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Dolphins agree to referendum for stadium tax dollars

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Joe Robbie, Feb 9, 2013.

  1. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    Awwww c'mon DJ, did the City of Miami suddenly become a no-where when we didn't get a SB from 1979-89 ? Miami actually had phenomenal growth in those years economically.

    Has SD suddenly not become an attractive place to visit because they refuse to upgrade Qualcomm Stadium ? Think of how long its been since they have had a SB, and think of how PERFECT SD is to host a SB. Maybe the only place in America that might be a better venue.
     
  2. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    The NFL is never going to do that, so that is why this is such a bad idea.

    Ross needs to just do it himself.
     
  3. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    Dude, it's not like Ross doesn't have the money to do it himself.......if he is that stupid, then he deserves an empty stadium.
     
  4. oakelmpine

    oakelmpine New Member

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    Well this is actually what I see happening. We renovate the stadium, and then he sells it for a profit, and the taxpayers get nothing from that sale.

    This could be a devious plot by Ross to increase the value to sell the team. Lets face it, so far he hasn't had a lot of fun owning the team, and maybe he is tiring of losing.
     
  5. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    Conversely, Miami isn't entitled or owed an NFL team.
     
  6. Joe Robbie

    Joe Robbie The Patriarch

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    Sure it is. They owe us for years of taking our money using false claims of presenting an actual NFL team.
     
  7. Shamboubou

    Shamboubou Well-Known Member

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    We are still paying for a freaking stadium here in Indianapolis that they freaking blew up!!! We are still paying for the RCA Dome with our tax money, on top of paying for ALL of Lucas Oil Stadium.
     
  8. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    Actually the NFL wants and needs football in Miami. It's not two different things either
     
  9. PSG

    PSG Clear Eyes. Full Hearts.

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    Nobody took your money. You and everyone else has willfully given your money to the Dolphins.
    Don't act like the victim.
     
  10. PSG

    PSG Clear Eyes. Full Hearts.

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    Wants? Abssolutley.
    Needs? Not a chance. The only market the NFL needs is NYC.
     
  11. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    That want does not outweigh their want for free money from the taxpayer.
     
  12. PhinishLine

    PhinishLine Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I'm not from Miami, so I don't know the dynamic, but I thought the money was coming from a hotel tax. I live in MD and we weren't hit really hard from the building of FedEx field down the street. Unless you live in a hotel, does it affect the average citizen in Miami?
     
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  13. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Because south Florida will reap the benefits of a world class facility..And your favorite football team will not have the biggest disadvantage in the league..
     
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  14. toto

    toto Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't understand the whole discussion here. No Miami resident or any other residents are paying a single cent for the renovations unless you stay in a hotel in Florida. So what's the big deal???

    If Ross get's the money and sells the team and/or stadium so what. He allready said if he get's the money he'll sign a contract that keeps the team in Miami for the next 15 years. So what's the fear here???

    I just don't get it.

    As a real fan I would be happy for this to come true. Even if it means paying something for it because we are coming to one or two games every year and that means staying in a hotel...
     
  15. PSG

    PSG Clear Eyes. Full Hearts.

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    Its paranoia.
    Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me. That's the current mentality.
     
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  16. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    No it's not.

    The hotel bad tax increase is expected to raise between $6-8 million per year for the next 20 years. Unfortunately the city needs the $200 million now, so where do you think it comes from?

    They sell municipal bonds and hope that the bed tax increase covers the interest and eventually the principal. If they're wrong or there is some event which severely limits travel then the regular taxpayer is screwed since the bonds need to be paid back no matter what.
     
  17. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    This is does not enter into their decision making process.
     
  18. Joe Robbie

    Joe Robbie The Patriarch

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    If the Dolphins get tax help, Broward should be included. Teams stay in the Ft. Lauderdale area, and the Super Bowl location is now referred to as "South Florida", not "Miami."
     
  19. Joe Robbie

    Joe Robbie The Patriarch

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    Doesn't make it any less true, tho.
     
  20. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    It's about what a premiere facility can bring in in terms of special events and the prestige that comes along with it..you create the right energy Inside the building, the lure becomes more attractive from a worldwide perspective.
     
  21. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Because the excuse makers will tell you that it might keep tourists from coming, thus having a negative affect......lol.
     
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  22. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    ..keep living in your fish bowl OZ..your teams, your fanbase, your city will continue not to take advantage of what a new facility could bring to the table, but at least you'll be happy because y'all think your loud in the endzone.
     
  23. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    The ultimate passive behavior, the complacency to support your local professional franchise is at an all time high, and yet folks continue to turn the other cheek....critical set of issues not being taken seriously, with incredibly poor judgement for the future of south Florida, the Miami dolphins, and the university of Miami.
     
  24. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box


    Then why would they want it in Miami? Because when football actually matters, Miami, for a mid market, has excellent ratings. That's big money. Period.
     
  25. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    There will be no guarantee that ALL the money will come from a bed tax. During down years for tourism it will be the City and it's taxpayers who pay the difference.
     
  26. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    Actually that is not entirely true. The Dolphins are also asking to receive a tax rebate from the state over several years. This tax rebate would come directing from the general revenue funds, therefore this would impact every tax payer in the state of Florida.

    As a Miami-Dade resident, the one problem I do have with raising the hotel tax in the county is that the hotels in Broward county and Palm Beach county are not being asked to raise their hotel taxes to help play for this renovation. The hotels in Broward and Palm Beach certainly benefit from events which take place in, "Joe Robbie Stadium". In fact I would guess that their are more season ticket holders who live in Broward and Palm Beach than live in Miami Dade county.

