Free Agency Thread? Free Agency Thread.

See your just digging deep for things to complain about there..... Surely you cant be advocating we overpay to keep these guys just for that reason ?!?! Lets not form a mob and embarrass ourselves again.

Dolphin fans are most notorious for being embarrassing to the franchise and other fans...... lets try to work together and change that.

Edit: Atleast we won't have to chant for other teams backup QBs anymore!!!!........ or riot when we don't sign one.

 

I dont think wood head can do what Edleman can do.

 

if indeed that scenario plays out where Clemons is the only one retained from two recent drafts, I don't even wanna think about how incredibly poor of a job that is.

 

Because both the offensive and defensive plans changed.

 

So if these players were willing to take a paycut and be reasonable, that'd speak more for Jeff Ireland's ability to gauge talent? Because I'm seeing a 1st round OT who is going to get $10,000,000+ per year. I'm seeing a 2nd round CB who won't be on this team if he is able to get 8,000,000 per year. I see a 4th round WR who is looking to make 6,000,000 because he just had a 1000 yard season.

I'm seeing guys that are performing very well, or at least "above average", and are looking to get paid for it. Is that not good for us? I'd say no. But does it mean Ireland is a waste? Hardly. He's finding these players.

First people are saying "What a waste, we won't have them on the team anymore" because we let them go to FA, but those same people are saying Vontae Davis being traded for a 2nd round pick is a clear cut example of Ireland drafting for **** value. I disagree with that sentiment, and it seems like it's a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" scenario.

I'm disappointed if we don't bring back Starks

 

I think you make a good point in that he found good players but I think it also reflects negatively on his ability to put a team together. Part of being a general manager is keeping these players and here we are with multiple "talented" players hitting free agency because they were never extended.

This kind of ties into that whole paradoxical narrative that Ireland can find good players yet put together a team that isn't good.

 

They didn't need to. He got a quarter of his yards in one game. In other words he got 55 yards a game which no team is going to fret over giving a teams top WR.

There is a Brian Hartline 1k YouTube thread and you'd be hard pressed to find a single double on Hartline at all.

 

Overrated is a rather subjective term, though. Are they overrated? We simply do not know if they are going to be retained or not. It's easy to sit back and say that Cameron Wake is a winner, when in reality he has "won" just as much as our other players! Do I think the Dolphins are a winning team the past 4-5 years? GOD no. Do I think guys like Jake Long, Brian Hartline,and Randy Starks are the reason for that? No, I'd say they were the barrels trying to keep this ship a float, but when you've only got 4 barrels and a mountain of **** (which Ireland has been doing a good job of jettisoning for potential, whether it's potential from FA in the form of salary cap dollars, or potential in the form of extra draft picks) I think that doesn't say you should get rid of the barrels, it just means you need to continue to add to that winning formula.

If some other team opts to pay those large sum contracts to these guys, while Miami feels they aren't worth it, I think that says more about Miami than it does those other players. Vincent Jackson isn't any less of a WR because he went to Tampa Bay as a result of getting a huge contract.

I give Pittsburgh credit for finding Mike Wallace in the 3rd even though their GM would be considered "missing" on that pick, if you use the same logic some people are attacking Jeff Ireland for.

 

Not so, players are a bit like rental vehicles, they are driven for awhile but eventually EVERY ONE of them is returned to the rental lot so to speak.

As Hartline correctly said his "hometown discount" was playing for a league minimum deal for 4 yrs and playing starting snaps for a reduced price.

Suspect Ireland is really disliked by the players the way Mike Brown is disliked by Cinci players

This does not mean they cannot be cogs on winning teams, it does mean or ginger genius just won't pay them, will start over at -0-, and will attempt to hype yet another draft class that is in fact a rebuild with the usual Ireland

"Trust me"

Added in, I do believe I see where this is heading Ck, it will be a rebuilding year, I suspect we sign some guys who are "underappreciated' on their teams say like Richard Marshall, meanwhile we..suck again.

Another thing that riles me about this is we ALWAYS carry on hand cash forward, to the tune of 5 million per yr for the last couple of years, it just is not spent.

Suspect this is one of the ways they offset the crappy ticket sales, but they never release contract details..so once again they hide behind bull****

 

That's really not sound logic. They could have completely eliminated the teams main receiving threat with no real trade-off, and they chose not to...why? Out of charity?

That's not really true. It's the same thing as a huge percentage of the guys in the league...They're only getting doubled when they're man covered and run into a deep zone.

 

I didn't read through the whole thread, but just to throw in my two cents...

I think the Dolphins would be crazy to let Fasano walk. He has been the epitomy of hard worker, and brings everything you want to the table other than speed. Bring in a Keller to compliment him ala David Martin. Clay is a luxury at this point. If he can develop some consistency that would be great!

Clemons had a very solid, though unspectacular season. He really got better at tackling, and fundamentals. Another year in this D may really pay off for him. Especially with Jones next to him... That being said, do we make a run at Ed Reed?

Jennings seems a given at this point. I hope we resign Hartline, and draft one or two wr's. Maybe one to groom, and one who can contribute immediately.

Just as everyone else says, I believe we resign Reggie at the right price, and give more carries to Lamar. I also hope Lane takes a step up and plays like he did early...

I say move Odrick inside and start Vernon. Get Randy back at the right price though.

 

I don't think you can write off the change in his receiving production. Guys yards per catch almost fell in half. They want a tight end who plays like a wide receiver in the pass game, Anthony Fasano is very much an old-school guy who makes his production off of leveraging his blocking for down the field play. Play-action or pass protection releases where he can draw a defender in and take them up the field.

