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Big O: The Only Competiton Fins Have For Manning is Colts

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by GARDENHEAD, Feb 25, 2012.

  1. BlameItOnTheHenne

    BlameItOnTheHenne Taking a poop

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    Davie
    It's only a matter of time.
     
  2. gafinfan

    gafinfan gunner Club Member

    Two resources on the phyical state of Peyton Manning's probability of returning to and regaining his form:

    http://www.espine.com/webmd-spine-surgery.htm

    This is quite along read but the following is posted to reinforce the second as truthful and coming from a Doctor specializing in this type operation with over 20 years experance.

    Dr. Pashman: Many people in the news have had spinal surgery, Scotty Pippin, Joe Montana, and many other high level of athletes. Spinal surgery is effective if the surgery is done technically well for the right diagnosis.

    http://www.revengeofthebirds.com/2012/2/8/2786079/some-clarity-on-peytons-injury

    Is Peyton Manning Joe Montana? No we are all different yet the record for this type operation being successfully used by football players and returning to their high level of play is on record. BTW Montana sat out a year too, if memory serves!

    Naysayers are always present tell us what can't be done, I guess that why they call them miracles, when normal human beings overcome those bumps in their road to living their lives again successfully.

    My fears about Peyton Manning do not concern his health but only his effect on our team long term if he comes here; because he is only a SHORT term answer to our QB situation. How we handle THAT problem is much more salient to our long term success IMVHO!
     
    padre31 likes this.
  3. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    I would love to see the Dolphins get the Peyton Manning who dominated the league when he was healthy. Unfortunately is doesn't appear from various reports that his neck problems are getting much better. If the Dolphins are indeed the only team other than the Colts interested in Manning, this is a very ominous sign that teams in need of a quality QB are very concerned about Manning's ability to ever be anywhere near the player he was before undergoing mutiple neck operations.

    It also appears that the Dolphins may be more concerned with selling season tickets than they are about putting a healthy QB on the playing field. I have no idea if the Dolphins are truly the only team interested in Manning if the Colts cut him but if they are, I think That Ross and Ireland need to take a closer look at why other QB hungry teams are shying away from a QB who was once considered the best QB in the game.

    I think the best thing for the Dolphins, QB wise, is to make a blockbuster trade with the Rams and draft RG3. This would increase season tickets sales by thousands and RG3 will be around for years to come. With Manning, there is no way of determining right now if he will ever be able to play another game in the NFL.
     
  4. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    He had some elbow problem on his right arm. I remember the last year he played, it looked like there was a golf ball under the skin on the point of his elbow.

    After that shot Leonard Marshall put on him in that one playoff game, where Leonard totally owned fat Bubba Paris, I'd don't think Joe's back was ever totally healthy again either for that matter.
     
  5. Deus ex dolphin

    Deus ex dolphin Well-Known Member

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    Well, at this point the Colts have committed to a rebuild of the team -almost 100%. They could trade the #1 pick and do a quick rebuild to let Peyton have one last window for a Super Bowl. That is the short-term fix though, and long-term getting Luck is probably the better way to go. Without the extra picks and players from a Luck trade the Colts would only give Manning an average team at best over the next year or two. Even if they expect Peyton to recover and be close to 100% healthy, Indy is moving on.

    Miami faces a similar choice, but Flynn is a bigger gamble then Luck (IMHO) to be successful. Ross knows he needs a winning season or two to get the fanbase back. Peyton can give us that, and ideally we would have drafted a young QB behind him to groom and who will be ready to take over in two years.
     
  6. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    So if 5 teams wanted to sign him, but he only signs with one, the other 4 teams didn't want to sign him? that makes no sense!
     
  7. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    Montana's nerve started regenerating immediately. In fact, he was playing after 56 days. Manning is at least 5 months after his most recent surgery (the fusion) and is still saying it will be months before we know if he gets back to full strength. I spoke to doctors and nurses about this before this season. At the time I was just asking for fantasy football purposes. I was told then that Manning should be fine in about a month, but I was warned that if the nerve didn't regenerate immediately, that you're looking at a recovery of a year or more or never. I think this was in May that I was asking so I was told if he's not practicing in July, don't draft him. That advice was sound. And I've yet to hear anybody provide any info that says we should expect to see Manning throwing at full strength in time for FA. The whole "if healthy" caveat was a pipe dream that ignored what was likely to happen medically. Reality is that the team will have to make a decision to either pass on Flynn or wait and hope if Manning gets healthy. That's the decision.

    I do agree that Manning is a short-term option. The team, the draft and the system will be geared towards Manning and a short-term run. Once that run ends then the team will start over and install the system that Philbin was brought in to install.
     
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  8. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    I also recall Jim Burt knocking him out in a playoff game, but you are correct, Montana was jacked up when the Chiefs traded for him, only we won't have to trade for him, and we won't have to reach for a Qb with a valuable asset like the #8 overall.

