Well for as crappy as you believe he played, his QBR was still 83.9. Had he averaged that the past two seasons, I doubt many here would be complaining.
That's such a great point, and not just b/c I like you MC. All too often do the QB's get too much credit for success (or too much blame for lack there of) where as IMO WR's don't get enough. Honestly, what would Marino have been without Duper & Clayton? He was obviously great..... but would he have reached his potential without those 2 studs? Conversely, would those 2 studs have reached their potential w/o Marino? I think not in either case. How about Montana without Rice........ Bradshaw w/o Stallworth & Swann. Aikman w/o Irvin. Manning w/o Harrison & Wayne. I will always feel that a great QB can't be great & reach his potential unless the players around him allow him to to do so.
I'm so glad Ireland never made an attempt to trade for Olsen. There is no way he'd have upgraded our passing game.
Sometimes everything dovetails just perfectly; would Joe Montana be in the HOF without coming under Bill Walsh's auspices? Would he be there without Jerry Rice? Roger Graig? For that matter, would anyone even have heard of Steve Young had he never gone to SF? And people wonder why I can't sleep.
Therein lies the rub. Others here believe they are also making objective observations. Just because others here may disagree with you sometimes, does not lessen their objectivity or make their observations any less worthwhile than yours.
There are other players??? Hmm, where did you get this piece of inside info? Isn't this Henneball we are talking about, as played in the NHL? National Henne League?
I basically agree with you. But I want to see what you say after you look back at the guards again. On several runs he and Colombo blocked down to the left, and Thomas did not see or attempt to see, from what I could tell, any open cutback lanes, and just plowed ahead into the pile of bodies, partially created by the C&C down blocks. On some of those types of plays, Murtha Incog and Pouncey just appeared to be blocking straight ahead. I recall Incog pulling right on one play, trying to create some counter action but he got caught up in traffic. It seems to me Atlanta was selling out to stop the inside run and we did not try much if any runs to the outside to mix things up. I also caught some of Murtha, especially in the 2nd qtr when the offense was going right to left and pass blocking he looked solid too. Colombo though, after all the horror stories we heard about his health and poor 2010, and probably justified for that matter, looked to me like a man with bionic knees. I'm feeling pretty good about our OTs now with Jake backed up by Murtha, and Colombo backed up by Garner. Carey we have to remember, has not played guard since his Miami days, so I think we can give him a mulligan for the first couple preseason games. edit: Just to refresh all our memories of Vernon at The U. He was a full time starter as a junior and senior. At RT as a junior and LG as a senior. Reserve as a sophomore and freshman
Given our leadership then, Brady may have ended up in the graveyard. He'd have had either Gailey or Norv to work with him though. We may have been able to develop him. Wanny though, after Norv left, was so myopic that he never tried to bring in a real proven OC to replace him. Just promote Joel Collier, who wussed out right before camp, leaving us with promoting our TE coach who had not been an OC before or since, Chris Foerster. He had a proven OC as the QB coach in Marc Trestman, but Marc wasn't promoted to play caller/OC type responsibilities till Bates took over. Not saying Trestman was great, but compared to Collier or Foerster? Marc was a slam dunk. The more I think about it, Wanny would have likely found a way to mess up Brady.
Oh contraire mon ami, I found their squeals of delight upon first viewing your friend "Little Todd" as being rather amusing. I think you all woke up Chad though. He started throwing empty beer bottles at your tent from his bedroom window.
there was room, but I cant complain about a pass hitting his TE in the hands after having his delivery impeded by a pass rusher.
It not that i want to complain, or maybe in a way I do but it's not personal because of Henne. That was the first pass of the game. I also dont think the pass was impeded. I also 100 percent blame Fasano for the int. I also have no huge problem with this. I just want better and soon because in less than a month this stuff counts. We saw a more nimble Chad Henne yesterday. He looks stronger, and moved around alot better than he EVER has. So I know he's been working his *** off. I'm happy with him but for me to critique one throw is not that bad. Other than those two throws i was plesently surprised...
On a side note (rewatching the Browns-Packers game), 5'9 185 Buster Skrine (CB, Cleveland) absolutely f'n torpedoed himself into the lead blocking fullback on a sweep right as if he were a freakin MLB. Damn I wanted that kid!!!
