Hartline is not a beast, and we need 3 beast. Let me give you an example: We need Dez, Demaryius and Megatron. Hartline does not meet expectations, and neither does the FO. Does that sink into your head?
So what team has three receivers of that caliber together? Try NONE! Miami needs receivers that run good, precise routes, have good hands, and can run after the catch.
No. I think you'll find, I've been almost as big a defender of the WR system Philbin is gunning for as you have. I just don't think Hartline is all that good of a WR. And if there's a game where he has to be the #1 THAT DAY because of matchups, the best we can hope for is his Arizona game performance (which we still lost). The point of Philbin's approach with WRs is that any of his guys could be the #1 WR that day. If it has to be Hartline that day, chances are we'll put up few points that game.
Hartline is decent. Just wish he could get into the endzone more. Everything else he does is definitely above average. The thing is, having him on the field means not having someone else on the field. When you can pencil in one TD for the year's production at one receiver spot, your offense is going to have a bit of a ceiling. Adding more talent opposite him may raise us over 20 points per game, but it sure wont put us in "high scoring offense" territory unless we get at least 4+ TDs from that second WR spot. At least.
Seriously? Hartline was the "No. 1" receiver all season and we won almost half our games with a rookie QB. His Arizona game was a great game by any standard and the fact that we lost that game had nothing to do with Hartline.
Except, yeah the one TD. I mean if you want to felate a guy for getting a bunch of yards in one game that we lost when the knock on that guy is he doesn't score, go for it. I keep hearing that yards are more important than scoring for WRs yet, we've been on the wrong side of .500 for 3 years with #1 Wrs that got a lot of yards and didn't score very much. And a lot of the losses were by 6 points or less. Our #1 WRs the past 3 years have combined for 9 TDs. 9 TDs. 3 years. But hey at least the each got over a 1000 yards each of those seasons.
As Tannehill improves, so will Hartline's touchdown production. He will never be a guy that gets you 10+ touchdowns from the receiver position, but there is no reason he can't get 5-6 touchdowns a season in a good system with a strong quarterback. See Wes Welker and his 1 TD in 3 years with Miami and an average of 6 TDs per season in New England with Tom Brady.
You seem to think that TD scoring is something inherent in certain receivers and Hartline can't score them. That's not true. WR TDs can fluctuate wildly from year to year. Calvin Johnson had 16 in 2011 and just 5 in 2012, despite having what was otherwise maybe the best season for a WR in NFL history. Brandon Marshall had double digit TDs his last year in Denver and then came to Miami and scored 3. Wes Welker scored 1 TD in his first 3 years and then went to NE and scored 8 his first year and had 9 a few years ago. Andre Johnson has every attribute one could ever want in a WR in terms of what is supposed to enable one to score TDs, but scored just 4 last year despite 112 receptions for almost 1600 yards. Same for Larry Fitzgerald, who also had only 4.
Wes Welker was a #3 WR here. He went to the Pats and has been the #1 or #2 since he's been there. Hartline has been a #1, #2 & #3 WR here, with 3 different offenses and 4 different QBs. Yet he keeps averaging under 3 tds a year.
Fluctuate? Have Hartline's TD numbers fluctuated? No, they haven't, regardless of position, offense or QB.
So we have to wait to see who or if Ireland adds some real speed to the WR corps to justify the salary Hartline received.
Great example. Teams that havent won ****, and some that have the same or worse record than us. Guess it takes a great WR to win the SB. Right Arizona?
He's been on the same team the whole time and played the same position the whole time. He had 1 season with a new head coach. During his career here has any WR caught a lot of TDs? As a rookie Hartline led the Dolphin WRs with 3 TDs. In 2010, Brandon Marshall had 3. In 2011, Marshall had 6. This team has had trouble getting into the red zone over the last 4 years and when they have they have been more prone to running or throwing to TEs or RBs.
Quite frankly, I'm very happy to have Hartline back, and I don't think they overpaid at all, given that this is what happens in FA. He's going to make less than half of what Wallace will eventually sign for, with either us, or someone else. And I don't think he's half the player (definitely more), so what's that tell you! It's good value! So, he doesn't score a lot of TDs, we get that, but he is good outside of the red zone, helping us get close so others can do the job. Now, we need some additional more qualified others to do that job, and presumably they are coming. AND, it may even open up some lanes for Hartline to score a few more too next season. Hartline catches nearly everything thrown his way, and he is a magician near the sidelines w/ keeping his feet in bounds. He's only going to get better too, and he's on the top of mind of our young QB. This was a no-brainer folks! White or black, a no brainer!
Plus people are just looking at the total money. The important part is the guaranteed money. If Miami brings in a better receiver than Hartline, it isn't going to be cost prohibitive to get rid of him or to that hard to ask him to reduce his salary. I keep on reading from people that there are wide receivers in the draft that can be an upgrade to Hartline. Well this contract makes it so, if it is true, then Hartline is easily replaced, and if it isn't then at least we still have Hartline.
Who argued that? Wait, so playing the #1, #2 or #3 Wr position counts as the same position? Who is arguing that? He's had three different OC's. Brandon Marshall also dropped 5 TDs his last year here. I'll ask you again, what in Hartline's arsenal or history shows he's capable of scoring more than 3 tds in a year, when he hasn't done it regardless of the offense, position, coach, OC, QB, competition, or surrounding talent? There are virtually no significant variables left.
He catches about 50% of what is thrown his way. Thats about average for receiverswith asmany targets as he got. Its nothing to complain about but saying he catches everything is false. Also nobody criticizes him for his ability to catch balls its what he does afterward that concerns most people. I however do agree with you that this was a good move by Ireland if we are paying him 6mil n change for 5 years. If it a heavily front loaded contract it still may be a good deal but a much riskier one.
IMO this contract makes it easy to trade Bess if we hit it big on WRs this year. Say we sign a wr in FA and draft a wr that are both better then Bess (hopefully better then Hartline as well) then the Dolphins have thier 1,2, and 3 guys and Bess is the odd man out. Bess is not a bad player and he is also a good return guy. They could trade him for a decent player on another team and fill another postion of need for us. I think this was a smart move. It was safe in that they did not put massive money into him and its safe to assume he will be a contributor next year. Having a full season under his belt in this new system, a full offseason to build chemistry with RT, and hopefully stays healthy through TC. He could be a very nice surprise player next season. If he does blow up we have him signed to a very freindly contract for 5 yrs. If it does not happen it wont kill us to dump him and move on. 12mil cap hit isnt that hard to swallow and you have to think he will be here at least 2 or 3 years unless he gets hurt. By that time the cap hit is only going to be about 5 mil. They did not get him for a steal but overall it was a pretty sound deal IMO. Good for both sides.
Not. Sure. If. Serious. Hartline couldn't take the top off of a $5 stripper last year. With his new contract though...
You forgot that he also has a shorter neck. I swear Collinsworth must come from a family of giraffes.
It is not his speed that keeps him out of the endzone. He needs to get better at catching in traffic.
