should be fully renovated by the beginning of the 2016 season.

 

That would probably mean that we will be playing the 2015 Season on a Construction Site? Especially if they really consider replacing the whole lower bowl. Should be interesting to see, I am just glad that they are finally making some moves!

 

Please god paint the seats green.

 

This whole thing is a half-measure.

 

That implies there's a full measure to take...and there isn't.

 

So don't do anything drastic right now. Ross is old and thinking short-term, which has brought us to this grim situation. With these renovations underway we will be stuck in a crap patched-up stadium in a crap location for decades.

 

Is that canopy definitly happening? Looks sick

 

I'm sure you know much more about design and having a 350 million dollar budget to renovate than the experts that are putting this together.

Why don't you call the architects and Ross and design it since you seem enlightened to the fact that the stadium will be a crap patched-up stadium? I mean that one picture gave you everything you needed to reach this brilliant conclusion.

 

I don't resemble a stadium that much.

I think that flat roof has "hurricane winds vulnerable" written all over it....

 

So going to a bunch of games at the place in question doesn't mean you can criticize it...you have to be an architect. Lol. Let alone the fact that I don't think I've ever talked to anyone who has been to various NFL venues and actually thinks SunLife is a good stadium.

It's a 27 year-old outdated stadium that we apparently want to stay in for another 20+ years. It has a poor seating structure, and provides no real home field advantage. Oh and it's in the middle of nowhere. None of those things are going to change no matter what roof or screens they slap on it.

 

Interesting. There's J.T. again being the spokesman. I get the feeling that J.T. is going to end up with a role somewhere on this team long before they ever sort out Marino (if they ever do).

 

That canopy has just got to help elevate the noise level in this place, correct? I would think this could help get the noise back closer to the levels of the old OB, especially if we have a sick defense playing under it. Right now, while the place can get generally loud, it doesn't seem to be a factor in any way for the opposing offense (unlike, what Seattle has, for example). This has to help in that way, for what little its worth.

Looking forward to it!

 

It actually reminds me a lot of the stadium in Cologne, and there the canopy helps elevating the noise level as well.

 

That looks a lot like it. That's a cool shot, thanks!

 

I'm so jealous of what the Jags did:

 

Maybe I'm too easily pleased, but I think it's rare to find a guy who can write a two billion dollar check for the franchise, and then another one for $400 million for renovations without sticking his hand into the taxpayers' pockets. If what he does is good enough for Goodell, I'm not going to look a gift horse in the mouth.

 

I'd rather go back to sitting crammed in cheek-to-cheek in the Orange Bowl. It was cramped and uncomfortable but it provided fans a reason to get more involved, to get off their butts and get loud and rattle the stadium. It was a superior game experience, including the downtown Miami location that actually felt like Miami rather than bumf*** no where.

Now, I'm glad something is being done to address the stadium, however, I agree with Linus- it's a bandaid, a cosmetic one at that b/c it's intended to ooh and ah you from a materialistic standpoint thanks to all the modernized updates, but at the end of the day that 350 million still FAILS to address the most critical issue which is- getting the fans closer to the goddam action so that our senses can get more involved inside the stadium than they do seated at home in front of our big screen TVs and surround sound systems where the players look larger and the pad & helmet cracking sound louder than they do at a live game.

They wanna add more seats at field level? That's great for the specific asses sitting in those seats but the rest of the stadium is STILL situated 90 feet from the sidelines. It's probably the only stadium in the NFL where you could be seated at lower level 50 yard line yet still feel like you're too far from the action, at least based on the expectations that come with purchasing lower-level mid-field seats. Lower level and 50 yard line mean sh** in this stadium.

