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Possible situation regarding 2008 draft.

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Kdawg954, Dec 3, 2007.

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  1. Kdawg954

    Kdawg954 Member

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    Let's say we have the #1, New England has the number 2 (via San Fran) . . and the Jets have #3. We really love Glen Dorsey (top player on our board), but picking him allows one of those 2 teams a shot at McFadden. Do we take McFadden based on that situation, or would we stick with our top player on our board.

    I bring this up, because I think this is a critical reason why we may end up taking McFadden, even if Brown is 100% . . . thoughts?
     
  2. Jagfish

    Jagfish Season Ticket Holder

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    I just wish the NFL had taken the Pats best 1st rder for cheating, blah! The rich get richer.
     
  3. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    We are so down right now such strategery is not a luxury that we can afford Kdawg.

    "if" we draft Mcfadden, it will be because he is the player that has the greatest chance of improving the Dolphins first and foremost, ditto Glenn Dorsey or Chris Long, worrying about the Pats or Jets (the Jets are the Bermuda triangle of high pick Rb's and Te's BTW) is not an option for us.

    It does make sense to talk up either McFadden or a QB just to see if trade offers will be made, Franchise improving trade offers, the idea that we should flatly say "We are taking XXXXX, it's a done deal" even a month before the draft is foolish and limits our options.
     
  4. sports24/7

    sports24/7 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    The draft is too important to worry about what other teams will do. The Dolphins need to take their player and not think about the Pats or Jets. If they mess this pick up they would continue to set back this franchise. Taking McFadden would be a waste unless there are some kind of complications with Ronnie's injury.
     
  5. djfresh47

    djfresh47 New Member

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    That is pretty funny if it's a reference to an old SNL bit. I talked to friends about the possibility of the Pats taking McFadden. I don't see it happening. What would be the point? They don't run the ball as it is so nobody can make a proper gauge of Maroney. Though maybe he's falling out of favor because I thought they were using Morris more than they use Maroney now. The Jets are a mess but I think they could take McFadden. I've never liked Jones and they're probably not taking a Qb or drafting a LT so unless they take Chris Long McFadden seems like the logical choice.
     
  6. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Taking McFadden would or "could" give us a viable top ten NFL offense, taking Glenn Dorsey would not move our Defense very much at all as we have too many holes for one player to fix or even really improve it.

    Why have two bad units when we could have one top flight one and one bad one instead of two poor units?
     
  7. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Exactly.."strategry"..lol....:laugh:

    Just trying to lighten the mood..wouldn't want to see anyone go nukeyer...:ffic:
     
  8. LikeUntoGod

    LikeUntoGod Season Ticket Holder

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    If you are looking at our draft as what matters to the Patriots then you are already lost. It is not about where McFadden goes or who the Patriots draft but WHO WE WILL DRAFT!

    It is about the Miami Dolphin's draft and future not anyone else.


    And wise up my friend, I doubt McFadden will even go in the top 2 picks and he could drop to 5-6. The Patriots have one of the best front offices in the NFL. They are going to draft a perfect need that will play for them for 10 years. There is no running back that fits a need they have.
     
  9. sports24/7

    sports24/7 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Taking McFadden wouldn't make this team much better on offense. Ronnie Brown was on pace to have a monster year running and receiving. Ronnie Brown makes this offense a very good unit. McFadden might be a better player, but would make Brown almost useless. I have heard the argument that teams need two backs, but you don't need two star backs and won't be able to afford both longterm. If McFadden is brought in, it won't be a RB by committee, because that would be silly. Why would you give McFadden plays off if he were the better player? A guy like Dorsey would improve this team quite a bit more than McFadden would because the difference in what we have at the position right now and what we would have in Dorsey is a huge difference compared to the difference between McFadden and Brown. Dorsey would be a huge step in improving the run defense. Your talking about a difference making DT in Dorsey, not you regular top rated Dt in the draft, but a once in a decade type player at that position. If you add a guy like a Jared Allen in FA you have now improved your defense tremendously. I love Darren McFadden and realize he is a special player, but we just don't need a running back. In fact that is the one position where we have the best depth.
     
  10. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    We would need much more then Glenn Dorsey to improve the defense, that is assuming 1. Dorsey is even healthy 2. That he performs well at the Combine.

    This idea that somehow a player who is injured all season, who also doesn't have a productive season, or a season as good as his junior season is somehow the #1 pick the in the draft is amazing.

    Based on what?

    And to be blunt, Ronnie is not going to make it into a game until when? October or so if we are fortunate? It generally takes a solid year to recover from a ACL, and chances are good (based on his past history) he will miss more time even after coming back from the ACL surgery.

