Mando:Dolphins are rebuilding, but won't admit it

Adam that is completely illogical, your new coach disagrees with you.

 

What we know about Flynn is Miami turned their attention to him once Manning turned Miami down. What we know is Philbin kept in contact with Flynn even during the Manning chase to let him know Miami was interested in him. What we know is Miami had him in for a visit. What we know is Miami offered Flynn a contract. What we know is Miami wasn't willing to offer him a "fair" contract for a starting QB by today's standards. What we know is Flynn chose Seattle over Miami and kept referring to Seattle's "vibe" and organization as to why he chose them over Miami.

What else do we know?

 

You actually heard coach Philbin say that? Do you a quote from Philbin anywhere indicating as such?

 

Obviously Philbin disagrees with you. I'll take his opinion over yours.

Intelligent people don't need bandwagons.

 

The mistake the Dolphins have made for years is to sign FA QB's or trade for other teams backups that aren't worth being starters. Now they MAY actually look for one in the draft and we are rebuilding? We are simply doing what we should have done since Marino retired.

 

This debate about Flynn is ridiculous and a waste of time..

 

I like RG3 a lot, but no way paying the price the Redskins did, let alone the one Miami would have had to pay being at #8.

 

You think his former coach is gonna publicly say something like that, about his former player???, the indictment was obvious enough for anyone to see, just put all the variables together.

Ross point blank told you all you needed to know..

 

True...what is done is done. I was clarifying my position in response to someone indicating I wanted Manning to be given a $95 million contact.

I know I don't trust our owner's ridiculous PR move this week...

Talk a dysfunctional FO. What functional FO would use a disgruntled fan to become the team spokesman?

 

i'm really torn on jake dj, do we really need this huge load of money to pay for a LT, when he was injured the last few games, did we really see that much of a difference ?

 

So your only blame stems from us not signing Manning..??

There was no one else to go after Adam ...until this draft

 

No he blames Ireland and Ross for not landing Flynn bc he thinks higher of Flynn than his own former coach.

Yea...

 

And you believe Ross? The same guy that denied chasing Harbaugh last year?

What I heard was a disgruntled fan become the Dolphin's spokesman this week. He said that Ross said...blah, blah, blah.

Would coach Philbin really be calling Flynn this off season letting him know he was a target if he didn't want him? Would Miami really fly Flynn in for a visit if Philbin didn't want him? Would Miami really have offered Flynn a contract if Philbin didn't want him?

This was about $$$ imo...that falls under our GM trying to manage our salary cap. When did those responsibilities fall to our rookie HC? So Fisher, a 17 year (?) vet doesn't get final say on personnel moves, but Philbin does?

 

How about proving it with an actual quote from coach Philbin.

Yea...

 

they are rebuilding/getting younger its just that word is a dirty word for fans. You actually think we were gonna compete for the AFC east this year? a quarterback away? you're crazy/know nothing about football if you think that. Sure a peyton manning could make us a wild card team but he's an exception. look how bad the colts actually are without him? are we that bad? obviously not since our qb play is about on par with what the colts had but we are still nothing more than a possible middle of the road 8-8 9-7 team and thats if stuff goes real well

 

I’m not sure how players becoming FA in 50 weeks equates to a rebuilding project this year. You don’t think it would be prudent to at least give the new staff a couple of weeks to watch the guys compete in person before making any sign/release/trade decisions?

Instead of looking at what was lost, let’s look at what is here.

QB Moore, Garrard, Devlin
RB Bush, Thomas, Messam, Clay
WR Hartline, Bess, Gates, Moore, Wallace, Pruitt
TE Fasano, Mastrud, Yeatman
OL Long, Incognito, Pouncey, Murtha, Garner, Hicks, Fenga, Jerry, Cook
DL Soliai, Starks, Odrick, McDaniel, Merling, Baker
LB Wake, Burnett, Dansby, Misi, Spitler, Trunsik, Westerman
DB Davis, Smith, Carrol, Wilson, Marshall, Clemons, Culver, Jones

I was very surprised by the Marshall trade and the loss of Bell - more so about Bell to be honest. And if I had to pick between Soliai and Langford, I would pick Soliai.

