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Discussion in 'Other Sports Forum' started by Boik14, Dec 1, 2011.

  1. Samphin

    Samphin Κακό σκυλί ψόφο δεν έχει

    Knicks and Heat fans...I love family reunions.
     
  2. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    we are indulging them...we are actually more interested in talking trash to Laker, Bulls, Mavs, and those decrepit old farts in Boston.
     
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  3. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    and for those of you that don't like advanced stats...then here are the old standard stats..head to head:

    http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=anthoca01&p2=jamesle01

    Code:
                           G 	W 	L 	GS 	MP 	FG 	FGA 	FG% 	3P 	3PA 	3P% 	FT 	FTA 	FT% 	ORB 	DRB 	TRB 	AST 	STL 	BLK 	TOV 	PF 	PTS
    LeBron James 	        13 	4 	9 	13 	39.5 	9.5 	20.4 	.464 	0.9 	3.9 	.235 	5.4 	7.8 	.693 	1.2 	5.9 	7.2 	7.6 	1.6 	0.7 	3.9 	2.8 	25.2
    Carmelo Anthony 	13 	9 	4 	13 	36.8 	8.0 	18.1 	.443 	0.7 	2.2 	.321 	5.2 	7.0 	.736 	1.6 	4.1 	5.7 	2.3 	0.9 	0.8 	3.3 	3.2 	21.8
    yep..Lebron can't "check" Melo. Those look like career lows to me from good ole' Melo.
     
  4. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    BTW. NBA Stats Cube, is back..so now you can have an orgy of stats to show how Lebron James dominates Carmelo Anthony.

    Did I run up the score enough? yes? okay..good.
     
  5. BlameItOnTheHenne

    BlameItOnTheHenne Taking a poop

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    Thank god the NBA is back :)
     
  6. Frumundah Finnatic

    Frumundah Finnatic U Mad Miami?

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    LOL at his Heat wont win comment.

    Why dont you worry about the Knicks becoming relevant?
     
  7. Boik14

    Boik14 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    That loser? LOL...the same guy your very own Pat Riley calls the best offensive player in the game? OK. Im aware of his playoff shortcomings. I can admit my favorite player hasnt played his best playoff ball yet. The only one of your three Id even want at this point is Wade.

    4-12 comes from lebron's record vs Melo including High School. He's never been able to beat Melo. I never said Melo's numbers were better, I said Lebron wont and cant win. And your very own stats bear that out. Even as a pro 4-9. And please, Denver was no juggernaut. That was a terrible team before Melo got there.
     
  8. SICK

    SICK Lounge Moderator

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    So you say Lebrons numbers are better yet go back to the overall record........does that NOT prove its about the team surrounding the players not the individuals?

    Lebron took a below average Cavs team to the FINALS......Melo? He is Tracy Mcgrady Deux. He can't even get out of the 1st round.
     
  9. Boik14

    Boik14 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I never said Melo's numbers were better. I said Lebron stunk in the 4th quarter which he did last year in the finals and I said Lebron cant beat Melo which he cant.

    Lebron didnt take a below average team to the finals. Mo Williams was freakin sick that year. Big Z was still playing adequately at C and so was Varejao. He was the primary scoring option. Melo's been stuck in the western conference with a guard oriented team and a set of injury prone bigs in Martin and Nene that couldnt deal with the LAL, Spurs, Suns or anyone elses bigs. Thats not to say Melo couldnt have played better but please lets realize the east was terrible during the years Lebron had success. i dont doubt for a minute that if roles had been reversed Melo would have accomplished at least as much as Lebron.
     
  10. Samphin

    Samphin Κακό σκυλί ψόφο δεν έχει

    I hate the LeBron took the Cavs to the Finals with no talent argument.

    First off it is absolutely false, and second off...the East was terrible during that time period. The West was (and still is to an extent) the dominant conference, and it has proven itself to be true come playoff time.
     
  11. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    Yeah..Mo Williams was sick that year. In Milwaukee. Mo Williams wasn't even on the team. Try again.
     