Watched rest of 1st qtr thru to beginning of 3rd qtr again. Jerry comes in around the time Moore enters the game at qb. I thought he did okay. He was going up against his brother most of the time (Peria Jerry). His pass blocking was good enough. His run blocking was marginally okay. He does seem to bend at the waist too much for my liking. He doesn't play with good leverage. I thought Feinga played okay as well at the LG position. I'm not sure either of them make the team though. I agree with you about our tackles. I thought Murtha had a solid game. I thought Colombo did enough to warrant consideration as the starter at RT. Hopefully if Long comes back for week 1, we'll be able to go with the better of Murtha or Colombo. Wouldn't be surprised if TS rotated them either. Hoping Carey gets better over time at RG. He's certainly better than Jerry or Feinga. Looked at the dline too. I'm totally smitten with Jared Odrick. He's darn near unblockable. He split a double team on a pass rush move that was a thing of beauty. Our d line towards the end of the year should be Langford / Soliai / Odrick. And I'd venture to say that could be the best d line in football at that time. I like Starks but I think he's peaked. He started to disappear at times last year. Certainly, the NT switch didn't suit him. The other guy I was really impressed with though was Phillip Merling. I really think he can help us this year. I'd contemplated the notion of trading him for a piece on the offensive side of the ball. But you can never have enough quality on the d line. Merling got off to a great start in the game against Atlanta. The obvious comparison is to put him up against Odrick, but they are different players IMO. Merling is a little more stout against the run atm. Odrick is more explosive as a pass rusher. I think we have two good players there. And when we go to a four man rush, both of them can help out in either of the four positions, which is a nice thing to have. You don't want to be short changed when you are looking for those types of players. Lot of people asked about Charles Clay. I thought he struggled yesterday finding his guy on run downs. One particular time he's lined up at TE next to Garner. Garner has a defender on his outside shoulder and then another defender outside of Clay. Clay blocks down leaving Garner to block nobody. The play was messed up anyway. But you could tell Garner was talking to Clay as they went back to the huddle. There's been talk that we'd cut Polite. I hope not. I'm not comfortable with Clay as our only blocking back. We haven't seen the pass receiving threat yet and hopefully we will. But from a running game perspective, he has a ways to go. And that's not a surprise though.
yeah Skrine was real agressive for a guy his size, that was the Senior Bowl right? He really can bust'er skrine...
Cutting Polite doesn't automatically mean we go with Clay at FB. There are probably half a dozen fullbacks who are going to get cut who are better than Polite right now. The guy had a magical 2009 season but it was sandwiched between two sub-mediocre campaigns. His ability to convert third and one is severely overrated. Those conversions are 95% offensive line push.
I like all our first 7 DL. Even Ronald Fields did pretty good yesterday. I think we are fortunate to have a viable backup NT behind Soliai. Really, we could start either NT or any 2 of our 5 DEs and not embarrass ourselves. It's great to able to throw wave after wave of DL at the offense. Most of them solid vs the run too. Especially when we have more emphasized pass coverage with our ILBs. Good run defenders on the line could help offset a little less of it at ILB. I'd hope we do not rotate at RT. I remember JJ doing that with the two Kevins at guard one year. Ended up neither of them had their best year. As for Clay, he was the most unimpressive of all our draft picks. Even Kearse made his presence felt more. He has a lot on his plate to learn though and hope he can find his niche. Kind of wonder about putting him at RB behind Polite sometimes, in a jumbo backfield look. Perhaps he could be the backup for Thomas's role.
Just wondering, did anyone notice JT whether he was in uniform or not, on the sidelines. I saw Marshall and Bush in uniform and pads throughout the game. Never noticed JT. Jake either, but since he is on PUP that's more to be expected.
It's not about complaining. It's about an analysis of error. Does Fasano need to catch it? Yes. Does this become an interception if Henne puts it where it's supposed to be? Probably not. Is Henne going to throw it that far behind his guy on such a short route if he doesn't have a defender in his face? Probably not. It's not like we mustn't blame Fasano, he certainly carries the lion's share of the blame here, but the mistakes start a lot earlier and pile up to a point where a TE is surprised by a wildly off target (for this route) throw and messes up. We've seen quite a lot of these mistakes (would be catches turning into INTs) last season, but very few in 2008, for instance. Mind you, I'm not saying it's on Henne (before this gets another partisan argument), but it is something that needs to be analyzed a little more closely than "Fasano ****ed up". Because our receivers, even the usually reliable ones, tend to **** up way too often in the recent past.
noone says it was a pefect pass, but he also couldnt lead him too far the outside coverage was there. either way I am sorry but the int was caused by Fasano klettibg teh ball get into his chest and bouncing in the air. One can projec that wouldnt have happened if it a perfect pass but the FACT is you dont know. AFter all balls do bounce in the air on perfect passes if the receiver lets the ball get into his pads. So while the pass wasnt perfect, it was good enough that Fasano was able to get turned around get his hands on it have it get thru his hands hit him in the pads and bounce up and get int. The cause of teh int was the ball hitting the pads and bouncing up. So if the qb hits his receiver in the hands/pads it is his fault the receiver didnt catch it? I am not buying sorry
Here is my problem with the Henne debate. This is a Dolphins message board. We are fans and therefor WANT to see our QB succeed. We've been sold this guy worked hard all offseason and that this is the year that he is going to turn a corner. So we are looking for him to come out and play well. Henne made a throw that was slightly behind his TE but very catchable. In the span of a game, EVERY QB has throws like this - and 99% of the time, they are caught. The TE bobbled it and it ended up an INT. Just because some of us are willing to overlook this, doesn't mean we aren't objective. We may be looking at it half-glass-full, but we aren't taking some huge stretch to be positive. It seems like if fans don't take the most negative position, we aren't being 'objective'. This is a fan message board, and I feel like anytime I take a situation that is 50/50 and look at it in the positive sense, suddenly I am a homer. Being 'objective' doesn't mean you have to be negative - it means you have to be realistic and not gloss over every mistake. I haven't seen this in this discussion - no one is saying that 2nd INT wasn't Henne's fault, for instance. There are times people are wearing their rose colored glasses and should be called on it. But anytime someone breaks down a situation and doesn't pick the worst-case scenario does not make them a homer. We're fans - let's act like it.