I've been Fasano's biggest fan, but he isn't what they want.

 

I also still wouldnt let him walk, as much as id rather see them try to find a compliment for what they do have a need for

 

If you're right, and they refuse to spend money and we suck again, then they can take their stadium referendum and shove it.

This off season is such a no-brainer that Ireland is either the world's biggest clown if he screws it up or he is under financial restraints that we aren't aware of. Need a receiver? There's 3 top shelf guys available. Need a TE? There are at least two really good one with Finley gettting the axe a distinct possibility.

 

I agree with the bolded, and I see them starting OV as a real possibility after ireland expressing his love for him. Like it or not

edit:edits

 

Charity would actually be putting effort into it. Hartline simply doesn't play well enough to demand attention beyond a single CB. The guy is an average at best #2 that got force fed cause there wasn't anyone else. He will NEVER EVER see 1000 yards again. Every single play in highlight threads showed him single matched. If there is anything remotely close to double coverage it's the safety coming over long after the completion.

 

If he's here next year and healthy he's probably going to have the same general production as this year. This offense isn't going to have a workhorse receiver, and despite popular opinion Hartline wasn't treated like one last year.

 

That depends on who else we get at WR. If we resign him, sign Jennings, and Bess is #3 and all 3 remain equally healthy, Hartline's catches are very likely going to drop. Last year, he had 74 catches, Bess had 61 while missing 3 games, and all the rest of the WRs playing mostly as the 3rd WR except when Bess was out, combined for 31.

If you look at targets, the rest of the WRs had 65, while Hartline had 118 and Bess had 96.

What sort of pct of catches or targets would indicate a workhorse WR in your opinion?

 

Isn't that pretty much the same number of catches between the #1 WR and the #2? Doesn't seem like Hartline and Bess were all that far off in terms of usage.

 

It's pretty hard to win in the NFL with just two WRs. If we add another WR like Jennings, that is going to take a lot of the targets from Hartline and Bess, so Hartline's production won't be as good as it was in 2012. IMO.

 

I'm not sure. We'll probably see a lot more 3WR formations. I don't think you'd see a disproportionate number of targets between the #1 and #2 though.

 

They changed to the point where we don't want to retain our draft successes?

 

If Jennings and Hartline are 1 and 2, and Bess is 3, not even considering a high draftee, just those 3, Bess is going to get a much higher pct of the total WR targets than the group of #3 WRs we had last season. So, to just say Hartline's production if he's resigned, because we have no workhorse WR, would remain the same, is not correct IMO.

 

You can gather every NFL WR and put them in a bullpen...throw a rock and hit one that could easily replace Hartline.

I hope they will be judicious with their money when it comes to Hartline and concentrate on Long and Smith.

 

Love what I see from Myers. Thoughts:

1) does the Iowa connection raise the odds of us targeting him
2) wouldn't he be more like Charles Clays role? Is it possible we still hope to see Clay step up, so avoid Myers? (mistake IMO)
3) I like signing players from crappy teams because they are liable to look even better with a better team

Great suggestion Shou

 

C'mon man.

You know good and well, many players aren't system interchangeable. There are guys suited to be Parcells type lineman and there are guys suited to be WC lineman, for example. Its like that in every sport. Sure there are plenty of transcendental players, but hey aren't the norm especially when you're working from a Parcells blueprint, which is very specific about things.

 

I like everything I hear, but he sounds as injury prone as Thomas.

Injury at TAMU. Hammy at combine. Injury at Carolina. Injury in Oakland.

Has he had a fully healthy year before?

 

Higher %, yes. But that may not necessarily change the number of targets the 1 and 2 get. You're very likely going to see an overall increase in passes thrown to WRs.

 

It seems that the Phins are in Phase 1 of free agency, where they are trying to lock up young players by offering upfront money for years. As long as these players stay productive and healthy, these deals do not create salary cap problems. I suspect that Clemens is packaged with Jones in order to provide upward trending middle of the secondary. Hartline will remain an enigma to the fans, but I believe his football smarts will enable him to remain productive as the team adds more skillful WRs.

Smith seems to have priced himself out of phase 1.

Long, Starks, and Fasano will be addressed during phase 2 as the team needs to be more careful with the remaining salary cap monies as these players are more likely to be less productive due to injury or post-prime athletic ability. It would be interesting if Philbin is involved as I suspect that these players may face position change and/or fewer snaps, while the players may need peace of mind that they will continue to play and earn a substantial salary. Long could be the key case if the coach can keep his veterans. Philbin may be very good at convincing Long that move to RT may hastened his return to an elite level by minimizing the number of time he plays poor technique due to speed rushers. Likewise, the move could be good for the team as it allows for LT competition between Martin and Yeatman.

As for the free agency, I believe Jennings is the target. I was leary of him until I mesmarized by his long arms while watching his highlights and recalled how the Packers have continually replaced their West Coast offense WR (i.e., Jennings>Driver>Freeman>Brooks). I estimate that a Jennings signing will benefit Matthews and Thigpen, the 2 current WRs that can catch the ball above the head while running downfield plus have been tested during the return game to handle the ball in tight conditions.

 

I like how your thinking for the most part, don't agree with Long to right tackle though, would keep him at left, and move Martin to guard.

 

Goodson was 2nd in the NFL in success-rate. He's a decent back. I'm not sure whether teams will be onto him or not, but he'd be a solid signing up to about $4-5M.