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Latest on Dolphins' Pitch for SunLife Renovations

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by schmolioot, Jan 14, 2013.

  1. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Those two pics say to me that were only adding some rows at the bottom...which is fine, however, your still stuck with 95 percent of the fans are farther away from their players than any other team..
     
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  2. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    Win and that will change. And I have to challenge some of those numbers. 67,000 is larger than almost all the other stadiums, so how can we be 19th and 16th....maybe in % of capacity but in actual numbers the Dolphins used to be (until the last 3 years) in the top 10 in actual attendance.
     
    Tone_E likes this.
  3. FinNasty

    FinNasty Alabama don’t want this... Staff Member Club Member

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    So those pictures represent what I believe you are hoping a Before and After would look like. Am I correct?

    Just trying to understand what you would be hopeful for?
     
  4. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    DJ when anything comes from Mike Dee, I have to always take it with a grain of salt. He has no loyalty to South Fla. He is about getting Super Bowls and BCS championships and getting those into that stadium more than to please Dolphins fans. On any hierarchy in his mind we always come 2nd.

    This is why I believe he should be gone BEFORE Ireland. I've been calling for his head for almost 3 years. He is no DolFan, he is a Mr Ross is my boss fan.
     
  5. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    No, what he wants it to take the top pic and move the entire seating structure closer to the field. So in your drawing, take the whole structure as is, and bring it to the green line.
     
  6. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    Do you live here ? Do you know that it isn't or that maybe people are just sick and tired of paying money for a team that can't get its act together ?

    I hate this out of town know it all's that pontificate about what goes on here and they have never lived here or spent significant time here.

    In the 1970's 1980's and 1990's this town was football crazy for the Dolphins, and to say this was not true is to not have lived here.....to say otherwise is to only be looking at the last 8 or 9 years, and even at that its only the last 3 years the attendance has fallen off and that's because people are sick & tired of the losing.
     
    NolesNPhinsFan likes this.
  7. maynard

    maynard Who, whom?

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    and a picture of a guy with a defined stomach
     
    Fin D likes this.
  8. PhinGeneral

    PhinGeneral PC Texas A&M, Bro Club Member

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    Just out of curiosity, what do you think he should be doing to please Dolphin fans that would make it a priority over getting big events into the stadium? He is, after all, CEO of both the Dolphins and the Stadium.
     
  9. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    A comple redo of the lower bowl is simple. You make two reference points. The point of which you want to bring the field closer to (point A) and the second point is set in stone. It's the bottom (or below) of the concrete structure of the luxury boxes (point B). Draw a line from point A to point B and you now have a new slope. Take out all the seats. Then have rows of seating welded together in sections and place them section by section over the existing concrete.

    The way it looks like the pics have been drawn up though, is the easiest way. The stadiums current angle of slope is very slow (just like a soccer stadium) so adding 10-15 rows is entirely possible and will fit right with the current slope or they might have to dig out a few feet of the field to lower it.
     
  10. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    My thoughts exactly. Well said.
     
  11. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    Well no you are wrong. That was a CITY OF MIAMI vote, and had nothing to do with the voters of Miami-Dade County. Only the voters of the City of Miami, voted on the "Miami One" program for downtown & city renovation. That was Mayor Manny Diaz's program. He was the Mayor of MIAMI, not Miami-Dade.
     
  12. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    If they are changing the sight line, then it will be a redo of the lower bowl. I don't see it with the amount they're talking. The lines of sight are actually not bad as they are now.

    The stadium was originally built with soccer in mind. A nice slow rise so if they redo the lower bowl completely and want to keep soccer in mind then it will be an even slower rise which is not the best to keep noise going towards the field.
     
  13. PhinGeneral

    PhinGeneral PC Texas A&M, Bro Club Member

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    It wasn't a knock on Miami. Obviously there are passionate fans there. But Cleveland and Baltimore are on another level when it comes to being passionate about their football teams. I don't even think the point is particularly arguable, and I don't live in Cleveland or Baltimore, either.
     
  14. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Lol, I'm sorry bro if I'm not makin sense...in those pics, in the 2nd one, the difference I see is that you brought the whole lower bowl closer to the field by extending the club level out, and starting the slant down from there, while leaving the upper bowl as is?

    If that is the case, yes it would be an improvement but in terms of diameter and circumference, the building will have the same outer dimensions..and I'm not sure it would look right relative to the upper bowl or that it can be done for 400 mill along with the other things they want to do.

    I question the whole process because nothing is clear...by saying that we will be able to play the game during renovations says that maybe their not thinking what we think their thinking..

    So basically Nasty, if they plan on moving the bowl closer, it's an improvement over a tremendously flawed design.
     
  15. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    people had no problem going to the games when they were winning, and if you win, people will go. Some people just refuse to see this as a fundamental element.
     
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  16. CANEPHINS

    CANEPHINS No Tats & Dreads Allowed

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    I love it! It is pretty much a total rebuild of the interior and it needs to be done.

    You either A. Build a new stadium or B. Fix what you got.

    B. is the better choice here and the investment by Ross is MASSIVE. Not just financially but to the community and the team. I am starting to believe that he is in it to win it and the Dolphins are not the Marlins. Far from it.

    The renderings are for the most part what has been thrown out there for the past few years and it works. Now it is time to make it happen, build a winner (both on the field and surrounding it, and bring Super Bowl L to Miami.
     