    Or Flynn, or Garrard, or Matt Moore for that matter.
     
  9. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    I disagree that Flynn is the bigger gamble. Despite the latest "reports" that Manning is improving, he can't throw yet. He's coming back from an injury that many never recover from. I'm not talking about the 70% that come back in a month b/c the nerve regenerates immediately. I'm talking about the group where the nerve doesn't regenerate immediately. I don't know what that percentage is, but everybody I've talked to and the cases I've seen make that percentage appear to be about 1 out of a 100. I do not rate Flynn's chances of success as lower than a guy who can't even throw yet and will most likely never be what he once was.
     
  10. FinSane

    FinSane Cynical Dolphins Fan

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    So when we sign Manning and likely crash-and-burn as usual, and Flynn goes on to lead a team deep into the playoffs, are we all gonna commit mass suicide as a fanbase?
     
  11. Deus ex dolphin

    Deus ex dolphin Well-Known Member

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    If Peyton appears to be at least a 50/50 gamble, I think Ross tells Ireland to get a deal done. I understand your serious concern over his nerve condition, the chance he may never play again seems very real. I'd love to see him beat the odds though and have a couple good-great seasons in Miami. Ross may decide that a combination of Moore/Manning would work for 2012. You let Matt start the season with the hope Petyon is ready to play by November or so. Signing Peyton will sell tickets, and they can dangle the "Manning-might-start-this-week" carrot through half the season at least. Unless we start out 0-7 again, fans will have hope Peyton can come in and turn the season around. Pretty good situation for an owner who needs to appease disgruntled fans. Ross could even hold out the hope Manning will be ready in 2013 and keep fans interested.

    Now, as for the other guys? I'd rate Luck at a 70% chance of being a good-great QB, while Flynn has a 60% chance to be solid-good. The catch with Flynn? That 60% only applies if he is playing under Philbin and the offense he knows so well. Otherwise, I'd rate Flynn at 30% in other offensive systems. Tannelhill I don't see being ready for at least another year.
     
  12. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    No, if I was going to kill myself for any decision this ownership has made, I would have killed myself when Ross informed us all that he intended on keeping Ireland as the GM. To me Ireland is the main problem with the organization. I am more shocked when he actually makes a good player personnel decision than I am when he makes a bad decision. Of course with a 20-28 record over the last three seasons, it is obvious that Ireland has made far more bad decisions than he has good decisions.
     
  13. slickj101

    slickj101 Is Water

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    I was with you up until "let Matt start the season."

    If we do commit to Manning, he's gotta be expected to start Week 1.
     
  14. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    IMO the best chance of selling tickets is to win. I don't see a plan to hopefully have Manning come in in November as a good football decision. I think that the team will have to make a decision on Flynn long before Manning is healthy so the decision is between an unhealthy Manning and Flynn. IMO the odds of Manning coming back at his former level is <1%. The odds of him playing at a level above what Moore provides is <10%. I'd say Flynn has about an 80% chance of being at least solid and 50% chance of being good enough to win a championship in Philbin's system. But the odds of Flynn being great in any other system are <10%. I think Luck has a >90% chance of being at least solid and >70% chance of being great. I agree that Tannehill should sit for a year. After that I'd say he has a 70% chance of being at least solid and a 50% chance being great.
     
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  15. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Yep, and I suspect he will start wk #1, whether or not he is "Peyton Manning" or Impostor Manning and his cap ramifications are the issues in my pov.
     
  16. KB21

    KB21 Almost Never Wrong Club Member

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    Detail me the poor personnel decisions he has made, and give me a comparison to other GM's in the league.
     
  17. GARDENHEAD

    GARDENHEAD Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You're right. Lemme re-phrase. It is my understanding that only two teams were kicking Drew Brees' tires. And only one offered him a contract. The Saints offered him a contract and nobody else did. Therefore, if we're the only team to offer Peyton Manning a contract, I'm not gonna worry about it. I'll celebrate it!
     
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  18. Deus ex dolphin

    Deus ex dolphin Well-Known Member

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    I laughed, then it wasn't all that funny. We could very well end up with "Imposter Manning" when all is said and done. Please tell me you'll start a thread that includes "Imposter Manning" in the title if things do indeed go south.

    Oh and slickj101? I wasn't saying that I'd like to see Moore start the season over Manning. Season tickets will be sold with the idea of Peyton starting from Day One, but he may not be recovered enough so they'll need to sell fans on the "maybe next week" idea as the season rolls along. How many fans would like to be able to say they were there when Peyton started his first home game as a Dolphin?
     
  19. Rocky Raccoon

    Rocky Raccoon Greasepaint Ghost Staff Member

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    The only fact is that there are going to be hundreds of Peyton Manning rumors over the next month. Buckle up.
     
