Dabolls offense needs a solid RB, of which, we do not have one so I can see us taking him unless we get someone to trade us down and we get a second round pick out of the deal. If we trade down I see us going Oline with the lower pick and perhaps pickup Locker in the second round or third.
Depends on who left on the board..lol....most likely Iam gonna take the player..You need serious production from that position, stability, playmaking ability, very low risk factor, hi character, you need the balance in your offense, definite worthy of the pick imo.
If he's at 15 and we are at 15 draft him. No question about it. We're going to trade back again though to get back our 2nd rounder. Hopfully we can draft someone who will be a standout this year. Merling and Odrick still havent lived up to making a trade back a good move.
I voted yes but it really depends. Could they trade back and pick up a very valuable 2nd? I'd do that before drafting a Rb at 15. Or could Jones be sitting there as well? Jones is a talent that makes a lot of sense for this offense as well.... what to do
I've been saying "Draft Ingram" all along, but with the recent rise in Ryan Mallett's price, I'd rather trade back and get Mallett and either offensive linemen, a free safety or a rush linebacker... maybe even a tight end. What's been evident to me, of late is that, if you have a good passing offense, the running game will sort of fall into place, regardless of who the back is. I say this with the Saints and Packers in mind.
IMO he's the safest pick on the board and he might turn into the next Emmitt Smith. The only real downside is his position. The running back position has become fungible and you might get 90% of the production from a 2nd, 3rd or later pick or combination of picks or a FA. Basically, I see nothing wrong with picking Ingram. I see all the risk in the opportunity cost of what else you might pick. So for me it depends on what else is available. I think I would value the opportunity cost more than Ingram if Newton or Gabbert slipped to our pick (value of the QB position) or if a trade down was available (value of multiple picks). But I think I would take Ingram over WRs like Green or Jones (should they slip) based on our needs even though they may be higher value prospects. I'm less sure about taking Ingram over a guy like Miller (LB) whom I like a lot but might not be a great fit or as big of a need. I'm also torn on Pouncy (OL) whom I also like a lot and is a similarly high need, but is also at a position that can generally be filled later.
This. I'd hope they'd have enough sense to draft Ingram and maybe find some interior help in the form of John Moffitt and Brandon Fusco (I read the Draft Winds column!).
I agree Dup..Iam gettin that guy somehow, I mean when I do my mock, its always under the scenario that iam gonna move current players to recoup that 2nd, but if I we cannot do that, then I would think on the heavy side of a trade down, and put the responsibility on my talents to identify talent later. He is the wildcard, CKAP that is, his availability changes a lot on what I do.
Problem with Ingram at #15 is, he won't be on the field enough to justify taking him that high, the most carries a Dolphins Running Back has had under Sparano is Ricky Williams' 241 in 2009, add in maybe 25 catches and we'd be looking at 270 touches for Mark Ingram and that is just not enough. A Rookie Rb who is good can make the largest impact on an offense of any player you can draft, but in Sparano's system Ingram would replace Ronnie Brown and his 18 carries..max.
I think that theory is flawed Pod.. Players determine rep count, and offensive philosophy...I look at it like this... Daboll ran a feature back type offense no? 331 touches to be exact...if so, mark ingram will give you everything hillis has.. Is he still not worth it.?
We have a new OC so the number of carries our backs had with our old OC seems irrelevant. Hillis would seem to be a better reference point. In 2010, he had 270 carries and 61 receptions or about 20.7 touches per game. Of course that doesn't include the snaps where he blocks or runs a route and isn't thrown the ball.
Didn't Ireland say he was looking for one of those, to paraphrase, "350 carry workhorses"? That's Ingram. Just look at the season Peyton Hillis had under Daboll last year, 270 carries and 61 receptions, 331 total touches, and if I remember right, I don't think he started every game, so that probably puts him on pace for 350 touches. Ingram is certainly more talented and could handle that workload. I mean, who would he be competing with for carries, Lex Hilliard? Sorry, not buying Lex Hilliard getting the ball more than 100 times. I think Sparano knows that fixing the run game is a must and Ingram is as sure a pick as there is in the draft. I think Daboll will get more control over the offense than Sparano allowed Henning (and for damn good reason), but I think that stupid rotation of series for series Sparano had with Brown and Williams will be out the window. *Edit* didn't see Rafael and DJ had posted about the same thing with regard to Hillis' touches before I posted. Now, do I think we'll draft Ingram if he's at 15? Probably not. I'd bet we'd draft an OL, or try and trade back and draft an OL. Or Ryan Kerrigan, anything but a playmaker at 15, sorry to say.
