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Poll: Tavon Austin vs Cordarrelle Patterson

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by LBsFinest, Mar 14, 2013.

Tavon Austin vs Cordarrelle Patterson @ 12

  1. Tavon Austin

    56.1%
  2. Cordarrelle Patterson

    43.9%
  1. Lee2000

    Lee2000 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    He did have that strong run, and maybe he burns us more if Bray is more accurate. But execution didn't occur as it could have and he had a decent game. From a threat standpoint he had a very good game you could say. There is no doubt he kept us on our heels. He is a top 15 player.
     
  2. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    :lol:
     
  3. Lee2000

    Lee2000 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Word I am hearing on other sites is that Miami envisions a 4 wr lineup of Bess, Wallace, Hartline, and Gibson. I know how assessed Gibson has been on this site, so in a way, as I have said before, I hope he actually signs and blows up in Miami. I will say this. Any front office assesses all available free agent talent and he was the second wr they chose to look at for a visit. I don't disrespect the views of our personnel guys on this site, but I do pull for a guy sometimes that doesn't meet all the criteria. There is little doubt that if Miami signs him he will become one of the most questioned moves of the off season. I pull for underdogs, and this guy already has that status for me before he is even signed.
     
  4. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Heres how I look at things.....

    Our offense has been a snoozer for so long.....I dont care about safe. Stack the deck with playmakers. Ive waited this long for the team to be a contender, if they all bust, oh well. Time to light this sh*t up.
     
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  5. KB21

    KB21 Almost Never Wrong Club Member

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    Oh, as Boomer stated yesterday, Miami had 3 scouts at the West Virginia Pro Day. Tavon Austin apparently impressed everyone in the drills.
     
  6. Lee2000

    Lee2000 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Would you want Eifert and Bailey/Swopes, or Austin and Kelce/other tight end?
     
  7. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    Austin is the better WR though. He catches better. He is far more explosive in his route running. Patterson is dynamic (less than Austin) with the ball in his hands, but not in trying to get open. There are also intelligence and "football smarts" questions that arose at the combine after he was "unimpressive" in the interviews. And it's not like he hasn't shown some of those brain farts on the field. IMO the NFL game is increasingly complex. Taking players with intelligence questions is therefore an increasingly high risk. There are great athletes that come out every year particularly at the WR position. IMO the reason that the WR position has such a high bust rate is because too many get blinded by how big and fast someone is. I think it is far more important to look at how good of a WR they are and at their ability to pick up the offense. You have to see that they've actually worked on their craft. If they didn't do that extra work on their route running that you can see on the field, then the odds aren't in favor of them doing the extra work at the next level. I see Patterson as a very high risk pick.
     
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  8. TooGoodForDez

    TooGoodForDez Deion Sanders for GM

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    No man. We need exceptional playmakers. No, you dont go for 6 average. you go for 1 exceptional.
     
  9. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    I want Austin at 1 and Bailey at 2, I seriously don't care how crazy that makes me look either. I'll be a genius when we have the greatest offense the NFL has ever seen in year or two.
     
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  10. KB21

    KB21 Almost Never Wrong Club Member

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    That's tough. I get the feeling many on here don't realize just how good Ryan Swope is. As much as I like Swope, I think I would lean towards Austin and Kelce/Escobar because I really think you could really screw with some defensive coordinators' minds with Wallace and Austin on the same side of the field.
     
  11. Fineas

    Fineas Club Member Luxury Box

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    For me, it's Austin by a very wide margin. I simply love what he brings as a slot receiver, perimeter receiver and RB in limited instances and zone read plays. I see him as a very low risk guy. The chances of his not being at least a very effective slot WR are negligible. And I don't see slot receivers as being inherently less valuable than outside WRs. They are easy to get the ball to and they move the chains. Austin adds big-play potential to that in ways that I don't think any slot receiver has ever done. The closest is maybe what Victor Cruz did in 2011. While Cruz is bigger, he is not as fast or quick and I don't think size plays much, if at all, into what has made him successful. Austin is also fully competent as an outside receiver and can do most of what has made Mike Wallace successful. I also love Austin as a RB out of the backfield, especially on zone read plays. This is a guy who averaged 9.5 yards per carry on more than 100 carries in college and rushed for an amazing 2660 yards and 34 TDs on 218 carries (12.2 ypc) in high school. While I wouldn't use him as an every down back I think he can be great in 5-7 carries per game. I don't buy into the concern that his size will make him prone to injury. First, while he is short, he is very well built. Second, I don't think there is much truth to the commonly held notion that small guys are more prone to getting injured. Relatively few injuries are caused by impact. Most injuries that cause players to miss time aren't impact plays, but are due to tortion on joints, ligaments and muscles. I have seen it written (but have not confirmed it myself) that Austin never missed a single game in HS or college. And the longevity/health record for small and/or thin receivers has been pretty good. Neither Clayton nor Duper missed a whole lot of tiem to injuries and they had pretty nice long careers. Same for Gary Clark, Ernest Givens, Nat Moore, Drew Hill, etc.

