Just a quick thought but I have been hearing about our lack of talent on this team. But then I think about so many teams that face the same issue and still win games. Who does Peyton throw to? Yes, it is Peyton, but who is catching and running the ball? And the WRs have to get open! Brady throws to no names. Cutler's WRS are........(waiting, waiting....zzzz...zzzz.....no worries, i dont really know either!) Rivers has Gates, even though he has been hurt, and the bulk of his WRs have been out all year! Can you name a Jags WR? The majority of teams dont have a All-Star roster. But they execute. The have pride. They have swagger. Are Bess, Marshall, and Hartline soooooo bad compared to most other teams? A veteran QB has the ability to make people around him better. Not every WR is all-pro but anyone who plays pro ball should at least be able to catch a five yard out!! That is why I thought Pennigton would have played much better then Henne. Oh!! We need to teach our defense to practice the foundamental things like not drop INTS and tackle............. in fact I hate the Dolphin scheme of giving so much cushion to the opposing WRS.....at least I hope that is why they other team is usually so wide open! But you gotta play like bad boys.......example.......no matter who the Ravens bring in......the new guy adopts to the new mentality and plays hard and with attitude..and besides Lewis and Reed how many defensive players in Baltimore do you know.....do the fins even have a true defensive leader? Please attack more and be attacked less!!
One guy..........hester is more of a special team.............after Hester maybe that knox kid.and then....and then..(the Jeopardy music starts to play!)......and are the bears WRs much better then the Fins? Hester or Marshall............pick one. Then Bess vs Knox.......and so on............... And I saw the Adams quote.............maybe he should coach the Fins
Peyton: Reggie Wayne Pierre Garcon Austin Collie Blair White Jacob Tamme Dallas Clark Brady: Gronkowski Aaron Hernandez Wes Welker Deion Branch Cutler: Johnny Knox Earl Bennett Devin Hester Greg Olsen Jags WRs: Mercedes Lewis Mike Sims-Walker Mike Thomas All named without looking anything up.
You said they were no names and Hester is a huge name. Knox is really good. Their third is Earl Bennett. I wouldn't put Bess Versus Knox because they are different type of receivers. I would probably pick Knox over Bess due to my love of speed though.
My point is the same......................Peyton is throwing to a guy named Tamme...........Dallas is on IR............. Collie is out AGAIN.........out for the season.....Garcon has missed 1/2 the season! And yet somebody has had to be catching the ball other then Wayne, right? There defintely has been no runniing game in Indy with the 3rd stringer RB playing!! Otherwise they would not be in the playoff hunt. Who is E.Bennet? Who is Mike Thomas? Is he on your fantasy team??? Anybody have Mike Thomas on thier fantasy team? As you write these names down, what do you think about the talent? Hasnt Sims-Walker been out 1/2 the season....nice try though.............they are normal WRs...average............just like ours...and yet those teams are in the playoffs or in contention............... Are those guys heads over heels better than Marshall, Bees, Fasano, Hartline??? How many of those guys will make the pro bowl, this year, or next...........2, 3 guys? The Qbs on those teams.............Manning, Brady, Cutler, Garrad............ superbowl, all pro, and at the very least with Garrad.............very good Qbs They work with the talent around them and help make average WRs better
I think the point within the original post is although football nerds like you and I who spend free time debating Dolphins football on the intranetz know who Sims-Walker and Mike Thomas are, casual fans across the country don't. They're not in TV commercials, they're not going to the pro bowl. Mike Nolan has helped install some swagger and attacking on defense, the whole Feed the Wolf thing was good for the guys. A lot of that has to do with consistency within the organization. Establishing that attitude and identity doesn't occur overnight. Ray Lewis and Brian Billick and Rex Ryan in Baltimore, Bill Cowher and Dick LeBeau and Troy Polamalu in Pittsburgh where the taste of Chuck Noll and Joe Green and Jack Lambert still hangs in the air, Petyon Manning and Tony Dungy in Indy, Belichick and Tom Brady in New England. Everyone is a no name until they make a name for themselves. And it has to do with the people around you and the overall success of your team. Great players play on ****ty teams all the time, the media makes you a "big name" not just your talent. Larry Fitzgerald was a big name during the 2008 playoffs and was touted as the bestest WR in football when Kurt Warner was throwing to him, but now with Max Hall and John Skelton under center I don't think I've seen a Fitzgerald highlight on tv all year. Signing several big names to fat contracts isn't the answer... ask the Redskins how that's worked the last 15 years. Brandon Marshall, Davone Bess, and Brian Hartline are a strong wide receiver group, the best Miami has seen in many years. They are young and Bess & Hartline have not reached their full potential. The defense has an identity now. The offense needs to develop one too besides "please don't turn the ball over, oh no we just turned the ball over, no negative plays, 3 is a magical number". A lot goes into what happens in Indy and NE with different no name parts being shifted in and out... it's not only the coach/QB but it's the scheme too. Players need to be put into positions where they can succeed. Something that made Jimmy Johnson great in his coaching career was putting no name players in positions to succeed, take advantage of their positives and hide their negatives, create mis-matches. It all doesn't come together overnight, Troy Aikman and Michael Irvin played on a 1-15 team. The defense is clearly on the right path and a few turnovers away from being elite, if all the elements can be maintained. It's about consistency. Dansby, Davis, and Wake should be the faces of the Dolphins defense for years to come. Mike Nolan was the best offseason acquisition last year.
