I just heard George Wilson, Player Rep of the Bills, who complained that they have not had the time to understand what the ratification was this PM. He said they didn't have time to digest the last five months work. Well. They are player reps. They are supposed to be the contact between the NFLPA and the members of each team. If they don't understand what is going on at this point enough to "sell it" to their teams, just what in the name of pluperfect purgatory were they, as Player Reps, doing for the last 130 plus days - standing around with their finger up their....... nose? To say I am disgusted would be like saying George Armstrong Custer had a mild ego issue.
Well, keep in mind we don't know the whole story here, however player reps are not lawyers, the NFLPA has a fleet of them on retainer. They have some 'splainin to do. The idea that they were just innoncent little bystanders whilst the dastardly NFL owners injected questionable codicils into the agreement is laughable, yet they claimed they were rick rolled? Come on man.
The negotiations are still ongoing. The owners have put the pressure on the players by agreeing to a deal. Now the players have to do damage control in order to explain why they aren't following suit, no pun intended. Ownership's last leverage point is the still locked doors at team facilities, for the players it's the still unresolved litigation and their status as a de-certified union. Neither side wants to put their final bargaining chip on the table. The owners signed "their" version of the agreement, the players will probably make a counter proposal and we'll go from there. But with so much already agreed to, I don't see either side risking the loss of preseason revenue over a few scraps on the table.
Rev spent four years in the Navy, and 13 more in the construction industry. Some times the colorful metaphors and spicy adjectives just seem .... ahh... handy and appropriate for the feelings of the moment. I restrain myself at most times.
Like I said in the other thread, if the NFL imposing a deadline on the players to agree to the CBA (of July 30th) after having been a recertified union is the holdup, couldn't that date have been pushed back? I think this July 30th date is a ploy by the players to make it seem like the owners are drawing a line in the sand. There is no such line, other than the fact that the players need to recertify prior to the start of the new league year (July 27th). But yeah, the NFLPA* is so friggin disorganized it's not even funny. This wouldn't have happened under Gene Upshaw's watch. Never thought I'd say this but I miss Gene Upshaw.
Per Mort, players expected to vote on Friday. Well.... we've heard it before... seeing is believing. Friday is going to be another long day.
At some point, they can stop comparing who's Johnson is bigger and just get on with the damn thing. Both sides remind me more of a bunch of tweenie girls fighting to see who is the prettiest all the while they all attend the FUGLY School for Girls.
I think it's a product of such a major difference in the level of intelligence between an average player and their representatives. The same representatives who are fighting for what they believe is in the best interest of the players. When you have such a difference, it's difficult to communicate just what has been agreed to in the mediations.
Let's see, they've been negotiating very hard since late May (both parties agree on that), they've reached nearly all parameters, particularly those of major importance to the rank and file (mainly monetary and both parties agree on that). The deal the two management councils and respective legal teams have reached was presented to the owners, who ratified it. Now the deal is being presented to the players and suddenly there are things in this agreement that no one on the NFLPA negotiating team ever saw before ?? I doubt that highly. Sounds to me like the NFLPA (and seriously, let's forget the asterisk...they are a union negotiating as such...the whole de-certification thing is a sham) has not been keeping their rank and file abreast of what they've agreed on with the owners team...That is their responsibility, right ?? Suddenly, after the owners' ratification, there are now more sticking points ?? Who's kidding who...De Smith and his team looks more and more inept as time goes on during this thing. Certainly, they have to go thru the process of de-shamification, that's a given but if there was an agreement with the owners by the NFLPA team, they should be out there selling it hard and there shouldn't be any holdups in this... And what are these issues that the owners "slipped" into the deal ?? Lots of talk about this but no proof of anything by anyone ?? I just find it very hard to believe that the owners went to the trouble to put the timetable in with this letter and not have reviewed that timetable with the NFLPA council ?? Unless the NFLPA was baiting the owners into a version of "coercing" the players to unionize, which I think any judge would see thru... The NFLPA has been wrong on many points during this process, and this is just one more way of showing their ineptitude...
Yeah, I think the players are just posturing, trying to save face. I have no sympathy left for them whatsoever. They got their money sharing, the retirees got an increase in benefits. other than those two issues, I could care less about the players. get their asses into a union, sign the damn agreement and play football you arseholes.
To be fair (and in a nutshell), the players side is saying negotiations had not yet been completed prior to the owner's vote. That there were still issues not yet resolved, and the owners just went ahead and ratified an agreement that included their side's terms on said issues. If this is indeed the case, I cannot fault the players. Anyone worth their salt would be doing the same thing.
