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Miami in Contract Talks with Long, Wake and Hartine

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by finsincebirth, Mar 30, 2012.

  1. dsteve

    dsteve Banned

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    hartline can wait. the only upside to signing him this year is you might get him cheaper than if he has a monster season this year.
     
  2. MikeHoncho

    MikeHoncho -=| Censored |=-

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    Givem his skillset, the Hartbreak kid aka White Lightning has a chance to break out in the WCO.
     
  3. finsincebirth

    finsincebirth Well-Known Member

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    It's clearly obvious that you only look at the stats when regarding a player. You seem to miss Hartline's ability to get open and make big plays especially like someone said earlier along the sideline.

    Does anybody remember that catch against Dallas?
     
  4. bakedmatt

    bakedmatt Well-Known Member

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    I like Brian Hartline. I just can't understand why he doesn't like YAC.
     
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  5. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    You failed. Period. Your understanding is very limited to looking at stats. Even your analysis of Hartline is very much into his stats. Also you seem to cling to the #1 or #2 receiver idea that no coach actually uses.

    Your opinion of Wake is very flawed. He was better in 2011 than he was in 2010. Even if you look at stats, his sacks might have been down but his hits on quarterback and pressures were either up or just has high as 2010. Another aspect to look at Wake is that in 2010 he was a much more limited outside linebacker. In 2011 he greatly increased his ability to stop the run and cover. He was a much better outside linebacker. He doesn't deserve Mario Williams money, however he is a much better player than Mark Anderson.
     
  6. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    Wow, you obviously are so blinded by your own opinion that you fail to understand that with the players you so seem to love, the Dolphins have been one of the worst teams in the league over the last three seasons. Of course I have no doubt you blame this entirely on Sparano and don't see that perhaps it had a lot more to do with the lack of talent on the roster.

    To me it just shows how low expectations are when Hartline is considered a player the Dolphins must sign because of his ability going forward. I was hoping that Ross would get rid of Sparano and Ireland after last season and most of the roster would have been blown up. I realize that the draft is just around the corner but I don't see this Dolphin team winning more than 6-7 games in 2012.
    They need to be looking to upgrade the WR position, not going with what has failed over the last three seasons.

    When I predicted before last season that the Dolphins would win only 5-6 games, I was told by many on here, and I am sure you were one of those telling me, that I didn't know what I was talking about. Well I am predicting another sub 500 season in 2012 and when it happens,you won't be able to blame it on Sparano this time. There is a severe lack of overall talent on this team and now that Sparano isn't around to blame any longer, many on here will soon realize that this lack of talent was the problem all along.
     
  7. finsincebirth

    finsincebirth Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
     
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  8. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    A) Just because Dolphins have been one of the worst teams in the league doesn't mean every player is one of the worst players in the league.

    B) That is a lot of projection and conjecture. It is amazing how poorly you read my mind.

    Your ability to turn any conversation into the SAME conversation is impressive. It is like you have one point, and then just write it over and over again. Thinking that you are actually making an analysis.

    I do not blame Sparano for everything. I look at the situation on a whole.

    EDIT: The 6-10 season did not surprise me. Looking at things objectively it looked to be a possibility. You failed AGAIN. You are good at failing. At least you are good at something.
     
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  9. Bulldog

    Bulldog New Member

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    Most rational people do blame Sparano. Coaching is greater than talent. A good coach can win in this league with average talent. The Dolphins, like it or not, have above average talent. The problem is that their talent has been misused or underutilized and that's a reflection on their coaching.
     
  10. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    No, it's not.
     
  11. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Yes, but you had no actual idea why the team would be bad. You were correct in a pretty simple, nearly binary issue. Your perceived assessment of talent wasn't correct, given the teams issue largely appeared to be awful lockout preparation.
     
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  12. BlameItOnTheHenne

    BlameItOnTheHenne Taking a poop

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    Davie
    Or this one
    [video=youtube;WjaV_LtmCVk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WjaV_LtmCVk[/video]

    This one as well
    http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-videos/09000d5d815265cb/Brian-Hartline-Highlight-WK-15-vs-Titans-2009
     
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  13. Bulldog

    Bulldog New Member

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    Yes it is...
     
