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Cam Wake Absent From Workouts

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by HardKoreXXX, Apr 10, 2012.

  1. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    I don't think it's cloudy at all. Other than this past year, he's been completely durable. He's also one of the top LT's in the league. You pay him as such. The only reason it would be cloudy is if you admit you had no business drafting an LT #1 in the 1st Place, since if everything went according to plan this is what they'd be faced with. The Cam Wake scenario is similar. You sign a guy like that hoping he can turn into an All-Pro. He is, and now it's like they don't know what to do. Go look at the Dolphins cap and try and make sense of it. It's a mess. 6.4 Million left? Who's making all that money? It's sad. Sad that there's not enough money to extend our best defensive player.
     
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  2. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    Common sense says they would.....again thats common sense though...
     
  3. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    I said that when they traded Marshall. If you're gonna do it, do it all the way. Get rid of everyone and clear the cap.
     
  4. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    From my understanding, at least for this year, trading Dansby actually costs cap space.
     
  5. PhinsRDbest

    PhinsRDbest Transform and Transcend

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    Question for everyone, would you take a 2nd round pick for Wake? If not what would you deem fair?
     
  6. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    Next year will be a rebuilding year anyway, so I'd be fine with that so long as it wasn't on the books for several years after that.
     
  7. Clipse

    Clipse mediocrity sucks

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    I agree with this. If you're going to rebuild, rebuild the right way. Clear up cap space. Acquire draft picks for guys that you can like Dansby and Wake. Only keep guys that fit into future plans. Play the young guys, if they ball out, great. If not, they get experience and you get a great pick for a QB. No more half assing it.
     
  8. Bulldog

    Bulldog New Member

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    WTF are you talking about? I never said NFL players don't deserve their pay, they do, they make the owners a lot of money.
     
  9. Bumrush

    Bumrush Stable Genius Club Member

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    With that attitude I'm happy to announce that you are the first person I have put on ignore since I joined the site. Congrats on taking out Jet trolls. You should be honored.
     
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  10. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Yup.
     
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  11. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    Right. My point is that when it comes to negotiations we have no idea who is asking for what. We have no idea if Cam Wake says he'll only sign for Williams money. We have no idea if Ireland has even offered him a legitimate extension. We are speculating, but really its just based on the assumption that we would like to give him a contract that is suitable for us, yet still an upgrade for him.

    And to be absolutely fair, Cameron Wake is largely responsible for his current positioning. He is the one that worked himself out of the NFL. He is the one that spent time in the CFL, only to take such a low contract to come back into the NFL. This isn't a guy thats outperformed his entire life. He underperformed as much as he overperformed, which is why he's only making $600k.
     
  12. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    I'm fairly certain most "franchise" QBs were drafted outside of the top-10.
     
  13. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    Except Miami has more control than you are implying. They can franchise him if necessary.
     
  14. jinx

    jinx Well-Known Member

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    [TABLE]
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    [TD]Julius Peppers got 6 years/$91.5M with $42M guaranteed with the Bears.


    [/TD]
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  15. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    Si.....
     
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  16. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    Can doesnt mean they will.....who honestly knows what they are thinking...
     
  17. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    There is enough money. There just isn't a clear advantage to signing him to a contract worth $X. It really depends on the price.
     
  18. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    The clear advantage is that you don't have to franchise him next year. I believe the Dolphins, currently, have 6.4 Mill in cap. That 6.4 will have to be used for draft picks. So if they don't do some maneuvering (Long), I don't think they could afford it.
     
  19. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    I'm fairly certain I know what they're thinking. They're thinking that they would rather pay Wake $600k than $12M. They're thinking that Cam Wake is 30 years old, and they can keep him until he's 32 yrs old by paying him $600k this season and the franchise number next season.

    What exactly would be the benefit of extend him now as opposed to next offseason? The big benefit would be the leverage you have in forcing him to take less than $10M/yr. So essentially at this point you have Wake saying he wants to be paid in the top-5 at his position for the next 3-4 years. You have the Dolphins saying they can have him for 2 more years at half the cost, then he can roll the dice as a 32 yr old free agent trying to get top-5 money.
     