My take for whatever it's worth. While I believe the NFLPA is the most to blame in this issue, the players themselves and the owners all have their faults as well. In the end, I take the following position on the NFL: Given that NFL teams are not publicly owned (outside of GB, although I don't know that it the Packers are considered "publicly" owned), the "stockholders" for each of these teams are simply the fans. With any publicly traded company, you manage your company to make money (i.e. be profitable), conduct business ethically, and ultimately make your stock holders happy by making them money. In the NFL, it's the job of an owner and it's players to make the stock holders happy by winning football games. The longer the lockout the continues the more impossible it becomes for any of these teams to win football games. The second that it's determined even 1 regular season NFL game will be missed, my ship has sailed with the NFL and I'm selling my "stock". I may be selling low, but I can't justify owning a share of a company that has complete disregard for their stockholders. The NFL (and this includes the players) have run their business with complete disregard for it's stockholders. Ticket prices have continued to go up in all markets as the owners and players continued to make more and more money. Apparel prices have always risen throughout the years in a league that has continued to grow. There is no give back to the fans (i.e. the stockholders). I'm ok continuing to put my time and what little money I contribute to the NFL as long as they are not eliminating parts of a season due to the disagreement on how to divy up BILLIONS of dollars. As you can see, I'm fed up and I find it hard to believe how any fans can't be thinking this same way after all we give to the sport. We need to start fighting back.
Let’s see, they’ve been negotiating very hard since late May (both parties agree on that), they’ve reached nearly all parameters, particularly those of major importance to the rank and file (mainly monetary and both parties agree on that). The deal the two management councils and respective legal teams have reached was presented to the owners, who ratified it. Now the deal is being presented to the players and suddenly there are things in this agreement that no one on the NFLPA negotiating team ever saw before ?? I doubt that highly. Sounds to me like the NFLPA (and seriously, let’s forget the asterisk…they are a union negotiating as such…the whole de-certification thing is a sham) has not been keeping their rank and file abreast of what they’ve agreed on with the owners team…That is their responsibility, right ?? Suddenly, after the owners’ ratification, there are now more sticking points ?? Who’s kidding who…De Smith and his team looks more and more inept as time goes on during this thing. Certainly, they have to go thru the process of de-shamification, that’s a given [can't be a CBA without and union and a management side] but if there was an agreement with the owners by the NFLPA team, they should be out there selling it hard and there shouldn’t be any holdups in this… And what are these issues that the owners “slipped” into the deal ?? Lots of talk about this but no proof of anything by anyone ?? I just find it very hard to believe that the owners went to the trouble to put the timetable in with this letter and not have reviewed that timetable with the NFLPA council ?? Where has De Smith disappeared to ?? At a time that, if the accusations by player reps are true, he should be out there pounding the podium and talking to every microphone he can to propagate his players cause, but he's been eerily quiet... Unless the NFLPA was baiting the owners into a version of “coercing” the players to unionize, which I think any judge would see thru… The NFLPA has been wrong on many points during this process, and this is just one more way of showing their ineptitude… Sad too, because until this point, I was believing that De Smith and Goodell were the ones keeping this negotiations going...now I'm not too sure that De Smith was even there...at least several of his player reps are intimating.... EDIT: Oops, sorry guys, wrong thread...had several up...screwed up and duplicated...
This is my take on the issue: The players can ratify the CBA as a non-union, but to agree on the non-economic issues they have to be a union. Rules state that they have to be a union by the start of the league year on the 27th. The owners put in a clause stating that they would have until the 30th to reach an agreement on disciplinary and other non-economic issues or they would move forward with 2006 rules. They don't want the 2006 rules and DeMaurice Smith believes they're strong arming them, as Heath Evans stated was the real culprit on NFL Network after he had to backpedal from his earlier tweet. The contention is not any added things to the CBA. The contention as stated by Evans himself is that the NFL is trying to force them to do something and DeMaurice Smith doesn't want to give in to the pressure. This is as much about ego as it is giving them 4 days to work on non-economic issues.
You know all the details of the 700 page document? Please link me to that when you get a chance. I've been unable to find it.
They are kind of like the J E S T fans when it comes to spelling, I'm sure most Bills fans/players can't spell CBA.
Guys, remember. It's not the items in the CBA that the players are pushing back on. It's the deadlines the NFL put in place around re-certifying the union and the un-resolved issues around the individual player law suits. The actual CBA has been ok'd by both parties. The problem is that the owners have said "in order to agree upon the CBA, you must re-certify by x date". The players didn't like being put in that position. Outside of the individual lawsuits, the remaining issues obviously revolve around egos and it's egos I'm becoming less and less patient with. I've ultimately had enough. I've said it before, 1 regular season game lost and I'm done with the NFL.
