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Cordarrelle Patterson, WR - Tenn.

Discussion in 'NFL Draft Forum' started by Bpk, Jan 8, 2013.

  1. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    There's been more buzz (mainly from CK I think) about Cordarrelle Patterson at our 12th pick.

    Here's a thread to post videos of Cordarrelle and opinions of him.

    My notes when I watched Cordarrelle games on video about a month ago.

    Cordarrelle Patterson WR
    - crisp
    - routes? ran wrong route on TD!? He laughs, says coach is "trippin"... that he 'had to get open". but can tell he knows he ran it wrong (I'm in love with this guy so far.)
    - good with ball in his hands
    - plays fast
    - runningback moves
    - how is his TIMING on timing routes?
    - good conditioning! 80 yard return, not out of breath
    - Strong, conditioned athelte
    - straight line speed
    - change of direction
    - can he go up in the air and win the ball? (aendzone?)
    - played out of the SLOT a lot?
    - like Bess on STEROIDS in every way
    - physical like Boldin but faster and niftier
    - TONS of juice in him, passion to play, excited
    - WINNER
    LOVE HIM
    - CALM CUSTOMER under pressure and in BIG *** games!
    Question Marks: I would have liked to see him on more jump balls in the endzone. Can he pull down contested TD throws?
    - Not 100% sure on his emotional maturity.


    I don't like him at 12. I prefer a second round WR where I feel the value is better. I also prefer a WR with a more traditional skillset, who gives most of their production on bread and butter downfield receptions, not special teams or constraint/wrinkle plays. Finally, I expect a first round WR to be proven at making difficult contested catches on jump balls. That's where redzone TDs come from.

    Cordarrelle is amazing, but I wouldn't take him until the late first or early second round and I doubt he lasts that long.
     
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  2. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    Seems like a draft pick if you have a long term plan. Doesn't seem to be the type to come in and set the league on fire. Might have a good Josh Gordon type year, which would be nice.

    Looks like he is going to be a great kick returner.
     
  3. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    That's pretty funny.

    No offense I just meant from a stream of consciousness standpoint.
     
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  4. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Interesting pair of statements. I was about to disagree with you with respect to the first statement but then when you said might have a Josh Gordon type year I got confused and wanted to agree with you.

    Gordon had 50 catches for 805 yards and 5 touchdowns this year. Everyone has gone positively gaga over T.Y. Hilton but Gordon had virtually the same year and his physical prowess holds the promise of more development.

    To me that kind of IS coming in and setting the league on fire for a rookie. It's definitely upper echelon amongst rookie receiver performances of the decade.

    I think Cordarrelle Patterson is exactly the kind of guy that can make an immediate impact. The less explosive technique guys, they're the ones that to me have trouble right away until they've perfected their technique. Guys with great physical gifts have it easier, IMO. I think of Cordarrelle as probably being the most gifted receiver in this Draft from a pure physical talent perspective. He's 6'3" and outruns guys vertically, yet can cut and juke like Tavon Austin.
     
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  5. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    This is an excellent video of Cordarrelle Patterson, actually. YouTube being what it is, still an excellent video.

    [video=youtube;rIXqAtF1--M]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIXqAtF1--M[/video]
     
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  6. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box


    LOL!!! I know, right? I was thinking the same thing as I read it and couldn;t understand why I had discomfort when you floated the thought of him as our pick at #12.

    I couldn't reconcile how exited I was about him with why I didn't feel right about wanting him that high.

    And it comes down to HOW we could use him and HOW MUCH we could use him.

    I think his special teams production dwindles in the NFL if he proves to be a great wR, because you don;t risk him on STs. So I can;t assume that I'll be getting that from him long term, if the plan is for him to become a great Pro Bowl quality wide receiver.

    Similarly, most NFL WR production is not on reverses, or option passes, etc. I can see where screens will be good for him... but I acannot ignore the feeling that for him to be a success as a well-spent 12th overall pick we have to be able to get a lot out of him vertically and on contested endzone catches. I'm not sold on Cordarrelle in those regards.

