The details matter. The details are the reason most free agent wide receivers don't pan out. The details are what makes them a fit or not. The only player I have ever seen that was so supremely talented that the details didn't matter was Randy Moss. Mike Williams is not Randy Moss.
KB, I'd agreed with your previous analysis that Wallace wasn't the target and Jennings was a better fit. Now, that the Dolphins have signed Wallace, I have to believe that he fits their philosophy since Ireland and Philbin share a skill for planning and preparation. IMO, the signing was based on their inability to find and develop outside receivers. On the other hand, the the team seems to collect inside WR without spending much money or picks. Additionally, when Tannehill is trying to be risk-adverse, he seems to prefer outside throws. By adding an outside threat, I believe the goal is to improve his success as well as open the middle of the field to a developing player, such as Matthews, Fuller, Binns, etc). Therefore, if Wallace continues to perform as he did in Pittsburgh, will the Dolphins be a better team if they develop Antonio Brown type WRs?
Um.....Hartline was the main guy last year. Now he won't be. How am I saying anything different than you?
Hartline was targeted on average 8 times a game. Bess was targeted on average 8 times a game. So who was the main guy?
Results matter more than details. Details matter only when there are no results. Mike Wallace is overpaid, but at least he provides results that this offense needs. Napoleon preferred lucky generals to good generals, if that analogy makes any sense here.
We're just going to have to agree to disagree here, KB. All I ask is maybe tone down the rhetoric in every single thread.
Why? If we hadn't signed him, I'd never heard the end of how this will doom the Dolphins. I can't talk about Mike Wallace and not bring up his poor route running and his lack of a complete skill set at the position. That's the bottom line.
Please for the love of god KB let it rest. I have a headache hearing (reading) this broken record over and over and over. You're talking in circles.
Do I really need to tell you why, KB? Read every thread where you shoehorn it in. Nobody wants to read the obsession anymore. And the whole logic of "Well if we DIDNT sign him people would be *****ing up a huge storm!" is pretty piss poor and not a real excuse. edit: Forget it, I tried. Shame, I enjoy your posts! (The 5% that aren't about Mike Wallace) but it just gets so nauseating seeing the same *****y tone again and again, like an ex gf who holds a grudge.
Considering no one is saying anything remotely close to "Wow I'm so happy we signed Wallace because his routes are so crisp! Good contract for an all-pro route runner!" There is no reason YOU should be getting a head ache here. The only reason its being stated as a good signing is because he filled the massive hole the offense had. Speed and deep threat (partnered with age). On top of the fact that this team was in desperate need of landing a FA they wanted. You know what this team currently had before the signing? pretty decent route runners, with mostly dependable hands. Now we have an equillibrium that benefits each side of the spectrum. You yourself agree he is fast, there is no denying it. So leave it at that. They aren't giving him 60 million for the crispness of his routes, so you should quit damning him, and the office for the signing him just based off of that, don't you think? He's a phin now mang
Again: why does the way something should be matter to you more than the results of the way a thing is?
So you admit that we just made a vertical stretch receiver the third highest paid receiver in football and put him on the same pedestal as Calvin Johnson, Larry Fitzgerald, and Andre Johnson?
And yet, here's Mike Wallace. So either Philbin and Ireland know more about the offense than you do, or they think they can teach Mike Wallace how to run in a certain direction. I hate to be put in the position of defending Jeff Ireland, but in this instance the franchise knows more than we do.
No. The franchise is trying to secure a stadium deal, and they went after the flashiest player on the market regardless of scheme fit.
Hey Guys. Being a Steeler fan, I was curious as to what Phins fans thoughts were on the signing of Mike Wallace so I jumped over to your board to find out. Before I comment, please know I wish the best for Wallace and hope he can help your team close the gap on the Pats. Lord knows I hate them with a passion. Having said that, I have to say I think KB21 is spot on with everything he has to say in this thread. I know that's not something you want to hear or agree with but I'm just giving you my honest opinion. Before I continue, I was shocked when KB stated he would rather save the money on signing Wallace and instead draft Wheaton in round 3. Not only did I agree but the Steelers then followed up and did just that during last weekends draft. As for Wallace, KB is correct. Wallace is a poor route runner and has a difficult time getting open on the short to intermediate routes. Any success in that area could be attributed to Roethlisberger extending plays thus allowing Wallace more time to get open. Sorry...that's just what I saw during his time in Pittsburgh. Also, against big strong DB's, Wallace had trouble getting off the line of scrimmage. Simply put, he needs time to get open. As a Steeler fan, it was quite frustrating and left me wondering "what could have been" had Wallace become a more complete receiver. Also, Wallace had a tendency to drop some passes in big time situations. I didn't expect that considering he was in his contract year and wanted to prove he was worth what he would be asking. No doubt, Wallace can take the top off of defenses but last year it seemed teams had him figured out. He wasn't nearly as effective as in previous years and I attribute much of that to not having much of a game outside of going deep. I'll be honest, I had absolutely no problem when the Steelers letting him walk. I wish him the best but the money he was demanding was more than he is worth.
Even if all that is true, his 836 yrds and 8 TDs would have put us in the playoffs. Consider both of our starting WRs combined for 2 tds. Combined. 2. TDs.
