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Dolphins Have To Believe In Henne

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Georgia Fin, Jan 18, 2011.

  1. Georgia Fin

    Georgia Fin Fin For Life

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  2. Oghma

    Oghma Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Can they afford the risk though? If they stand pat with Henne and he tanks then the 2011 season is lost along with Sparano and Ireland's jobs.

    I think they will go looking for another option at QB.

    I've no real idea if Henne can be salvaged but I doubt we find out in Miami.
     
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  3. Ohio Fanatic

    Ohio Fanatic Twuaddle or bust Club Member

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    they really don't have a choice. the QB options out there (right now) stink. McNabb, Vince Young both stink and would ruin this franchise. anyone else is a scrub. Henne does have some major faults, but if our new OC could actually try to coach around Henne's strengths instead of his weaknesses, then Henne could be good enough to salvage next season.

    my point exactly. if you have one of the 3 or 4 elite QBs, then they can thrive under most circumstances. Since we don't, and neither does the other 27 teams, you have to figure out how to properly utilize the tools you have and nurture Henne. Like any other average to above-average QB, you give him time to pass and a reliable running game and he can be good enough to win games. We can draft another QB this year or get a free agent QB in another year.
     
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  4. brandon27

    brandon27 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Good article, but it reads like it was written by an 8 year old.

    Henne has his flaws, and made some boneheaded mistakes through the year, you'd expect that. At the end of the day though, this article makes a really great point IMO. It's no wonder this organization has had some talented guys come in here at QB with tons of potential and failed miserably. Every one of them has been under the immense pressure to be Marino 2, and our coaching staffs are constantly turning over to the point where nobody here has been patient enough to try and actually develop one of these guys. Hopefully Daboll is here to help to that with Henne. It has to happen this year, I just don't see any other options right now for this team at QB realistically. The fact that Sparano is still here though, is going to make it tough to put Henne out on the field at all unless he really lights it up all camp and preseason.... of course thats if there's a season.
     
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  5. Rocky Raccoon

    Rocky Raccoon Greasepaint Ghost Staff Member

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    If Daboll brings the Patriots' style spread offense here like he wants to, then that might favor Henne. The new coaches are going to have to work with him this offseason.
     
  6. GMJohnson

    GMJohnson New Member

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    I disagree with the idea that the teams success depends on the performance of a young QB. Sanchez sucked in 09 and made it to the AFCCG. He was average this year, and again, AFCCG. That's b/c Sanchez has a running game, a defense, play makers, and the public & private backing of his coaches and front office staff. Sanchez isn't asked to carry his team week in and week out. Nor does he have to look over his shoulder every time he throws a bad pass. The number of differences is countless, the difference in salary (10million vs less than 1 million) perhaps the biggest. Perhaps most important though, one guy is being made out to be the franchise even when clearly he's not, the other is being set up as the fall guy, when obviously, he is not.
     
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  7. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    they can bring in two new QBs and not hurt Henne's feelings by dumping Thigpen and Pennington. One vet to replace Pennington and one rookie or 2nd yr QB off someone's roster
     
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  8. GMJohnson

    GMJohnson New Member

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    OK, but 2 new QBs solves nothing though. Two better QBs will help, but I don't see any. I see lots of better RBs, WRs, TEs & OL. Firing Henning was addition by subtraction. We tried to fire Sparano but it didn't work. The OC & HC both gone (almost) within a week of the season, that tells me that the GM/brass think our problems go much deeper than QB.
     
  9. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    i dont think daboll is better then henning by any stretch. we will see though. i agree however that we need a vet that is capable though. maybe hasselbeck
     
  10. Buckeyetroop

    Buckeyetroop Active Member

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    IMO Sanchez and Henne shouldn't be mentioned in same breath. Sanchez shows leadership capabilities that his teammates seem to rally around. He struggled at times but has big play abilities. He can make things happen. I'm not a big fan of Sanchez's but I think when all is said and done their careers will be vastly different for all those reasons.
     
  11. Abbi Normal

    Abbi Normal Banned

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    Wouldn't be surprised, if they still believed in Henne. Part of Sparanos big flaws, recognizing talent in a timely fashion. But from the direction we've been going nothing would surprise me. And frankly at this point after the preceding disappointing 10 years of spinning our wheels and shocking decision currently being made I don't really give a damn.

    And anyone who still thinks Henne can be a #1 QB in the NFL needs to have my brain implanted or go to Davie and apply for a job.........
     
