Shame on you Todd, don't you know that playing experience is frowned upon here? Especially by people who've never played. No one wants to hear about how sending your receivers into a kill zone is viewed (among teammates) as even worse than throwing a pick or taking a sack. No one wants to hear about how you cant see through a wall of 6'5 300+ lb linemen or get a full follow through when there's a DL in your grill. No one wants to hear about how a QB needs to put the ball directly onto his TEs and RBs as opposed to leading his WRs who are more adept at catching the ball with their hands only. Get a clue, man.
The ball hit Fasano in his numbers and it still got picked so I'm not sure how you can make that assumption.
wasn't it McCoy who was chastised for putting his receivers too often into kill zones last year? I believe Harrison's hit was one of them. By the way. I completely agree. It's much smarter to lead Fasano into Robinson than leave it on his inside shoulder. Just ask DeSean Jackson. [video=youtube;xwAhWlfF3NM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwAhWlfF3NM[/video] PS: I don't think it matters how much bigger Fasano is than a DB; their helmets are still roughly the same size.
How many feet away was Harrison when Massaquio caught this similar situation pass?...... about the same distance that Dunta would be if Fasano were lead? [video=youtube;oRWZ5l0nzXo]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRWZ5l0nzXo[/video]
Fasano is more concerned with A) Catching a pass in a preseason game or B) Having his knees blown out or head damaged by a blind side hit...? Hmmm.
GM, Or maybe you put it on your TE's outside or upfield shoulder like this beauty. After all, it's a perfectly thrown ball like some members are talking about. lol. [video=youtube;FsZZP6h6NMI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FsZZP6h6NMI[/video] It'd be a terrible throw if Manning left it short or put it on Dallas's back shoulder and prevented Clark from getting killed. I don't think fans realize accuracy sometimes means NOT putting the pass right on the money.
I bet TJ Housh is excited about this well placed pass. [video=youtube;6FvRcvRqYDo]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6FvRcvRqYDo&feature=related[/video]
Look at Dunta's body positioning. He's on the balls of his feet with his body weight leaning forward ready to lay one on Anthony if he's led.
Yes because wide receiver Josh Cribbs having outside linebacker James Harrison bearing down on him is SO similar to 255 pound tight end Anthony Fasano having 185 pound corner Dunta Robinson bearing down on him. Tight ends are known to be a fragile position, we should go to extraordinary lengths to protect them from those vicious 185 pound corners.
Even if Fasano catches the ball, the undersized (and apparently feeble) Dunta Robinson is going to hit Fasano somewhere and Fasano is going to fumble the ball.
Because the Cb was barely making a break on the ball when Fasano got his mitts on it. Plus there was like 10 feet or so between them. Now if Fasano TIPS a perfectly lead pass, then yeah, maybe it does because one never knows how bounces go. That ball hit him in the numbers and was surely a catchable pass that Fasano should make every single time. But the pass was not where it should have been. You do not throw back shoulder like that with space to the front, an opening to the front, and with a defender chasing, and another one so close to that back shoulder. Unless its a quick curl for a first down. The only real explaination to excuse the throw is that Henne had a player bearing down on him and got the ball out before he got smacked and that that defender may have even touched Henne's arm as he released it. If I'm a betting man, I say Henne would have wanted to get the ball more out in front.
I'm more concerned about the O-Line and Run Game than QB at this point. If we can have a strong O-Line and Run Game we'll be in most every game and should get a bunch of wins. Henne can't carry a team, but I expect him to be decent enough if the rushing attack (with o-line help of course) can get going.
Yeah, that's what can happen when you lead a guy into the flat vs a Cover 2 zone and/or a rolled up corner. Yeah Henne, throw it a little further outside so your teammate can get his *** decapitated.
Weight isn't the issue here. A 160 lb DB can blow out your ACL if he catches you before you have time to protect yourself. Hines Ward has a rule that was made just for him after he decapitated the 250+ LB Keith Rivers, so try again.
I bet Nate Hughes & Jordan Shipley were both glad they were able to catch these passes in stride. [video=youtube;VXx7Fv5AS8Y]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXx7Fv5AS8Y&feature=related[/video] [video=youtube;kfoPYpC4pyY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kfoPYpC4pyY[/video] Jerry, d'you know that the human head weighs 8 pounds? lol.
