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Cam Newton to start vs Dolphins

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by jim1, Aug 17, 2011.

  1. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    I take it you missed my first post and don't know the definition of "overall"?
     
  2. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    By one game. And Vick's last season there he was...yep...7-9. ;)
     
  3. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    Overall 93 TD's, 58 Ints, 80 passer rating. 4time Pro Bowler. That's not horrible. I remember seeing him pick apart the Dolphins a few years ago, it was a pretty impressive performance.
     
  4. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    80 QBR? No...try 76 QBR for his career. Averages around 13 passing TD's a season with a 55% comp percentage, played 16 games in only one out of his 8 eligible seasons, led the league 3 times in fumbles, and 2 years in prison.

    OVERALL he's been a **** QB.

    Last season, as I wrote before, was his only good season.
     
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  5. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    And yet he's been in 4 Pro Bowls. Go figure.

    76 QBR for Atlanta, 100 for Philly, 80 overall.

    Your avg TD #s are skewed because he played very little in 2001, 2003 and 2009.
     
  6. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    Pro Bowls mean crap. Pro Bowls are popularity contests nowadays. How many All Pro's has he made? ;)

    And I see what you did to come up with an 80 career QBR. You included the 6 TOTAL completions he made in 2009 that gave him a 93 QBR. However, you then said my numbers were skewed cause he played very little in 2001, 2003 and 2009. lol...So, you can use 2009 (13 attempts) but I can't use 2009 or 2001 (113 attempts) or 2003 (100 attempts)? lol


    BTW, I didn't use his 2009 season for his TD average per season. ;)
     
  7. Rhody Phins Fan

    Rhody Phins Fan Well-Known Member

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    You can't ignore his rushing tho. He was running from the quarterback position so those yards need to be taken into consideration.
     
  8. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    I didn't even look at 2009. And I didn't bother with with the rushing aspect, although I should have.
     
  9. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    You had to have considered his 2009 season to get the 80 QBR. I didn't include 2009 (his 13 passing attempts) and as such his career QBR is a 76. I don't look at his rushing yards when I talk about him being a ****ty QB. If someone were to say he was a fast runner I'd agree. That's about all he's good at.

    However, how did you like that superb outing he had against the Steelers tonight? lol
     
  10. smahtaz

    smahtaz Pimpin Ain't Easy

    It appears there are a lot of Vick fans on our board. He sucked out loud tonight.
     
  11. Muck

    Muck Throwback Uniform Crusader Retired Administrator

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    Vick horrible? Really?

    I think we need to refresh on what that word actually means.

    Dude won playoff games in Atlanta despite not having his head screwed on. It's on now and he's lighting up the league.

    I'd do backflips if he were our QB.

    - sent from my EVO 3D -
     
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  12. Muck

    Muck Throwback Uniform Crusader Retired Administrator

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    So did Josh Freeman.

    What does that prove?

    - sent from my EVO 3D -
     
  13. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    His time in Atlanta produced a 75.7 QBR. His time in Philly it has been 100.0 and all years combined it becomes 80.15. If you removed 2009, it only adjusts his career QBR to 80.07

    http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/V/VickMi00.htm
     
  14. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    It proves jack squat.
     
  15. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    Dude never posted a QBR higher than 78 when he was in Atlanta and I think he averaged around 150 ypg in passing.

    He won playoff games or the Atlanta Falcons won playoff games? Besides, his postseason record is 2-4 with a 55% comp percentage and a 76 QBR.

    Again, I'm talking about his QUARTERBACK skills. They suck ***. Yes, he can run fast...that's it. He can't hit the broad side of a barn. He can't read a defense if his life depended on it. He can't do anything even a mediocre QB can do. He runs fast...that is it.
     
  16. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    You're both right, my bad. 76 is actually his average season QBR. Meaning that if you add up all of his QBR's (sans the 2009 season) and average them out it will come to 76. If you don't include his 2009 season he is 1163 for 2102, 14523 yds, 92 TDs, 58 INTs...which does in fact add up to an 80 QBR.

    Still though, he's posted a QBR of over 80 (81 and 100) twice in his 7 seasons of playing.
     