  14. gunn34

    gunn34 I miss Don & Dan

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    How many times was he targeted? Look at his reception percentage and compare it to BM.
     
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  15. Bulldog

    Bulldog New Member

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    Shhh...You'll confuse some people with all this rational talk!
     
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  16. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Personally think it's premature to start giving a Brian Hartline a long term deal. But, I know that a lot of that decision has to do with Joe Philbin liking him, so I suppose it's OK.
     
  17. gandalfin

    gandalfin Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Hartline can do some great things on the sidelines. His main problem is what Maynard mentioned earlier, he can't keep on his feet enough after he makes catches.
     
  18. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Nelson needs to learn to fall down better, before he could be compared to Hartline.
     
  19. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    In 2011, Hartline thrown at 66 times with 35 catches for 53% catch pct. 1 TD, 7 drops. Defenders picked off 6 passes when Hartline was the target. 0 tackles broken or avoided.
    Bess was thrown at 79 times, 51 catches, 64.6% catch pct. 3 TDs, 5 drops. Defenders picked off 2 passes when Bess was the target. 7 tackles broken or avoided.
    Marshall was thrown at 138 times, 81 catches, 58.7% catch pct. 6 TDs, 14 drops and 3 passes thrown at him were intercepted. 9 tackles broken or avoided.
     
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  20. VanDolPhan

    VanDolPhan Club member Club Member

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    He does seem to be a bit more suited for a WCO so he's intriguing in that way. Plus with Brandon Marshall out I believe he was doing pretty solid as they spread the ball around. As long as it's a reasonable contract I could see them doing it. Something like Incognito got or a bit more. Nothing insane. It's a risk move as I see it. He either outplays that contract so we have a bargain..or he's the same guy but at least easily manageable to cut if he doesn't.
     
  21. alen1

    alen1 New Member

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    Has been so since college. That's one of the things that's always stood out.

    Same thing GB said when they re-upped Jordy Nelson for cheap last off-season.

    No it's not.
     
  22. Mud-n-Cleats

    Mud-n-Cleats New Member

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  23. bran

    bran Senior Member

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    i we extend all 3 hartline is very underrated and i think this year will have a breakout type year
     
  24. Frumundah Finnatic

    Frumundah Finnatic U Mad Miami?

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    You would think they'd do this before FA started.

    To be fair to Hartline, he got behind the defense alot, Henne just had no deep ball accuracy.
    And Moore cant throw a deep pass if his life depended on it.
     
  25. alen1

    alen1 New Member

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    "Will allow"?
     
  26. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Why?
     
  27. southbeachbeast

    southbeachbeast New Member

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    To all you pessimist Dolphin "fans" out there (and I know theres a lot of you):

    I think you will be presently surprised this year on just how much better the coaching is going to be overall, and how huge of a difference that is going to make. Coaching is such a big part of the game that never gets discussed and lets face it, Sparano and Daboll do not belong in the same class as Philbin and Sherman. Im telling you our offense is going to be soooo much better just on that. I mean Daboll didnt even know how to use Reggie Bush til about half way through the season. And lets face it Sparano is just useless. This zone blocking scheme is going to be a perfect fit for our offense with Bush and Thomas just being one cut up field running behing Long and Pouncey. Oh and Steve Slaton ran for 1200 yds. and 9 TDs in the same system in Houston a couple years ago, but he was not a good fit in our "power" running game which is a thing of the past. You dont realize how slim the margin of victory in the NFL is, in games where Moore started and finished, we only lost ONE game by more than 3 points and that was his first game after a lockout shortened season being the back up. How many reps you think he got with the first team offense?? and that game was on the road in New York. We only lost to Giants on road by 3, Pats on road by 3, and Dallas on road by 1. In Philly game Long and Moore got hurt. If Moore had been the starter from opening day we could have EASILY gone 10-6. Are you guys blind??? And that was with bad coaching all year!!!! Were going to have GOOD coaching all year this year, and actually have an offseason to learn the offense and defense. And we havent even had the draft yet! How can you guys be predicting were going to be so bad. Just cuz everyone else is saying that, let the offseason play out and see what happens. Did anyone think we would go 11-5 the year after 1-15?? It must suck to be so negative.
     