Thats exactly why i would want Fasano facing what was coming at him. He had time to react with the right pass..
BUt...but...but...if you use pythagorean's theorem the DB was 4 miles away, isn't even in the frame and has NO chance of hitting the receiver. I don't care if the WR was KO'd...it was all an illusion! That's right...evil Philly black magic that made it look like Asante could travel at the speed of light and make that hit. Wait...what hit?
Has absolutely no bearing on Fasano being lead. Unless of course, Robinson planned on drawing a flag and a fine. Those are all illigal hits....
This has to be one of the silliest things you've ever written. Honestly, is there no end you'll go to thrash Henne? remind me again how much Fasano's head weighs? Is it coated in armor? TE Kevin Boss-- 6'6, 255....... DB Sherrod Martin, 6'1, 198. Boss with a concussion and neck injury. The shot by Martin "felt like a baseball bat to my head". [video] [video]http://www.sny.tv/media/video.jsp?content_id=12120517&topic_id=6479520[/video] [/video] Then we have Kevin Boss black out #2. Kevin Boss vs Eric Weddle (5'11, 200). Proceed to the 3:20 mark. [video=youtube;PMu6_MK5_HQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMu6_MK5_HQ[/video] Then there's the Kevin Boss being knocked out by defensive back Antrel Rolle. Can't find the video though. How about the new 12 year concussion study, the one by by former members of the NFL’s Mild Traumatic Brain Injury Committee: Casson said the increased rate of concussions among tight ends may have something to do with how the game has evolved over the years. “Tight ends are being used less as blockers and more as pass receivers, so they’re running down the field at higher speeds and are more prone to being involved in significant head collisions,” he said. I guess you are right, CK. Tight ends ARE fragile. Apparently they get concussions just like the rest of us. Who'd a thunk it?
so what you're saying is it's fine to lead a receiver into a zone b/c you know the defender sitting there isn't going to throw in a helmet to helmet? Are we talking about the same Robinson who blew up DeSean Jackson with a helmet to helmet? How about if it's an accidental helmet to helmet? How about if it's a helmet to wrist? Does Fasano's wrist weight 255 pounds, CK? Helmet to knee? Dunta Robinson: 188 lbs........... Fasano's ACL: 8 ounces. Was this Dallas Clark hit illegal? Clark: 6'3, 252...... Denard Jackson: 6'0, 200. Please go back to the commentary on the play. [video=youtube;FsZZP6h6NMI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FsZZP6h6NMI[/video]
Just b/c you can see that from the eye in the sky doesn't mean a QB can see the amount of cushion when there's a wall of linemen in front of him. Are you trying to say that on every play where a CB is in zone, that a QB knows for sure there will be 10 feet of distance between a DB and the TE entering his zone? That's the question right there. If Henne can see the DB and knows there's some cushion, then he can lead his target. If he can't see the DB but knows he's there, he's wise to not risking getting his target killed. Personally, I agree with your last part and think Henne's arm was impeded at its release point.
No, what I'm saying is that there was at least 10 feet between them on THAT play, and Henne knew it. The only excuse is that his arm might have been tapped or he rushed it to avoid that. The video clearly shows a nice path that Henne was locked onto with his eye in the sky...
Since you like to take the time why dont you find some of the plays where the TE completly runs over the DB's! Hell, go ahead and do it versus some linebackers too. I'm willing to bet that there are a ton more that are positive plays instead of injuries to the TE's.
IMO, generally speaking on a play like that, yes. He's not being led potentially exposed into a defender's zone. I'm not really a fan of saying--- "well it's ok to do it this time, but it's not ok that time." I'd rather not let a QB get into any bad habits. You should know before the snap what the potential outcomes are, and if you know that guy could be sitting there to take your players head off, you don't give him the chance, especially if he's blocked from your line of sight and don't know if he's 10 feet away or 3 feet away. Chronologically, first thing I'm thinking on this play (before the snap) is putting it where I'm not getting Fasano killed. If he's my primary option, then his safety trumps thoughts of YAC. Then, while the play is transpiring, if I have a visual on the defender and see there's enough room to lead my target w/o sending him to the hospital, I'll lead him. McCoy was reamed for letting his guys get killed last year, and since today's NFL players are bigger, stronger, and faster than ever, I'd rather not take the chance.
