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Not picking ryan has doomed this regime

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by pumpdogs, Nov 12, 2010.

  1. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    That's really an awful counter argument. I'm not saying they are disproportionately important, they are. Simply not to the point where wins and losses are their sole responsibility, and nowhere even close to the point where you can justify taking Matt Ryan over Jake Long.
     
  2. Itsdahumidity

    Itsdahumidity X gonna take it from ya

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    btw, Stafford's last injury? He ran out of the pocket and got tackled from behind.
     
  3. gilv13

    gilv13 Well-Known Member

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    not at all. I guess the point i thought he was trying to make is that if you don't have a line to protect your QB, it doesn't matter his potential because he may never reach it, that's all.
     
  4. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Just wondering....

    Are the Atlanta Falcons building an offense to suit Ryans strengths...or are they trying to force Ryan into their offense?
     
  5. krypto

    krypto Banned

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    What are you talkin about??? We had EVERY opportunity to beat the Ravens, it was our bs tackling techniques and missed tackles that killed us.
     
  6. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    forced into their offense. how much has changed with that offense since he's arrived?
     
  7. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    No.
     
  8. Hexonx

    Hexonx Active Member

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    No this organization doesn't believe in developing QBs, so Ryan would have been classified as a bust here. Sorry I love Ryan, live in Atlanta and watching him grow up, but with our coaching he would have been pulled after a few bad games. We need a coaching staff that is going to really develop a QB long term. I like Pennington, but I think not giving Henne a chance is terrible to finish this out.
     
  9. emocomputerjock

    emocomputerjock Senior Member

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    I think if Henne had a positive TD to INT ratio, this thread doesn't happen. But here we are.
     
  10. Hexonx

    Hexonx Active Member

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    Some pieces were already there. Roddy White and Michael Jenkins. They added Michael Turner and Tony Gonzalez via free agent and trades, they then spent draft picks on the Defense and Offense line. So basically they are building the team around Ryan.

    Imagine that?
     
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  11. Two Tacos

    Two Tacos Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You aren't addressing my point, which is that you don't have to get a good to great QB in the draft, but you do for a good to great LT. Passing on Ryan doesn't mean we passed on the position. Can you get a good LT later than the first round? Sure, but same goes with the QB position. You cannot get a good LT in free agency, can get Brees, or Warner, or Vick, or Pennington for that matter.
     
  12. Hexonx

    Hexonx Active Member

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    No question about it, but putting him on the bench does nothing. We did the same thing to John Beck, we classified him a bust after a couple games. We brought another free agent in and never let him play. Im not saying Henne is a bust, but I do think he is scared to throw the ball sometimes, I don't think Henning is helping him with his play calling at all. We are a mess right now. I hope Pennington goes 6-2 but it still doesnt answer any questions going forward, its obvious Marshall needs help.

    Dare I say this, but would we be a lot better with Ted Ginn still here who can at the very least run a simple go route and open things up?

    I have never bashed Sparano, but I was never a fan of Henning anyways. The way I see it is our coaching staff is afraid to win. They are way too conservative, and it hasnt helped Henne at all.
     
  13. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    michael turner was there. they got him in free agency prior to the draft. only gonzalez was really added
     
  14. JimToss

    JimToss Thank You Chad Pennington

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    Did our FO not say we liked Henne just as much as they liked Ryan?
    It may just have been coachspeak, but if this is the truth, they got absolutely amazing value.

    Again if this is truth we technically could have selected Henne #1 overall. Or we could have had DE Chris Long. Either way we would have been without a LT and a QB.

    It may not have panned out that way, but as the draft was happening they believed they got a HOF LT and a franchise QB. I have done the same thing if I felt that way.

    Praises would have and still have the chance to be sung from the mountaintops for the 2008 draft.
     
  15. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    ONLY Gonzalez? Sheesh...thats a pretty big Only....
     