I don’t think it’s much of a stretch to think some combination of Murtha, Garner, Hicks, Fenga, Jerry and Cook should be able to replace the production of Carey and Colombo.

I considered 2008 a rebuilding project, but this is not a roster devoid of talent. Just like every other team in the NFL, some young guys are going to have to step up and fill the shoes of their predecessor.

 

I don't know, maybe I am looking at this in the wrong way or a different way but it seems to me that we are still in a rebuilding mode from when Parcells first arrived. Our offensive line has never been settled and we are still trying to replace players there, our receiving core has never been set with starters in every position. We have a running game that is still not consistent with the exception of Bush who has been dynamic but only here a year and is definitely not an every down back, so last years rookie needs to step it up and make more of an impact. Though Fasano has been good we still have questions at TE and we don't know if Clay is the answer. We still don't know if we have a franchise quarterback yet or what we will need to do to get one. Thats not a slap at Moore who I believe has shown some good things or to Garrard who hasn't played a down yet for the Dolphins but its just a fact that we just don't know. The defense is improved and much better than it was but there are still consistent questions at different positions. I still don't think our secondary is consistent enough to say its set or playoff caliber. We still need another pass rusher opposite Wake to apply consistent pressure and help prevent the constant double teaming of Wake. We have again had a major turnover in coaching and we have yet to see what results that it may bring. I know there have been improvements but I still don't believe we are there yet until we can win consistently and can be more relevant in our division and regain some respect. I imagine my opinion may not set well with some but its a view I just accept but I believe things will change.

 

I am not saying we have a roster full of bad players. I was responding to the thread about whether Miami is "rebuilding." I think Miami is when I look at the actual contracts. Having to replace 6-7 starters out of 22 starters from last year and pointing out that all the players in bold are free agents following this year leaves me to believe so.

I don't see a sense of urgency to re-sign Moore, Long, Wake, Bush, Hartline, Fasano, Starks, Smith, Clemons...maybe some of these players will be resigned, maybe not. But if we are replacing 6-7 new starters from last year and we will replace another 7-10 starters from this year, next year I believe that qualifies as rebuilding.

 

How was losing Bell a surprise?

 

If these numbers are correct, the Dolphins should have over $50M in cap space next year and should be in good shape to resign the players they need to.

http://nyjetscap.com/Dolphins/dolphins2013.php

 

You're right. More of a disappointment on my part than a surprise.

 

Mando & Cole arrive at their opinions of Miami because info is being filtered through their dislike of the Dolphins. That's why most of their opinions are as negative as they are. Its never, the Dolphins miss out on X player...its the Dolphins miss out on X player which might send them into a dizzying vortex of franchise ending sucktitude. The owner & GM are conspiring to tank the next 10 season in an attempt to move the team to Dubai. (And they act like they aren't biased because they used the word "might".)

Jason Cole's bile was apparent when we traded BM away. He blasted the franchise as only a Jets fan masquerading as an objective observer could....until it came out BM punched a chick. New article goes up 30 minutes later.

As fan's of the Dolphins, we should give as much credence to Cole & Mando's word as we give to Fireman Ed's opinion on Miami.

 

IMO, the 6 or 7 people we have pending contracts will probably only be 2 or 3 after Philbon see's them work out. I'm not worried.

 

lol He didn't have to. Ross did it for him. "If my HC wanted Flynn, he'd be here."

Not going to get any clearer for you. And no, I'd never expect Philbin to come out and say that about a guy he's worked with for 4 years. It'd be undermining Flynn and a real ******* move for Philbin to do that to him.

 

exactly.

If the Steelers essentially "trade" Wallace for a 1st rounder after already cutting numerous old, expensive players, then I guess Pitt must be "rebuilding" as well.