    Plus I have major concerns about him as a receiver in a timing and precision based offense.

    So I begin to depend on him more and more for screens?

    It was at this point that I realized, if it's this much of a process to figure out HOW I would get the most out of him, then he's actually not the best fit for us until we already have that other #1WR who moves the chains on relaiable routes, who can go vertical and win a jump ball, and who will fight for the TD catch with a DB or TWO punching at his arms.
     
  7. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    It kind of is. When thinking of "Setting the world on fire" I am more thinking about Randy Moss or a #1 type receiver everyone loves to say.

    I am always scared of receivers with the negatives of "Needs a year to learn how to run routes."

    I hate when people use former Dolphin players as comparison, however it does remind me of Ted Ginn. Just of course very different since Ginn looks like he relied MUCH more on speed and doesn't have the elusiveness.

    At the same time, with Miami being 7-9 with a few games that could have really used a player who has the ability to take a bubble screen, reverse, or just fly pattern to the house.
     
  8. Boomer

    Boomer Premium Member Luxury Box

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    He's a lot tougher than Ginn.
     
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  9. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    I am not trying to say he is Ted Ginn. Just another reciever that has me on edge when pointing out he needs to learn routes. Like Heyward-Bey for example.
     
  10. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I think the Combine is going to be big for Cordarrelle Patterson because his pure long speed is really hard to gauge on tape.

    The problem lies in his cutting. He does a LOT of it on most of the plays you see the ball go his direction. Every time you cut, you lose speed, and you can really only regain a marginal amount of it back. Sometimes it's kind of remarkable how much speed he does recover after cutting so many times on some of these plays. But it could be why I noticed before that from a pure long speed standpoint there are definitely guys running faster. David Amerson is estimated to be only a 4.59 guy by NFL Draft Scout. Toward the end of one of Cordarrelle's runs, it's clear the two are at about the same long speed.

    But then you see Cordarrelle just flat out beat a guy like Jaylen Jenkins of Florida with straight speed, and you're like whoa, wait a minute...how fast IS this guy after all? Jenkins looked helpless trying to close even while Cordarrelle was looking up for the ball which slows you up. Jenkins is estimated to be a 4.42 guy.

    Also this is just from an experience standpoint in terms of watching guys run at the Combine for a long time, you look at Cordarrelle's body type, leg length and his high gait, and you can imagine him flying down the track like a Travis Benjamin did.

    So...it'll be interesting.

    Two angles to keep in mind about Patterson:

    1. Growth. A year ago he was playing JUCO ball. He comes right in and faces one of the highest rated corners in the country in David Amerson and burns him to cinders. Was Amerson overrated? Probably. But then he's out there taking Louchiez Purifoy to school, and he's the #1 rated sophomore CB according to NFL Draft Scout. Then he's taking on Johnthan Banks with some success, and Darius Slay with even more success. He made a nice play against Robert Lester of Alabama.

    2. Route running. It isn't just about technique. There's a lot of innate ability involved in that. One of the reasons I like him is because that same cut-n-go ability which proves absolutely ridiculous against even SEC defenses, is present in a simple slant play, or in a back shoulder throw. And he loves to use his hands on his routes to keep defensive backs at bay.
     
  11. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    If Ted Ginn were this big and had these kinds of open field running skills we would be having a different conversation. In the back of our minds I think we always knew we were counting on Ginn's incredible long speed to make up for the fact that he was an unexciting open field runner.
     
  12. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    If we draft Cordarrelle at 12, we are putting a lot of weight on how well Ken O'Keefe can teach this kid.

    Ken O'Keefe. Whose experience at WR is restricted to the one year (this year) he was put at WR coach by friend Joe Philbin (Iowa connection) and the two season he spent playing WR for John Carroll University, a listless Div III school, back in the early 1970's. Come on man. The best that can be said for John Carroll is that Don Shula is an alumnus.

    The jury is SO out on whether O'Keefe will be a good WR's coach. My money is on him being average, but no better than that. And we want to draft a kid who needs a ton of coaching to reaching his potential?