  28. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You know what's funny, the patriots signed four players last in free agency Haynesworth..Ochostinko..Shaun Ellis...Andre carter...= can a brother get a job...

    Some plan that was...
     
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  29. muscle979

    muscle979 Season Ticket Holder

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    I know. Do they mean he can sign the Dolphins contract and then get out of it if somebody else offers him a multiyear deal?
     
  30. BlameItOnTheHenne

    BlameItOnTheHenne Taking a poop

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    Davie

    LOL I remember the reaction to the Haynesworth and Ochostinko signings.

    CROWN THE HOODIE, CROWN HIM FOR SIGNING 2 WASHED UP PLAYERS. CROWN HIM!
     
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  31. Frumundah Finnatic

    Frumundah Finnatic U Mad Miami?

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    We would restructure their deals in a way that would create more cap space,allowing us to offer more to Free agents.
     
  32. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Ridiculous statement. His passer rating on deep passes last season was 81.
     
  33. Frumundah Finnatic

    Frumundah Finnatic U Mad Miami?

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    There is no velocity on his deep passes, he throws way too many ducks for my liking.
     
  34. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    For me BTH, I looked at all four players, and wouldn't of signed any of them, seriously, I think there is something really strange going on when you can't see how much drop off a player currently has relative to his good playing days, yet you still wanna sign him..in the case of Chad, the drop off was so distinct, the body was at least 10 lbs lighter from his prime, and IMO it was all do to lack of offseason work ethic, bottom line the dude has no strength to beat nfl corners, and it was very obvious to me..Shaun Ellis, really, come on man..to take a shot on a guy who stole money from Washington while complaining the whole time??, there are some issues in that dept..Take their Qb away from them and their almost the colts.
     
  35. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    I'm fairly certain we've offered as much for each FA as we were willing to spend. I don't think we looked at a FA and said damn we just can't afford him. I think we said damn that's too much for him.
     
  36. Frumundah Finnatic

    Frumundah Finnatic U Mad Miami?

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    For Flynn and Manning that may be true(FTR I was iffy on Flynn and $98 million for Manning is too much, and I wanted him badly), but lets say we really wanted Winston, and his deciding factor was money. I think we would have tried to clear up some cap space before the FA period, as we have done in the past.
     
  37. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Again, if they wanted*to they could have offered it, and then made the decision. I'm saying I haven't heard that we lost anyone because the money wasn't there. We have chose not to pay what some people were wanting, but that's different.
     
  38. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    That's a damn good passer rating for throwing down the field, I don't care if he underhands it there if that is the result.
     
  39. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Interestingly, Moore was much better outside the numbers deep than he is down the middle. His passer ratings in order for left deep, middle deep, and right deep were 86.5, 28.1, and 98.6 respectively. Does that indicate we need a better pass receiving threat to threaten the seam? Seems like if his arm strength was in question, outside the numbers would be where he would have had the lower passer ratings.
     
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  40. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    Well I do believe we are in desperate need of a seam threat. Personally I'd be in favor of trading back (to wherever you as a FO feel is the latest guaranteed spot) adding additional picks and then taking Fleener. Some will say he is a reach in the first but in my opinion he will not be there in the second. His measurables alone pretty much guarantee to me that he ends up as a mid-later first rounder.

    In my perfect personal scenario

    1) Fleener
    2) Best RT/DE available
    3) RT/DE (whichever wasn't selected)
    3) Tommy Streeter

    Also if you trade back for Fleener you acquire at least another third rounder but possibly a second. At that slot you can try and acquire a FS if you see value or possibly even another WR.
     

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