Trust me, I understand. I completely agree that Henne needs to finish drives in the endzone. He needs to improve in that area. But, he DOES move the ball quite well. Which tells me he can get the job done. Just has to finish better.
The offensive inneptitude we witnessed last night had VERY little to do with Thigpen, and EVERYTHING to do with injuries along the OL. You just can't play against a professional NFL defense using what turned out to be the third string center calling the line calls and the guard positions scrambled beyond recognition. It all starts with the OL, for success and failure, and it didn't matter what QB you had in there last night, the end result would have been similar. Think about it. You're chicago. You see a third string QB and a make shift third string-esque OL and you should be thinking, "take away the run (just got ALOT easier with injuries) and blitz the hell out the QB and make him beat you." And that's what happened. Miami was a three legged dog last night and then to make matters worse, Marshall goes out. The injury bug has turned into a pandemic plague for this team and is a mere shadow of the team that it fielded just one week ago when it beat a very good Tennessee team, and did so by nailing the coffin shut at the end of the game by letting their third string QB march down the field and score a TD. Have to keep things in proper perspective. Thigpen wasn't the problem. Injuries was the problem and that's not something Henne can fix, unless he's an athletic trainer/surgeon. I don't think Hyde is saying the Dolphins have given up on Henne, but just as I have stated here before, they're not likely to put all their eggs in his basket next year either. They must hedge their bets. QB is a position you HAVE to get right, and Henne has at the very least shown the coaches and many of us fans enough red flags that the front office should at least give it a good long hard look. STarting now.
i agree that the offensive line was probably 90% of the problem. thigpen had some bad moments though. that wounded duck to marshall i believe that was picked was flat out awful
That's because a lot of folks here just never take off the orange & aqua glasses. If they can't see that in order to save the season, the coaching staff was benching Henne, all because they have no confidence in his ability to lead us to a playoff, you're never going to convince them. They would buy a piece of the Everglades from Tony Sparano if he was selling it.
I am not defending Thigpen's play last night because I had stated on a previous thread that I never thought that Thigpen was anything more than a third string QB in the NFL. But to assume Henne was playing with the same group of players during his time at QB as Thigpen did last night. Just does not make sense. First of all. Jake long played the worst game of his career. Of course this has a lot to do with the fact he was only playing with one good arm. Vernon Carey played as if he had never played right tackle before. The interior of the offensive line played terribly. You had a second team center start the game and after being injured. He was replaced by Incognito, who was the starting left guard but the third team center. As far as providing any type of rushing attack which would have taken pressure off Thigpen. Well Ricky and Ronnie combined for a grand total of 11 yards for the evening. Also let's not forget that Thighpen had to play most of the game without Marshall. Even when Marshall was in the game. He dropped more passes then he caught. So comparing the squad Henne has played with this year to the players Thigpen had to play with is really unfair. Because if Henne had played with these same players last night. The Dolphins would not have been any more effective on offense. The play of the offense last night was terrible and no QB in NFL history could have changed the results of this game.
Sparano was trying to save the season by going with Pennington? That's like trying to put out a fire by throwing rocks at it...and dislocating your shoulder in the process.
Hyde made some great points and yet another to chime in on what was just a headscratching game plan by father time up in the booth. While Henning has a smattering of people on here who absolutely refuse to even consider that anything he does could at all be negative, there are more and more people noticing the glaring evidence. I'm still amazed at the people convinced Henne is garbage at this point as well. Unbelievable to me.
If Henne's play in the Tennessee game before the injury was any kind of indicator, Sparano benching him was brilliant. He sure looked like a different, and better QB than who I watched vs. the Ravens. After that I don't know how anybody could argue against the move. The benching was a wake up call for him. It told him to make plays, Henning be damned.
I agree,that game had disaster written all over it, and he came in and directed us to a victory that wasn't that close. thats whats up and he deserves respect for it.
I'm sorry, but if you begin tinkering with too many variables, then you risk not even knowing what the actual problem was.... as well as risk tinkering with something that may have not needed tinkering to begin with. 1) We know that Henning is washed up. I don't know how many teams he needs to be fired from before this becomes universally accepted. An OC who averages less than 20 pts/game over his entire career doesn't have a place in this current league. 2) We know that Henne CAN actually play when he's allowed to rather than being pent up like a caged lion. 3) We know Sparano can motivate a team but we're not entirely certain of his head-coaching ability. IMO, we change #1 and see how 2 & 3 respond with a new OC in place. If Sparano is either: standing up for Henning, shares Dan's mentality, or shows an inability to adapt...... then he should go too. If Henne doesn't become a top 10-15 QB during his 3rd year starting <with a qualifed OC>, then we start looking in the 2012 1st round for a suitable replacement. I don't think it will come to that.
