Official WWE/TNA Wrestling Thread

If they haven't changed the design by now, then it isn't going to happen. The right thing to do would have been for Cena to sport the new title, thus splitting away the WWE from the bling belt. That way they could simply look at Punk and sya "Hey, you don't even have the right title." But alas, they kept the same design, which leads me to believe that it isn't changing.

Johnny Ace as a corporate stooge actually works for me, but as someone else said on another site, it made ZERO sense for Cena to be the one attacking him (outside of the dead on impression). Cena's fanbase does not know who Johnny Ace is or what his role is. Punk's fanbase, mos tlikely does. It would have made more sense for Punk to rip him apart than Cena, but this is just more of the WWE trying to get Cena over with the insider crowd and failing.

A scenario was floated ot me though that Johnny Ace as the anonymous Raw G.M. would be kind of interesting. Have him keep coming out and questioning HHH's decisions until HHH asks just who the hell he thinks he is considering he ha sno authority over the day to day operations of RAW. Ace pulls out his blackberry, types somethign very quickly and the sound effect for the RAW GM goes off. Cole stand sup, looking somewhat confused but reads the e-mail that says, "Who do I think I am? I think you now KNOW who I am!"

At that point, I say you have HHH already know that Ace was the GM and he allows Edge to come out spear Johnny Ace, and HHH, as COO, leans down and gets to do his first "You're fired!"

It doesn't establish much outside of ridding Raw of the Anonymous GM bit with a somewhat logical conclusion and establish HHH as THE authority figure. A little nod to history and continuity with Edge coming out to pound on Ace, and then you move on.

 

The Johnny Ace GM thing would have made more sense with Vince still being in charge but now that Triple H is why do we need a stooge running around questioning Triple H on each decision? Triple H doesn't need any 'Yes Men' around kissing his fat skinny butt.

Also I don't think the GM lap top was out on last night's RAW and I do remember seeing it last week but it wasn't used so it looks like the GM thing is gone without explaination which I think is ultimately a good thing.

 

I think the point would be for HHH to simply KNOW that Ace was the GM (since he is in control now and knows everything that has been going on), but to let Ace hang himself by thinking that HHH doesn't know. It sort of plays into the Cerebral Assassin gimmick of HHH. And it gives the angle some closure. I HATE when angles just peter off without any explanation like who drove the hummer, who raised the briefcase, Gtv (if you want to go way back). Just do a one off segment to kill the angle dead, write Ace off of television and pop the crowd with Edge coming out for a one shot deal.

 

Well with the title design, if Punk wins at SS then he can be true to his word and get rid of that "ugly title" I think them having the same title now is basically to let everyone know that they both are the WWE Champ

 

I'd rather they just drop the GM thing all together instead of giving us more useless segments with Triple H and Ace instead of focusing on the in ring products. But hey if they want to do a quick 2 minute thing next week on RAW where Triple H calls Ace out on it to give the angle closure that's fine but I don't really want it dragged out for weeks since there wouldn't be any big pay off in it. I mean yeah it would be cool to see Edge back but he can't wrestle again so who cares, might as well save his return for something better.

As for the other angles, I can barely remember the hummer angle but wasn't Kidman suppose to be the driver or somehow involved? As for the briefcase it was revealed to be The Big Boss Man (since no one in Vince's Corporation could interfer in the Ladder match Boss Man quit the Corporation the week before and rejoined the next night thus creating a loophole) and GTV was Goldust (since it was originally called GD-TV) until he got fired and for some reason they kept playing the angle up.

I actually thought CM Punk was going to say something like if I win the match at SS we're going to retire this ugly belt last night and there's still time for that to happen. I hope.

 

I know the conclusions to all, but they were awful and slapped together so far after the fact that it meant nothing. GDTV was the first week, and then it went to GTV as it was so obvious that it was him. But then they just let it float away.

 

Well I guess sometimes letting a GTV or another wrestling mystery go without explaination is sometimes better than trying to explain it, like how Vince was The Undertaker's 'higher power'. But hey that's WrestleCrap for you, whenever there's a mystery the pay off almost always sucks.

 

there was this time where Goldust had a secret about booker t or something along those lines, maybe he was going to get payback for something idk but they never went any further

 

Cena needs a heel turn badly. SS they need to have HHH come out and screw Punk by helping Cena win. Thus the rebirth of the "corporate champ"

 

Yes completely agree. I felt Cena should have joined McMahon and Johnny Ace at Money in the Bank, but hopefully he goes corporate and let CM Punk be the face in the feud.

 

I'd rather have Cena lose and disappear from the main event scene for awhile and let guys like Morrison, Mysterio, Del Rio and Miz take turns at CM Punk.

