QB Kyle Orton

I heard its tavaris jackson

 

Jackpot.

 

Was going to say probably wrong on that one Sick.

Cross off the Seachickens

Leaves:

Cardinals
Vikings
Bengals maybe (ton of cap room they have to spend)

Scheftie is saying they want a #1 or #2, I'd give the #2 pick if I could get a later pick or Robert Ayers in the deal.

 

And that really just sucks the life out of a young Defense, very disheartening when you believe your Qb hurts you more then helps you.

 

They are asking a #1 for Kyle bloody Orton? I mean, I might - might! - consider a 2nd if I was a little more sold on Orton than I am, but even if they throw in Ayers' smoking hot sister, I wouldn't pay a #1.

 

Seahawks going the SUCK FOR LUCK route

 

I won't diss em for it. He's going to be special.

 

IMO yes. I thought those guys did a poor job of calling plays with any creativity, but at times last year it felt like Henning was specifically calling plays that gave Henne, our RBs and our OL little or no chance to succeed. It was almost like he was saying it's my way or no way and I'm going to call plays that I know can't work just to prove I can.

 

How can so many people be sold on a QB who's been so up and down throughout his career but at the same time are categorically done with Chad Henne after 28 games where he has a 14-14 record as a starter?

I'm not saying Henne is the answer. I'm not saying Henne is better than Orton, or that Orton is better than Henne. I'm saying that the grass always seems greener on the other side of the fence, and most of the time it's the same damn grass.

 

I think Henning needs to be paired with a QB that can audible out of some of his quirky ideas when the play's just not there. I don't mean it as a knack on Henne, but he was either not allowed to or too complacent/scared/indifferent/pick your poison to do so, even when it was obvious to pretty much everyone in the Western hemisphere that the play simply wasn't there. I don't necessarily think that the play calls themselves were the issue; it was that, for whatever reason, there was no Chad Pennington to act as sort of a double check device. I would see us come out in a formation, immediately suspect quirky play call idea #127 and say, don't do it, audible into something else. Henne never did. Whether that was on him or Sparano or Henning, I don't know, but I don't think Henning is a bad OC per se. He just needs a leash on the field.

 

This is official.

 

So our choices are:

A QB who isn't elite but good enough to set us back in a QB search based on our record and the draft pick cost he would come with.

A QB who hasn't been successful in the NFL and the jury is still out on. He could be good or he could stay the same.

[sarcasm]With such great choices, how could we lose?[/sarcasm] It depends on what you want. Orton only if we can get him for a player and a fourth. If Henne beats him out, there won't be complaints.

 

Vikings and Redskins discussing McNabb trade, per Schefter

 

We scored on our opening drive of the game vs Buffalo(FG), Minnesota(TD), Green Bay(TD), Pittsburgh(FG), Cincinnati(FG), Baltimore(TD), the Ravens game marked the 4th consecutive week where we scored on our first possession. In the Week 3 Jets game we had the near miss TD to Hartline on the post and vs New England we had the 3rd and 6 botched WC play that knocked us out of FG range. That's 6 for 8 and nearly 8 for 8 in terms of scoring on our opening drives of the game. We also scored on our opening drive vs Oakland(FG) and Tennessee(TD), with missed FGs on the opening drive vs both Cleveland and Buffalo. That's 8 out of 16, 10 if you count the missed FGs. I'm not sure its accurate to say that we were digging holes on offense.

From what I saw our problem was that when we got a lead we would sit on it and not push the issue on offense any longer. When most teams reach the 30 yd line, they start going for the end zone. When our offense got inside the 30, we started attacking the 20 yd line, inching forward to protect the FG instead attacking for a possible TD. I don't know who the driving force behind that philosophy was but I'd like to think that when in scoring range most QBs want to throw TDs not hand off to their backs or come out of the game for a 1.6 yard WC play.

 

I cannot wait til we are done and acquire a qb. At least then we are discussing opinions on what is and not what each would like to happen. Good news it should be soon.

Orton at the right price is teh best option IMO at this point, but if not Orton who? So what is the right price? Sorry will never be on board with Young, if it ends up him, I wont hope for failure as that would be sacriliges IMO, but he will have to show me.

As far as Henne, everyone knows how I feel, but he cannot be handed the job, there are mitigating factors for the issues last year but none that definiotively say he wasnt at fault, nor he was greatly at fault. All these factors says is Henne is not a sure thing either way and so you need to allow him to compete legitimately but with someone that can reasonably have a shot to beat him. Orton fills that. Kolb would but cost way too high. I dont think VY does I just dont but I can be wrong.

Time will tell, it is nice to be talking actual football moves tho

 

The numbers are what they are. And in this case, they are around a 55 rating with 6 TD and 12 INT for Chad Henne when leading or in a tied ballgame. Now, I'm totally with you on the ultra-conservative game plans. And they might well explain the pretty low TD number for these situations. But they don't really explain why Henne threw the vast majority of his INTs precisely when the game plan asked him not to turn it over. And they also don't explain the lousy % and YPA. In fact, Chad Henne had the worst ahead and tied game stats for any QB with at least 50 attempts in those categories. Which seems rather odd given that we ostensibly didn't ask him to make big plays but rather simply told him not to make a mistake.