That makes absolutely no sense. This isn't football derby. It's not a competition to see who can knock out whom. Who cares how many DBs have been run over by TEs in the past if your TE happens to be the player receiving a spinal injury during the present play. Please tell me you're just playing around and aren't really this foolish when it comes to player safety.
Why? It might look great on film but does that somehow nullify all the concussions TEs are getting? So now it's wise to risk losing your TE b/c you're hoping to pick up a couple more yards?
I remember Marino one time hitting Keith Byars perfectly in stride on a shallow cross, immediately after catching it, he turned upfield only to be met right at the knees square on by the shoulder pads of a much smaller corner. Byars was hurt, because his knees hyperextended, but I cannot recall how badly. This was like 1994-95 To assume Robinson could not do damage to a guy the size of Fasano is absolutely ridiculous. Any CB Robinson's size hits a TE around the knee area with his shoulder, can potentially do significant damage if he is hit just right.
And I'm saying Henne missed the spot and should have lead Fasano. Leaving your target out to dry is not happening in that situation. It's just not! There is plenty of space for Fasano to lower his shoulder and knock the snot out of Robinson if he comes in even remotely high. There are also plenty of times when you see a target get the snot knocked out of them from behind that results in back, neck and head injuries...
No, it shows exactly what was most likely going to happen. Fasano, having enough time to lower the boom on Robinson, and possibly give him a concussion. It's not just TE's getting them and hardly from Cb's
I find it foolish that you are thinking that Henne thought of player safety when he made that poor throw and a HUGE stretch when it comes to defending the poor pass.
Come on Todd! You cannot be serious? I really enjoyed people questioning my eyesight to maybe being wrong on what happened over lets not get Fasano hurt. This guessing of what could have happened, could have happened to the Db as well....
Look, I do not know the exact spot that Henne intended to throw that pass. Neither do you or anyone else here. All any of us do actually know is the pass arrived at Fasano well within the framework of his body and any pro tight end worth his salt should make that catch 95% of the time at least. Yac or no yac. Fvck yac for that matter. It was very catchable. It was not caught. Bottom line, end of story. Was it a perfect pass? No! Was it a bad pass? Hell no!. Could it have been better placed? Probably so. Does that excuse Fasano for dropping it? Not on your life!
And 5% of the time it is intercepted. Which is why when you throw it behind the receiver, you do not throw it on his shoulder pads. It was catchable, however it was poorly placed.
that still doesn't answer my question (and I don't mean that in a rude way). On every play where a CB is in zone, do you know for sure there will be 10 feet of distance between himself and the TE entering his zone? Do you know this with certainty pre-snap to where you can lead your target every time? There are some people here who would call Henne's placement on that throw poor regardless of the answer to the above question. "The pass was thrown to his inside; it's a terrible pass; Henne sucks; blehh". When in reality, that "poorly placed" pass as they call it could potentially save Fasano from a trip to the hospital. Some of these people seem to think that, regardless of the situation, Henne's pass needs to be in front of his receiver. When you go back to the replay (the one from behind Henne) it very much looks like Pouncy, Incognito, and Atlanta's Dlineman could be blocking Henne's view of Dunta at the time Chad is starting his delivery. What GM and I are telling these people is---- we don't know for sure what Henne is able to see when delivering the pass, so if Dunta is blocked from site, then it's actually a better throw to put it on Fasano's inside shoulder to keep him from going unprotected into a zone. If you put it on his back hip or inside shoulder, you can slow him down and almost direct him away from a more violent collision that lay waiting in front of him.... b/c if he's catching it full steam, he still has to get his head around, locate the defender, adjust himself for the impact, which by the time the defender arrives, could be too late b/c the defender has had a few steps longer to prepare for it. Now, it's possible like you say that Henne did see Dunta and was leading Fasano b/c he knew he had some room, which would explain the pass being behind Fasano when his release is impeded. This still has nothing to do with some people's mind set that a pass behind Fasano is bad no matter what.