    It's not adding up, for me.
     
  13. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Do you really think the Dolphins will take into consideration in their evaluation of Cordarrelle Patterson that they have a crappy wide receivers coach and so they shouldn't bother trying to develop a young guy?

    If that was their line of reasoning they'd just fire him.
     
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  14. jegol71

    jegol71 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    What an exciting player. I had visions of the 2007 Ronnie Brown, pre-injury, when he was a flat-out jukebox. We won't take him, but that doesn't stop me from paying attention to the team that does. He seems to play fast regardless of what his timed numbers will be. Seems much more stout upon contact than his frame appears.
     
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  15. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    His hands worry me, but everything else looks good. He's just such a body catcher it's tough to judge IMO.
     
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  16. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Patterson seems to have confidence in his hands or else he wouldn't be attempting a few of those unnecessary 1 handed grabs IMO.
     
  17. unluckyluciano

    unluckyluciano For My Hero JetsSuck

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    seems to me like he has pretty good vision. and is either smart or very instinctual.
     
  18. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    I agree that it won't occur to them in this decision.

    But I question Philbin's staff appointments, including Turner on O line.

    So if you ask my opinion on whether to draft a guy who lacks technique and needs a lot of good coaching to succeed in the NFL, I'm gonna say no. Take the guy who is less raw, because I don't like our chances at developing the raw kid.
     
  19. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    Reminds me of Roddy White. I don't think he's much of a deep threat, but I think he will be a good route runner in the NFL.
     
  20. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I hate to dismiss that but at the same time I know that Roddy White was a body catcher and so was Golden Tate. It's a fine difference but I think there's a difference between a guy that cradles a ball into his body trying to shield it away from the defender and a guy that does so to try and increase his chances of catching the ball. If you have time look through all the catches and judge how often he catches it unnecessarily with his body when a defender isn't really around to try and challenge the catch.
     
  21. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Actually that's the thing that worries me most about his hands because the tendency to try for that can show his lack of polish. A lot of times it's easier to try and stab the ball with one hand, while you're on the move and your body is leaning this way or that. When Matt Jones made the transition to wide receiver he did it all the time. It takes discipline and technique to make sure you get two hands on the ball in all but the most extreme situations.
     
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  22. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    That's the only video I saw of him, and only other time I remember seeing Tennessee was against Akron (and I don't specifically remember Patterson in that game). I didn't notice a lot of unnecessary body catching just more than I am used to seeing. One of the slants vs Vanderbilt in the highlight eased my concerns a bit because he cleanly snatched it out of the air. I did see a drop or two (in my opinion) and while that's not unexpected they were all catches away from his body. That's the only thing thy gives me pause.

    Believe me though, concerns or not, I won't complain if we take him.
     
  23. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    That's the thing. You watch him running in the open field and he cuts so damn much by the time he's getting into a deep gait to try and judge speed against others, he's already lost a lot.

    But look at this:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=GOXSDNMCp-8#t=145s

    That's Jaylen Watkins. No, he didn't actually catch the ball and that's a problem. But if we're talking about deep threat ability, outside of maybe a Mike Wallace eating up an 8 yard cushion and still blowing by his corner, this is pretty good because Watkins had legit 4.42 speed. What is of particular interest to me is at the point where Watkins stops hand fighting with Patterson, he starts pumping his arms and trying his damnedest to gain speed and close on Patterson while Patterson is looking up for the ball which would tend to slow you down. But look close, and pay attention to the body language. Not only is Watkins completely at a loss to try and close up any distance, his body language shows that he knows he can't catch up. Those horses eyed one another, and Patterson won.

    If he can do that to a guy with 4.42 speed then I imagine at 6'3" then he really is a deep threat.

    Does the same beating Robert Lester vertically here.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=kGZVE1p6Q40#t=3s

    And then of course there's this infamous play which he made on David Amerson.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=QypUGJch5yk#t=30s
     
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  24. sports24/7

    sports24/7 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    What impresses me the most is his acceleration and lateral quickness for a guy that size. He is certainly an interesting prospect.
     