My issue is that people pick sides and then act like anyone that disagrees to the positive side is a rose colored glasses blind homer, yet cannot see through their dark color blacked out glasses that they are as one tracked as they claim us to be. Noone discounts that there are reasons to be concerned and noone said Henne alleviated those concerns, but he did have some positives. And every qb even the elite throw passes that are not perfect but are caught. The starting offense as a whole looked like ****, as it starts with the oline. Columbo sucks and when long gets back hopefully Murtha moves to RT. Run game looks like sh.. so there are concerns all over the place. The thing I saw was Henne taking leadership, talking to Bess and Hartline, yapping at Murtha, those are positives, so I want to see how Henne progresses. If after the TB game, he hasnt progressed then you have to consider Moore, but if he does show that progress and shows he is in command, then he may have started to turn the corner
Damn, I'd have drafted him on the name alone. Buster Skrine. Is there a better football name? Never mind that, it's a great name for many reasons. "Hey guys, I took this chick home from the bar last night and really Buster Skrine"
I am going to go back and look but the 3 times I watched it it looked to me that there was an outside defender that could have broken up the pass if he lead him
I love that "act like fans" ... ya your interpretation of a fan ..... Nothing personal just a pet peeve when somebody has the audacity to be the "Fan" creator..... and expects everyone to live by their parameters........everybody in here is a dolphin fan to even possibly a falt and cares immensely... and for you to make that judgement is just well I won't use the word I'm thinking.... You have a right to your views and others have a right to complain and have alternate views it's a sports forum for gods sake....If everybody was afraid of to criticize there would be no need for this place... Damn this whole country is getting so polarized into just hearing what they want to and belittling, bad mouthing and condemning and not wanting to even hear alternate views as if they should Not have a right to have them...... God Bless America, were really going to need the extra help.... Almost everybody in here is on such a hair trigger ready to go off on any contrasting views... Lets all try to use a little self discipline ....were ALL fans and want to see our team succeed. This can be a great place to "communicate opinions" instead of belittling each other..... Now I don't want to get you pissed off by having an alternate view, but some in hear are forming conclusions not just from in the moment (1 play or preseason gm.) as you seem to believe but from sometimes years of seeing the same inefficiencies and continuous patterns that are causing them concern BECAUSE THEY CARE.. Some of us in here look at the team and say how can we make it better and expose areas we think are weak in order to strengthen for the betterment of the team....The good team stuff is mostly clear to all and in our opinions is not necessary to go over.....weak areas need to be exposed as soon as possible and upgraded and is the important things to be clarified, brought to the surface and fixed ...it's not being negative per say...........and thus debated Hey nobodies got a good crystal ball so were all in the same boat of uncertainty...........and only time will tell... But come on people we're all on the same team.....remember
My point is that being negative doesn't make you 'objective'. It is insulting that any positive thought is homerism and pointing out any negative makes you 'objective'. Objective analysis can be positive as well.
See but I'm not concerened about if Henne leads the ball out front that it might or might not be an interception. If that happens it happens. Why I would have loved to have seen it out front is the possible chance of yards after the catch, or even moreso, it brings relief to the next down not being 10 yards out from the 1st down marker. Depending on the down and distance the plays starts with. It could be huge to the drive. So was the pass good enough to catch? I never once said it wasn't! I just want better from our Qb and have already said Fasano screwed up the play a hundred times....
T o reiterate this point, it is to be expected that people will differ on opinion. The issue is there are some that seem to feel that there opinion is so much above everyone elses that it should not be questioned and if you do you are a blind homer that cannot see the truth and if you only open your eyes you would obviously agree 100% with their opinion cause they cant be wrong. It is a case of each side refusing to see they are doing exactly what they are accusing the other of doing. If Abbi - everyone would do what you profess the boards are for, then it would be as it should. But people keep finding unique ways to use word to belittle differing opinions as if we are too stupid to see what they are doing
If you see it different it won't change my mind so it is really fruitless. I've seen it 5 times, and have drawn my conclusion to it. I'm not trying to change yours either...
If we had last years offense, I'd agree that adding another fullback would be an option. But this year, I think we're asking the fullback to do a lot more, presnap movement and option routes etc. I don't think that's a worthy option this year.
