Can someone explain to me what happened to this guy. I understand that Guard is different than Tackle, but blocking is blocking. Is he struggling learning the new position or have his skills eroded so badly that he's just not productive anymore? Obviously his skills have eroded somewhat or else he wouldn't have been moved to Guard. Or maybe he just had a bad game. I dunno. I'm just confused. -ps--Henne looked great!
Carey has seen his overall play diminish over the last few years. That is why the Dolphins cut his pay and moved him from right tackle. I guess they thought the move to right guard would improve his play because he would no longer have to worry about blocking speedy defensive ends. As you noted though, he no longer blocks anyone. The Dolphins should sign O'Hara and cut Carey. O'Hara may not be the offensive lineman he was a few years ago but he is definitely better than Carey is right now. I hope they sign O'Hara and put him at center. They can move Pouncey to right guard, where he should have been playing from the beginning. Pouncey just doesn't have the skill at this time to take on the defensive tackles in the NFL while playing center. Perhaps a few years at right guard would improve his play on the offensive line.
Careys problem is he just does not give two sh*&%^ts anymore, period. Its pretty evident Pouncey cannot move the larger DTs we are going to face this year. Told everyone he is no where in talent like his brother is. Like day and night.
I said it when the move happened that Carey has failed everytime they asked him to play Guard. Hell Wanny tried him in that first preseason and Carey lasted something like 3 days and moved him back quickly. The guy just plays better at tackle then guard. However considering his injuries last year, he should have come in lighter then years past. He's too old to be carrying 350lbs anymore.
I don't get it. We're facing 13 3-4s this season. Why not have the strongest interior linemen play C (Incognito) and then have two athletic pass blockers play LG and RG. Something like: LG- Brian Waters C- Richie Incognito RG- Mike Pouncey
1- Vernon looks out of shape, off balance and weak in his core and base. Plus slow. 2 - I am worried this staff will not to any of the obvious things (move Carey to RT, sign a RG, or shuffle Incognito, Pouncey etc and sign Waters or O'Hara) to solve this problem, and will stubbornly stick to their plan of Carey at RG and Columbo at RT. If so, Sparano ends up unemployed after a losing season.
I simply cannot believe Waters is still a FA. Granted, he is 34 yrs old, but he can still play. What does he want? 20mil a year or what? In over 531 passing attempts last season, he allowed one sack. IMO, I'm to the point of saying screw the run blocking as a the main priority. We need the 5 OL who can best keep rushers off Henne if we are to have a chance this season. Your idea would be better than what we got. Seems like Tony is stuck on Pouncey playing C though, no matter what. As if by making him RG this season, it would look like we reached on the pick or something. Even if we added Waters and moved Richie to RG would be better IMO.
Carey's performance tonight was woeful. Then again, so was Jerry's...and Murtha's...and Colombo's... 5 sacks; 22 yards on 17 carries. That tells the story in a nutshell.
Clean, I have to think Waters is being picky about what type of situation he wants to land in; meaning the money, and the coach, offense style, chance to win, if it's a city with his favorite burger chain in it, who knows what else. I agree that he is too good not to be signed by now unless the hold up were on his end. I want Brian Waters, big time. But this late in the game, not sure the team will make that move. The stats for the Oline are SO bad though that I don;t think they can delude themselves into thinking it'll improve from within. If they can delude themselves to that degree, then they deserve whatever's coming to them.
He hasn;t looked the same since he had recurring back issues. Seems like he let himself go, or it inhibited his ability to train hard. His midsection just looks like the jalopy from Beverly Hillbillies. And I don't just mean fat, I mean he plays like he has poor core strength through his lower torso, waist and pelvis.
Another thought, we got a backup in Berger who has allowed 2 sacks in 829 pass blocking snaps the past two seasons. He was ranked overall the 16th center in 2010 and 13th overall in 2009. Before I'd want to continue like we are, either plug him at RG, or move Pouncey there and put him back in at C. Or else, since Gurode didn't play tonight there were rumors maybe he is about to be traded. We could only hope he is the latest Phinboy. Or else, sign Leonard Davis and plug him at RG. Couldn't be any worse. Heck I've been wondering about also trying Willis there.
If you ever do have a back injury, I can assure you, your mobility is significantly reduced. There's no way around it.
I'm wondering if the Dolphins are waiting until after Week 1 -- like teams tend to do -- so the veteran salaries aren't fully guaranteed. Unfortunately we have a divisional game first. And the right side of the OL looks awful. We have two new veteran players there, and we got worse.
about the offensive line: 1) I called for a free-agent elite LG early on in the process 2) however, we do have talent in the stable 3) would give Incognito another look @ Center, move Pouncey to LG & bring in Jerry in @ RG moving Carey over to compete with Murtha @ RT Long-Pouncey-Incognito-Jerry-Murtha/Carey Sparano will lose his job if cannot resolve this issue in a timely fashion. the line is horrendous. it must be fixed.
Carey's not all that fat for an NFL player, and he's not any bigger or out of shape than he's ever been going back to college. I think it's a little bit early to be heralding the apocalypse as well. They certainly haven't looked good in this game or the Falcons game, but it's preseason. The backs all look fine, and are making good runs when they have holes or are catching the ball, and it wouldn't be the most astounding thing ever to go through a preseason with poor play and get at least average play during the season. Because it's not about getting your strongest person at Center to beat a NT?
I hope that Sparano, Daboll, Deguliamo and Ireland are meeting today to solve this. They had better do something fast! This line is terrible. Figures. Henne is not looking bad and the oline is just awful. Can't win for losing.