  12. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    That';s interesting. So you like vastly inferior basketball players. There is not a metric available to suggest that Melo is better than Lebron James. and Amare' argument is his inflated stats that will come crashing down as Melo Shoots away.

    Denver was no juggernaut? I explained to you already, how Denver was a favorite in 9 of the 13 meetings. I offered you real data..and you are offering "Go New York Go".

    How can you type with a straight face, that Lebron "won't and can't" win?

    Have you checked his age? He is so far, the most accomplished basketball player of his generation, (more accomplished than MICHAEL JORDAN at the same time) besides Kobe Bryant, and Lebron didn't have a in Prime SHAQ to hand him his first few championships.

    You sound utterly ridiculous, and are playing right into the Knicks/Jets Fan stereotype.
     
  13. Desides

    Desides Well-Known Member

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    You realize you’ve contradicted yourself here, right? I hate to be Phoenix Wright here (at least in this particular instance) but if “the East was terrible during that time period”, then the Cavs were also terrible by association, and as such, LeBron actually did take a Cavs team without talent to the Finals.

    I think it’s pretty telling that at least one person in this thread thought that there was someone on that Finals team that actually wasn’t.
     
  14. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    He took the Cavs to the Finals with no talent.

    Take in this juggernaut:

    Starting Five:

    Eric SNow
    Larry Hughes
    Lebron James
    Drew Gooden
    Zydrunas Ilgauskas

    Bench rotation:

    Anderson Varejao
    Donyell Marshall
    Sasha Pavlovic
    Daniel Gibson
    Damon Jones
     
  15. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    The numbers don't lie. and the Facts remain the same:

    .The numbers suggest that Lebron James is vastly superior to Carmelo Anthony, and that he dominates him head to head.

    .That Melo had the better team for 9 of the 13 meetings.

    .Melo has been out of the first round once, while he had better teams overall.

    .Lebron James outperforms his regular season numbers in the playoffs, while Melo does not.

    .By the time the Knicks reach the playoffs this year, it will be over 4,000 days since their last playoff win.

    .Knicks fans are still delusional after all these years.
     
  16. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    That was an exciting time. :lol:

    I had just got back into NBA basketball around then.
     
  17. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    At the same age (now):

    Michael Jordan:

    Rookie of the Year
    6 time all-star
    1 time MVP
    2 Eastern Conference Finals Appearances

    #1 ranking in Winshares
    #4 Defensive Rating
    #1 in PER

    Lebron James:

    Rookie of the Year
    7 time All-star
    2 time MVP
    3 Eastern Conference Finals Appearances
    2 NBA Finals Appearances

    #1 ranking in Winshares
    #3 Defensive Rating
    #1 in PER
     
  18. Clipse

    Clipse mediocrity sucks

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    Why is Carmelo even being mentioned here? Carmelo doesn't play a lick of defense, and isn't 1/10 the passer LeBron is. He's not as good a scorer as LeBron either. And to top it all off, Denver was much better last year without Carmelo. It must be something in the water in New York. Between Jets and Knicks fans, I've never seen so much delusion. Well, aside from Florida State fans anyways.
     
  19. SICK

    SICK Lounge Moderator

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    *Swish*
     
  20. MikeHoncho

    MikeHoncho -=| Censored |=-

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    Why are you deflecting the discussion away from Melo, Sec? Is it because you know LeBron can't compare with Melo? :shifty:
     
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  21. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    I know we had our playoff tiff last year...

    But your sixers..are in one helluva position. You GOTTA keep Thad Young..then make a play for a real center (Hawes sucks), and I think you vault to EC contender status.

    You put D12 on your Sixers, as a Heat fan, I am telling you..I would be concerned.

    What are you thinking as far as your team? (who you want)
     
  22. Clipse

    Clipse mediocrity sucks

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    As you stated, we need a center first and foremost. Hawes is the worst player I have ever seen. We don't even need anything special, just a defensive stopper. Hell give me Sammy Dummybert back. Next we need a go to scorer. Maybe that becomes Jrue Holiday in time, or maybe we trade for one. Dunno. I do know we need to be shopping Iguodala and Lou Williams hard. Those are our best chance at a center/scorer since we have no cap room. Monta Ellis, Kevin Martin, and Chris Kaman have been the names thrown around the most. Ellis would have to come with Biedrins, in which I'd definately pass. Kaman would possibly come with Al-Farouq Aminu. Also we need Evan Turner to have big improvement. He worked all summer long with Herb Magee on that ugly jumper of his. If he can get that mid range jumper back to what it was at OSU, he'll be fine.