 

By the way, this is a pretty depressing stat research. Not only because even Jimmy bloody Claussen was vastly superiour to Henne in ahead and tied situations (he doesn't qualify for the 50 attempts though) - the poor dude only played around 20% of his attempts from ahead or in a tied game. Way to kill a rookie QB ...

 

Just what we need, Kyle Fiedler...no thanks...just another QB...UNLESS we're talking a 4th rounder or lower...

 

I dunno man. I agree that the numbers are bad but it kind of sounds like you're dumping our collective offensive issues on the head of one guy.

Henne had the #1 conversion rate in the league for 3rd and 7 or less, but I'm not going to give him credit for it. That's the entire offense, Bess & Marshall especially, performing in key situations not just Henne playing well. Team game.

 

I'd rather sign Hasselbeck.

 

May I ask why? Out of all the options, this is the one that rests at the bottom of my list (along with McNabb). I'd much rather stick with Henne.

 

Hasselbeck is done. He hasn't thrown more touchdowns than interceptions since 2007. I don't understand why some people actually want him.

 

No, I'm really not. I mean, point to Sparano, point to Henning, point to Lee, it's all fair game. But the only recent player that managed to put up stats in the same ballpark (actually, he managed to do even worse) was JaMarcus Russell. Not even acknowledged busts like Alex Smith come even close. Heck, Joey Harrington did better in those situations, and by a mile too. I realize that sounds like I want to bury poor Chad, but that's genuinely not what I'm trying to do. It's just that, thanks to Boik, I've found a spectacularly bad set of stats that not even the who is who of high profile busts ever came close to reaching. Draw your own conclusions from that. I'm a bit stunned.

 

Also, gets worse, Henne's int's were on our side of the 50 yd line, when he turned the ball over the most it was likely to lead to points on the scoreboard.

As I've told GMJ, there are reasons why people are none to happy with #7.

 

Bulger off of the menu as well, if that report is accurate, and it does meet his midwest criteria.

I'd literally fly out to Denver and hand them a #2 pick for Orton at this point in time.

The worst blunders in recent Dolphins history have come when opportunity knocked, and we turned it down, it is not like Football Karama has just turned it's back on us, we simply do not take "yes" for an answer when it does shine upon us.

 

Young by default is a nightmare,

 

Denver's price will go down... they won't go into the season with Orton on their roster.

 

To be honest, I think Mike Brown just wants out of this with his ego still erect like a giant *****. He'll deal Palmer in the end, it's just a matter of making him believe that he's got the biggest.

 

Clayton was speculating 2 or 3 rd was what Denver is looking for, and 4 or 5th is what was being offered....FWIW

 

I do not give a damn about next yr's draft, they will have one after that, and one after one, and one after that one.

Think of it this way, if that #2 pick (likely to bust out 45% of the time within 3 yrs) is so crucial, then trade back in Rd #1 and pick up another one.

Meanwhile, we are staring at a season with Chad Henne, Tom Brandstater and Joe Devlin manning the Qb position.

Does that sound like a winning formula?

How about this opportunity:

Dallas-already lost 3/5th of their Oline, could lose 4/5ths if Doug Free Walks
Giants-lost 3/5ths of their Oline

We play them both.

 

Imo that is an Institutional decision Vendi, Brown is a notoriously bad owner, if he allows Palmer to force him into a trade, then other players will do the same thing, and the problem would persist, if he crosses his arms, says "no" then he continue his crappy business practices with the players less likely to try the same thing as they know he is not bluffing.

And keep in mind, the new CBA massively favors the owners in holdout situations, a player losses 1 accrued yr if they do not report by "X" date, eegads what a terrible place to land for a young player.

 

Don't F with Cowher's draft next year is my motto, if I'm Stephen Ross. But to each his own.

 

The draft, with the new rookie pay, is going to be desirable to draft high again. Not mention the talent pool will be there next year....my point is that next year will be a rat race to try and trade up in....maybe easier said than done

 

A third round pick and Phillip Merling should do it.

 

I suppose I should qualify my statement. If it costs us a 2nd rounder for Orton or Kolb, I'd rather sign Hasselbeck for free. I think Hasselbeck can be a decent stop-gap for a year or two this regime finds the QB of the future.
If we can get Orton for a 4th, maybe even a 3rd that's fine. But I assume someone will offer Denver a 2nd.

 

Shall never agree with that one Aqua, seen to many drafts were things never play out as one would like them to play out to think a season should be sacrificed for a draft pick is just bizarre to me.

Sucker for Lucker thinking never appealed to me.

 

At least we won the Chad Henne sweepstakes.

If we're just not sold on Vince Young, think we go the Rosenfels route?