  16. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    we added marshall, the ravens added boldin. all the 2008 QBs got new toys :lol: except for brian brohm who got coal in his stocking
     
  17. Phinatic19

    Phinatic19 New Member

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    Right... While we continue to wait and let Henne 'develop' we'll be passing up on actual talent... Henne sucks, face it. All this be patient nonsense is crap.

    Look at Mark Sanchez, look at Sam Bradford, look at Matt Ryan, look at Joe Flacco.

    Chad Henne, in his 3rd year, 8 TDs, 10 INTs, BENCHED.

    Sam Bradford, rookie, 10+ TDs, 8+ INTs, STARTER.

    :up:
     
  18. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    water over the bridge
    however just for sport
    I would have gone with Ryan or Flacco
    both were doable, legitimate options
     
  19. NJFINSFAN1

    NJFINSFAN1 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    And name one thing they have that we don't that helps a young QB???

    A Running game, we don't run the ball!!!!!

    Put any of those QB's on our team and we are no better than 4-4.
     
  20. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Ding ding ding. Props for remembering the Tedford QB knock.

    To be fair, no way Rodgers excels here. He would have been ruined too.

    I said it before, Ryan should have been the pick. The knock on him was he had a stud WR and a stud RB. So we have stud RBs and a stud WR and still can't score a lick. The litmus test is this weekend. If Pennington leads us into the promise land (the endzone) then what?
     
  21. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I agree and also thought Ryan should've been the pick. Obviously Jake is great and you can't turn back the clock, but we could've had Ryan and say Michael Oher the following year. Probably a much better combo then Long/Henne.

    I've said it before, but Henne is what he is. There may be nothing wrong with his development but at the peak, he's still going to be just ok. By the time Ryan/flacco, etc got to 21 starts they were clearly franchise type guys. Henne is at 21 starts and is still just ok.

    Hell, he was better last year.
     
  22. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    We had Vernon Carey who graded out pretty darn good in his one year at LT.

    And I've listed before, and in this thread someone else did, the terrible LT's of the super bowl winning teams. Bushrod of the saints wasn't even guaranteed a starting job this year. David Diehl of the Giants was a stopgap, slid over from LG (having never played LT) and was a terrible LT. And they still won.
     
  23. FinsAreLife

    FinsAreLife Well-Known Member

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    I just dont think this thread is a good one. Youre debating something you really just cant change. Our pick was well spent.
     
  24. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    Even using hindsight, you'd have been better off trading to get Sam Bradford.
     
  25. The G Man

    The G Man Git 'r doooonnne!!!

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    I have to admit...sitting there watching the game last night, I was filled with "what if's" re; Ryan. Kid would've looked really good in aqua and orange. But, Long was the "safe" pick. And, Henne's eventual success or failure will forever be tied to the hip of the Long pick. Right now, it is questionable IMO. But, the jury is still out. We probably won't know for sure until next year.

    But yeah...knowing then what we all know now, I would've definitely taken Ryan first overall. It's looking like he's gonna end up along the same lines of Manning & Brady at the rate he's going. In fact, he was compared favorably to both last night by the analysts for his smarts. So, it's kinda hard to not at least wonder...what if?
     
  26. Hexonx

    Hexonx Active Member

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    They added Boldin, TJ, Stalworth, drafted Ray Rice. Yeah they are building around Flacco.
     
  27. TiP54

    TiP54 Bad Reputation

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    We didn't stop him, but we sure as hell contained him. IIRC he had two runs of 10 yards back to back. You take that away and he was under 4 yac. And 50 receiving yards? 1 screen went for 37. Not saying he didint do anything, he just didint have the type of success that numbers say he did.
     
  28. mommabilly

    mommabilly No riders allowed

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    This is Parcells MO, in his entire coaching career, the man has never gone big time in the draft on a QB.
     
  29. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    Yeah the Ravens, definitely have gone into high gear
     
  30. finserg

    finserg Well-Known Member

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    Cant complain about jake but the Qb is more difficult to take ,We missed a very good Qb but to look back now is plain dum.We have a great left tackle in jake long.
     
  31. SeanP

    SeanP Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I disagree with this to be honest.