    If the hotel tax in all three counties were raised by one cent, this would probably be enough to pay for the entire amount of the money requested by the Dolphins and no general revenue funds would be needed from the state.
     
  27. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box


    Ding ding ding!! Now, I'm not opposed to the bed tax but this is exactly why it will be next to impossible for it to pass by a vote is the local residents. Brahman will be all over this once a date is set. Even though he has been reluctant to speak right now.
     
  28. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    Broward residents were very adament about a stadium being built near them back when this place was built. It is literally a few football fields away from the Dade/Broward line. But this is where they will balk on having to pay anything. It is not in Broward County.
     
  29. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    Wake up man! As many times as I've sat here and typed about this issue, you still don't understand.

    As for the endzones......lmfao is about all I can do
     
  30. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Funny..decades I've been talking about these issues, finally we get some execs in place who literally come out and tell the public there are issues inside the building, they flat out tell you that changes need to be made to the structure, literally telling you seats NEED to be moved closer, do you think they are talking about how their upper bowl is the biggest in the league for sh&$ and gifpggles..they talk about energy, atmoshere, competing with other stadiums in those depts, and yet the ignorance of this fanbase continues to ignore, or not even understand..
     
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  31. Joe Robbie

    Joe Robbie The Patriarch

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    Cool story. Now they need to pay for it.
     
  32. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    I don't think that the fan base is ignoring the need for a stadium which produces more energy and a better atmosphere. I just think many people are questioning why a muti-billionaire needs any tax money to pay for his PRIVATE stadium.

    Joe Robbie built the stadium many years ago with his own money. At the time, he was one of the least wealthy owners in the NFL. Ross on the other hand is one of the richest owners in the entire league. While I would vote in favor of the stadium renovations. I can certainly understand why the vast majority of the citizens in the county, (who never attend games or are even Dolphin fans), would be opposed to any tax dollars being given to a private stadium, owned by a muti-billionaire.

    The fact is that the Dolphin fan base in South Florida may agree with you, but much of that fan base lives outside Miami-Dade county and they will have no vote on this referendum. I would also argue that the vast majority of the voters in Miami Dade county could care less about the Dolphins. All you have to do is see how attendance and TV ratings have declined for Dolphin games in recent years to conclude that the fan base for the Dolphins, isn't what it once was in this area.
     
  33. PSG

    PSG Clear Eyes. Full Hearts.

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    They want it in Miami because of the tradition.
    But if you think the NFL needs a franchise in Miami you are fooling yourself.
     
  34. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    But the NFL's business model inherently entails teams to be bad. The business model for the league can't be making every market have a good team. They have to rely on things other than having a winning team.
     
  35. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    The NFL may not care if the team in South Florida is bad or not, but the fans certainly care. That is why attendance and TV ratings have declined as the Dolphins have become a consistent losing team in the NFL. In South Florida, winning is all that matters. New or renovated stadiums don't mean a thing if the team on the field is no good.

    The Dolphins used to draw 70,000 fans or more in a dilapidated Orange Bowl and when they first relocated to, "Joe Robbie Stadium". Of course they were consistent winners and a playoff team almost every year back then. When the Dolphins become a consistent winners again, fans will return to the stadium. Until then, attendance will continue to decline, no matter how much money is spent on stadium renovations.
     
  36. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    This isn't the point. The point isn't what makes fans attend games. The point is whether the Dolphins would be better off under the environment you describe, or potentially elsewhere. The NFL routinely gets subsidies from cities. If they aren't getting subsidies from Miami, then that is going to affect their choice to have a team in Miami.
     
  37. marshallfin1

    marshallfin1 New Member

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    never understood things like this, instead of asking the billionare to pay for his own revonovations for his business, we instead ask poor people to pay for the billionaires renovations. As they say, the rich get richer and the poor get poorer and things like this shows you why. The rich are always finding loopholes to screw over the poor people and there it is.
     
  38. 1. Leaving this decision up to the voters in Miami via referendum is a poor way to do this. This should be voted on by elected Representatives who have the time and the authority to fully investigate if this is a good investment for the state or not. (notice I said state not county) Doing it this way absolves the politicians of responsibility if it becomes an unpopular choice but it is not the most effective way of getting to the best possible answer.

    2. If they are going to take the cowards way out and make this a referendum vote. It should be state-wide. The results of how people in Miami vote will have an impact on people who live in Pensacola. Everybody this effects should be given the opportunity to weigh in on it. Otherwise limit the funding to the county and leave the state out of it.

    3. If this does happen it amounts to corporate welfare. Ross and the NFL don't need it. We are talking about an exclusive entertainment product. They do not have any competition. If they want to improve their stadium then they should pay for it themselves.

    4. If the argument is that making these improvements boosts the surrounding economy, then they should ask for private donations from those bossinesses that will supposedly benefit from the renovations. I have yet seen any projections put forth with specific numbers attached to them. In fact I have not seen them offer anything specific about any of it. They cant tell us if it will bring any SBs to miami. They cant tell us how much revenue it will generate for the area. They cant even tell us specificaly how much it will cost beyond a broad estimation.

    My vote is NO and it has nothing to do with the Marlins. I vote no because its a bad idea to move forward on something this big when you have not been giving enough information to make an informed decision.

    DJ you can rest easy because I live in Manatee county so my NO vote wont matter :tantrum:
     
  39. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box


    The only people that are fooling themselves are those conspiracy theorists thinking Miami is moving.
     
  40. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box


    This was one of the Dolphins worst seasons ever as far as attendance and yet they still made a marginal profit. That means they still paid their part of revenue sharing. That's what the NFL wants along with TV ratings. Miami will alway be wanted by the NFL.
     

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