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Chad Henne's Downfield Passing Game: An Objective Analysis

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by shouright, Oct 26, 2010.

  1. hugoguzman

    hugoguzman New Member

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    To quote the wise and venerable FlavaFlave: "I can't do nothin' fo ya man"

    a) Saying that you can't wait more than 19 starts to evaluate a young quarterback confirms my suspicions that you're impatient at best (thought I'm leaning towards unrealistic, unfounded, and uninformed).
    b) Saying that you think Henne is mediocre is little more than an opinion that is not backed up by his production (he's already an average to above average NFL QB after just 19 starts)

    I'm about to turn 34, so I've also grown up with the same issues you've grown up with. However, that doesn't mean that I'm going to check logic out there do in favor irrational emotion.

    This is a franchise that is just 2+ years removed from a 1-15 record. The roster has been completely turned over in that time, making it one of the youngest and inexperienced in all of football. Add to that a very young and inexperienced QB and guess what?

    Patience is key.

    If you don't have it, then I can't do nothin' fo you man.
     
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  2. The Aqua Crush

    The Aqua Crush New Member

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    Henning is as conservative as they come. He will set us up to stay close and win with taking the lowest calculated risk. It's his mantra.

    Henne won't open it up until Henning isn't calling the plays. It's not a bad coordinator to have this early in his career, teaches him the essence of being a pocket passer and understanding and making a variety of throws.

    He has understood how to throw it away, live to see another play very well this season. He didn't turn it over against pittsburgh, which is a huge accomplishment for any qb.

    Hennings gameplan on offense gave us a legitamate chance to beat the steelers, we did score lots of points but fell on the wrong side of another close game.

    I hope Henne gets a different coordinator in successive years, for what he's been directed to do and how to learn how to manage a game and read defenses, especially front 7's of defenses I think he has done a tremendous job. He's given us a chance to win almost every game we've played. He even had us in a position to beat NE, until the SP teams fell apart.

    He's learning what it takes to win, extremely accurate on 3rd downs (where he has to pass). He's learning what it takes to lead a team and win games the right way IMO. This will bode well for his progression well beyond this year.

    Of course it all depends how you evaluate or judge a QB. I think some great traits for a qb include things like, throwing it away if need be, limiting turnovers, moving an offense downfield, converting on 3rd downs, ability to avoid being sacked or escape pressure, completion percentage, TD/INT ratio, yards thrown.

    He's not perfect but he has made strides this year in almost all those categories, at least in my opinion.
     
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  3. ToddsPhins

    ToddsPhins Banned

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    Well said Aqua..... well said. :knucks:
     
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  4. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    It is true that with Henne, we will always be in the game and have a chance to come back.

    I am very disappointed, though, at the way we looked in the 2 minute drill in the Pitt game. How much of that is Henne and how much is HEnning? It was so bad.
     
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  5. tx-fin

    tx-fin Keeping the faith

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    Dude, you are just wasting you time with this, can't you tell? The man-crush on Henne is so intense here, that they don't care about our Fins winning, just about Henne becoming the second man to walk on water. No matter how we suck as a team, it will never be his fault. I'm surprised they haven't renamed it "Henne.com" 'cause that's all that matters.
     
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  6. The Aqua Crush

    The Aqua Crush New Member

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    I was extremely suprised at the lack of urgency or focus the offense had there. I believe it was the fault of almost everyone on offense. Including coaches / coordinators and the players.

    A couple of things that stood out to me on that drive.

    The draw to Ronnie. Very good play call. They had injuries in the middle, were dog tired, why not start em out chasing ronnie?

    Where it went wrong: Ronnie clipped his own guard / or tackle (cant remember who) which killed his momentum, when he got the ball he needed to bounce it around the line and it was daylight. First down and more daylight. Ronnie's lack of effort and excecution ruined that play. His minimal workload all day he should have burned the lb who closed the gap on him, he was worked much harder all day.