Not what happened Deej, last yr Ronnie B was going well and they pulled him out of the game, afterwards Sparano said Ronnie B probably carried the ball too much in that game...could have been RW, but the point remains, Sparano does not use a Workhorse. And Ireland said you can no longer find them, or rather "they are hard to find", if Ingram can have 280 carries, I'd be all for him.
I would trade back to get a 2nd round pick. We have a few more wholes to fill and I would gamble on getting a RB later in the draft. Peyton Hillis was a 7th round pick so it's possible Daboll could use another RB effectively even with a "limited" skill set.
Well said, and thank you for teaching me a new word in "fungible". Although I disagree with your posistion on the potential WRs should they slip. I think a good WR especially a speedster would really make things easier for Brandon Marshall and whoever our QB ends up being. I think they key for this team to improve offensively will be to help the QB and I don't see a RB helping the QB as much as improving our #2 WR.
Exactly. If Odrick were were healthy he could try and live up to Earl Thomas, Dez Bryant, Devin McCourty, or Maurkice Pouncey. But he's not.
Depends on who's there. I honestly rate Julio Jones as higher than his teammate Ingram in terms of value for the Dolphins. RB's go deep. Julio Jones is Julio Jones. Physically, he's amazing to measure. He is prime to be a beast for years to come.
I really like Jones, but in terms of need I see Jones as less of an upgrade over Hartline than Ingram is over Hilliard. And based on the offense Daboll has run in the past, I would say that RB is critical to what he likes to do. I also think that a strong running game would take the most pressure off Henne (and therefore be the most helpful to him). In terms of helping Henne, I would list a seam TE as next most helpful followed by a receiving back. After those, I would list an upgraded speed WR to add to Marshall and Bess.
if we don't trade down: Mallet or Ingram @15 round 3: best offensive linesman on the board round 4: best offensive linesman on the board round 5: best offensive linesman on the board or McElroy, if we don't draft a QB @ 15
Ronnie & Ricky were not used as "work horses" but I dont think that means Sparano is philosophically opposed to the idea of a clear #1. If our #1 is clearly superior to #2 then I doubt Sparano will platoon them just for the hell of it.
I'd draft him twice if I could, and according to CBS he'll be there. http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/team-needs This is the draft order of teams before us: Pathers, Broncos, Bills, Bengals, Cardinals, Browns, 49ers, Titans, Cowboys, Redskins, Texans, Vikings, Lions, and Rams. Of their team needs none of them have RB as their biggest need. 5 teams need QB's, 6 teams need Defense, 1 needs a Tight End, 1 needs a G, and the other needs a WR. By the looks of things our chances of getting the QB of our dreams in this draft doesn't look good, but there will be many interior linemen and RB's for the taking at 15. This draft is very deep in OL which can be nabbed in later rounds so I'd take Ingram in a flash. Simply put, he'd be the best player there and we'd better get used to the idea that all of the big name QB's that we drool over will be gone.
Well, to me my #15 board would be: -trade back, I've seen the Eagles may have interest in trading up to snatch a Cb, if the Texans price themselves out of the market we would be plan B. -Ryan Kerrigan Julio Jones Mark Ingram Gabe Carimi Ryan Mallet Imo the question comes down to how much they feel they need a fast impact from the #15 pick, in that light the order would be: -Carimi he'd play 500 snaps -Ingram 300 touches running and catching -Julio Jones He would return kicks and punts and challenge Hartline -Ryan Mallet, out of character boom or bust pick, huge upside though
if iam a coach and mt back is giving 3.7 a clip, hes gettin reps taken away, let mark ingram run the football and see how that same coach changes his philosophy on the fly. If your back has innate ability to slam the hole and stay balanced in the next level on first down, chances are he's gonna get it again.
I voted no. Not because I don't like him as a player, because I think he is a great RB prospect and I would be happy if we did draft him at #15. But I think it is easy to find a good RB in the later rounds, or even undrafted for that matter. We need to take a long hard look at the QB, DB, and LB prospects available, or Julio Jones would be great, but I doubt he will be available at fifteen. Trading down would be ideal of course, but can we get lucky enough to trade down two years in a row?