I look at each seat as a piece of property, and in this case they're as poor as the land they sit on. It's simple common friggin' sense. A 6,000 square foot home in Coral Springs will be far less desirable and sell for much less than the same property in east Fort Lauderdale. Why? Location, location, location. It's closer to the beach and action. If that 6,000 square foot Ft Laud home were being offered for the price of the Coral Springs one, how hot would its value be? That's analogous to our lower-level midfield seats. Currently, every seat in the stadium has fans sitting in Coral Springs when a new stadium could've moved them up to A1A where they can smell the water. Homes in actual Coral Springs have HD TVs and internet access; their living rooms have shade and comfy couches to sit on; their fridges are stocked with beer. Ross wants to spend $350 million to give them what they already get without leaving their front door? BIG. F***ING. DEAL. Give those Coral Springs people something they CAN'T get at home- a taste of the goddam action! Make the game from stands seem larger than the one on their TVs, louder than the one on their surround sound systems, and kinesthetically stronger from real game vibrations and real game noise than they could possibly get at home.

Getting the lower level on top of the action improves the "property value" of every seat in the stadium. Let's say the lower level is separated into 3 classes: Class 1 is field level; Class 2 is middle of the lower level; Class 3 is back of the lower level. If the fans at field level are moved 40+ feet closer to the field, then everywhere else in the stadium is moved up a level as well. The new and closer field level seats would now be in a class above the old ones and thus more valuable and desirable. The new Class 2 seats would essentially become the prior Class 1 seats, and the new Class 3 seats would essentially become the prior Class 2 ones. That same effect gets carried over into the upper level, but it's actually magnified more b/c the further back you are, the greater the impact becomes. Moving the lower level seats up 40 feet is nice, but moving a pair of squinting eyes 60 feet closer in the upper deck is even better [which includes building the start of the upper level itself closer to the start of the lower level like Seattle's Century Link Field and others do]. Half of the upper level would now become the new Class 3 seats.... and the back up the upper level would now be situated as close as the front of the prior upper level, hence improving their value. No more need for binoculars to recognize numbers. The suites would be 50-60 feet closer thus upping their value and ROI, because let's face it- who really wants to pay an arm and a leg to watch a game from a suite that would otherwise be in the nosebleed section of other stadiums. If the eyes were moved closer to the field, the stadium wouldn't need 4 mega HD screens. If the eyes were moved closer to the field, fans would feel less of a need to be preoccupied with their cell phones and playing on the internet.

It cost Seattle $430 million to build Century Link Field (would cost $560 million in 2014). They went simple and to the point- making it as much about the game experience as possible rather than the stadium experience as the pics below show. You won't find 4 giant HD screens in Seattle's stadium. Instead you find fans placed on top of the action who are close enough to feel like they can make a difference, thus unifying themselves as the "12th Man", an experience they CAN'T get from their living rooms. They're close enough to the action that if feels as big or bigger than from televisions. Meanwhile, Ross is spending $350 million to make the fan experience more tolerable for the next 20 years when he could've done it right for $200 million more. He's attempting to make the stadium more enjoyable, not the game, and it will eventually fail as the mystique of its newness wears off and fans emotionally find themselves back where they started- disattached from the action and game experience.

When you look at every packed, rocking sporting stadium around the world, what's the biggest common denominator? -the game experience. In its purest form, fans are there to WATCH, HEAR, and FEEL the game. Everything else they can get at home if they want. You wanna put more asses in seats? Improve the ability to watch, hear, and feel the f***ing game. Make it feel like they have to have it. Make it feel like it beats the s**t out of watching from home b/c its an experience they simply cant get from home. Adrenaline is a beautiful thing, and it's addictive. Put them on top of the action where they feel more involved, their senses are more involved, and the adrenaline gets pumping because of it and they'll wanna feel that adrenaline again the following week.

Look at Seattle's $430 million stadium compared to ours. The open endzone makes you viscerally feel like you're part of the city your team resides in rather than Sun Life Stadium that feels like you could be anywhere in the country at that very moment. Look how close Seattle's lower level is, and look how far Miami's is.... and especially notice how far Miami's upper level is from the field. Hell, Miami's upper level is so far away it would almost fit completely outside of Seattle's stadium if you overlapped them, and conversely- you could almost fit Seattle's entire stands into the space that occupies Miami's field and first level.








I mean look at the two pics below. 10 rows back in the upper level in Seattle looks massively closer than 5 rows back in the upper level in Miami. Look at the people in front of the photographer of each photo; they're the same size, so the picture scale roughly identical, and the person taking the picture in Seattle is about 5 rows back than the one from Miami, yet the field looks twice as big in Seattle. You can actually see the other side of the stadium and make out the fans.