    The Fasano drop. Again poor excecution. Henne made a throw to the first down that hit Anthony in the hands. Needs to be a catch, no excuse. That is now two plays if our focus as an offense was sharper, we would have had a new set of downs and 10 less yards to gain to get Carpenter in range.

    The polite screen pass. Again, poor play call. Polite is good in certain situations, 3rd and long, not so much. I put that on Henning. If you want to run a screen pass underneath knowing you have 2 downs to make up the yardage and the D is pulled back, put your best open field runner in that position. Ricky, Ronnie or Bess (preferably Bess) should have had the chance. Polite failed miserably but he was not put in a good situation to succeed. That falls on Henning and Henne for their decisions, IMO.

    After that the 4th down desperation was evident. Henne's pocket presence was poor and the whole offense seemed desperate, which they were. Game over.

    I thought we had a real chance after Pitt scored the FG. I said we have lots of time, and we only need a fg to win. Pretty good situation.

    Then it unfolded and i was shocked we excecuted so poorly. No one was in sync, on the same page, urgent, focused. It looked like OTA drills for the first time in a year. Not what we need from our 2 min offense. I'm sure Sparano let them all hear how poor that was. I'm also sure that since we have a conservative play calling coordinator on offense, odds are we are going to be in a TON of tight games all year. Against the worst or best teams in the league. If that is the case, our 2 minute offense to steal wins better be iron clad. It wasn't and we lost. The 2 minute offense for how we play games is even more important due to the frequency of how many close games we play, Sprano, Henning and the offense better get that together for the remainder of the year or we may end up on the wrong side of the close game coin more than we would like, and in my opinion how ever many of those close games we can win will determine our playoff fate.

    so far we have been in 5 close games (by the end of the game):

    Bills: won
    MIN: Won
    Jets: Lost
    GB: won
    Pitt: Lost

    3-2. Not bad but not great. That's 5/6 games that were "Close" in my opinion. A very high number not to have a stellar 2 minute offense. I also believe the pats game would have been "close" as it was at halftime, if the sp teams didn't implode.
     
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  7. ToddsPhins

    ToddsPhins Banned

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    Man crush? Please. A good many of the members here (unlike yourself and 23rd) actually KNOW talent when we see it..... and also know that young QBs don't blossom overnight. We have legitimate expectations...... not unreasonable, ridiculous ones that very few QBs in the history of the NFL could meet not named Marino.

    There's no man crush. "We" merely grow tired of ignorant, clueless fans saying Henne's the problem when he's not....... and calling for his replacement when he's one of the top 3 or 4 QBs drafted over the past 6 years. "We" KNOW that this team does NOT take the next step forward if we don't allow Henne the time to develop, and "we" also KNOW that a veteran QB who can win against weak teams is nice and all during regular season but means absolutely NOTHING when he can't beat a talented defense in order to get through the playoffs. If there's a man crush anywhere, it's 23rd's obsession with a declining veteran named Pennington.

    Come back to the forum after you understand the developmental process that virtually all quality QBs go through.

    What's hilarious about this all is 23rd is saying we should draft a QB with our 1st round pick to replace Henne so we can win....... the hilarious part is that doing so would delay our winning even further b/c said 1st round QB will take a few years to develop just as all rookie QBs do, meanwhile Henne is already 2/3 the way through the process. Talk about blind ignorance and a complete lack of logic. LMAO.
     
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  8. The Aqua Crush

    The Aqua Crush New Member

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    The best part too is playcalling and stats. Ryan Fitzpatrick has the second best qb rating in the NFL just behind Peyton. Thrown a ton of TDs, put up points against tough team defenses. Yet they are still winless.

    If all Henne did was open it up to Marshall down the sidelines and Hartline on the other sidelines and was play called to throw 25 yard + throws at a higher clip, doesn't mean that you will win more games.

    Henne's excecution and Henning's conservative play calling has us at a 3-3 record. Henne has done great so far of what he has been asked to do. He's not the sole reason we lose games or win games for that matter. It's a team game.