  12. Rocky Raccoon

    Rocky Raccoon Greasepaint Ghost Staff Member

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    How much does Henning pay you to change his diaper? :shifty:
     
  13. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    lol. i think we can hope he's better (the guy's 35 or so) but there is nothing in his career that you can say this is a better coordinator at this stage. i think you're thoughts are what we all have to wish for. that the guy never really ran his style of offense and miami will be the first place that he does. because if he runs what he ran in cleveland we'll be like the panthers fans who regretted getting rid of henning for jeff davidson. right now this seems more like a jeff davidson hire then a josh mcdaniels hire but hopefully i'm wrong
     
  14. Rocky Raccoon

    Rocky Raccoon Greasepaint Ghost Staff Member

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    I wanted a young guy with experience in a dynamic offense, which he had in New England. So we'll see what happens.
     
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  15. GreysonWinfield

    GreysonWinfield Release The Hounds

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    Bring in Bulger.
     
  16. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    LeBatard makes the point I've been trying to make the entire year, but does it in a way I never could. Great article.
     
  17. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    And LOL at the comments below that article. Talk about not being able to see the forest through the trees.
     
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  18. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Right on many different levels, lack of patience, coaching carousel, no patience for young Qb's.

    And a lockout.

    The difference to me between Henne and Sanchez, is not the Stat Monkey stuff, it is Sanchez is 4-1 in the playoffs, while Henne has not shown anything to cause a reasonable person to believe he is our Qb of the future.
     
  19. JimToss

    JimToss Thank You Chad Pennington

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    If the Dolphins end up believing in Henne.
    I believe we win 6 games next year.
     
  20. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Sanchez makes numerous big plays which off set some of his bonehead decisions. Henne, not so much. That's the difference.

    Second, it's hilarious for LeBatard to write this column when he's been bashing Henne on his show all year. Now he wants to be contrarian?

    Finally, going into this season expecting Daboll to work miracles with Henne, when he's worked no miracle with any QB (I don't care what Penny says, he was 1-7 as a starter with Daboll and was benched for Kellen Clemens) is a recipe for abject disaster.

    This hire came about becasue we couldn't get anybody better. I've accepted that's the scenario we're in until Sparano miraculously has a 11-12 win season or he's fired.
     
  21. Coral Reefer

    Coral Reefer Premium Member

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    While this may be the case with Henne the problem with the QB position has been a lack of investment in it.
    For over a decade we didn't invest in the QB spot and everyone that was brought in to "address" it were bargain basement finds.
    I agree that scrapping Henne is bad move. I completely believe in player development and that a player can progress. It takes time and commitment by a staff.
    Having said that lets not ignore what the real issue at QB has been with the Dolphins and that is criminal neglect.

    I also don't at all agree with the whole "Ghost of Marino" deal.
    None of these coaching staffs had expected a Marino.
    Hell, their choices on filling the spot proves that.
    The QB's brought in during the past were just expected to be good in their own right and worse, in the Wanny years, just a caretaker is all he wanted.
    None of them were good. They played exactly to what the level their pedigree said they would. Marino had nothing to do with that. The lack of talent did.
     
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  22. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Well, I still do believe Henne can flourish in a no huddle/hurry up offense which can be a portion of the Spread, as 3 or more Wr's actually makes reads simpler.

    As for Daboll, well he has not done a thing good or bad so far, so I am willing to let him at least live up or live down, to his resume.
     
  23. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    If they don't believe in Henne long term then every minute we continue to spend on him is simply a waste of time. If they do believe in him they have a funny way of showing it.
     
  24. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Disagree, Henne has been handed to much imho, he was the heir apparent since 2008 and he has not shown he should remain in that role via his play, which to means it is time for a real competition for the Qb job.
     
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  25. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    But you don't think they should bring in a first rounder, so who is the competition?

    Another stopgap, like Hasselbeck? An unproven guy who will cost a first, like Kolb? A reclamation project like VY?

    And forget about Orton. John Fox said it is open competition between he and Tebow next year.
     
  26. Coral Reefer

    Coral Reefer Premium Member

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    What young QB's were there that this franchise has "had a lack of patience" with?

    Prior to 2007 the last semi serious QB prospect we drafted was Scott Mitchell in 1990
    We've neglected to bring in talent period.
    Were addressing it now but it's too damn late and that's why were still suffering.
    You don't go 17 years without attempting to develop a QB and then wonder why you can't find one.
    Organization as been unbelievably stupid in that regard.
     