  17. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    Interesting. The last time I checked running was a Quarterback skill. Vick redefined the position in that regard. When I saw him play against the Dolphins a few years ago he sliced us and diced us with his feet and his arm. Broad sides of barns were ample targets for him on that day, for sure. Go ahead, throw out last year's season in which he was the NFL MVP runner up. Does that voting suck, too, same as the Pro Bowl? Whatever makes you feel better.
     
  18. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    Interesting. The last time I checked running was a Quarterback skill. Vick redefined the position in that regard. When I saw him play against the Dolphins a few years ago he sliced us and diced us with his feet and his arm. Broad sides of barns were ample targets for him on that day, for sure. Go ahead, throw out last year's season in which he was the NFL MVP runner up. Does that voting suck, too, same as the Pro Bowl? Whatever makes you feel better.
     
  19. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    93 TDs....58 INTs....terrible QB...jeanyes..
     
  20. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    HEY HEY HEY! How dare you talk about his running skill!! Hes aloud to talk about his fumbles but your not aloud to talk about his running skill damn it!! Lets talk only about his completion percentage where his ATL WRs dropped 11.3 percent of catchable balls Mike Vick threw...HES ****ING AWFUL!
     
  21. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    "Running" is required at ALL positions. However, you don't pick a QB who can run fast but not do anything else.

    It's nice that you remember one game of Vick's. Hell, if I remember only one game of Henne's I could then compare him to Dan Marino. lol

    I'm not throwing out last season. Although, it seems everyone else, including you, is throwing out all BUT last season. I'm looking at his OVERALL body of work. You know, his ****ty QB'ing.

    Your post, with it's double standards, makes me laugh. Whatever makes you feel better.
     
  22. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    Nice cherry picking.

    Henne- 62% career completion percentage...HE'S JOE ****ING MONTANA!!! lol

    Vick---55% comp....averages 13 TD passes a season....posted an 80 QBR in a season twice his ENTIRE career... terrible QB...

    (What is "jeanyes"?)
     
  23. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    Henne has a 62% comp percentage. What's the % of dropped passes from his WR's? ;)
     
  24. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    How about nice cherry picking by you. All you have is his completion % for your arguement. Excluding 2009 season, He has Vick has 92 TDs in 86 games. You use the TD passes a season for your arguement however you fail to mention he has seasons where he played 8 games, 5 games, and 12 games. Of course his TD passes per season is low.

    In reality he actually has 122 total TDs in 7 seasons and 86 games. meaning in the course of a 16 game season that is over 22 TDs a game. terrible..
     
  25. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    Not as much as the ATL wideouts. Henne is check down king, of course his completion % is higher. Vick was a down field passer.

    Vick has not been an accurate passer in his career. No doubt. 55% is not good. But again, thats all you have. When you factor in EVERYTHING, he was good.

    BTW, Dan Marinos career % is 59 and John Elways is 57. a whole 2 and 4 % more...guess they couldnt hit the broad side of a barn either huh?
     
  26. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    In 2002 his QBR was 81.6. That was his best season in Atlanta.
     
  27. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    Amazing how you say your taking his whole body of work in consideration considering the guy has a 80 QB rating. 125 career TDs. and 46 and 31 as a starter. but yet thats terrible.
     
  28. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    I don't think you know what cherry picking means or you're not reading my posts in their entirety. I haven't just used his comp % to show that he's a ****ty QB.

    You are making one good point though with your 8 , 5, and 12 game seasons. He can't stay on the field. You realize that durability is one MAJOR factor of being a good football player, right? So not only does his accuracy suck, his defense reading ability suck, his turnover ratio suck, and his personal character suck, but he's also injury prone. He was drafted 10 years ago. 86 games...8.6 games per season. Do you really think that any QB who can be counted on to play 8.6 games per season, due to being injured, in prison... whatever, is GREAT? LMFAO!

    Also, you try to manipulate his TD's by imaging him in full 16 game seasons. Well guess what, he's played a 16 game season once, so his 13 passing TD's per season is correct.

    Try again.
     
  29. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    And you say you're taking into consideration his "whole body of work" with this crap?

    One good season put his QBR up to an 80 from a 76. He's posted a QBR of over 80 twice out of his 7 years. 55% career comp %. Averages less than 150 yards passing per game in is career. One full 16 game season due to being injury prone and spending 2 years in prison. Led the league in fumbles 3 times. Averages 13 passing TD's per season.

    Again...****ty QB...he can run fast... that is it.
     