    Henne's development is about what i expected from him. As our offensive philosophy changes, so will his game. But it's a controlled process. One i'm fine with.
     
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  9. ToddsPhins

    ToddsPhins Banned

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    Exactly..... "of what he's been asked to do". He was asked to play conservatively and not turn the ball over the first 2 games. He did just that and we won. He was asked to air it out against the Jets, and he lit them up and was the SOLE reason we had a chance to beat them. The Pats game wasn't stellar, but ALL QBs have rough games, and at least he wasn't the reason we lost. He was asked to open it up against GB, and we beat them on their own turf. We put the game on HIS young shoulders against the best team in the NFL, and he carried us to what should've been a victory. Penny would not have scored more points against the Jets or Steelers than Henne did, and there's a good chance (based on what history tells us) that we might not have beaten GB or Minne if he were starting. They complain about us being 3-3 with Henne when we realistically could be 1-5 with Penny...... and would be lucky to be 3-3 with him. Where as we should be 5-1 right now with Henne, and that's without a ground game to help him out. That's gotta count for something.
     
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  10. hugoguzman

    hugoguzman New Member

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    I've seen some hilarious posts, but this one takes the cake.

    I think you've got things backwards. Most of the people on this forum are aware of Henne's shortcomings and are also aware that he must continue to progress in order to prove that he can be a long-term franchise quarterback (myself included).

    It's people like you that will stop at nothing to see Henne fail, so that your original (and unflinching) opinion can end up being true.

    And no matter how many obvious facts and observations are floated your way, you refuse to budge one bit in terms of your perspective on Henne.

    If anything, it's fans like you that would prefer to see the franchise take another step back before as opposed to having to admit that Henne is a legitimate quarterback.

    As for me, I think he's already shown enough (both statistically and visually) to earn the starting job for the rest of the year. And if he continues to show progression the way he has this season, then he should be the unquestioned started going into 2011.
     
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  11. ToddsPhins

    ToddsPhins Banned

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    Some people are probably living in such a past Marino fantasy world that they forget that football's actually a "team" game.
     
  12. ToddsPhins

    ToddsPhins Banned

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    And, IMO, as guys like Manning and Brady eventually retire, we'll begin seeing his name mentioned in the upper echelon of QBs.
     
  13. hugoguzman

    hugoguzman New Member

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    He still has a lot of progressing to do before I can considering him "upper echelon" IMO, but I definitely like what I see through 19 starts.

    P.S. I give Pennington A LOT OF CREDIT for how Henne has progressed. I think he's been key. Honestly, with every passing game, Henne looks more and more like a Pennington clone (only with a much stronger arm and larger frame)
     
  14. TheMageGandalf

    TheMageGandalf Senior Member

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    [​IMG]
     
  15. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    you believe that was a screen pass? I thought it was a checkdown throw? what makes you think it was a screen. was there even one blocker in front of him. i plan to rewatch the game tmw, i'm just wondering
     
  16. GreenMachine

    GreenMachine New Member

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    Do not kill me, but this Dolphins offense is more suited to Pennington.

    I know you have Marshall, but beyond that it reminds me of the Mangini/ Herm Jets.

    A decent run game with average to above average receivers.

    Bess is Coles
    Cotchery is Hartline
    R and r is Martin and Jordan
     
  17. Two Tacos

    Two Tacos Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You want Penny throwing a 15yrd out over Henne? And this would be good because we could be the Mangini/Herm Jets?


    I don't suppose there is anyway we can get you a job with the Jets coaching staff... is there? :tongue2:
     
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  18. GreenMachine

    GreenMachine New Member

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    Or chad makes better decisions.

    Reading is fundamental.

    And yes, Sporanos play calling is like the Herm/Mangini Jets. Never go downfield and Run baby run.
     
  19. ToddsPhins

    ToddsPhins Banned

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    Have you seen Penny and our offense attempt to operate against good teams like the Steelers?

    Watch both of the Ravens games, then the Arizona game, followed by the Falcons game. It's not a pretty sight. No offense, but we have higher hopes than barely being a playoff team. :yes:

    Question to you: Would you want him back to replace Sanchez?
     