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  27. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Ill tell you why he is ..... because of the fact he is 35 and is just now making his mark. Part of Hennings issues....were he was a battle worn OC...who had no reason to change how he did things. A young OC who wants to obviously become an elite coach in the NFL...is going to be energetic...and aggresive. For that reason alone he is better....
     
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  28. rdhstlr23

    rdhstlr23 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't agree with a certain part of the article. The Jets didn't open it up for Mark Sanchez. What the Jets did do correctly is surround Mark Sanchez with all the talent in the world. He has 4-5 good/very good WRs, respectively. He's got a great offensive line with a fine running game, along with an OC committed to that running game. If you watched, and I think most of us watched, the NYJ vs. NE game last week, you'll see that there wasn't many throws Mark Sanchez made--other than the TD to Holmes, which a great catch as well. Everything was simple crossing routes, pop outs/ins, and hitches. They didn't really "open it up". Matter of fact, Jets fans would get just as frustrated at Schottenheimer as we did Henning for the bland/conservative gameplan. Really gives you an idea of how average Sanchez is--but hey he's got very good coaches and teammates around him that pick up his play.

    Enough of Sanchez, but I'm starting to agree with the belief that the coaching staff is a bit more to blame about Henne's regression as the player himself. With that said, we've got to do something about the position. Someone has to be brought in and Chad Henne needs to earn the job outright through the offseason/training camp--if there is an offseason/training camp.
     
  29. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Every coach since 03 has been under the gun CR, that is undeniable and it has led to several colossal mistakes being made at the Qb position, Wanny in 04 had the "win or else' threat in comes Feely, Saban had no interest in developing anything in comes Culpepper, Cameron was all sunshine and flowers until we were 0-8..in steps John Beck.

    That is why the new dumbest thing I've heard is "Sparano should draft a Qb for the future!" coupled to "If Sparano starts the season 2-4 he is fired!!"

    *Gosh* those two things seem to be at odds...
     
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  30. GMJohnson

    GMJohnson New Member

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    Agree. Sanchez' TEAM wins games, Henne's team doesn't. For some reason, wins and losses are attributed to QBs and no other position. D'Brickashaw Ferguson better than Jake b/c he wins playoff games. Jason Taylor is better than Cam Wake b/c Taylor made the AFCCG and Wake is sitting at home. Silly right? But it's done with QBs ad nauseum.
     
  31. Coral Reefer

    Coral Reefer Premium Member

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    I have a foot on both sides of this argument

    I don't believe that "not giving up on Henne" means he is handed the starting job next year like some tend to think.
    Henne is in fact still in that time frame where a young player can learn and progress. He has shown flashes of really good ability with the flashes of putridity.
    I think the Dolphins need to see if with a new influence, a coach making a concentrated effort to help him in the areas needs to improve in and an OC that will hopefully call a game to the talents we have will make a difference.

    Having said that, QB is too important a position to leave up in the air.
    Competition is needed.
    I would LOVE if we brought Hasselbeck in as the "stop gap".
    You know you're going to get a certain level of play out of him.

    Secondly I'd also like to see us draft a QB.
    I'm not enamored with any of the 1st rounders except for Gabbert personally.
    I don't think any of the rest are those special talents youd like to see drafting in the 1st.
    I've become enamored with Devlin like some others have.
    I'd love to see us trade down, pick up a couple second round spots and go from there.
    There are some QB prospects that have been talked about that show good promise and we'd be able to upgrade other positions as well.
     
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  32. GMJohnson

    GMJohnson New Member

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    Man, I was with you on the 1st paragraph. Then you lost me :lol:.

    If Sanchez has a great OL, good WRs, solid coaching and that makes him and his team a success, how does bringing in another QB to help Henne? Did Kellen Clemens or Mark Brunell help Sanchez? I doubt it. But Mangold, Ferguson, Greene, Tomlinson, Edwards, Holmes, Cotchery and the #3 defense helped him a bunch.

    IMO, instead of bringing in a QB to challenge Henne, we should use our limited resources to support Henne and make his job a little easier.
     
  33. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Best man they feel is right for the job should be brought in, be that a Vet, a 1st rd pick, whomever.

    One of the pratfalls here is A) dolfans are unhappy B) they then feel they are General Managers

    I enjoy playing armchair GM as much as the next fella, I also know it takes hours of studying game tapes on a player before a decision can be made whether to acquire them just tossing names out is fine, but no GM makes decisions that way.
     
