http://miamiherald.typepad.com/dolp...erned-about-capacity-at-sun-life-stadium.html -lowest seating capacity in the lower bowl in the NFL -largest number of upper deck seats in the NFL at 35,000 -leads to the need to purchase tickets so games are aired on local TV Interesting stuff.
Even more curious is how Pro Football Talk happens upon this blog entry from January 27 and writes about it today. Not saying it isn't interesting or discussion-worthy today, because it definitely is. Just wondering how Florio happened upon it 5 months later, since it'd be buried in the archives.
Just revamp the lower level to have seating closer to the field. They'd have to slightly raise the original seating behind it without interfering with the 2nd Deck. It's just concrete. Definitely gunna have to tarp over (black out) a section or two in the upper deck in that case tho. Why they had to spend all that $ on the outside a few years ago is beyond me.
Regurgitated information.. There should of been a plan in place last year knowing that the Marlins would be out, not sure why there is no talk on this front publicly, the city, the team, the current owner the fans are all losing with this pathetic structure..what terrible vision from our old owner, just pathetic.
It sounds as though Dee understands the disadvantages from a structural POV, and how that relates to the team and fanbase from an negative energy standpoint, but like we've been saying, where the hell is the sense of urgency?
Refurbishing the stadium isn't going to be cost-effective for them. Adding seats in the lower bowl won't end up paying for itself. The most value-added they can get it is from new luxury boxes and more expensive amenities. They only logical way for that to happen is with a new stadium. Seems to me that they are angling for a new stadium here within the next 5-7 years.
Man I hope so, and if they do, we better as a fanbase let them know about our history when it comes to loud stadiums, I would hope that thephins.com would get involved in a small revolution to get the POV of the people across to the suits..
I am a long time season ticket holder and I re-upped for next year. After going to the the new Marlins stadium, it really makes Joe Robbie Stadium (it will always be JRS to me) look dated. Not only are the seats too far away and uncovered but the concessions completely and inexcusably suck, there are often long bathroom lines, the jumbotrons need to be updated, and there should be a pedestrian overpass for the tens of thousands of people that have to cross Ives Dairy Road from the parking lots to get to the stadium. Some of the above issues, like the concessions, can be fixed cheaply and right now. Others are structural and will take longer and cost more. But the stadium is getting dated
They've figured it out. The problem is that they wanted Broward County to pass a tourist tax to pay for the renovations. Broward County said no.
I think if you look at the NFL stadiums that have been built recently, the trend hasn't been "louder". Stephen Ross has a lot of experience getting the taxpayer to fund construction projects. I don't think the Dolphins get a new stadium right away. But I definitely think they will get one within 10 years. But I wouldn't hold my breath on the stadium being built around crowd noise. It will be built around luxury amenities.
What I meant by that Des, is how much of a disadvantage the current stadium is to our team, it's fans, and the owners pockets..The fact that they continue to add millions to the exterior is telling.
Their mistake Stringer, those stadiums are not reaching the potential that the one I'm talking about could.. I totally, 100 percent believe you can have both, the amenities and the intimidation built right into the blueprint.. What folks don't seem to conceptualize is how many fans would come to the stadium just to experience that type of energy, especially if it's special, especially if it's marketed correctly, especially if the structure has specs involved to create what you are envisioning..You could create a whole subculture where it becomes a must visit place.. I can't imagine what a Dolphin/Canes interchangable OB2 replica could do for the city, culture, and Economy..The extra money you would get from its prescense would pay for itself in no time.. It could be the greatest investment opportunity in south Florida sports history.
They're doing the exterior because Roger Goodell is threatening to withhold future Super Bowls from the stadium.
It's going to be a long time before any sports team is going to be able to get public money in South Florida after the Marlins have poisoned the well.
Yup, your right..terrible dilemma we are in...Putting money into a disaster of a stadium is horrible business.
Yeah right, our home stadium structure and lack of energy created by fans being more far away than any other stadium in the league doesn't affect our players mentality, passion and enthusiasm.. sure OZ, keep telling yourself that my friend.
You say this same thing a thousand times and you have the nerve to tell me to keep telling myself something? Lets see here... My thinking is.....The team wins games, attendance is up, and crowds are very good. Your thinking is......The team sucks and its because of the atmosphere that the stadium creates. So again, it has absolutely nothing to do with the stadium being a disadvantage to the TEAM! The stadium is too big. The fans that pay the most money (sidelines) cannot get close enough to the action to REALLY enjoy a football game. The fans in the upper decks are too far away to enjoy a football game. Fans are not there to make the team better. The stadium needs to make the fan experience better.
Oz, I didnt start the threads, but I will make my comments if the topic keeps coming up, and you know I respect you, but if you think our stadium is not a problem, then we're on different planets so there's no sense of me annoying you with a debate.
There has been a number of studies that have shown that home field provides favorable officiating. Those studies also show that it doest hae much of an effect on player performance. I think it provides advantages and disadvantages. It might pump guys up, but that can just as likely lead to mistakes. I think theres also more pressure at home, which could be a negative. The bottom line is that I believe a louder crowd provides an advantage, but not for the reasons commonly believed. The real advantage IMO is in creating bias in the officials.
I think your on an island when you state that the configuration of the stadium is not a problem, executives of our team have already point blank told you that it is, and that it needs to be fixed. Before they ever addressed it, I was writing my thoughts about it, and I'm sorry that's annoying to you. Why do you think there talking about changing it?, if it was just about fielding better players and winning games it wouldn't be a topic at all..The fact that it is, should be all the proof you need to not have such a conviction that there isn't a problem..