    I'm expecting another mediocre type 6-8 seed season. It'll be that way until Brand/Iguodala come off the books. No cap room to make any real improvements. Though maybe we amnesty Brand and make a move for Nene or Marc Gasol. Unlike the Knicks and their empty stats "Superstars", we'll win a playoff game at least...
     
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  23. Frumundah Finnatic

    Frumundah Finnatic U Mad Miami?

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    NEW YAWWWWK IS DA ****ING MECCA.

    Its pretty ironic they keep calling that even after the whole "dont build a mosque near Ground Zero thing".

    I bet 90% of Manhattan doesnt even know what Mecca is.

    /Dumbasses.
     
  24. Desides

    Desides Well-Known Member

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    Da Mecca is Da Gahden bruh! Evvyone knows dat! :shifty:
     
  25. finfansince72

    finfansince72 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/sto...-paul-knows-new-york-knicks-lack-trade-assets

    LMAO @ the Knicks.

    "He has not asked for a trade to the Knicks because he knows the Knicks don't have anything to offer," the source said. "He wouldn't insult the Hornets by doing that."

    "The problem facing the Knicks is that they sacrificed the bulk of their young talent to acquire Anthony from the Denver Nuggets at last season's trade deadline.

    Presuming the Knicks want to keep Stoudemire and Anthony, the only trading chips they have of any value are Chauncey Billups, Toney Douglas, Ronny Turiaf and Landry Fields. "

    Not only money standing in the way.
     
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  26. Clipse

    Clipse mediocrity sucks

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    That's what happens when you trade every decent player on your team for one empty stat superstar.
     
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  27. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    I think you gotta build to beat the Heat....so D12 should be the priority, but keeping Iggy. As bad as he has played lately..that is ONE guy that you can actually say, gives Lebron James issues.

    There are two players that have actually had success vs. LBJ, they are Gerald Wallace and Igoudala. I think you want one of them.

    I love the Lou Williams Jrue Holliday combo, and Thad Yound is a keeper. But push comes to shove..Thad Young is a real piece to offer in a D12 trade. (maybe the best piece out there)

    Of the three EC opponents, Philly played the Heat the best. That have something, they need to build on that series.
     
  28. Clipse

    Clipse mediocrity sucks

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    Evan Turner played some pretty decent defense on LeBron as well in that playoff series from what I remember. I don't see even a sliver of chance we land Dwight Howard quite frankly. Iguodala had a masterful year last year on defense. Every star player he came up against got shut down for the most part. Really fun to watch. Absolutely criminal that Kobe ****ing Bryant made NBA All Defensive 1st team over him. Jrue Holiday has all the defensive potential in the world too. Of course all that is just fine with me, defense is paramount when it comes to winning in the NBA. Especially going up against the Heat. Have Iguodala able to guard LeBron, Jrue/Turner eventually able to guard Wade. Brand isn't the shotblocker he used to be, but he's physical, and getting physical with Bosh isn't a bad thing. Of course he's not a long term answer though. I sure wouldn't mind a guy like John Henson in the draft though.
     
  29. Paul 13

    Paul 13 Chaotic Neutral & Unstable Genius Staff Member

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    Don't look now but MY Lakers are going after Paul AAAANNNNDDDD Howard. Bynum, Gasol and Odom look to be headed out. Wow....
     
  30. Samphin

    Samphin Κακό σκυλί ψόφο δεν έχει

    As a Lakers fan, the thought of having Paul and Howard alongside Kobe makes me want to make hand babies until the Finals. But realistically, this can't happen. If NBA trade rumors involving the Lakers have taught me anything, its that you can't expect the trade rumor that becomes public, to go through. It just never works that way for L.A. Furthermore, I can't help but wonder if Broussard pulled this story from a Lakers fan site. Woj had an article this morning about how Paul and Howard were RACING each other to L.A. (despite the fact that the article talks about how Paul wants to go to New York, which somehow got translated to L.A.), and the reaction from Lakers fans was why race each other when you can bring them both in?