  25. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Incidentally the Florida game was one of the games that I hadn't seen before but when I saw it, it really moved the needle for me on Patterson.
     
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  26. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Similarly, here's Cordarrelle Patterson matched up on CB Branden Smith of Georgia, whom in my humble opinion Patterson got open on at will when he was actually running a route. So bad I thought Georgia actually adjusted the matchups and responsibilities so that Smith wouldn't find himself in a high pressure technique against Patterson again. Not that it mattered as I thought Patterson got open just as easily on Sanders Commings, especially on slant patterns.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=CiH27BqHHqI#t=250s

    Same thing. Branden Smith is a guy that has run a 4.43 at campus testing. He gets into a press, tries to be physical with Patterson but is unsuccessful, but most importantly pause when the ball is in the air and they come back into frame. Look what happens when the ball is in the air and Patterson is looking up for it and trying to run under the pass. Smith isn't trying to be physical anymore, he's pumping his arms and putting on the afterburners to try and close the separation. It's not happening. Look at the body language and how far out in front Smith's got his head trying to catch up. This is a Cordarrelle Patterson that has his head up in the sky trying to track the ball and adjust his speed to get under it, and a 4.43 guy is at a loss to try and close the distance no matter how hard he runs.
     
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  27. ajaffe9

    ajaffe9 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    His Florida tape is really impressive, even more so when you consider Florida had one of the best defenses in the country. In that game he really showed he can be productive in all levels of the passing game. Had a great slant in a goal line situation where the CB is taught to prevent the receiver from getting inside. Patterson uses his quickness to cut in front of the CB and then shields him with his 6'4" frame. Had a nice intermediate dig route where he just sat in the soft spot of the zone and caught the ball. In the deep part of the passing game, he showed that he can make big plays in all of the clips that CK just posted above, including one against Florida CB Jaylen Watkins.

    This guy is a starter Day 1 for the Dolphins. Would be very happy taking him at 12. Maybe move back a couple spots to gain an extra pick to try to move into the late first round with some packaged picks, but wouldn't want to move too far back to risk losing him.
     
  28. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Agree, it concerns me as well.
     
  29. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Really good to know. I'm going to check that out. I like making notes of which games I watched because I think that has a LOT to do with the opinions we form.
     
  30. RickyBobby

    RickyBobby VIP DIY

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    I see a mix of a young Randy Moss and a old Randy Moss

    He jumps like an old Randy Moss but runs after the catch like a young Randy Moss.

    I don't think his hands are as good as Moss', but he is probably a little more physical.

    Should be good to see him run the gauntlet at the combine and run the 40

    he is electric with the ball in his hands
     
  31. invid

    invid Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    He would be a great fit for this offense. Can you imagine him catching one of those comebacks and being all alone on an island against the cornerback after that? He would probably win more than half of the time. I honestly hope he blows the pre-draft events up, which would vindicate Ireland's selection of him at 12.
     
  32. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I'm going to put 20:1 odds that Miami doesn't draft him. I get excited about him but let's be honest here.
     
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  33. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Feet planted on the ground.

    Agree.

    But if he made it to the bottom of the first round... do you not trade your high second and high third to move up and grab him?

    I would have to seriously consider doing so.


    Another scenario: if Free Agency opens and Wallace, Jennnings and Bowe sign elsewhere... the #12 spot is more in play for a WR. (Though it;s probably Kennan Allen in that case).


    The more I look at it, the less likely I think I get my wish of Stedman Bailey in the second unless we sign one of those free agents.
     
  34. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Some notes from the South Carolina game which was his worst game statistically I believe with 1 kick return for 13 yards, 1 punt return for -8 yards, 3 catches for 26 yards and 3 runs for 21 yards.

    On kick returns he made an impact no matter what the stats say. South Carolina did all they could to avoid kicking to him, including kicking one out of bounds which gave it to the Vols on the 40 yard line, and a squib which gave it to them on the 36 yard line. Those are as good as 40 and 36 yard returns. There were other shenanigans in there just doing whatever they could to keep Patterson from getting the kickoff returns.