Tough call... I love Ingram, although he doesn't have the kind of speed we need. With Ronnie coming back (I hope), we need that other guy to be a utility guy, with speed to burn IMHO. I'd like Julio Jones to fall in our lap at 15!
This really is the point. No selection of a player can be made in a vacuum. If Blaine Gabbert were miraculously there - no way! And, if the team feels there are 3-4 other RB's that may be there in round 3, and there are 3-4 O-linemen that look like they'll be there in the 20-25 range, might be much better to trade down. Just impossible to make this decision at this point b/c there are so many other variables. That said, I do like Ingram as a player and, barring injuries, think he will be a very good RB.
Third draft in a row, Davis and Odrick were both trade back picks, as was Sean Smith, and here we are again..hoping to trade back. For once I'd like to shop outside of the bargain bin..just once...
Agree, its a mistake to claim that Ronnie was playing well in the first place IMO. Ronnie is a dancer. He's not an "Im afraid to hit the hole" dancer, he's an "I cant see the hole' dancer. He shuffles his feet waiting until he sees a hole and in the NFL it's normally to late by then. Kinda like a QB who waits till his WR is open before he throws it, too late by then you have to anticipate. Ronnie lacks that and he left a TON of yds on the field. Ricky OTOH has excellent vision but he lacks any lateral quickness and burst. So if the play breaks down Ricky cant do anything, and even if its wide open, Ricky struggles to to do anything on the 2nd level. Actually, neither guy does anything on the 2nd level, neither guy threatens the edge. I wouldn't mind Ronnie as a backup, but neither guy is starter material IMO. Ingram lacks top end speed but he is quicker thru the hole than anyone in the draft and he runs with authority. He has excellent feet and cutting ability, and has enough burst to get to the edge. I'm not a fan of taking him at 15 but he is an instant upgrade over what we currently have and I think he'd receive the lion's share of the carries if he were here.
We didn't trade down to take Davis, or Smith. We were picking 25th b/c we won the division, and we received excellent value with both picks. The jury is out on Odrick but he was a starter before he was injured. Misi is a quality starter. IMO Misi outperformed most of the LBs we were targeting at #12, Derrick Morgan, Brandon Graham, Pierre Paul etc. We got Dobbins out of that trade down also. Ireland basically flipped his 2010 1st & 2nd, & his 2011 2nd into Odrick, Misi, Dobbins, & Marshall. If he can trade down this year, recoup the 2nd and grab a starter w/ it, then we basically got Marshall in exchange for nothing. Bargain bin indeed.
We passed on Clay Matthews to take Davis. You are correct, we traded down with the Colts and selected Smith and Clemons, of course they took Nalbone before Clemons. And indeed, bargain bin, we consistently move away from Elite talent to draft blue collar types.
That's true. Both work hand in hand. But I think in today's NFL, you can't be successful with just a good running game if your passing game is mediocre. Recent superbowl winners have proven you can be successful with just a great passing game even if your running game is below average (Packers, Saints, Colts, etc.) Based on that, fix the passing game first. Running game is a luxury in today's NFL.
Vontae Davis wasn't a trade back pick. It has worked before though, and in later rounds with Sean Smith and Kendall Langford. As for last year, it would've been nice to scoop up Earl Thomas, but they had no way of knowing that Paul Soliai was going to bust out. He wasn't even penciled in as a starter Randy Starks was, so it's hard to fault them on that. As for their early round picks, call it rounds 1-3, I think they've certainly had their share of wobbles, but they've also landed Jake Long, Kendall Langford, Vontae Davis, Sean Smith, and Koa Misi, all of whom are solid starters. They've also hit quality depth guys like Odrick potentially (who was a starter), Merling, and Henne's started for almost 2 full seasons - solid player or not, they've gotten production out of him. The only real misses were Pat White and Patrick Turner, the jury is still out on John Jerry. As for Matthews, we signed one Cameron Wake in the 2009 offseason AND got a top CB out of it. If they trade back and still land a Mike Pouncey out of the pick, then I'm all for it. I think they've earned the trust to do that, but if Julio Jones is sitting there, you pick him and start him opposite from Marshall day one, no questions asked. I'd have a serious qualm passing him up.