We are making 2 different points..........I dont want to give you the idea other teams are not talented...............they have hard working WRS and good ones....to make it to the NFL..you have to have some talent..my point is this....... are we REALLY so far behind in talent......in some cases, compared to other teams, we might even be better talent wise....... ........what would Brady do with Bess? We know what Brady did with Welker. What kind of numbers would fasano put up with Manning? Or would Marshall be an upgrade over any of the Jags or Bears WR corp. And when you think of Hester....you think kick returns............not really WR ....or have you seen his highlights......... the majority of success he has enjoyed is as a awesome returner............he is a good WR, but a SPECIALIST in special teams.......... I dont know but I would be curious to see how may catches he actually has. And the bulk of his TDs are in ........... A) special teams or B) receptions My conversation tackles the corp of WRs............but ok add Hester....doesnt change the point..........
excellent points......but the fins have not lost over the past 30 yrs for lack of talent............MARINO, TAYLOR, ZACH, And this year....i dont think the WRs were the major problem....some blame......but not the major issue......... We have had the best coaches in football come in with Parcells, Jimmy Johnson, and the offensive mind of Cam-which did not work- but you get it.....and of course Shula......... it is frustrating......... no matter who has come in or paroled the sideline...the fins always play the same...........never getting better.....never make the push like other teams...they just stay around the middle of the pack year after year.............the play on the field is pretty much the same. They go on a run and break your heart........... coaches bring in new ideas and philosafies......same results..........draft..........dont get me started! I am always at the stadium for the draft, and I wish you could see peoples faces when the name is announced. It goes from huge excitement and anticipation.......with people shouting out popular names to total silence and disgust.........you hear a ton of NOOOOO!!!!!!!!! and HUH??? and dont forget WHO????
The QB issue stands out.....but the defense even improved has missed tons of tackles and dropped game changing INTS. Our all pro kicker missed 4 kicks the other day.....the coaches seem clueless.............this teamis NOT one QB away from greatness.........but the QB doesnt help!!
If your point is to say that Brady and Manning and Cutler are better/more experienced than our 2nd year QB then I think most would agree.
My point is that people say things to suggest Miami is losing due to lack of talent.....such like the WR corp. I see teams with the same issues...the same level of talent..... endure and over come. They still make pushes when under-maned or deplieted. Why? Are they so much better than Miami, at least on paper? I dont think so........those other teams play better when faced with the same conditions. Why? Im not sure what it is...an intangable.....hard to explain..... It has to be that they have a conviction or never say die attitude. They are hungry. They have a ceratin pride or swagger about them and the team they play for..............I havent seen Miami play with that actitude in forever Why do you think Miami has been so up and down these past 30 years?? If you had to put your finger on one thing........
We have a QB who is learning on the fly. The Pats and Colts have HOF QB's with 10+ years experience. The Jags & Bears have experienced QBs who have Pro-Bowl on their resume. That's the main difference. Cutler threw 26 TDs-27 INTs last year when he had no running game and a crappy OC. Mike Martz comes in, and with the same basic cast, he's playing much better. Less mistakes more wins, so yes, coaching plays a role. Manning has had to deal w/ injuries all year, and he's having his worst season since he was a rookie. Brady eats spinach for breakfast, wheaties for lunch, and gummy berry juice for dinner, that explains a lot. Garrard is an interesting guy with respect to Henne. I think Henne can have a similar type career, consistently average, needing a good running game and a few weapons to be any better than that. But again, these are seasoned vets, HOF guys, Proro Bowlers etc. I don't think its fair to compare our guy to them. He'll come out looking bad every time.
There's a thing about tailoring a system to a QB. NO has 6'0'' Brees so they just got a bunch of freakishly tall WR's. Rivers is great with the deep high ball so everyone is tall and pretty quick. Manning throws to spots to great route runners are the key in his offense. Reggie Wayne is in the top 2 in route running between he and L. Fitz. Collie and Gonzalez (when healthy) run great routes. David Garrard is better inside the numbers than stretching the field and that's what Mike Thomas and Marcedes (spell the damn name right lol) Lewis. Joe Flacco can throw hard and high, they got guys who can catch anything that looks like a football. Mark Sanchez sucks, so they got ****ty receivers. Rodgers throws a nice deep ball in stride so they have Jennings and Finley who are great runners. Driver is just damn good. Actually, all of the Packers receivers are built the same way. Steelers have Big Ben who can rocket a pass so they got Wallace and the rest of those guys are great blockers for the run. Ryan is good at deep and intermediate passes. Tony G is just him and Roddy White works best in those areas. Brady is just excellent at the short and intermediate passes but was slipping on the deep throws. They got rid of Moss, got Branch, two great TE's, and now are YAC monsters. Looking at it, I don't think we have the personnel to fit our QB. I think Pads pointed out he works best with a myriad of targets (like Brady now) out of the shotgun. More of a Spread rather than traditional. A 3 WR set as well. I think if we don't have the right personnel to suit him, send him somewhere else and get someone it suits. If it doesn't get us wins then our overall philosophy is shot. At this point, our two best WR's are both slot guys. Our best boundary receiver is a fourth round pick, our TE is a great number 2 who won't spread the D thin. If we could spread the D more we might be able to have more success. I think some new cleets are beneficial too. From preseason our guys were falling down all the time.
I think Team philosophy is... [video=youtube;79vdlEcWxvM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79vdlEcWxvM[/video]
I agree with everything you said. Except in Miami's case. We have all types of schemes and WRs of all size and abilities. We have changed coaching philosophies..... and there has been no change as far as making the playoffs or general results on the field. hey have gone after every type of WR Musclar- (Boston) Fast- (Ginn jr, Tony Martin ) Slow /hands- (Welker) Big- ( Gangsten, Marshall) Hands- ( McDuffie) All-pro ( Marks Bros.) And dont forget Keith Jackson We have had our share of talent at WR..........all sizes........... different skills........... we've changed the offense..tried different QBs.......changed the back field ten times.......... how curse can a team be that nothing has worked!!