 

The problem is those guys just arent strong enough to carry main event status for too long. As big of a fan of Rey's as I am he is Smackdown main event but not Raw, not for a longer period. Morrison is stale, doesnt interest me at all. Del Rio I will tell you does intrigue me, but there is still something missing. Miz is pretty good as well, but just not as interesting. What Raw is missing is a good drawn out fued, and IMO it starts by making a face (Cena) who has run his course into a heel and being under HHH's arm would make HHH the "McMahon" heir that he should be.

 

Well that's the WWE's big problem in a nutshell all the possible programs are either stale or the opponents for Punk aren't built up well enough. I'm sure the WWE will milk the Cena/Punk program for at least 1 more PPV after Summer Slam but then what? Even turning Cena heel will still be too long of a feud with Punk. Plus not sure what Cena can really do to freshen the angle up more as a heel anyway. The only guy that the WWE can bring in to freshen up the scene would be Jericho but he's going on another tour in November so I doubt both he and the WWE would bring him in for 2 months then keep him off TV for a few months until he's done touring.

The WWE simply needs to build up their guys. No more start and stop, start and stop especially with someone like Morrison, who is still over with the crowd. Did you hear the reaction he got when Triple H mentioned him in his promo?

 

Ok my above post saying MiTB was up 20% was false so I apologize with that. The 2nd quarter PPVs are up 20% however MiTB's number hasn't been release yet. Although PPVs are up 20% they pretty much bombed in the US but did well overseas.

And house show numbers haven't gotten better with CM Punk and those numbers usually respond quickly to hot angles but so far there's been no movement on that front right now. Hopefully MiTB and SummerSlam do well or I can see the WWE losing faith in Punk.

EDIT: I somehow deleted my original post. D'oh.

 

Well it's WWE Roster Cut Day, so far these people were cut:

David Hart Smith
Gail Kim (she quit apparently although after Monday she was probably going to be cut)
Melina
Vladimir Kozlov
Chris Masters

I'm sure more to come. The only real 'surprise' is Melina although she's done nothing in forever. Maybe this will be good for Morrison though.

 

Smith:should have been paired back again with Kidd. They should have never split that team but tag teams aren't their strong area.

Kim:could have been used much better because she is an amazing wrestler who never really got the chance,ball was dropped

Melina:she was a decent wrestler,hopefully Morrison doesn't walk out over it like previous wrestlers have

Kozlov: eh....

Masters: decent wrestler who they only featured on Superstars and NXT for whatever reason but another tag team broken with Santino.

 

I can see that too. If they demote Punk back down to RKO eating duties I don't know if I can continue to watch anymore. I don't dislike Cena but this is not a good angle for him IMO. Cena laying any claim to a title now with Punk back goes against the core values he's based his character off of. They need a true heel feuding with Punk right now. It's unfortunate Jericho is not around. They really should have put the 'new' belt on a heel.

 

Roster cut day? What are they the NFL? I had no idea they had anything like that.

 

I think Punk can still play a heel, just pair him with someone like Mysterio, or hell give R-Truth another shot or turn Morrison heel or let Miz go after him. Anything with Cena is just so old, stale and boring. I think it would be refreshing if Cena just took a month or two off.

But if the numbers are low I can easily see the WWE blaming Punk and depushing him. That's the WWE's main problem, they don't ever follow through with pushes. It's always start then stop, start then stop unless you're Cena or Orton. They need to realize people are just sick of seeing those guys right now.

Oh yeah usually two or three times a year the WWE will cut a bunch of guys on the same day. They usually do one right after WrestleMania before the draft and one in the summer time and then sometimes in the winter.

 

Looks like Zach Ryder is on his way to getting pinned by every wrestler on Smackdown.

 

Obviously. It's definitely a giant F-U by the WWE because he got over via Twitter, Facebook and YouTube on his own and not from them. Instead of pushing him and trying to milk him for money they're doing the opposite. This is close to a billion dollar company too dropping the ball. But hey keep pushing Mark Henry, maybe he'll get over after 16 years one of these days.

 

I wish Punk could have said the real reason he re-signed which is that there is no viable alternative. I can honestly say if he was feuding with Miz right now I would be interested. But of course after SummerSlam Cena will be undisputed WWE champ and Orton will be world champ and I guess everything will be right in Vince McMahon's universe. I feel like the base that WWE is catering too are kids and women. Because those are the only people who want to see Cena and Orton repeatedly put over.

Another thought I had recently: I used to think Jerry Lawler was a pretty good heel announcer back in the day. Michael Cole is better. One of the main reasons I even bother with SmackDown right now at all is to listen to him take shots at Booker all night on the commentary table.

 

MiTB did 135k buys (international buys weren't included). It's an increase from last year's MiTB PPV (also co-head lined with Cena) but word is the WWE was expecting 150k buys. It's while it's definitely a positive, the WWE is viewing it as a negative as well.