Wallace dropped roughly 5% of the passes that were catchable. All due respect, but you're just a fan. I give this just as much weight as a regular fan from our board who wanders over to the Chiefs board and gives his review of Fasano or Sean Smith. There are lots of fans of the Dolphins that have terrible opinions of the Dolphins. You being a Steelers fan does not give you any type of insight into the guy. I notice this over and over with free agents. "Hi guys, I'm a fan of *Player X's former team*" like it's anything but an indication that you now have to shake the buff of bias.
I was listening intently thru the first few paragraphs until the last one...Your guys problems last season was not that Wallace couldn't get open or that Ben wasn't making those amazing plays after the initial called play broke down, it was that Ben didn't have the time, even with his uncanny ability to move around. Your OL was terrible this past season...that explains more about what Ben and Wallace could or could not do than the fact that defenses 'figured out' Wallace. I don't know that Wallace is a complete receiver either. I do know that his route tree has improved from watching him and the Steelers for a few years... I also know that defenses can scheme only so much against speed then speed will win out... At any rate, I wish the best for you guys, unless we are playing you...
Also they had zero running game. The steelers offense was a mess all around, and the prime suspect was not only Mike Wallace...he was a victim of the drop off around him. also considering Tannehill can and will extend plays with his feet also, I see Wallace succeeding here. FinD hit the nail on the head. His "drop off" numbers put us in the playoffs. Ill take it. **** being 7-9
So you found our site, dug up a thread from a month and a half ago, only to come here to tell us Wallace isn't very good? Thanks for dropping by...
Why the hate on a guy giving his red cent? Thank you, John, for having an opinion and choosing thephins forum to share it with. I appreciate the perspective of a steelers fan. Now, a thread on what we couldn't possibly know... Well, this is a forum. What de heck you gonna do? Do I give a good gosh darn if Wallace can run crisp routes? About as much as I cared that Zach Thomas was a shrimp and no one knew who th hell Orande Gadsen was. We'll ge our answer on game days. And if he's scoring touchdowns, routes be damned.
All receivers need to get better and faster at getting into their route..if their not and it is a weakness, Tannehill will not be as good Ben, because Ben is one of the best and delaying the play and improvising.
My apologies if I offended you or anyone else. Just thought some of you may want an opinion from someone who watched Wallace play exclusively for the past 3 years. I know anytime my Steelers pick up a free agent or draft players out of college, I go to those boards representing the team that player played for and dig up threads where their fans are talking about him.. Not saying they they know anymore than me but I still like to get opinions from fans who had the opportunity to watch them play more than I did. Not sure if that makes sense to you or not. Like I said earlier, I wish nothing but the best for Wallace and certainly hope your team can close the gap on those Patriots.
I posted in this thread months ago and was immediately run off because of some criticisms I may have had against Mike Wallace. Anyway, was just curious if you fans are happy and content with his production this year after making him one of the highest paid receivers in the game. In case you are wondering, my opinion of him hasn't changed one bit..
It was your honest opinion and you were still attacked. But don't worry b/c it was shared with some of us Dolfans. Some of us knew Wallace was, is and will always be a body catcher. I'll go further. Wallace is a perfect pass location WR.
My response now is exactly the same that it was in march....When wallace was in Pittsburgh both a Bruce Arians and Ben Roethlisberger defended Wallace on his route running. His draft year the criticism of his route running was valid. Maybe in to year two it was valid. He's become a pretty good route runner. The bigger criticism I have of Wallace is that he does not consistently fight for the ball and that he gets through his routes too quick sometimes which messes up the timing of the play. Imo, play calling, play design, and lack of oline/running game have had a more negative effect on wallace and Tannehill numbers, not wallaces route running.
Because those deep balls he caught on Sunday were perfect passes right? It's an odd time to come and slam Wallace. Without him the Dolphins probably get shut out against Carolina and get blown out. He was their only source of offense for almost the entire game. Mike Wallace is what he is. He is not a Calvin Johnson, or Andre Johnson type WR. He is still a very good WR when he is used correctly, and despite his lack of production, he has made this offense better by opening up the field for other receivers. There's a reason why Charles Clay is having a career year. There's a reason why Gibson was playing at the highest level of his career despite the fact that he was playing a position (slot) that he, himself said he was not as comfortable with. There's a reason why our 2nd year 7th round pick is having so much success at WR this year in the slot.
LOL Richard Mathews, tips a ball up for an INT, and drops two passes one in the end zone. You have a low opinion of what success is.
We're stuck with that contract for at least one more season unfortunately.. might as well hope for the best but the guy is about as good as Chris Chambers was for us and that's not the kind of receiver you pay 60 million to. Desean Jackson is putting on pace for 1400 and his contract is 10 million less. Pretty sure if you replace Mike with Desean on the team we would have 2 more wins.
What did DeSean Jackson do last year? The year before? 700 and 900 yards. Jackson is a very good receiver so Im not knocking him but a poor offensive system is going to be a poor offensive system and an offense that is flawed (ours is OL and the fact we have no height/real jumping ability at that position) is going to produce flawed results (which is what Jackson gave those last 2 years). When Wallace had Bruce Arians he was a lot more productive then when he had Todd Haley. When Wallace had Arians he was a lot more productive then what hes given us under Sherman. There is a reason for that...play design and the ability to utilize a players strengths...something Chip Kelly is doing for DeSean Jackson.
I'm not giving up on the cat, his contract was too much, maybe he will restructure at some point.but I think we will see improved play in the last part of the season and next year.