It costs a Seattle fan half as much to sit 10 rows back in the upper level than it does a Miami fan to sit at the back of the lower level, and the Seattle fan is closer to the field as you can see by the last pic below. You can tell it's closer b/c of how much wider Seattle's field looks in relation to the person taking the picture. Sun Life is so wide behind both sidelines that the pic below gives the illusion that you could be sitting behind the endzone. That's insane. Look at the Miami fan below at the very bottom of the picture in the middle wearing the white jersey and white hat. Would his experience be more enjoyable if he were sitting 20 rows closer?... how about if he were sitting 20 rows closer w/o paying extra for it? How many of you have looked for those closer vacant seats after games have gotten under way? How many of you would attend more games if Mr Ross said, "We're gonna put you 20 rows closer to the action and not charge you a penny more for it, and if you do wanna sit at the same distance from the field you've been sitting, we're gonna charge you less for it b/c you'll technically be seated further back in the stadium even though you're proximity to the field doesn't change?" What if you were a season ticket holder who is on the fence about re-upping and Mr Ross says, "Would it make a difference if I moved you a dozen rows closer at no extra?"

10 rows back in upper level [can actually see the upper level across from you and distinguish the fans]


5 rows back in upper level [field looks half the size as Seattle's above]


back of the lower level [field looks 3/4 the size of Seattle's 10 rows deep in the upper level]

 

Yet I've been to Miami Hurricane games in JRS that were as loud as any venue I've seen. The fans dictate it with their passion for the game not the stadium. I disagree. Bring an exciting product to JRS and it will feel like any other NFL stadium save for a few anomalies like Seattle..

 

I rather have our aqua-blue instead of JJ's aqua-green.

After looking at the scale models of the roof one thing has me concerned. It won't remain entirely flat right? There has to be some type of incline/slant for draining purposes.

 

The stadium is a crutch for fan apathy. There has been the odd time I've heard it get real loud in that stadium. It's the fact this team hasn't been good enough to get loud for in a long while and a mixture of fair weather fans and fans of other teams. You do see it get pretty damn loud on occasion, but it's damn rare.

 

What do exceptions have to do with the norm? The average Canes game at JRS is pretty weak compared to most venues so please don't try to spin it, and that's what matters. Lesser ACC programs feature stadiums that display a significantly greater energy level.

That's too simplistic and naive WADR. How are you inducing fan passion when you keep them so far from the action? If you were at South Beach and Sarah Randall & Jordan Carver were wading topless in your vicinity, would your "passion" increase the closer they bounced to you, or would it be the same at 5 feet as it would at 40 just because of your general passion for boobies? Here, just so you don't have to google them to gain the appropriate mental picture: NSFW

Spoiler

Spoiler

There's a reason stadium seats get more expensive the closer they get to the field. That alone defeats your argument. People want to be closer to the action, period. I respectfully don't think you understand how passion works. Passion for the Dolphins is what makes us watch them every Sunday, but we can do it at home or at a great sports bar while keeping up with our fantasy team and watching other games during commercials, and we can have an awesome time in the process; an improved game experience is what will make us wanna watch it at the stadium. It's foolish to think passion alone for the Dolphins should be enough to drive fans to the stadium, pack the stands, and get the place rocking. If this were like 30 years ago when all the current distractions and improved ways to watch games didn't exist [like Fantasy Football, HD Sunday Ticket, huge screen TVs, higher gas prices, higher ticket prices, higher cost of living, heavier driving traffic, etc], local Miami fans would have far less reason to watch games from home b/c the experience would be significantly inferior to an actual game one.

Really? Seattle's 4-12 season of 2008 was at 101.5% occupancy. Their stadium drew just 4 less fans that season than their 2013 Super Bowl one. Seattle was 5-11 in 2009 and was again over 100% occupancy. Despite back-to-back terrible seasons, their stadium was regarded as the loudest in the NFL at the time and led the league in false starts b/c its fans still took pride in being the 12th man regardless of record. The stadium played a heavy part in that.