 

Completely agree and ignoring the fans once again. How dare us fans choose who we decide is over, they'll fix our wagons, here's Mark Henry. I feel it's too little too late for Henry and besides he's not much a draw anyway.

 

He doesn't draw but McMahon signed him to a huge 10 year deal for big money back in 1995 thinking he would be the next Hogan and was obviously embarrassed by that contract so that's probably a pretty good reason as to why he's still around. He did have a decent run as a mid-carder in 1998-2000ish with The Nation and then as Sexual Chocolate. By all accounts he's a good guy in the back, is willing to do anything the company asks and is African American (which is a big key since the WWE has always been looked at as a bit racist) so that's in his favor.

 

I remember him having an angle with chyna in the late 90s, I think that's when he was doing the sexual chocolate bit. He was always hurt by poor mic skills, IMO. They've changed his angle too much since then. I mean just a few months ago they had him coming out with Santino [lucky for him that was brief] and now suddenly he wants to break legs on smackdown. I actually think the current angle is about as good of one as you can get for Mark Henry, it's just 15 years too late.

 

Yeah, he probably could have gotten over as a monster heel, especially since he has the tough guy look but they keep flip floping him back and forth between face and heel. And when he's a face he's just so over the top.

 

I've said it a million times...Mark Henry is GOOD for the WWE. The guy shows up, goes to work, never gets in to trouble in or outside of the business and is willing to do and work with anything. He isn't the most talented guy ever, but he has a genuine love for this sport and has tried extremely hard to get to decent inside the ring. You have to commend him for that. He is also legit strong so the gimmick is very believeable.

I think guys like him, and Kane serve as long tenured veterans that young guys can learn through example on how to conduct yourself, how to appraoch the business, etc. And you need guys like this. And I don't understand the Zach Ryder crowd inthat, they compalined forever that he wasn't getting on TV. Now he is on Raw and Smackdown every week and the complaints are that he loses? What, we can't be happy that he got himself on to TV organically, now we need him to be a world beater? The guy is a goof, and has a goofy offense to boot.

The only way he is ever being taken seriously is with a major overhaul to his character...which would hurt his standing with the fans so it is a catch 22. I honestly think folks should be happy with what they are getting in terms of TV time.

TNA had a PPV last night. Shows you how much I am in to their product as I didn't even KNOW they had a PPV until this morning. I read a few different reports and it seems very bland. Angle is the new champ, but it does nothing for me. I don't know how that fed has been able to grow its raitings to the point that it has with all of its convoluted storylines, but more power to them I guess.

 

I think the point with Henry is they continue to push him when he's not over nor has ever drawn any money instead of pushing new guys. That was my whole problem with Kane as champion on Smackdown last year for like 6 months. The WWE has been in a transition period for a few years now with The Undertaker, Shawn Michaels, Triple H and now Edge hanging it up, not to mention Jericho coming and going. It's time to build new stars instead of pushing guys like Kane and Henry. Give Barrett the world title and let him run with it for awhile or Sheamus but book the guys right and give them a solid run like they did finally with The Miz. Since 2002, the last transition period, the WWE has made 3 stars in Cena, Orton and Basita. 3 stars in 9 years isn't very good and it's not like they don't have talent on the roster.

As for Zack Ryder, yeah the guy is a goof ball and a comedy character but he's gotten himself over without the WWE even putting him on TV. The guy does a pretty good selling t-shirts and if you look in the crowd you see tons of Ryder signs so why not push the guy instead of jobbing him? Isn't the point to make money? Why not give him a run and see what you can get out of him. John Cena started out as a comedy character with his white rapper gimmick and look at him now. Sure Ryder will probably have to change his gimmick over time if he wants to stick around but that can happen naturally. Why not ride the hot hand for awhile and if he fails so what he becomes another Santino, no harm no foul. I think people are mad that he's losing because they want to see him be a winner. But it just seems like this is a message from the WWE to the fans saying "we're going to tell you who you want to watch each week", when it should be the other way around.

 

Don't ge tme wrong, I don't need to see Henry pushed to the moon. All I am saying is that from a business standpoint, he is a plus. Especially with investors and potential sponsors. He is a guy that they can trot out to events, showings, etc., and know that nothing bad will happen. Keeping him relevant on TV makes those appearances mean something more for the kids and fans that show up as well. A lot of times, you go to these types of events and you have someone likeCurt Hawkins representing the WWE and you are severely let down. Having a "name" guy who has been involved in current storylines, means a lot to getting people to show up, and yes, this include sMArk Henry.

In terms of building stars, we have agreed on this for a long time, but the WWE has never really built a ton of stars at once. There are only so many that you can have at the top. And I would contend that they have actually done a pretty good job recently of building stars. Miz is a star and pretty much a household name now. As is CM Punk. No one is near John Cena in terms of worldwide appeal, but then again, only a handful of wrestlers have ever been there.