  34. PHINANALYST

    PHINANALYST Well-Known Member

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    that's my biggest issue with the Daboll hire .... we were interviewing 2 candidates that already HAVE developed QBs - but yet we chose Daboll .... exactly why would we do that???

    FWIW, i would love to see Sanchez try to work miracles with this team .... the JESTS WRs are always open by 2 steps -- wonder why that is ... he would look like Thigpen here.
     
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  35. adamprez2003

    adamprez2003 Senior Member

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    being aggressive doesnt make you good it just makes you aggressive and there is noone in cleveland who believes he was agressive
     
  36. GMJohnson

    GMJohnson New Member

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    You've got to have the players to get aggressive with. Cant beat tanks and artillery with rifles and mortars.
     
  37. mbmonk

    mbmonk I have no clue

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    I could understand the call to open it up if we were running the ball 40+ times a game and throwing 12+ times. But that wasn't the case last year. Henne average more attempts per game than Sanchez, Rothlesburger, Brady, Aaron Rodgers, Flaco, and Cutler.

    Out of the Top 15 QB's in attempts per game only 2 have more INT's than TD's. They are McNabb and Henne. Fitzpatrick of the Buffalo Bills has more TD's than INT and a better QB rating. Fitzpatrick had to play roughly the same schedule as the Dolphins. Have a look for yourself: http://www.nfl.com/stats/categoryst...-s=PASSING_ATTEMPTS_PER_GAME_AVG&d-447263-n=1

    If one is arguing that the coaching staff was playing it safe in terms of calling the offense. Then is it not even more alarming that Henne threw more INT's than TD's? If we are making safe play calls then the chance of INT's should go down, but Henne was tied for 4th in the league int terms of total INT's thrown. ( http://www.nfl.com/stats/categoryst...d-447263-s=PASSING_INTERCEPTIONS&d-447263-n=1 ).

    If someone wants to genuinly argue that the coaching staff was just calling plays that didn't fit into Henne's strengths (an argument I am not opposed to), then they should back it up with what Henne's strengths are that are being under utilized and what weaknesses that the coaching staff failed to minimize. The best example would be CK's PA pass article. Though I don't remember CK arguing what strengths that Henne possessed that the coaching staff didn't exploit.

    I also don't remember CK arguing that Henne was a quality QB either. Which is opposite of LeBatard is suggesting here. LeBatard is suggesting that Henne is a quality QB and we just need to "treat him right and love on him" so to speak and he will blossom into a franchise QB I assume. The problem is confidence isn't 'given' as LeBatard is suggesting; it's earned. Confidence from the players and coaching staff is earned through action. Has Henne earned that confidence? The suggestion seems to be no in terms of the coaching staff. I don't know about the players. Hard to truly know what his fellow players think.
     
  38. mbmonk

    mbmonk I have no clue

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    Sorry. To clarify and shorten my argument LeBatard is suggesting that we should give our confidence to Henne and things will be fine. But people never just "give" their confidence, It's earned by someone through actions.

    In the entire article where does he show that Chad Henne ( not Sanchez, not Brady, etc..) has earned anyone's confidence? The entire argument in the article is based on other QB's in the league. The actions and deeds that matter are those of and by Chad Henne, not Mark Sanchez or Tom Brady. I will have confidence in Henne when he earns it. Almost nothing about this season gave me confidence in Henne.
     
  39. Striking

    Striking Junior Member

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    Dan hit on some of the issues with this team but the biggest was lack of depth. Too many injuries on the line and not enough talent to back-up effectively. I don't want to go into the same issues about the line, receivers who dropped way too many passes and awful game calling/plans. The coaching staff that was here is essentially gone, pretty much only the HC remains and he's been told to open things up. Players who were on the fringe will be challenged by new blood and will likely be cycled out. To save his job Sparano will bring a QB who can challenge for the starting job, what does it prove if we win 10 games with a McNabb or Hasselback I don't know, to me it would be 2008 all over again. Ireland will need to bring in talent on offense to make this whole thing go, being big is not enough. I believe there is enough talent here to have a 9 or even 10 win team. We just need more playmakers (stop dropping INTs), and guys that can get those extra yards simply because they are faster to make us an 11 win team.
     
  40. dolphan197

    dolphan197 New Member

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    "and I'm sure that I’m hoping, as is everyone else, that he goes down as the greatest quarterback in Miami Dolphins history –- and you know what that will mean."
    -Stephen Ross
     

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