Well if the mentality is that we shouldn't have taken a franchise Qb because he wouldn't succeed here anyway then we honestly should just move the team to LA or just get rid of the franchise. I mean seriously, don't take a franchise Qb because we don't have a ready made Superbowl team at every position already? Thats just idiotic. I'd much rather start with the franchise Qb then build around him versus the other way around. No sane GM would pick to pass a Franchise Qb to build their oline, thats just crazy or stupid or both.
Exactly, but that would have been risky, another way to look at passing over Ryan is: "We do not trust ourselves enough to properly evaluate Ryan as a Qb, so we took Jake Long" Even more damming is, Ryan was not plan B, Chris Long was, and to me that sums up to a "T" what has went wrong over the last 4 yrs.
I think the mentality was "we don't need a Matt Ryan to win just give me a Chad Henne and a good team around him and we'll win", the mentality from the front office on down was coaching and O/Dline wins championships which might have been true 10 years ago but this is a Qb league now. Game managers and mediocre Qb play can't be hidden with running backs and defense anymore. You have to score points with the passing game and Qb play to win in the modern NFL.
I don't neccessarily agree with that FFs72, there is value in moving counter to a trend, that is to say one does not exclude the other, you can win like that, but it requires your linemen to dominate and your defense to be great. This is how the Jets have won, the same with Ryan's falcons. However, both have Qb's they took in the Top 10, so maybe better said "you can win that way, but you still need a Qb who can make plays".
I'm about to blapheme, but if your asking about when it all started to go wrong for this franchise, well, it was when we drafted Marino......Now hear me out, we had a decent team and we needed Marino, however..the front office strarted to neglect need areas. Like for instance running back. They were perfectly happy to let the short passing game replace running. Problem was the offense would score way to fast. Against teams like Buffalo at the time who had Kelly who could light it up when needed, and had Thurman Thomas to grind it out, they would wear our defense down. Thats when the crappy drafting started. We never got our balance while we had Marino, and thats why he does't have a ring. And since Marino, the failure to adequately adress the Qb position is why we are at where we are at now. They keeping approaching drafting and free agency like we are only one player away.
IMO You should always take the most dynamic player on the board if you believe that player is going to dominate at his postion. Creating missmatches is what wins football games. The Ravens do just fine with a mediocre QB but they have a great back in Ray Rice who defenses have to plan against and commit players to stopping him on every down he is in the game. That is what we lack. BM is probably our best offensive player and he is wildly inconsistent.
Jake is not having a good year. At all. I see Matt Ryan getting slammed a lot for not having a great season yet Jake is completely off the hook for under performing it seems. Injury or not he's in there so he needs to perform.
Sanchez also played well in the playoff games that the Jest have won. You need quality Qb play to win in the NFL right now. I'd say its possible but extremely unlikely to win in the playoffs without a top Qb at this point.
While Marino certainly didn't have a balanced team most of the time he was around bad luck is the reason he didn't win the big one. Look at the team Peyton Manning won a Super Bowl against and look at the team Dan was supposed to beat in his sophomore season in the big game. You're talking about a joke of an NFC championship team with Rex Grossman at the helm vs. one of the greatest franchises ever built. Nobody in the AFC could figure out those Bills teams, it wasn't just Miami. That's the reason they went to four Super Bowls in a row, something that is completely unprecedented. The NFC was dominant but the AFC took too long to catch up with what the Bills were doing. It's a little crazy to imply that Don Shula was not trying to build a balanced team around Dan Marino. He just failed at it.
You DAMN the pick while letting the picker slide and DAMN the franchise while letting the FO and HC slide? You two slay me. First of all Matt Ryan is not and may never be a Franchise QB and Coaches, those guys you flake off as an afterthought, can and do make all the difference in the world! Your wonder boy Matt Ryan is a case in point! Under QB coach Bill Musgrave Ryan went from the 20th ranked in 08 to 9 in 10 back down to 21 in 11 under new QB coach Bob Bratkowski, the guy Palmer didn't want in Cinncy! I wonder why! BTW the guy in slot #22 this year, yep you got it, Chad Henne! As for "he wouldn't succeed here anyway then we honestly should just move the team to LA or just get rid of the franchise." Oh really? Why not just fire the HC and FO and then draft a QB who truly would make a difference while at the same time HIRE a HC and FO that can do a proper job of drafting and coaching. Seems to me to be a better choice ....... unless you'd rather tuck tail and run!
LT is one of the most important position in football. your quarterback cant throw from his back. matt ryan isn't that good. he has a killer offense around him and still is barely average. roddy white, gonzo, turner and now julio jones and they still aren't that good.
they def drafted about 3 or 4 rbs in the first round when they had marino. what we really needed was some defense. take the 2000 era dolphins and replace fiedler with an in prime marino and thats super bowl every year.
Matt Ryan is a franchise QB and he's definitely better than average. There's really no point in reading a post that says otherwise. How many sacks has Jake Long given up this season since we're evaluating players' careers and potential based on 7 games this season?