  30. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    Dude, give it up. Your whole argument is horrendous and ludicrous.
     
  31. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    So why can you consider the fact Vicks durability but you dont consider his running skill? LMAO. you are cherry picking and its obvious.

    forget season wise, 16 game season wise, whatever. The fact is, without bending it in any way possible, Vick has 122 TDs and 85 TOs in 86 games. Correct?

    Thats 1.4 TDs a game. That is .98 TO a game. Lets compare...

    Chad Henne - 28 TDs in 29 games - 35 TOs in 29 games - Just under 1 TD a game - 1.2 TO a game.

    Brett Farve - 522 TDs in 298 games - 409 TOs - 1.7 TDs a game - 1.4 TOs a game

    McNabb - 258 TDs in 161 Games - 1.6 TDs a game - 161 TOs - 1 TO a game

    Flacco - 63 TDs in 48 games - 1.3 TDs a game - 42 TOs - .87 TOs a game

    Eli Manning - 159 TDs in 105 games - 1.51 a game - 172 TOs - 1.64 TO a game

    Brees - 1.75 TDs a game - 1.14 TO a game

    Rivers - 1.6 TDs a game - .92 TO a game

    Matt Ryan - 1.47 TDs a game - .87 TO a game

    Cutler - 1.6 TD a game - 1.38 TO a game

    Big Ben - 1.59 TD a game - 1.08 TOs a game

    Hasselbeck - 1.08 TD a game - .9 TO a game

    So now that your "his turnover ratio suck" theory is thrown out the window...We can both agree hes not the most accurate thrower. Cant read defense theory is horse**** and proof is in his numbers. His personal character? again, amazing how you dont want to talk about his running but can factor in personal character and durability....seems like this argument is slipping through your fingers to me...try again...or not please because your wrong and have nothing to back it up outside of 55%.
     
  32. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    Of course it is....to you!

    I mean, you've proven nothing and instead of trying you just proclaim yourself the victor and advise me to "give up". :lol:

    I guess you're right. Vick is a GREAT QB if you only look at last season. :up:


    However, if you look at his entire career you'd see thatt he guy can run fast, can't throw an accurate pass, gets injured a lot, can't read a defense, fumbles a lot, and was forced to spend 2 years away from the league due to being in prison. So no...you're not right. He's crap.
     
  33. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    LMFAO!

    Vick has had 58 INT's and 66 fumbles in his career. To me that's more than 85. My math tells me that 58+66= 124.

    So, that's 1.5 TO per game. So, only Eli is worse out of your list of QB's.


    HAHAHAHAHAH!!


    Henne's TO ratio is better than Vick's...hahahahahahaha!
     
  34. 2k5

    2k5 I miss Ted Ginn Jr.

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    This thread sucks.
     
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  35. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    When I want your opinion on Michael Vick I'll give it to you. I never said that he was great, I questioned your conclusion that he's horrible. Did you read my ealier post?
     
  36. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    Another great, informative post.

    Listen, twerp, you butted in...if you don't want my opinion or if you want to "question" me either back up your **** with something other than "your argument is ludicrous" or GTFO...OK?


    No offense.
     
  37. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    Do everyone a favor and double up on your meds. Four Pro Bowls and he sucks- great argument. I should have avoided this stink bomb thread in the first place, lesson learned- don't wallow in others' crapitude.
     
  38. MarinePhinFan

    MarinePhinFan Banned

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    Vick's career Y/A= 6.9

    Henne's career Y/A= 6.7


    Look at what TODAY's QB's are getting in terms of comp% an dcompare those to Vick.

    Look at 20 years ago the QB's comp % and compare those to Marino.

    Why do I always have to explain this simple stuff? It's like pre-school around this place.
     
  39. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    Yea, pre-school because obviously you dont understand YPA. the A, actually stands for "Attempt". OK still with me? Since Vick completion % is much lower, obviously his YPA would be lower. If it was YPC Vicks #s would be astounding. Heres a little blurb about Vick when he was about to make a comeback to the NFL..

    Like taking candy from a baby
     
  40. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    HAHAHAHA!! hilarious that you dont know the definition of a TO..TO=Turnover. a fumble isnt exactly a TO, a lost fumble is!! BAHAHAHAAH! hilarious. and I factored in lost fumbles for everyone on the list.
     

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