There's no way this would've been replicated had Sun Life Stadium been built instead of Qwest Field. Qwest was constructed specifically to enhance the game experience, and everything about it was built to help get it loud, keep it loud, and get the adrenaline flowing. That ability to facilitate loudness & energy made fans wanna hear it loud, feel the energy, and keep it that way. What gets people pumped up more, listening to music turned up or music at a calmer level? Does a blockbuster action movie get your blood flowing more in a large theatre with a massive sound system than it does at a dollar theatre? If you didn't have a good theatre to experience your movie in, would you feel more inclined to wait for RedBox and watch it at home for far cheaper?

At Sun Life, the game experience is so mediocre because of the stadium's terrible design for football that, if the team isn't winning, attendance drops by the thousands. There's a reason we DONT see football-only stadiums built the way Sun Life was built. It's because it makes for a poorer overall game experience, not a better one.


Why listen to me when you can read this instead:

 

Here's a great Time Magazine article discussing the impact of Seattle's stadium:

Since it was built, CenturyLink/Qwest Field has led the NFL in opponent false starts.
In a 2005 dramatic overtime win vs the Giants, NY was called for 11 false starts and botched 3 field goals, and Mike Holmgren dedicated the game ball to the 12th man b/c the crowd is what made the difference. Now, when you're in a stadium that's specifically acoustically built to get loud and facilitate loudness like Seattle's, and fans see that it allows them to make a difference [like the false start stat and NY example above], then people will in turn get louder and remain louder in order to continue impacting games, in turn jacking up their endorphins and energy level and thus improving their overall game experience, making them more likely to want to attend games regardless of record.

I used to watch Miami Hooters games back in the day as often as possible [regardless of the hour drive], and I couldn't care less about arena football. I had minimal passion for the game itself. But you know what- the game experience were a blast. You're right on top of the action. The energy level was high. Music was pumping to keep it loud. You're close enough to see the cheerleaders. The "stadium" made the actual experience more enjoyable than a bland Dolphins game where the closest seat is like 90 feet from the field and it takes an effort to get the noise going. I opted for watching Hooters games live and caught the Dolphins on TV. But you can bet your *** if Miami played at Century Link Field I'd have said adios to the arena games.

 

It's just speculation but I think Ross is under the mindset that he only has two alternatives- spend $350 million in renovations or purchase a new stadium for $1.2 billion with every amenity possible as if he's buying a 5 star resort, which would be consistent with his mentality as a developer where he's faced with a specific group of expectations in real estate that aren't necessarily shared with football fans attending a game. The stadium doesn't need to be turned into a resort or spa, and the stadium's focal point shouldn't be about becoming a social event/gathering like a Starbucks. Seattle spent $430 million to build Qwest Field with the intention of making all about football and the game itself, and it did nothing but make the experience for Seahawks fans better.

 

I agree with the distance from the field gripes but phinsationals post quoting time magazine gives a lot of credit to Seattle's canopies in terms of pumping up the volume. My question is wouldn't a giant canopy over the top of sun life help out the stadiums sound dramatically?

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It would help some but it likely wouldn't be enough considering the stands are so far from the field to generate and contain a quality noise level, and also considering there's a lot more that goes into noise than simply covering part of the stadium.

Seattle's stadium was strategically constructed from the ground up to get loud. It's like a clam shell with a curved roof that funnels sound straight to the field. Their upper level extends like 50 feet over the lower level which allows the lower level noise to bounce off it and onto the field as well, plus serving to trap that swirling noise in the stadium longer. They use a lot of steel and concrete to reverberate the noise, and their Hawk's Nest section in the endzone is aluminum seating, and we all know how loud that gets.

From the stadium's architectural director:

With the canopy in Miami, it would get louder when fans are actually making noise, but it still doesn't solve the problem of getting fans closer to the field to make them feel a part of the action and thus more motivated to get the noise started in the first place, and I don't think a canopy alone would get the noise level loud enough to make a real difference like it does in Seattle where opponents are induced into fall starts, off sides, missed field goals, miscommunications, and mental errors, which in turn motivate the fans to get noisy or stay noisy b/c they know they're making a difference.