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  20. gafinfan

    gafinfan gunner Club Member

    The main difference between Manning and Montana, imvho, was/is the time difference caused by Manning not getting his problem getting checked out and repaired at once! The time lag between when he first had his warning sign and then getting it operated on was what is now causing the long recovery time. Joe got hurt and at once got something done about it allowing for FAR less nerve damage! Peyton, wanting to suck it up, did nothing which has resulted in a far longer and less likely to recover results. That doesn't mean he won't, never the less just as we saw in 07 with Pennington, we had a great first year followed by 3 years in the wilderness and that is what I don't want us to go thru again! Philbin is not Sparano, thank God, but Jeff Ireland is still Jeff Ireland so did he learn his lesson or not!?

    At the same time, on the face of it, I surely would not play the smokescreen game by hinting anything negative about Peyton or his recovery which goes against everything I would hope happens! We get RGIII without having to give up the farm!
     
  21. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    The things is you don't actually repair the nerve. All they can do is try to clear away the stuff around it that is damaging it and wait/hope for it to regenerate on its own. He had two procedures where they thought they did that and it didn't regenerate. Then he had the more invasive fusion and it didn't start to regenerate immediately either. Now there are some mixed reports that there has been some regeneration but not much. This is actually very common and exactly what I was told to expect. (If the nerve eventually starts to regenerate then you will have fewer connections and some of the nerve endings will connect in the wrong place resulting in weaker and inconsistent muscle contractions). All of this makes me believe that Manning is not in that 70% group that recover when the nerve regenerates immediately, but almost assuredly in that other group that never recovers to 100% after the nerve doesn't regenerate immediately.
     
  22. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    could be a lot of posters eating grow round here, when Manning leads us to the SuperBowl in 2012
     
  23. Ohio Fanatic

    Ohio Fanatic Twuaddle or bust Club Member

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    eating grow?

    It's nice - that world that you're living in. can you give me the address? Do they give you Prozac at the door?
     
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  24. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    ask your wife, she can give you directions. she usually brings the drugs when she visits but not prozac.:kiss:
     
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  25. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    I like his avatar. I've been trying to get a date with her. But my phone calls and text messages go unanswered. :cry:
     
  26. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    I agree, and some others will eat crow, and I'll be glad to eat grow and crow mixed together if Manning does lead us to the Super Bowl. If he wins it, I'll streak main street of my town with a raging boner, and a dolphin painted on my chest. :yes:
     
  27. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    grow is better than what we've been eating, anyway you look at it
     
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  28. Dolphins1Beatles

    Dolphins1Beatles Ziggy Stardust

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    Whether you want him or not...does it seem like the Colts will just let March 8 come and go? It's this Thursday and then Peyton is free to sign.
     
  29. dolfan22

    dolfan22 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Then the question will be , who is running faster , the people behind you , or the ones in front of you? ;)
     
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  30. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Oh, I am sure there will be many love struck young ladies chasing me. :yes:

    Oops, gotta go, the guys in the white coats are coming to kick me off the computer again. ;)
     
    dolfan22 likes this.
  31. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Oh oh, I thought "grow" was one of those herbal tablets that claim to give men a boost in their endowment. Hence my promise to streak with a boner. I figured the grow tabs would give me some impressive equipment, especially mixed with the high protein qualities of freshly cooked crow meat. :yes:
     
  32. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    grow or crow, hope we make the right choices & have a successful season in 2012
     
  33. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    Manning is all but in uniform. Looking forward to this season with tremendous expectation. I love it!
     
  34. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    Manning may wind up here - but I'd give Arizona the edge over Miami. Weather great - less humidity; HOF WR (Fitzgerald > Marshall); other than 49ers, weak division. Great stadium and fan base is more supportive.

    I predict Manning will go to Cardinals - but an outside shot the 49ers could actually sneak in there (they'd have to swoop in at the very end otherwise they'd destroy Smith's confidence if they did not land Manning).

    I think Manning wants to stay away from NFC East (Brother Eli); and AFC East (Belichick/Brady).
     
  35. BlameItOnTheHenne

    BlameItOnTheHenne Taking a poop

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    So what you're really saying is that Peyton Manning is scared of a challenge? Yeah, doubt that.
     
  36. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    [​IMG]
     
  37. BlameItOnTheHenne

    BlameItOnTheHenne Taking a poop

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    [​IMG]
     
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  38. Killerphins

    Killerphins The Finger

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    Apparently the Seahawks are opening up the checkbook and are willing to pony up big dollars for Manning.
    So much for that ridiculous incentive laden contract idea that was being tossed around.
     
  39. Killerphins

    Killerphins The Finger

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    We can't afford to give Manning guaranteed money like a few other teams.
    This ship has sailed folks.
    The Manning dream is over.
     
  40. Bruzer

    Bruzer New Member

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    ok Thanks Mr. Ross for the update. Glad to see our owner knows what hes doing ... :up:

    Anyways will be interesting with Miami and several teams making a run at manning, I am probably most worried about the cardinals about getting him. I know manning isnt just in it for money and cards give a damn good chance to win also.
     

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