    If we take McFadden we, hedge our bets, and if Ronnie comes back strong, we will have a very explosive backfield like the Vikings have this season, if McFadden proves to be APII, then we have a grind it out back and a home run hitting back, Ronnie get's a little older, we can trade him, and still have McFadden for years after Ronnie is gone.

    RB's contract is up in two years, "if" McFadden is as good as he appears to be out on the field, we can have a top flight RB for until 2014, either way, if Ronnie comes back strong, or with a slow comeback, our Offense won't be derailed waiting for Ronnie.
     
  11. unifiedtheory

    unifiedtheory Sub Pending Luxury Box

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    NEVER draft someone just so another divisional team doesn't get him. We are a LONG way away from worrying about what the New England Patriots are doing. We have to worry about the Miami Dolphins and let the rest take care of itself.
     
  12. dolphan117

    dolphan117 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Agreed...... Although I would suck to have NE take McFadden.

    Only good news for slowing down the NE offense is that Stallworth might not be there next year due to his contract essential being a one year tryout, if they want to keep him after this year they either have to play him an insane amount of money or get him to renegotiate his deal. Moss will be a FA as well but I kinda expect them to find a way to keep him. :mad:
     
  13. sports24/7

    sports24/7 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Glenn Dorsey is worthy of the #1 pick because when healthy he is one of the best DT prospects to come out of the draft in a long time. When he was healthy he was an unstoppable force. And just because he has been playing injured and below his ability doesn't mean he hasn't been effective. He has still been a very good player. I'm not the only one who thinks this either. Mel Kiper has him #1 on his big board and many others have said he is as good a defensive prospect as there gets. No he won't instantly make this a good defense, but he will instantly make them better. And like I said if the Dolphins go and get a big time defensive FA then the defense could be a lot better next year.

    As far as Ronnie being out, Cam says he hopes to have him back by camp and even if it takes until October, if he comes back at full strength it's not worth taking a guy with the #1 overall pick because your top guy is out for a few games. You don't use the 1st overall pick to "hedge your bet" either. This pick is one of the most important in recent history and the Dolphins need to spend it fixing problems, not adding a luxury.
     
  14. Bonedoc7777

    Bonedoc7777 New Member

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    the word is dallas loves mcfadden, how about two ones a second and marion barber, that would give us two ones and three twos and a RB
     
  15. VanDolPhan

    VanDolPhan Club member Club Member

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    Man so much hot air. Ronnie's timetable is to be back for training camp and with the shape he is in it's very reasonable at the least that he should be good to go with a couple preseason games to go. Ronnie was leading the league in yards from scrimmage and this team couldn't win a game because it was giving up MORE on defense.

    Wake up and smell the coffee. Were the 32nd ranked run defense because every time Traylor isn't in this team has nothing at DT to stop from being run up the gut. That's where most of the yards are coming from. Dorsey has AS much of a shot at bringing back the famed Miami run D as McFadden does of being a great RB. However Running Back has not been Miami's problem (except the last couple games with all the injuries) and drafting him with all the holes Miami has would yet be another huge drafting mistake regardless of how good he is.

    I can guarantee he won't be the pick. Unless Beck turns things around Miami is in great need of QB, DT and DE which are all in the top 5 right now draft wise. When Cameron gets his rear fired, the next coach is going to come in and see Ronnie isn't the problem.
     
  16. REV KEV

    REV KEV New Member

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    This is true..., RB is fragile constantly nicked..., but a good lead blocker at his price is too costly..., get him healthy and trade him...
     
  17. sweeper

    sweeper New Member

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    RB will be traded if mcfad comes on board. look what mueller did with RW he wont keep em both trust. and dorsey is good but just bc our unit is horrible it doesn't mean you ignore it although i DO BELIEVE we shoudl finish our OFFENSE first before we go Defense. Mcfad wont put us in the top 10 offense cuz our TE sucks big time, our G n T are not GOOD, our pass prot. is horrible and our WRs blow besides Ginn. we are far from fixing it. I wouldn't mind the following to help this unit get better and team...

    ...Mcfad, trade R.B. get LETSSS SAY a late first rounder for him or something mid to denver, (lets say 25th pick just for the heck of it), get Hardy with taht pick (WR 6'6 220 runs 4.4 40's was a baller now a football player), use the 2nd rounder on a T or G or MLB, use the next 2nd rounder, on a G, T, MLB or DT.

    3rd rounder on a TE, S. 4th on a T, G, S, TE or CB, assuming MLB goes in the 2nd.

    then in FA go for Trufant (as samuels and aramashadu "sp") wont be let go of. Get some STers on this team via FA and some Depth along wiht maybe, JUST MAYBE a Jared Allen and this is assuming we dont trade JT for more picks as well then pick up 1 more Vet WR as Hagan is not even good enough for a number 3 spot.
     