Time for you to go back and re-read my posts here. Not once did I say the configuration is not a problem. I've said it since the place was built. What I did say was it's not for the reason you keep harping on. It needs to be changed to suit the fans so they can have a better experience at a game. So they might want to come back or sign on for season tickets. BUT to have a larger following they need to be a much better team.
I've been going to Dolphins games since 81 on a regular basis. Had season tickets in the OB from 85 till we left. A loud crowd is not enough of an advantage to win a game alone. That is a crazy claim. However, in a close contest, a rabid crowd in a stadium that holds the noise is enough of an advantage to cause a crucial mistake by the opposition leading to a win. Anyone that thinks excessive home crowd noise does not affect the game on a deeper basis than supposed "home cooking" officiating never attended a big game in the OB. I can't count the number of games the OB crowd had a direct affect on the momentum and for causing issues for the opposing team during a close game. Closed endzone of the OB wreaked havoc on opposing teams. That stadium got loud enough to disrupt visiting teams. Opposing teams and coaches directly mentioned it over the years. On the flip side I had season tickets at Joe Robbie for years as well and went to a lot of sold out games there. At it's peak with the entire crowd riled up it simply does not compare. I don't think Joe Robbie can be fixed personally. They may try to but I don't see it. They'd have to start from scratch and really, in this economic environment, there is zero chance of that. Just have to remember the good old days.
I get your POV Oz, you don't feel players can play better because of how a stadium is built and provides energy...I feel a stadium configuration determines the level of energy that can be produced..so with that being said, our stadium is the worst in the NFL when it comes to energy inside, I dont think that can be debated, strictly from a construction standpoint, the distance does not provide palpable electricity, (now just because your section was crazy on a Monday nite doesn't fix the big problem consistently) now our other disagreement comes in the form that I 100 percent believe that players don't like playing in that environment and their performance can be tangibly affected, you don't.. I'll say it again, the stadium Creates a passive, lazy crowd, and why shouldnt it, when you dont feel the intimancy,no matter how many games were winning, it will always make its ugly prescense felt at some point.. They want to improve it, not just because of the fans, if you listen to the players and Mike Dee word for word, you can tell, there is an issue there are very cognisant of, and IMO that issue is exactly what I'm talking about.. And for the record, what I'm saying is, if you were able to build what it is I'm talking about, and you take the same players, and let them play in both stadiums, if you don't think players would perform better and harder in the orange bowl or the type of stadium I'm talking about, I vehemently disagree, when fans are in top of the action, players pay harder and with more focus..don't believe that?, you don't have to, doesn't mean it isn't true.
Heightened sense of awareness.. When you have the right stadium, it's in play, when you don't, it's not, when you do, you have more energy, when you don't, you don't..
When you have a good team, then you have the right energy. When you have a good game going on, then you have good energy. I don't go to a game saying this place sucks so I'm just going to sit in my seat and clap for an occassional good play...
Loudest I ever heard JRS get, in person, was Miami vs Denver in 2001. Miami was down 10-0 in the 4th quarter and scored 21 unanswered to win the game 21-10. With 14 min left, Fiedler hit Chambers for a TD to make it 10-7. Life was breathed into the stadium. A few plays later Kenny Mixon intercepted Brian Griese and ran it back for a 56 yard TD. The stadium was literally shaking after he scored the TD. Miami kicked off and then Denver fumbled the return. What I thought was the loudest the stadium could get (after the INT TD) was topped on this fumble. 3 plays later Miami scored another TD. Three TD's in less than 5 min. Still, that noise probably was half as loud as they OB was on the Monday night in 85 when Miami beat the then undefeated Bears. I wasn't at that game, but I know how loud it was. [video=youtube;_m0SzNtY9WI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_m0SzNtY9WI[/video]
talk about saying the same things over and over, everyone knows its an issue, but you proclaim that its all good, just win and everything will be ok, nothing personal, I just don't think you get the concept of bad configuration relative to energy and a heighten sense of awareness for your players, and how that relates to players performance.. I'd like to say, if we ever have this convo again I would appreciate if you wouldn't start out the conversation with degrading my opinion..I respect your opinion, and if you wanna write about it a thousand times, then do it.. Mike Dee.. " The money would bring a number of seats*18 feet closer to the field and add 3,500 seats, thereby increasing the number of seats between the goal lines and probably*making the place louder*-- creating a football game experience superior to the one fans gets now. Doesn't sound like he agrees with your take that's there isn't a major problem, if he didn't think his vision would help the players why the hell does he want to do it..sh&$s and giggles, we're talking a couple of million dollars... I mean really, why not just focus on improving the video structures and the tarp, why all this talk over and over again about bringing the seats closer to the action? " Dee wants to bring the fans closer to the field" His thoughts not mine. "We have the furthest distance from the sidelines with our lower bowl in the NFL," {Dolphins president Mike] Dee said. "We have the fewest number of seats in that lower seating level between the 20 yard lines, between the goal lines, in the NFL. Not just the facilities that compete for Super Bowls. We've got to fix that ... Hmmm, I wonder why he thinks "HE'S GOT TO FIX THAT...
i understand what you are saying Dj, but the reason isnt to help the players, players are going to play, its for the fan experiance. Sure the players may enjoy the fans and the crowd and it pumps them up, but i dont think it has an over whelming effect on them. i have seen crowds in the past effect games, but these days of silent snap counts and helmet speakers to relay the plays in, other than the weather or long travel from coast to coast i dont see the effect like it used to be. I love seeing a packed stadium and hear the crowd at its peak decibals. But a renovaded or new stadium is for the fans and the money they bring in. It's for the payers not the players.
Since we're saying "nothing personal"......... Nothing personal Deej but you do not have a clue what you're talking about.