  20. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    playcalling is based on personnell, ours and the opponents. we have a QB that can destroy man to man coverage but is still learning how to defeat cover 2. guess what he will be facing until he learns how to defeat cover 2 on his own? how do you defeat cover 2? a strong running game helps to bring the safeties down into the box. we dont have that. a tight end who can attack the mlb deep can exploit the cover 2. we dont have that. so we are stuck trying to pass under the coverage and on the sidelines we have to run routes where either the wr fakes inside and instead goes out or run a duel route where one receiver goes deep and hopefully takes both the corner and safety with him while the second receiver goes short or intermediate and hopefully is open. while we are going through the learning process for henne its better to play conservative and rely on our budding defense than to just have henne winging it around blindly.
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2010
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  21. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Yes on the ways to break cover Two. I'd also include tall receivers (Wallace and Marshall outside) running sideline routes and having an arced pass dropped to them about 12 yards upfield along the sideline. Real touch pass. Henne is getting better at that placement and we saw one like that last week, I think, though the route might have been Fasano's to that soft spot in the zone. A fast RB could get there on a wheel route too.

    Mainly, though, you need a good running game, seam busting TE, or to attack the gaps with your slot guy. Only the last one is an option the way we're playing ow, as Bess can handle that. BUT it means Henne must have great ball location to throw into that area. AND he CANNOT telegraph it by staring at the receiver or D-linemen will get their hands up in Henne's face, or a defender (LB or Slot CB) will break on the ball and intercept it.

    Seriously, we need the damned running game back or a TE who is more threat in the receiving game.
     
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  22. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    agreed. the fade is a good route as is he wheel. and you nailed it, we really need the running game to come back.
     
  23. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    we really need for Pennington to come back
     
  24. ToddsPhins

    ToddsPhins Banned

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    I didn't know he went somewhere. :dunno: Is he on vacation?...... b/c if we go a DAY without him mentoring Henne..................
     
  25. hugoguzman

    hugoguzman New Member

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    Don't you get tired of making the same post over and over again.

    Pennington is not going to return as the starting QB.

    Get over it, and be happy that we have him as a coach and mentor to Henne.
     
  26. GreenMachine

    GreenMachine New Member

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    Sanchez is 5-1..Henne is not.
     
  27. NJFINSFAN1

    NJFINSFAN1 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    True, but you have to admit the running game you guys have is helping Sanchez big time.

    I think Sanchez is a good QB, but the running game is helping very much.
     
  28. ToddsPhins

    ToddsPhins Banned

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    Buddy, answer the legitimate original question or GTFO. If you can't talk football w/o the jabs, then we don't need your immature nonsense posts here.
     
  29. phins3454

    phins3454 New Member

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    Yeah youre right, we were doing so well with penny at the start of last year (0-2), and he was doing oh so well :pity: And forget about the four picks he threw in the playoff game against the Ravens.

    Penny would just get hurt anyways. look up injury prone and Pennys name would be beside it with his jersey number.
     
  30. StarBustFB

    StarBustFB New Member

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    I don't think there is any doubt that Henne has the ability or the arm strength to get the ball down the field. I think the coaching staff has maintained a lack of confidence in him, and therefore they've been tentative to turn him lose. To be honest, I it's affected his play to this point, as we see in his flashes of brilliance and then the occasional bonehead throw for an interception. I think its time for Sparano to take the training wheels off and let Henne go nuts. If we see that, good things will happen.
     
  31. resnor

    resnor Derp Sherpa

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    That would be 5-2 now, with another spectacular game by the overrated New York pretty boy.
     
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  32. StLouisFinFan

    StLouisFinFan New Member

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    No, your defense and running game are 5-1. Let's not give credit where credit is not due....not when you're QB is barely completing 50% of his passes.
     
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  33. GreenMachine

    GreenMachine New Member

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    Hi, My name is now Tony Sporano
     

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