    I am very wary of Patterson. He's raw and there is some suggestion that he isn't the brightest guy, which is a bad combination. His production his one season in college was underwhelming. Yes, he had a huge day against low-level competition in Troy and nice, but not great, games against NC State, Florida and Kentucky, but didn't get more than 3 catches or 75 yards in any other game. And while he has nice physical numbers, I don't see him as truly elite or uncommon physically. His size is good, but not unique. His speed is good, but not uncommon. His vertical jump is good but not special. While he certainly could become a good, or even great player, I think there's also a pretty good chance that he'll bust.
     
  12. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    Way too much to invest in WRs. I could see one or the other, but not both.
     
  13. DearbornDolfan

    DearbornDolfan Active Member

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    I voted for Austin for two very simple reasons. One, unlike Patterson, he doesn't go backwards in an effort to make a big play; that drives me freaking nuts. Two, unlike Patterson, he knows when to go down.
     
  14. Mrtree

    Mrtree Juan Huron's agent

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    I think the answer is Austin for the very reason you give here. He adds multiple dimensions to our offense.
     
  15. dWreck

    dWreck formerly dcaf

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    Its very interesting to me how split the Poll is. I like it.

    I went for CP because I liked his measurables and his game...Prototypical. It seems like TA has only been talked about recently (by most people, not all) and it just seems like a really sudden jump to me... Slot or not the size is a tiny bit concerning to me. ( I know its been stated that statistics show that doesn't matter blah blah) Just my opinion. But you can't deny that speed, quickness, ball skills and dirty dirty cuts. Multi-dimensional.

    Although I will admit after wathcing more film on TA than I previously had, he certainly is a game changer and i'm starting to lean more towards him than I thought I would. At the same time on the opposite end the more I read about CP the more he slowly keeps sliding for me. Examples would be like a few of the points Fineas has already made. He is a raw-ish and its a tad concerning.

    In the end I'm going to have to agree with ck in that neither of these guys are going to get picked anyway. lol.
     
  16. Hurricane

    Hurricane Guest

    This.

    Tavon ran a .08 second faster 40.

    Cordarrelle is 6 inches taller.

    I've made the argument that Tavon can succeed, and while he may be slightly more elusive, Patterson more than makes up for it with tackle-breaking ability and size. I think he could be a 2009 version of Miles Austin.
     
  17. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Based on what? Conventional wisdom? Who cares.

    Hartline will be gone soon, as will Bess. My scenario would leave Wallace, Austin & Bailey. That's not too much.
     
  18. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    Not if you're going with a 4-wide alignment.
     
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  19. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    That's for sure. What can Austin or Patterson do that Hartline cannot? :lol:
     
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  20. Jcouch1021

    Jcouch1021 New Member

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    What I love about CP is the size/speed and the ability to make a small play into a home run. I can also see him playing a part In the slot and not just a perimeter guy. He catches the ball extremely well on the run and if you watch some of his tape you'll see he's not afraid to go over the middle and lower his shoulder to get a couple more yards. I think tavon Austin is a very special player. Geno smith was on fire last year. I love what they both bring to the table but I like the versatility that comes with Patterson more then Austin. Patterson can play any of the wideout positions. And I believe inside the 20 he is more of a threat to go up and grab one for us.
     
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  21. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Austin and any one of Kelce/Ertz/Escobar/McDonald...
     
  22. Jcouch1021

    Jcouch1021 New Member

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    I voted Patterson but if star is available I can't see us pass him up. Talk about penetration in the middle and above avg ability to stop the run. He does not ever give up on a play and played the second most snaps out of any dT in the draft. What seems to be Brady's worst nightmare besides pollard? Getting knocked on his ***
     
  23. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    We have 3. Even if we go to 4-wide essentially all the time, we aren't going to have 4 guys with 100 targets. Even at 80 targets each (which is more realistic) it'd be a poor use of resources to take Austin in the 1st AND Bailey in the 2nd (one or the other would be fine) when there are other needs on the team and plenty of talented WRs available in the same tier as Bailey (who could himself very likely not go in rd 2).
     
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  24. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    It'll be at least 2 full seasons before Hartline is gone. You don't need his replacement right now.
     
  25. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Need? Bailey is special and is easily the most complete receiver in this draft and many others.
     
  26. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    If that is the case, why even bother taking Austin? Bailey should be more than enough of a valued component to add to the offense when we could use help in the OL and a weapon at TE (not even mentioning the defense).
     
  27. TooGoodForDez

    TooGoodForDez Deion Sanders for GM

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    If a team went 4 wide all the time, with around around 800 plays (450 passing 350 running), there could be 200 targets per WR, theoretically.
     
  28. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    There were 3 WRs in the entire NFL with 200 targets.
     