I'd bring in John Jerry into the mix because he has all the intangibles to play the position. the only thing he lacks is a good offensive line to grow with while he's still learning. with year two he' ll certainly bring more to the table than as a rookie. Jerry is your right guard. let Carey and Murtha compete @ RT. might see Carey's game significantly pick up competing @ RT
Takes away your power as well, hate to say..Carey looks done, Sparano should pull the plug if he can find an upgrade by Monday.
funny, i've talked about Vernon for a while now .... as his effort level at RT was not very good either. He gave effort for about 2-3 steps on every play and then stopped - pretty much all last year and even the year before, but because of 'stats' many here heralded Carey as one of the elite RTs in the league ... and even inferred that he could still slide over to LT. it doesn't matter what his health condition is ... back, knees whatever -- this is a business. I so wish we would have traded him when his perceived value was high. regardless, all i ask for is a solid OL -- and we are a ways from that right now today. even if we sign someone, it will take at least 'some' time to come together as a unit. the OL is going to dictate the level of success this year ... as the defense has no reason to not hold up its end of the bargain -- and STs should be improved over the last 2 years. lets right this ship ..... NOW!
Beat like a beaten drum even ... he has regressed significantly and he wasn't at any where near the production level needed that if he didn't improve a lot he would not be a serviceable player . His only hope is he gets an "injury" and begs borrows or buys another off season to decide if he wants to work hard and smart enough to have half a chance to not be a huge bust for Miami. Listened to the radio broadcast while watching the game , and Keith Sims was direct and blunt about the Oline. Mike Dee was on with the radio crew and he asked how the rookie or newcomer was doing ( meaning Sims on the broadcast ) and Joe Rose said he almost left the booth to go suit up because of how bad the line play was. Sims was extremely direct in detailing the performance , and I liked that he was.
Well knee injuries coupled with back problems won't help him. He looks like he can't sit down in pass pro, he's leaning and subsequently getting beaten by quicker 3 technique tackles (I'm using that term to name the quicker defenders we've faced the last few weeks).If he continues to lean, he's not going to do well, if he can some felxibility back, his game will improve.
Jerry is not the answer at guard. He is really nothing but another draft choice for the offensive line who will be lucky to make the team this season. The fact that the Dolphins have him playing tackle and not guard clearly shows that they have already seen that he does not have what it takes to play inside. He also doesn't have the foot work to play tackle. So if he makes the team, all that will show is that Ireland will keep him around for another year, just to avoid the heat he would take for once again proving that he has no idea how to draft players who actually know how to play on the offensive line. Other than Jake Long,the Dolphins have done a miserable job of improving the offensive line over the last four years. I think the line they have at the present time will end up being the worst line they have had in Miami since the offensive line, the year they went 1-15. The problem with the Dolphins is Ireland, who is responsible for providing the team with quality players on the offensive line. He has been a complete failure in this regard. Until Ross comes to his senses and actually fires Ireland and brings in a GM who can actually select quality NFL talent. The Dolphins will remain the bad to mediocre team they have been for over a decade.
I think it's more that he simply hasn't adjusted to players being in closer quarters in the interior. He's used to having more of a cushion in pass protection, and now players are on him more quickly. Athletically, people suggesting he is slow are off-base. We've seen him block linemen covering him on an interior shade down the line on outside zones to the left(He didn't get a load of movement on him, but he kept him blocked and flowing), and we've seen him zone out to the second level and hit a linebacker now problem.
I wonder if the biggest thing is along the same lines as what your saying, where the fact the defender has his hands on him in a second is making the difference. Interior lineman need exceptionally quick hands, and right now, he's getting beaten to the punch. If this is the case, then he needs to get this down, in a hurry. My concerns are his footwork; powersteps etc and his ability to win those hand fights initially. Once Vernon does get a grasp of his man, he does quite well, but getting his hands on him is a bit of an issue right now.
Ireland has done well in bringing in talent. Hitting 40% of his draft picks would be stellar for any GM. Ireland IMO has done well thus far - is he perfect? No. But he's better than Mueller or Saban in that regard, or anyone else we've had for the past 15+ years hands down.
I hate to agree with you on this. Its great that we've hit on picks like Vontae, SS, Langforrd, et al. It sucks that all the o-line picks (save for Jake) are terrible.
They've struggled on the offensive line for sure. But he's excelled in other areas. I don't believe we can extrapolate total incompetence from failure at one position. Nor would I be ready to call Pouncey a bust after three preseason games. Honestly, and I hate to do this, but do we know that Jerry was indeed Ireland's pick? Odds are it was, but as we've learned, Parcells exerted influence even more than we might have thought. We know it was Parcells on the phone shortly after midnight to get Justin Smiley. We know it was Parcells that took Pat White. We know that Parcells was against sending even that 7th round pick to JAX for Tony McDaniel. Etc. I simply don't recall on Jerry either way. I'm not happy with the right side of the OL this morning. But I don't believe it's Jeff Ireland that moved Vernon Carey to guard. He doesn't make that call unilaterally IMO. There are some variables that we simply aren't privy to.
So this thread got me thinking: If our O-line sucked so bad, how did Henne get the time to throw that awesome pass to Marshall??? The answer: both RBs stayed in to block!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jegJe7nLEBA&feature=player_embedded
Ireland has done well above average as a GM. I'd suggest you go look at what other teams have drafted during the same time period, and come back and tell me who all you've got as better.
Actually Tampa tried to create an alley on the right side and sent two blitzers into it. That was a great job all around to get that handled.
i think carey has been breaking down physically for the last few seasons. him moving to guard isnt working out at this point. it may very well be that the physical toll of playing that position has caught up with him. on the other hand there is a chance that its simply him learning a new position. if i had to bet i would say he is done but one thing i wont do is trash him. i think he's handled himself well overall and gave his all to our team over the years. if its the end for him i hope i wish him well and thank him for his contributions to our team