  20. jinx

    jinx Well-Known Member

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    Trent Cole got 4 years/$53M with $15M guaranteed.

    I imagine Wake and his reps will be looking for something in that range.
     
  21. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Go ahead, that is what 19 million?

    I await Ireland's "we have a contract" statement, that will be the perfect opportunity to point out so did:

    -Jake Grove
    -YBell
    -Channing Crowder
    -Vern Carey

    Maybe, Matt Roth was right.
     
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  22. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    How is franchising him a disadvantage? Presumably his contract request at this point is to be among the top-5 at his position, which is what they'll pay him if he's franchised. In both scenarios he is making $10M+ in 2012.
     
  23. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Or

    He forces a trade, signs an extension with the new team

    Wake has the leverage in the situation, he is smart to use it.
     
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  24. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    IIRC the franchise number is $12M for defensive ends.
     
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  25. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    Forces a trade when and how?
     
  26. HardKoreXXX

    HardKoreXXX Insensitive to the Touch

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    Right, but that 10+ Million could be paid off as a bonus, and not count against the cap.
     
  27. ToddsPhins

    ToddsPhins Banned

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    Eh, it was probably like 'Hostel' and the Ireland family sold them on the black market.
     
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  28. Clipse

    Clipse mediocrity sucks

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    One less homer to listen to. Looks like we'll both benefit.
     
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  29. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    By simply...holding out.

    Really is that simple, and the new rules about the holdout yr not counting towards FA means nothing, as you point out, he would have been franchised anyway, so there is no downside, only upside for him to..holdout.

    Which would mean, we'd have to trade him, that is if he holds out and he has -0- reason not to as 600k is not sufficient, and if he will "lose" a FA yr to the franchise tag, he'd be stupid not to holdout.

    Good place to point out this could all have been avoided if Ireland had signed him to an extension after 2010?
     
  30. Clipse

    Clipse mediocrity sucks

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    Cam Wake is 30 years old. He wants a longtime deal to give him long time financial security. I very highly doubt he would settle for a one year franchise tag.
     
  31. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    Bonuses count against the cap. Difference is that you can prorate them. But either way, Wake is going to ask for a lot more than $10M total in guaranteed/bonus money. We're looking at probably $30M guaranteed he's requesting. So if you want to keep him for only 3 years, thats $10M/yr in cap space for him.

    The problem here is that he might not be an elite player in 3 years. You have to be very careful in terms of how much guaranteed money you give him, because you could wind up with a 34 year old average defensive end thats being paid like hes an elite one.
     
  32. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    When has a player ever held out in the NFL and it resulted in him being traded?

    There is the obvious downside of him sitting out a year at 30 years old.
     
  33. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    His other choice is to not get paid anything
     
  34. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    I meant the downside for the Dolphins.
     
  35. Clipse

    Clipse mediocrity sucks

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    More often than not, they get the money they're looking for. Desean Jackson, Chris Johnson, and Revis being the latest examples.
     
  36. slickj101

    slickj101 Is Water

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    6 pages of

    [​IMG]


    :waits for a week or two when Wake is resigned and people complain Long isn't:
     
  37. Clipse

    Clipse mediocrity sucks

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    No Cameron Wake. I'd prefer to just trade him and start the rebuilding process that we should of started in 2008. But that's what it pretty much comes down to. You sign him, trade him, or let him walk.
     
  38. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Jared Allen..I "think", VJax held out, and wrangled a guarantee of no franchise tag for the 2nd season.

    This situation really boils down to is Wake stupid enough to take a 2 yr 19.6 million dollar deal (recall Mario Williams would have gotten 19 if the Texans tagged him) or holding out for a trade and a 4 yr, 40 million dollar deal?

    A lower tag number actually would make a holdout even more attractive to Wake, 2 yr, 12.6 or 4 yr, 40 million?
     
  39. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    28.4 million dollars is not exactly peanuts.

    Would you risk 600k for 39.4 million?
     
  40. slickj101

    slickj101 Is Water

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    You're assuming he cares about money as much as you think he does. Or at least the difference in those two sums.

    It's not like those are the only two options either.
     

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