    The timing of the article, reaction and nightly news of Howard/Paul to L.A. smacks of "unnamed sources," to me. And this is coming from a huge Lakers fan as most on here know. I just can't get on board with this report.

    Furthermore, this report says that Bynum, LO, AND Gasol would have to be shipped out. Which means you will have solve done issue (getting younger with Paul/Howard) and weakened a strength (front line bigs/depth).

    I suppose, assuming that this were to go through, you still field a starting lineup that consists of PG: Paul SG: Kobe SF: Artest PF:??? C: Howard.

    Not a bad starting lineup and a couple of defensive minded people to go with the defensive minded coach now, but still, one injury to that front line and a world of hurt is upon you.

    Not to mention what the luxury tax scale is going to do to the Lakers in a ocuple of years. I fully expect them to hold on to their amnesty clause until then and rid themselves of Walton's salary at the appropriate time. But Kobe/Howard/Paul on the same team in a ocuple of years is going to get pretty damned expensive, even with the HUMONGOUS TV contract the Lakers just signed (which basically allows Dr. Buss to give the luxry tax system the middle finger for all of eternity if he so chooses). I don't know if that will deter them or not.

    I know Kapono was invited in for a look, and they need an outside shooter. I suppose any Howard trade will involve Turkoglu's contract coming back with him, so perhaps he becomes your starting 4 along with the outside shooter? I don't know. I think getting one or the other is probably more realistic as opposed to both. And Laker fans will want Howard over Paul for the most part, evne if it means giving up Bynum and Odom.

    Personally, I would call Philly and see if Iggy can be had for Odom, and then try to package a deal surrounding Bynum to get Howard. Gets you youth and speed, as well as keeps your front line somewhat in tact with Howard and Gasol teaming up. Play Iggy/Artest at the 3 depending on the situation and pray that Fisher/Blake can run with the Kobe and the gang.

    Realistically, the Lakers are going to sign a vet or two and probably go to battle with what they have. Dallas seems to have dismantled themselves and New Orleans is about to do the same. Outside of Oklahoma City, I don't see to many obstacles for the Lakers to get back to the WCF this year. I really don't.
     
  31. Clipse

    Clipse mediocrity sucks

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    Broussard is usually wrong. Only ESPN Basketball guy more clueless is Chad Ford. And there's no way Philly would ever accept Odom for Iguodala, that's just laughable. I seem to remember that being brought up at the trade deadline as well. Probably from a Lakers fan. Nobody is more delusional when it comes to trades than Lakers fans, from my experience anyways.
     
  32. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    If anyone takes anything the Lakers has for either Dwight Howard or Chris Paul, that isn't named Kobe, they're ******ed.
     
  33. Samphin

    Samphin Κακό σκυλί ψόφο δεν έχει

    Broussard is actually fairly spot on. and the A.I. for Odom rumors were generated out of Philly...hate to break it to you, but its true.

    And every fan base has it's irrational fans who overrate their players. The Lakers are simply the team that pulls it off. Unless, of course, you think that Elden Campbell for the rights to Kobe Bryant was fair...or Kwame Brown, Marc Gasol and filler for Pau Gasol wasn't lopsided either. :P

    I don't think we end up with both. In fact, I am pretty sure we don't end up with either. But I am starting to think that they can pry Chris Paul away and keep 2/3's of their front line in tact.

    Also, don't be surprised if the WARRIORS jump into the frey. Jerry West is running that organization now and the ne wowenr has deep pockets. I wouldn't be surprised if Logo pulls something off. My guess is they will probably have to part with Curry or Ellis in order to get a package together, but if it means Paul or Howard coming to Oakland...he will do it.
     