But back to Henry, I think he is close to retiring, so they may be giving him one last hurrah as a thanks for putting in close to two decades of service with them.

Ryder has gotten himself popular on the internet which has resulted in a vocal crowd and wrestlers alike speaking up for him. At this point, it is on him to get over further with the "regular" audience. That takes time, time that the WWE is giving him on TV. I'm all for giving him a shot, I just find that the internet darlings who don't win the title right away, isn't a bad thing. Give him time, let him progress and see if it grows organically even further or not.

 

I'm not saying he should be given a title right away but why have him job right off the bat? How does that help him? He beat Michael Cole, which was a good start since Cole has a lot of heel heat but then the next week he jobs in a tag team match. Again how does that help him? Let him start to build up a winning streak for awhile and see how crowds react to him. Let him beat R-Truth with help from John Morrison or something although those lines.

I just want to see the WWE commit to pushing a few guys for awhile instead of changing things up every other week depending on Vince's moods. There's no reason why Morrison shouldn't be a bigger star right now, granted some of it is on him but the WWE never really gave him the ball to run with. Again a few years ago with Sheamus they gave him the title but then totally turned him into a coward and that killed the little heat he had to begin with. I'm not sure how you can say they've done a good job building stars (you really think The Miz is a household name? I think he's one of the more popular superstars today but I don't even think someone like Randy Orton is a household name and he's way more popular than The Miz is) though because the fact is they really haven't and it shows in ratings, buy rates and house show figures as they're all down and have been down for a long time.

 

Tag team matches are the perfect opportunity to put new guys over someone. I'm not sure either why Ryder needed to end up on his back in that tag match. It's making it a little harder for someone to get over when they're losing every match.

Cena is the only guy in the WWE that can claim to be a household name and even he is not on the level guys like Rock and Stone Cold were IMO. When I think of a 'household name' I'm thinking I could go knock on the door of every house in my neighborhood and most of them would know who this guy was. I just don't see that happening with Miz or even Punk at this point. They're way over with wrestling fans but they're not mainstream. It helps Miz that a mainstream athlete like Brian Wilson is on camera wearing his shirt but he's still not there yet.

I have no problem with Mark Henry, I don't think all of the fault for him not being bigger in the business even falls on him. I don't see much reason for them to feud him with guys like Show or Kane. I like the idea of them using him to put Sheamus over as a new top face on Smackdown.

 

I agree with everything here and yeah that's my thinking on household names thing. There's no way The Miz is a household name. And like you said John Cena is probably the only guy that's a household name on the active roster right now and even he might be a bit stretch as wrestling isn't as popular as it was in the late 90s early 2000s.

 

Punk's promos are so strong because he's speaking the truth, you can tell he actually believes what he's saying, unlike Cena where you can tell is scripted. Cena just doesn't stand a chance in a war of words. And I'm already sick of Triple H and miss Vince.

 

I thought Cena cut a pretty damn good promo tonight to be honest

Punks is on another level though

 

Great ending tonight. Punk an dCena were on anothe rlevel tonight. BOTH knocked it out of the park and got back to their rightful pandering of fanbases. Cena telling Punk that he is only concerned with the people that back him was a nice touch. It leaves it open for a heel turn or as a face comment going forward. Punk just putting WWE's business on blast was awesome and you can tell that HHH knows that he is overmatched in that arena.

I also liked what Miz is doing in drawing attention to the fact that he is a hot commodity and being completely ignored. Also, maybe I am being an optimist, but I would LOVE to see Beht Phoenix make good on her promise and just DESTROY the Divas. Put an end to this BS and pull a Chyna like run. Bring in people like Lita and Trish for a one time shot at a PPV, only to be killed as well. Then, just when it looks like no one can challenge here, the wild laughter hits and out comes Karma. Back from her pregnancy and out for payback.

Have her kill the entire division dead as well to prove to Beth that she is worthy, then let them fight at Wrestlemania for the title. Not sure if this can happen with Karma's situation, but it might make for an actual hot angle in the WWE's Divas division. It is too bad that Gail Kim is done as she was a great opponent for Karma.

 

I just watched the promo. I thought both were very good.
I love seeing christian with that gold.
And I think its good r truth won. I know I'm probably in the minority but I can't stand john morrison.

 

I love seeing christian with the belt to. Wonder what es going to say on smackdown. To bad the suspense will last a day since smackdown tapes Tuesday.

I loved how Cena mentioned his 5 moves, how maybe he's hogan 2.0, and how people want him to turn heel. Felt real.

It's funny but HHH looks out of place.

Loved the straight to dvd crack and how punk bringing up the recent firings

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Me too. It's going to really suck to see them put it back on Orton at SummerSlam.