  29. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    My guess is that Austin is a very likely pick for Miami while Patterson is very unlikely. There were reports of Miami asking Allen very specific questions while at the combine regarding what he would do against specific coverages and looks. I expect that they asked similar questions of all the WRs they spoke to. I think that Miami's offense requires the WR to know almost as much as the QB in order to make the correct checks and adjustments. And seeing how players like Matthews, Egnew and and several vets had trouble even getting on the field last year because they didn't know the offense well enough I can't imagine that Miami would want to bring in somebody at #12 who might not be able to get it enough to even get on the field. Couple that with reports that Patterson was unimpressive in his interviews and that scouts were questioning his intelligence and football smarts and I just don't see him as the guy we're targeting.

    On the other hand, Austin is considered bright and it was obvious that he worked on his craft (or at least "got it" quickly) since he is so much more polished. He is accustomed to working in a fast paced offense which I imagine is still the goal even though our high snap counts didn't materialize last season. (my understanding was that most of the WRs didn't know the offense well enough). Ireland was known to be targeting Harvin a few years back. I think that's the kind of play maker that he wants. And now he has a coach who probably also wants and understands how to use him. Couple that with all the reports of Ireland personally going to WV and I think Austin's high on our target list.

    Off topic, but I also think all of the reasons above except for the direct contact would also point to Swope.
     
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  30. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    I would think they are more interested in taking a TE early than a WR.
     
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  31. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    Swope is the most likely WR Miami drafts IMO, especially when you consider how much Ireland values measurables.
     
  32. Lee2000

    Lee2000 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't think Miami takes two receivers if they sign Gibson, but I do believe they might draft one, and I just happen to think it will be Austin. If they poison pill a contract for Pitta, then they will likely take a tight end later in the draft. They have to get some depth on OL and at cb. That is evident today. Probably a rb. And likely a defensive end. Bringing in Bennett got my attention. I could see them going after a 43 defensive end.
     
  33. TooGoodForDez

    TooGoodForDez Deion Sanders for GM

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    I understand. But look:

    Green Bay targets:

    Cobb 104
    Jones 98
    Finley 88
    Nelson 73
    Jennings 62

    Take Jennings targets away and distribute the, you can have an offense with 4 WR with 100 targets.
     
  34. Lee2000

    Lee2000 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I find it amazing that folks have forgotten how much of a crush Ireland had on Harvin just a few years ago. I believe he has shifted that desire to Austin. I think this is what Darlington probably referred to as the surprising draft strategy he has become aware of.
     
  35. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    I have Bailey as the best WR in this draft. I think that by year two or three he would be the #1 WR on the team. I also think that after this year we'll probably lose Bess. Additionally, you have to understand that not every pick or FA works out. Realistically if you hit on 50% you're a superstar. That doesn't even count injury. So that means that you need extra players to cover that. If you're primary goal is to get play makers for RT then you better not just have the minimum.
     
  36. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Because Austin is a different animal. Our team's greatest weakness the past many years is no explosion on offense. The one time we had the ability for big plays, we won the division. Did NE invest "too much" into the TE position?

    Our oline can benefit from lower round help. So can our defense (which isn't all that bad btw). There are no transcendent players available at our pick other than Austin & Bailey. Everyone else that we have a shot at are typical role players. These two can be special.

    I guess I don't understand the aversion to dynamic playmakers. What's the worst that can happen....we don't make the playoffs?

    Its time to strap some balls on this franchise and become deadly. Ridiculous speed + ridiculous agility + ridiculous tenacity + the ridiculous heat = a deadly wr corp. Deadly.
     
  37. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    The Packers have had 5 guys at 50+ targets for the past 4 years. So even taking one away, they wouldn't get distributed vertically upward in all likelihood.
     
  38. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    I can certainly appreciate the 50% argument, and I was already factoring in Bess. We do have other guys already on the team that are young that the team is likely interested in developing though (and yes I know it's unlikely they all, or possibly even one, work out: referring to Matthews, Fuller, Tyms, and even Binns).

    I'm hardly averse to dynamic playmakers, but I do factor in resource allocation into my decisions as to what I think would be best for the team. I don't see Bailey as special or transcendent, though I do think he's very good. Even thinking Bailey's special I don't know that adding him and Austin as opposed to other positions/players is what would be best.

    Obviously the worst that could happen is missing the playoffs, but I would like to make them.
     
  39. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Resource allocation is a good thing. We have to stop people from scoring and we have to score ourselves. We have consistently been good at one and horrible at the other. Let's improve the offense. Let's give Tannehill every tool we can. We cannot be worse off then we've been. Its time to change our approach.
     
  40. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    We obviously already have with the addition of Wallace. And I'm all for improving the offense, hence me wanting to add Eifert and Swope (in addition to OL).

    My issue with you wanting to add Austin and Bailey is far more about you wanting to spend 12 and 42 (on the same position), as opposed to say 12 and 79, than it is about the players involved.
     

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