    On offense, the mark of a good player is how statistically you can look at 3 runs for 21 yards and say "meh" but then watch the plays and be really wowed. One end-around he just blazes so fast that he gains 9 yards even though the Gamecocks had great pursuit. There was a jet sweep (might've technically been a catch) where he he gets to the perimeter and starts turning up field and a corner goes down to the turf with the receiver blocking him, getting in Patterson's way. Patterson hurdles over the both of them and clears no less than 15 or 16 feet (just over 5 yards) in the air before being met as he came back down, stayed on his feet initially despite the wallop, gang tackle...only a 5 yard gain. Got open vertically against Jimmy Legree and was overthrown. Got REALLY open on a nice little fade-stop, good gain. Took a snap from tailback executing a toss play and the guy's vision and cutting ability availed him plenty there as he found the creases inside the blocking, gained some good yardage. Did the same thing lined up as a tailback on the toss, this time had to make a man miss in the backfield right off the toss, still got out and gained like 5 or 6 yards. What a weapon. His final catch of the day was yet another nice example of how he can instantaneously get his hips around after the catch and begin running with the ball in his hands. Justin Hunter can't do that.
     
  35. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    How many years would the staff use him at kick return (a significant amount) if he was actually playing well as one of our top two receivers?

    In your honest estimation.

    Keep in mind, he takes a lot more contact than a Devin Hester at WR. Patterson's routes subject him to much more contact than a fly route and occasional WR screen guy.

    My feeling is he would see significant STs touches only in his first season, then less and less each year.
     
  36. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    The Dolphins have a return guy they like in Thigpen. I think Patterson has so much to learn they'd want him focusing on receiver.

    I heard reference to Patterson really only arriving at UT shortly before the start of the season. I guess he arrived a month after most incoming freshman so he got maybe like a month or so of FBS coaching before he had to go into regular season mode.

    Have an article saying he posted a 10.33 second 100 meter dash just before arriving to the football team. Also says he did a 39 inch vertical and a 22 foot long jump. And I'm telling you he actually did at least 16 feet on the football field during a jet sweep.
     
  37. BuckeyeKing

    BuckeyeKing Wolves DYNASTY!!!!

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    Well it is Ireland.
     
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  38. ajaffe9

    ajaffe9 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I feel like this whole season there has been so much talk about a lack of speed and playmaking on offense, especially at the wide receiver position. Everybody has said that was our biggest weakness. By taking Patterson at 12, I think you add a guy that can really add some playmaking ability to our receivers group and will make guys like Hartline and Bess better by being able to stretch the defense a little bit. And then you can bring some variety into the offense with his ability on sweeps and reverses and things start to look a lot more dynamic.

    Clearly the strength of this draft is on the line of scrimmage. I think it really comes down to a couple choices: if one of the elite top 12 prospects (Joeckel, Werner, etc.) falls to us then you take him; otherwise, you have to look at a guy like Ansah or Sheldon Richardson compared to Patterson and decide which position will have the better prospects available in rounds 2 and 3. That's my take on it. What do you guys think?
     
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  39. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Exactly what I've been saying. He will need to focus on receiver. So discount those special teams contributions from any projections for how he'll produce for us.

    That said, yes, he's a physical freak. Still not sure he warrants a 12.
     
  40. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    I think a lot depends on what happens in Free Agency first.

    But of the guys you mentioned, Ansah fits the best without rearranging the whole Dline... richardson, to me, only fits if we cut Soliai loose (trade him)... but I think this staff will cling to him as our run defense was the only thing they could be certain of last year (though by year's end it was shaky too).

    I feel like we could potentially trade down and still get one of these guys like Ansah or Cordarrelle. Somewhere in the 21-24 range. Plus pick up a pick.

    Or, we target an existing NFL player and move the 12th pick to bring in a day one starter. The exception, to me, is if one of the top guys falls to us. I had hoped Millinier would make it to 12, but now I doubt it.
     
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