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  34. Clipse

    Clipse mediocrity sucks

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    We'll just have to agree to disagree on that then, because when Chris Broussard isn't stroking LeBron's dick, he's usually being wrong about something. And you're wrong about the Odom-Iggy thing. It was the Lakers who contacted the 76ers after they were rejected by Minnesota on a trade for their #2 overall pick. However it was the Lakers fans who actually thought that trade had even the slightest possibility of happening, while 76ers fans were laughing at such nonsense. Eventually, the trade talks died a day later because there is no reason whatsoever why the Sixers would want Odom.
     
  35. Clipse

    Clipse mediocrity sucks

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    I don't think it would be such a bad thing if the Magic made a deal involving Bynum. There aren't many better Centers in the league than Bynum, when he's healthy, which is never, but still, it's better than getting nothing whatsoever for Howard.
     
  36. Samphin

    Samphin Κακό σκυλί ψόφο δεν έχει

    Minnesota contacted L.A. about trading their pick for Bynum, L.A. balked and countered with Odom which was turned down on Minny's side. The talks eventually morphoed into a Pau for Kevin Love swap that never materialized. But the initial trade request came from Minny by all reports. And a quick Google search shows just about every article having Philly shopping Iggy and reaching out to a number of teams. And again, L.A. offered up Odom as the main package point. But it's pointless to argue, neither one of us were involved in it so it's hard ot say who offered what. But I am of the opinion that Odom is a better overall player than Iggy. Iggy just happens to be younger and faster at this point, which the Lakers desperately need. And Broussard broke the LeBron story, as well as a bunch of other signings. He is as good as a source as anyone, imo.

    I would trade Bynum for Howard and a bad contract in a heartbeat. I love the updie of Bynum, but those knees are always going to be troublesome. Bynum is the second best center in the league behind Howard. Granted it is a distant second, but he is second. No one posesses the combination that he does at the 5. He wants his own team and I don' tthink he wants to play with Kobe for the next 3-5 years of his career before he can rightfully stake claim as the Lakers being "his team." I wonder if the Magic have the balls to sit on Howard though and let him walk for nothing on prnciple, knowing that no one else can pay him more and max contracts will be hard to come by for contenders in a couple of years.
     
  37. Yes sir! THat would be incredible!!
     
  38. Paul 13

    Paul 13 Chaotic Neutral & Unstable Genius Staff Member

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    Hold on I have a joke... Metta World Peace... Thank you and good night...
     
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  39. FinSane

    FinSane Cynical Dolphins Fan

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    As bad as Broussard and Ford are, Woj lost credibility with me last year with the LeBron fiasco. There aren't too many good NBA insiders around anymore, Woj being considered the best is really telling. I read his stuff, it's just a bunch of mindless speculating and contrarian reporting.

    Anyway, I think LA would be content in giving up Gasol, Odom and Bynum in getting Howard. It would be a no-brainer. Gasol has a reputation for being soft and coming up short in big games. Odom is all athleticism but his game is limited. Bynum is hurt 75% of the season every year. It would be highway robbery in fact trading those three for the best center in the league.

    As for Paul, I'm not sure if there would be anything left for them to trade him for, assuming Orlando would want all three in return for DH. And the NBA owns the Hornets, they would want a star in return for trading a star, the only one on the roster. The Lakers would have to trade everyone but Kobe to pull off a trade for both. I see them getting Howard, but getting Paul would be a huge stretch.
     
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  40. Samphin

    Samphin Κακό σκυλί ψόφο δεν έχει

    No way L.A. trades Odom, Bynum AND Gasol for Howard. That actually makes them worse. I could see two of those three going (most likely Bynum and Odom...from L.A.'s perspective), but they won't trade all three.

    All the rumors are wrapped around Chris Paul right now. Lakers are in the mix with a package surrounding Pau Gasol and filler contract/draft picks. If they pull that off, they will turn around and ship Bynum to Orlando for Howard as well. If they can't (and I assume the Warriors or Clippers with up the ante for Paul), then I think L.A. will turn their focus strictly to Howard.

    I really think Kupchak is content with running with the current roster and in turn, won't compromise the team beyond where he thinks it is acceptable to get either one of these players.
     

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