  18. inFINSible

    inFINSible Bad ministrator

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    How'd that Marino thing turn out? Didn't he have a crap senior season and a great junior year? yeah, he dropped in the draft but, should he have? No, obviously not.

    Dorsey would be a centerpiece of the defense for 10 years while McFadden/Brown would not last three years.

    Next year, if Brown is not fully healthy to start the season, Williams will be.

    McFadden is no a once in a lifetime player. He is not the type of player that you must draft no matter what your needs are. He is just another RB and he's a luxury we can't afford to screw around with. We have plenty of talent and plenty of depth at RB. We need to make some other part of the team better.

    Worrying about what team he'll go to if we don't get him, is a losers' mentality because it doesn't matter, as long as we improve THIS team.

    but if you really want to worry about it, try looking at it this way....Dorsey will make our run defense better, that right there negates to some degree how much McFadden improves the pats or jets run game. McFadden leaves our run defense the same and doesn't improve our run offense because we already have more than enough talent playing there and all he would do is, if thrown into the mix, is to take carries away from somebody else.

    We absolutely do not need McFadden and he is absolutely not the kind of can't-miss-hall-of-fame RB that you HAVE TO take.
     
  19. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    No, Glenn Dorsey would dramatically improve a defense, a defense that needs to compete against a powerhouse offense in the AFC East that is the New England Patriots.

    If we are ever going to even think about stopping Tom Brady, we would need special defensive players like a Glenn Dorsey who could make an impact on the game on every snap. He has such a great burst of speed and he's incredibly powerful.

    All of us bashed Houston for not taking Reggie Bush, and look how well it's working out for them. Mario Williams has 8.5 sacks, 2 forced fumbles, and 40 tackles so far this season. What has Reggie Bush done?

    Our offense when healthy is already damn good. John Beck is going to go in his second year [hopefully taking 2 step forward from his rookie year], and our franchise running back Ronnie Brown will be back as well. We need to get some veteran receivers to play along side of Ted Ginn Jr [preferrably Patrick Crayton and a possession receiver that can make the tough, physical catches]. In the draft we need to seriously target linebackers, defensive end/tackle, offensive tackle and guards, and defensive backs.

    If we are going to draft a running back for insurance, you take a guy like Kevin Smith if he enters the draft with our 32nd pick overall [first/second rounder], or Steve Slaton who may drop to the early second round as well. But you don't invest on another star running back. I know about the two back system, but 2 star running backs doesn't make any sense at all.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2007
  20. Big E

    Big E Plus sized porn star

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    NE cannot get McFadden, if we have to draft him so be it.
     
  21. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    You guys have to be freaking kidding me. So we're just going to draft him because we need to keep him away from New England? Are you freaking serious? We're going to let New England force us to draft another running back when we are already loaded on that position? Please.

    I'm so glad you guys aren't running the team. Hopefully Mueller makes the smart choice, and that's Glenn Dorsey or Chris Long.
     
  22. Big E

    Big E Plus sized porn star

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    so you take Dorsey with the #1? Another year another wasted first rounder...good call. And like having McFadden would be a bad thing. Look at Jax, Saints, Minn. Look at what having Taylor and Peterson did to their offense! And they have even less talent on their O then we do!
     
  23. ssmiami

    ssmiami Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Lets invest all our cap money into the rb postion, cause rb's never bust do they [ki jana carter , L. phillips, ennis, Dayne]. The best dt's in the league are nearly all very high draft picks [Seymour, Henderson ,Haynesworth, K.Williams,Harris, Stroud, Sapp, Ngata, Okoye, McFarland] These players were all top 15 [majority in the top 10] picks.
     
  24. Big E

    Big E Plus sized porn star

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    And DT's dont bust? You cant base your draft on past busts. You never know how a player is going to play in the NFL until he is actually playing in the NFL.
     
  25. ssmiami

    ssmiami Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    All postions can bust, i dont understand how fans think Dorsey is a bad pick
     
  26. Big E

    Big E Plus sized porn star

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    I dont think he's a bad pick. I just dont think he's the best pick for your money at the # 1 spot. If the Phins trade down and draft him, ok, but he's not the best player coming out of college.
     
  27. ssmiami

    ssmiami Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I would only take Dmac if Ronnie is traded [i really wouldnt want that to happen], we cant sink that amount of money into one position. Of course if Ronnie so badly hurt he never comes back the same, then for sure take Dmac, but i guess we wont know for some time.
     
  28. Frumundah Finnatic

    Frumundah Finnatic U Mad Miami?