The first time it all went wrong was when Jimmy left. "While" he was running the show the organization and team was in continuous flux. Jimmy didn't like losing to the Jags, but despised answering to the local media, and likely concluded that together, it wasn't worth the effort. The second time it all went wrong was when Saban left. Disliked by many within the organization, "While" Saban was at the helm, he held the team, and everyone employed by it accountable. While something should have been done to ward off Alabama's pursuit of him, the media's unrelenting pestilence regarding it, helped drive him to the brink. Our most recent demise, originated with Parcells departure. His influence while here was both dynamic, and imposing on this team, yet the local Media for whatever reason, began a campaign of questioning when Parcells would leave, and relentlessly badgered him on his plans for signing everything over to Ireland. This, despite Sparano's inexperience, and myopic view of the Big Picture, found them prodding Parcells for answers on where he was going next, rather than pointing to any sense of obligation for staying to see this thing through. Our local press opened the door, and paved the way for his exit.
Jake Long is playing really bad this season too. Maybe its an injury but either way, his product on the field is unsat for a LT thats is paid what he is. I think a better argument for the regime playing it safe is Odrick and Misi over Earl Thomas. You want someone that can cause matchup problems and has potential to make a game changing play.
guys I thank you for your input and I am sorry if my original post was all over the place for I had many thoughts and i should have kep it simple and I disagree about trading Marino i would have drafted Jake Long but here is my problem , why draft a olineman and pay him more then a skill position when a ot can be found in the later rounds. Many coaches focus on the skill positions first and build the oline and dline so there really is more then one way to fillet a fish. trading up to get vernon carey was a mistake as well . If I was a qualified hc /gm I would have kept Marino for two more years and so with chambers , welker ricky and donald Lee and randy mc. marino could have wone a superbowl ring, and i say this because it was our qb in Feidler that cost us two playoff games . i would have drafted Aaron Rodgers that year we drafted Ronnie then i would have taken Adrian Peterson whe ever that year was that we passed on him.
Yep it started with Shula's decline and inability to build a team around Marino, then it snowballed over a decade and a half into the mess we're in today. Green Bay went through a similar thing until Favre raised them out of obscurity in the mid 90's (actually the acquisition of Reggie White helped as well).
Below are some of the best teams in the NFL in 2011, not one has a LT chosen number one overall in the draft. As a matter of fact, the only team with a LT selected number one overal in the draft is us, Miami and we are currently ranked 32 out of 32 teams. The only other LT selected with the first overal pick in the draft was in 1998, Orlando Pace. I put the team alongside the players name so you can see, most teams have QBs that are better then anything Miami has had since Dan Marino was here. So am I to believe all 31 other NFL teams are clueless and always would select the best OT in the draft over a QB ? No they are not. We all love Jake and not saying Matt Ryan would have taken us to a Super Bowl but am saying if we had drafted Ryan the name Jake Long would not even be mentioned here. Matt Ryans is, constantly. Outside of Orlando Pace and Long, no other OT have ever been selected with the first overall pick in the draft. A guy named Kurt Warner saved the Rams rear end and led them to 2 SBs. In paces 2nd and third year. Once Warner was gone, nada, the team did nothing even with Orlando Pace at LT. As you can see below and I did not bother to put the full league list, the majority of the winning teams in the NFL would rather have good people under center then the " supposed " best LT in the draft. You have guys in the 4th 5th 7th rounds at LT and apparently their QBs are doing quite well. We would have also. Derek Sherod GB 1St round pick 32 Joe Staley SF 1st round pick 21 Matt Light NE 2nd round pick 48 Sam Baker Atlanta1st round pick 21 Atl Chris Scott Pitts injured 5th round pick replaced with MAX STARKS 3rd round pick 75, 2 weeks ago after Starks was not resigned by Pitts or anyone else in off season Demetrius Bell Buffalo 7th round pick 221 Jermon Bushrod New Orleans 4th round pick 125
Okay just so we understand I have been drinking, but half of these teams did pick a LT with their first pick, even if it wasn't #1. Not gonna argue the Ice over long, but with the line we had Matt woulda got killed, not to mention we had crap at wr.
Ron Yary, LT USC #1 overall. Anywho, point being, it doesn't happen for a reason, even in 1981 when Anthony Munoz was a lock All Pro LT, he went #3 overall.
Difference being, Vern Carey was coming off of a great season in his first yr at LT in 07. WE had John Beck and Josh McCown.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not a believer in get the line straight first then get your skill players, I just understand that, that was the philosphy of the past few regimes.......play it safe and whatnot.
LOL, Meant in modern times but actually, Yary did not play LT in the NFL, he played RT for Minn but just the same, youare right, he was an OT taken number one overall in what, the 50s? Thanks. Guess my point is in most instances that high in the draft if a team needs a QB and there is a good one there, they take it over a lineman. IMO, Tuna thought he had his QB for the present and immediate future in Chad Pennington and you know what ? He may have been right but injuries ruined that plan. Thinking along those lines then yeah, maybe , who knows, possibly Tuna or whoever thought, we got Chad, we do not need Ryan. We will never know. Tunas history shows him never going off the deep end for a QB anyway. Who knows
Since Shula we've had run-first and play defense coaches. Zero real attempt at build a NFL quality offense. That's the honest truth