 

Has anyone considered that our new Defensive Coordinator (ex DB coach) might have something to do with Bell's release b/c he either feels someone has the talent to replace him or b/c the type of defense he wants to run requires a different skill set from his SS?

 

The issue is whether they are rebuilding or not. I expressed no opinion as to whether it is a good move or not....

Very few teams who don't have a legit number 1 QB, and take QBs @ #1 are not rebuilding.

 

shouldnt be pretty clear that atleast the offense is rebuilding? we don't even have a legit number 2 WR let alone a number one. Bess is okay in the slot but not without someone to play the X.

no quarterback.

RB still up in the air as far as a consistent starter/every down back. I think Thomas will end up being better than most are giving him credit for and Bush can fall into more of a scat back/WR option.

holes at RT, G and LG.

TE being a huge hole/limited talent.


so thats 7 out of 11 positions in dire need of an upgrade.

 

Nope. Rebuilding an offense implies this offense failed. This offense is brand new. We are building it.

 

Why in gods name would you do that?

 

The whole 'rebuilding' thing is a sports media creation. Every team in the league has roster turnover, even the good teams. But even if the Pats have just as much turnover as us they aren't rebuilding, just reloading, according to the media.

What is really happening is every GM in the league is cutting, trading, signing and drafting players in order to make their team better. Some just happen to do so with a relatively poor base while others do so with a relatively good base. Assigning a narrative of rebuilding to those moves is just that, creating a narrative in order to be able to tell a story that readers want to hear.

The closest thing to an actual rebuilding that I can think of is the Colts. While they will probably keep a majority of their roster from last season, they have cut a significant portion of their on field productivity. But even then they still have a base to work with that they already built.

 

it still is unreal to me how mando is even allowed to write about miami after his high five disaster, even still having a job for a miami newspaper is unreal, dolphins officials should have banned his *** for life from dolphins property

 

So you have now QUOTED A FAN who was recalling what an owner supposedly said on a telephone conversation through a circus-like PR move and treating it like fact...

All the while ignoring that Philbin was calling Flynn when Miami was waiting on Manning and saying Flynn was a target. Ignoring that once Manning turned down the Dolphins, Miami immediately turned their attention to Flynn and had him in for a visit, ignoring that Flynn was offered a contract.

From your prospective Ross/Ireland were overriding Philbin's dislike of Flynn by having him in for a visit and offering him a contract. And apparently, Philbin just likes ****ing with his former players...

Wow, hard to argue with your reasoning when you are able to quote a fan, who quoted an owner on a telephone conversation, who appeared to be in a desperate PR move to save face after being lambasted in the media and by a disgruntled fan base. And can't seem to be able to sell many tickets to home games.

 

As opposed to the facts you just make up and spin to paint the FO in a negative light.

You still can't understand the difference between having a player in for a visit and offering them a contract to compete w/Moore as opposed to giving him a starter's deal and the keys to the offense so idk why I'm even wasting my time.

 

It's like we (The Miami Dolphins) are a hungry person going to a vending machine. Someone tells us what is in the vending machine and we say "You know cheetohs may not be the ultimate snack (Flynn) but they are inexpensive and will tide me over a while." we pull out 75 cents and see the bag costs $2.50 because it is the only vending machine in town. We then say "I like cheetohs but not at that value, it simply wasn't worth it to me in the long term".

Maybe that will help his understanding.

 

Dude, I've never seen people have such a misunderstanding of meetings, price, contracts, negotiations, terms, etc.

You'd think these people never made a purchase in their lives.

By Adam's logic, if you even looked at those Cheetos with remote interest, you're therefore obligated to sell your soul, firstborn, and wives for them.

 

Wait...so now you are changing your tune. You were saying coach Philbin didn't want him. But now you are saying he wanted him to come in and compete. You do understand that is different right than not wanting him right? And I am spinning the facts...

Since when did coach Philbin take over GM duties of assigning $$$ values to players?