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    1) Ricky was traded because he was a headcase

    2) Why do we trade the best player on this team? so we can pick an unproven RB? That makes no sense at all.

    Thats what they said about Dan the Man.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2007
  29. VanDolPhan

    VanDolPhan Club member Club Member

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    All positions bust, but you check around the league and the vast majority of the top tackles were taken in the top 15.

    And it doesn't have to be just Dorsey folks. Dorsey would be the first part of a defensive make over. A pass rusher could be added with the 32nd pick. Or the team could go DE Long with the first pick and try to get DT Frank Okam at 32 for example.

    There is ZERO argument one can give for McFadden when you have Ronnie Brown, Ricky Williams, Jessie Chatman and an emerging Lorenzo Booker. Even if they toss Williams and let Chatman walk at best you spend a 4th or less pick at RB for depth.

    Especially when the Dolphins highly need a pass rusher, a run stuffing DT, a challenger to Will Allen for #1 CB and possibly a Zach Thomas replacement (if he retires in the offseason) that might take care of 1-3rd round picks right there even with FA additions.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2007
  30. JMHPhin

    JMHPhin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Wow so we should resign ourselves to being teh AFC EAst spoilers? Not try to improve this team? Cause drfating McFadden only makes our team the same. Ronnie was doing awesome and his injury is not the Cpepp injury and will be 100%, so Ronnie 100% gives us what Mcfadden does. we in esssence stay the same. Dorsey or Long make our d-line instantly better. Dorsey is a special player talent wise, as well as the intangibles of heart and desire he has. He is a special player in a position of great need. We have teh room to re-sign Chatman he may want to go but he may want to stay, Cam showed him loyalty he may do so in return and Ricky will be back. We are covered at RB. We need a player on d-line and move Vonnie to DE and pickup a NT in FA or Dorsey can do it with some bulk.

    I dont know why we are debating this unless RB wont be healthy and nothing has said he wont, all reports said he will recover 100%.
     
  31. Big E

    Big E Plus sized porn star

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    What did the Saints do the yr they drafted Bush? oh yeh one game from the SB. Hows Minnesota done this yr with Peterson? Alot better then last year. And guess what, they made no major changes besides the RB position. A good solid runner can change our whole season, two could change alot more.
     
  32. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    New QB, new HC, new defensive players, rookie WR who had one of the best rookie years ever, new FA TE. I can go on probably.
     
  33. Big E

    Big E Plus sized porn star

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    you wanna kick me any more while I'm layin there? lol. But my point still stands..
     
  34. sweeper

    sweeper New Member

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    NO b/c he never lived UP TO HIS potential tahst why. wow do you know what your talking about dude? Hes barely played nething worht of a top pick with all those picks they traded you kidding me.

    Best player? so waht if he is the best player he cna't stand on the field so what worth does he do if he is the best but never on the field? THINK about it.

    and dan the man dropped b/c of alleged drug usage.
     
  35. sweeper

    sweeper New Member

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    btw they say ACL recovery is almsot always 100% but they never get full speed back. RB was not a game breaker let alone a game changer and now after the ACL its just goin to make it worse. RB dances a lot and had no speed, now hes not goin to be able to dance as much as he did before n lack more speed then ever.
     
  36. VanDolPhan

    VanDolPhan Club member Club Member

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    Going to be funny watching some reactions based on the various McFadden threads when he completely doesn't get picked. Not a chance in hell any coach will take him #1 when there are so many greater needs.
     
  37. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    It would go down like the Houston fan base when they chose Mario Williams instead of Reggie Bush.

    But ask any Texan fan how they feel of Charlie Casserly's decision NOW?

    What has Reggie Bush done lately? Nothing. Possibly the most overhyped running back to ever enter a draft with his 3.7 yard per carry this season and 5.7 yards per reception [last year averaged 8.4, that's a huge drop of production receiving wise].

    And Mario Williams? Having a pro bowl caliber year in his second season at defensive end with 8.5 sacks, 2 forced fumbles, and 40 tackles.

    Mario Williams > Reggie Bush.
     
  38. Big E

    Big E Plus sized porn star

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    You mean Vince young dont you?
     
  39. VanDolPhan

    VanDolPhan Club member Club Member

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    Young was never seriously in the running for 1st pick.


    Seriously though picking McFadden is just as bright as it was to pick Jamar Fletcher when we had Madison, Surtain in front of him.
     
  40. Vertical Limit

    Vertical Limit Senior Member

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    Like VanDolphan said, Vince Young wasn't even considered. The Texans made it clear that they didn't want to draft a quarterback weeks before the draft. It was down to Mario or Reggie Bush.
     

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