The only franchise QB I see in this draft is Andrew Luck plain and simple. They will have to ask themselves, if trading a 1st+next year 1st+Henne+25m is worth getting that franchise QB. If not it's either trading up for Luck or using that amount of cash+two 1sts to put Henne in the best possible position to win. You make the team talented enough Henne can win it for you. I don't doubt that, but what's more likely Luck carrying your team maybe around 2014 to a SB or this current team using both 1sts+25m to make the Dolphins superior to practically any team in the league in talent. Not just slightly better, much better than the average. This is what a SB roster looks like with Chad Henne and Sparano at the helm: QB- Henne RB- Brown, Micheal Bush FB- Polite WR- Marshall, Hartline, Bess, Jacoby Jones TE- Heath Miller, Fasano LT- Long LG- Mankins C- Kalil RG- Jerry RT- Carey DE- Odrick (developed into the level of Starks), McDaniels NT- Soliai, a veteran backup on the level of Ferguson DE- Starks, Langford, Baker ROLB- Wake, Moses RILB/LILB- Dansby, David Harris LOLB- Woodley, Misi FS- Clemons matured SS- Jones playing at the level of 2008 Bell CB- Davis, Harris, Caroll CB- Allen, Sapp, Plus a top ten special teams. See how much talent I had to put on the roster to get over the fact that Sparano is coaching it. Either you outwit, you out play through your QB, or you form an uber-team. That team outside of the QB position is more talented than every champion we've seen since perhaps the 2005 Steelers. Heck they're probably more talented than every team since the 99 Rams. They're that good on both sides of the ball. They're that difficult to assemble for Sparano. Why would you give Tony Sparano that kind of talent anyway. He has to go. He's done his job rebuilding the team's effort and will to play. He's limited though.
We could definitely win if we applied the extra $25 million and 2 1st round picks to offensive weapons (b/c it's only fair to dedicate these resources to Henne if people are thinking about using them on a rookie QB). -I'd prefer Mike Sims-Walker as a #2 to Jones personally. That's close to the $25 mill I would guess. -We could trade this year's 1st back once and end up with DeMarco Murray & a top TE threat like DJ Williams. -That still leaves us with next year's first that could be used on an elite playmaking scat back (LaMichael James or Andre Ellington) or even a RT. -Add in Greg Little in the 4th and we could be similar to the Giants' offense, only more dangerous. Marshall-Walker-Bess-Hartline-Little would be talented, scary and deep..... especially with the above threats out of the backfield and at TE. We could beat defenses all over the field while picking up some serious chunk yardage w/o greatly increasing the risk IMO. There's no way that Henne's not a top 8 QB annually with resources like that to share the load. We have the tougher parts out of the way (QB, #1 WR, elite LT, premium slot WR) so it's not like taking the offense to the next level would be very difficult if we actually applied ourselves.
Still where's Harris, where's Woodley, Mankins and Kalil. Let me ask you this. What's our record with a few other HCs coaching this team? Jack Del Rio for example. Lovie Smith. Josh McDaniels.
I didn't understand what you meant by "Still where's Harris, where's Woodley, Mankins and Kalil." I didn't mention them b/c you already did. I only added on the potential draft picks. I could very well see us at 6-4 or 7-3.
If Oakland can put up points with Campbell, then there's a problem if we cant score a bunch with Henne if given the weapons to succeed.
It's playoff success you're looking for as well though. Oakland won't do a thing in the playoffs at their current rate. As for the draft, I do trust Ireland to some degree especially when they stick to picking front seven players. They're quite good at it so far especially early. I don't trust them selecting any offensive players though at the skill positions. I'd say go to free agency for that.
I think we'd be lucky to keep our current team in tact (minus dead weight) and still finagle Mankins (or Carl Nicks) & possibly a Sims Walker type #2 receiver (who would probably qualify as a #1 for some teams). We can probably forget about Woodley & Harris since our defense is getting better just by aging. Kalil might run into the same problems as Grove--- would he be that much better than Berger to warrant the money? I'd almost rather go Mankins or Nicks and give Incognito a full offseason to duke it out with Berger at C. ??????
I agree on all parts.... but I was only them as an example b/c they don't have an elite QB yet have skilled players who allow him to succeed at a higher level. I don't trust them with skilled offensive players either.... which is why I'd love SimsWalker- still only 26, big, strong, fast and is making some plays & scoring in Jax despite being their best WR threat. If he came here where Marshall can draw the extra coverage he was facing, them we'd probably see the kid completely take off. I really want to see Greg Little in the 4 round though to give it that final touch. Maybe if we get a new OC and we begin seeing a different philosophical approach to our offense, then maybe we'll begin seeing better types of players drafted to match it.
Strange little thing I just read from Omar I may have missed last week. Henne was the one calling for the max protect packages? That can't be right. All he has is a kill not a total assignment of his receivers for the actual pass play?!! That's a huge problem if true, huge problem. If it's true he doesn't trust his ability to move around in the pocket to avoid the rush. If not true then it's more bull**** info. The switch from a run-blocking interior OL to a pass blocking group. The lack of outlet valves until very late in each play as opposed to early in 2008 with Pennington. Henne feel uncomfortable in that pocket or something?