    The only way to think he would have worked out here is to assume that he would have been as successful with our receivers, as he was with the ones he has in Atlanta. Not to mention that he would have played second fiddle to our running attack.

    I think he's a great player, but it's really hard, if not impossible to say he would have worked out better than Long has. Long is a perennial pro bowler here, now, on this team. If Long was a mediocre top 10 at best LT, I'd be inclined to agree with you. But he's a top 3, if not #1 at his position, and a very important position.

    If Ryan did what he did in Atlanta, here, ok I can agree with the argument, but there's no way to tell that.
     
  32. pumpdogs

    pumpdogs Well-Known Member

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    Lets see it is pretty easy to find a great qb in free agency,lets see 11 years later we are still searching for one.
    Let me ask you this do brees,manning,big ben,,brady have hall of fame left tackles?Are most of these qbs going to the hall of fame?The moral of the story is you don't need a hall of fame left tackle to win a superbowl but it sure does help to have a hall of fame qb.
     
  33. Two Tacos

    Two Tacos Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Ryan wasn't our only chance at getting a good QB. Jake was our only chance at getting a HOF LT. Ryan has only just begun to out play Henne, and the book isn't closed on Henne yet. Just because our FO has made bad decisions when it comes to FA QBs doesn't mean they have to continue to. Even with the draft they could have made moves to get Flacco or Freeman, even taken a flier on Mccoy (who is looking like he'd fit this O to a T) they didn't because they thought Henne was the real deal. If he isn't, that is going to be the mistake, not passing on Ryan for Jake Long. They commited to Henne.
     
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  34. AdamC13

    AdamC13 Well-Known Member

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    Well said...could you imagine the disaster the Chargers would have been in if they passed on Ryan Leaf, or the Bengals on Akili Smith, or the Browns on Tim Couch, or the Lions on Joey Harrington, or the Raiders on Jamarcus Russell, or the 49ers on Alex Smith, or the...

    Had those teams not drafted their franchise QBs it might have set those franchise's back years.
     
  35. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Really? 'Cause it's kind of difficult for me to see how you "go big time" on a quarterback more than he did when he used the #1 overall pick on Drew Bledsoe.
     
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  36. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Thank you. "You do not pass on a franchise qb when you need one" might be the most asinine draft platitude there is. How the **** do you know which one the franchise ones are?
     
  37. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Name all their back up quarterbacks.

    Exactly.
     
  38. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Atlanta: Chris Redman-played well coming in for an injured Ryan last year and kept team afloat during disastrous Bobby Petrino tenure/fallout. A viable short term option if Ryan had crapped the bed.

    Baltimore: Marc bulger-Former pro bowler. Certainly a viable short term guy had Flacco completely stunk up the joint.

    NYJ: Kellen Clemens/Mark Brunell-you have a point here.
     
  39. Big Red

    Big Red Long Lasting Freshness

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    I wouldn't say "doomed." But it might have set us back a few years. Three years after Parcells, Ireland, and Sparano took charge it appears we are still looking for a QB.

    True. But it's hard not to think about it in our current situation.

    Hopefully this is true. Because it will be hard to stomach Matt Ryan hoisting the Lombardi trophy while the Dolphins continue to wallow in mediocrity.

    This is what eats at me also. Not Oher so much although he is probably the best option after Long. But the fact that we could have drafted Ryan and addressed our left tackle position another way.

    This is every Dolphins fan's greatest fear isn't it? We all have to ask ourselves if we have honestly seen greatness in Henne. Personally I have seen the potential but I have also seen an awful lot of turnovers and mistakes. I just don't know if Henne can overcome his weaknesses and live up to his potential.

    Best post I have read in days! :up:

    If I'm being honest, knowing then what I know now, I agree with you. I would've taken Ryan. Especially in light of our current situation. How could you not?!
     
  40. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Matt Ryan

    17-1 AT HOME!!!!!!!

    Chad Henne

    11-11 Overall, 3-6 at home, 5 straight losses.

    Yes, these two guys are exactly the same player.
     

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