  17. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    I think it's more than this. What Ross wants (and I think DJ - he and I have been on the same page here with the stadium for several years) is both seats that are closer but also a smaller upper deck, a bit steeper incline which creates a more enclosed "bowl." There are three problems right now with the stadium:

    1) seats start too far away from the field;

    2) too many seats are upper deck (which also dissipates sound);

    3) the angle of the seats are not as perpendicular to the field (it seems to me) as seats at many other stadiums - so those stadiums have a stronger sound and better vision because the seats are closer.

    Would be interesting to see the engineering needed to do this but Ross would have to really make a strong presentation that this would not just be a small fix (i.e. seats a bit closer to the field).

    On another topic, the average voter, imo, should be able to differentiate between the Dolphins and Marlins. It's pretty easy to sell the point that the Dolphins can't do a fire sale as there is a hard bottom on the Salary cap - unlike the Marlins. The NFL simply does not want and can't afford a Marlins type situation. MLB generates so much of its revenue from local situations (whereas the NFL does from a national perspective - which requires a strong competitive league).
     
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  18. Serpico Jones

    Serpico Jones Well-Known Member

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  19. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    I've been in the constuction industry most of my life. It really depends on the plans. The one thing they will, more than likely, have to keep the same are the luxury boxes so there are only a few ways this project can be done. All, except making new concrete stuctures of the steps can be done in one offseason....easily.
     
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  20. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    No one, but no one is arguing that winning isn't the main factor to improving attendance.

    What is happening though, is that people are arguing that is the ONLY way to increase attendance. Some people might just be more willing to pay to watch an average team if they don't have to roasted in the upper deck, for example.
     
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  21. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    I guess you haven't watched many Raiders games the last few years have you ? They have had an almost empty top deck for at least the last 4 or 5 years and most games have been blacked out. Chiefs this year had about 15-20,000 empty seats at games this year.

    Don't start that **** that its all on the DolFans. They have been very loyal for many years of losing and filled that stadium until the last 3. If you want to argue otherwise you are having selective memory issues on purpose it would seem.
     
    NolesNPhinsFan likes this.
  22. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    I'd also argue that attendance would increase with better seating and a louder stadium.

    Even if the Dolphins win, it's not that exciting to be at a game relative to other stadiums, imo. But, make a game where the Dolphins win a really awesome fan experience (not talking about gimmicks here - like stuff outside the stadium or half-time shows, etc.) where it is incredibly loud, intense, where the game can be viewed really well by fans, and there will be a bigger impetus to go back.

    And, the louder the stadium, the more intense it is, the better the team will perform. There will be a genuine home-field advantage (not just in terms of warm weather).
     
  23. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    Buffalo had thousands of empty seats this year even for the NE game. This crap about how all other fans are more loyal has to STOP. Fans aren't going right now because its the only way to protest the losing.......UGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH it drives me crazy when these lies start getting told many times and it becomes truth.
     
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  24. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    It can be done in different ways to make it happen in one year. A complete tear our and rebuild will be tough to do in one year with teams still using the stadium while it's being done. A lot of things can be built to architectural specs offsite and set with cranes during the offseason.
     
  25. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    Not that much.......the present Dolphins facility cost less than $ 10 million.
     
  26. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    I have thought the same thing. With that money and this, they could have spent $ 750-800 and built DJ's new place.
     
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  27. FinNasty

    FinNasty Alabama don’t want this... Staff Member Club Member

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    Well, you would literally have to tear it all down and build it back up from the ground... which isnt possible.

    So, staying within the idea of it being being remodeled instead of a new stadium being built... I was looking to see what he was hoping for.
     
  28. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box


    That is the only way it can be done if they plan to keep the luxury suites! And we know there is a ton of money for Ross in those suites...
     
  29. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    It was only built 3 years ago......not great but it could possibly do for 1 year.
     
  30. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Hey now...lol....I'm an *** man.
     
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  31. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    I understand what you were doing, I'm just trying to help you understand what DJ really wants using your drawings.
     
  32. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    all true canes, if the pics are not an optical illusion.
     
  33. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    I 1000 percent guarantee that their project will make it louder on the field.

    If I stand 30 feet from you and scream you will hear me but If I stand 12 feet from you, you will hear me a lot better right? Now imagine 2000 or so people doing it. Then imagine the canopy redirecting the noise leaving the stadium back onto the field.
     
  34. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    I don't know, that is a very, very sticky question that Shalala is probably asking as well.

    They may have to be compensated by the Dolphins, and then play all their games for one year on the road. Under no circumstances can I see them ever playing at FIU, given the animosity between the two Athletic Depts. They maybe could strike a deal with FAU and it would include some home games in the future for FAU I guess.

    But I would be beyond shocked if they ever played at FIU.
     
  35. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    ok, so you see in that video there they just have that extension come out from the last row, the rest is the same except knocking out some chunks of the upper deck.
     
  36. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    we weren't talking about where they play, but the training facilities. That would cost less than $ 20 million I am sure. The present facility was built for around $ 9 million back 1991 or 1992.
     
  37. PhinGeneral

    PhinGeneral PC Texas A&M, Bro Club Member

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    Much of that video (especially the part you're speaking of) was reused from the last renovation plan video they came up with a few years ago.
     
  38. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    Nobody goes to their games as it is, why expand it ?
     
  39. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    My research with the Seattle and raven fanbase agree that logistics are the main reason why their engaged so much in the game, from the beginning, they say its the main reason why they're in their seats, and our willing to stand..because when they do, they can see the impact on a game, and their p,ayers..recently The niner game was their 12 th man crowning achievement, they absolutely claim they helped win that game, on penalties alone, something like 8 false starts..
     
  40. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    No one could possibly know unless we see some drawings. The only way it works is to also bring the luxury suites closer because they will lose their line of site by 18 feet
     
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