Poll: Tavon Austin vs Cordarrelle Patterson

I don't know about last year, but their career numbers are average to above average among NFL kick returners, so size really wasn't an impediment. It doesn't take a lot of size to be a good kick returner. Mel Gray was 5-9, 175. Dante Hall was 5-8, 180.

 

They're both really good.

I think Cordarrelle is better.

 

Especially with a guy as raw as Cordarelle. Hey I admit he's got a ton of talent but there is absolute bust potential there as well.

 

Robert Meacham says hi.

 

This "raw" argument for Cordarrelle Patterson is extremely over-used and I'm not getting a feeling that the ways in which he really is "raw" or "not raw" are generally understood.

For example, considering there's an extraordinary amount of tape on Patterson out there on YouTube...and I'm not even just talking about highlight reels but also full SEC games on YouTube...can anyone point me toward even just one or two plays, routes or whatever, where you can say, "This is a raw player"?

I mean, where's the rubber meet the road on this? People have a claim, so let's see it backed up?

And no, drops do not qualify. Every receiver drops the football.

 

I agree. I think too many on here are demeaning one to make their case for the other stronger. These are probably your first two receivers drafted. Best case scenario with both is a Julio Jones type with Patterson and a Percy Harvin type with Austin.

 

i dunno comparing austin and patterson highlights its just not even close, i know austin has more tape out there, but that makes it even harder to look better...give me some tavon austin and never look back....don´t get me wrong would also be happy if we pick patterson..i just want to go WR at #12, we need to invest in the position we have overlooked for sooooo long

 

I don't know that I was trying to demean Cordarelle. More so attacking the "can't miss" statement on him. If we drafted either of them I would be their biggest fan the next day.

I just like the multifaceted attack we would have with Austin.

 

what happened to bjoern werner´s stock by the way most mocks have him top 5 and now he is in question with our pick, would be really cool to have a guy from my hometown on MY FREAKIN TEAM, but i´m not sure if i would want him over tavon austin

 

Yeah I really think that's probably the case. These are your first two receivers drafted. In #MockTwo even I considered trading trading back into the 1st round for Tavon Austin instead of Cordarrelle Patterson. Or rather I thought if I'd managed to trade back up to #16 as I originally intended then I could be assured of Patterson but if I couldn't and could only trade up to #22 then I would have to go with Austin most likely, and I still considered it very hard.

What I've been trying to do lately is really isolate Tavon out on the route. That's the thing I need to see. Literally half his receiving production are screens, between the sweep screen (patty cake ball) and other screens. I GET that the guy has great RAC skills. Trust me. There's enough tape out there. I get it. He and Cordarrelle are special that way. But I've seen Cordarrelle out on the route. I've seen him run the bang-8, the shake route, the fade-stop, the back shoulder, the 9 route, drags, out and ups, post-corners, digs, etc. I've seen him catch footballs and get open on every single one of those routes.

I haven't seen all that from Tavon Austin yet. I'm looking. It's not easy to find. I'd ding him more for it, but the fact of the matter is he's a pretty savvy guy out on the route when it comes to getting open. His specialty is varying his speed and being sudden to create separation. That works on the inside really well. Will it work on the outside?

 

I think we should just trade up and draft both

 

That would be so much fun.

 

No takers on the Cordarrelle Patterson "raw" challenge?

Find me one or two plays where Patterson did something "raw"?

 

*crickets*

 

Yatil Green's measurables confirmed he'd never bust too.

 

BRo, you know better than that. ponk!

 

What would be the point? We did the same thing on Mallett and it boiled down to an opinion. I said his feet/decisions when pressured weren't quick enough and I saw a 2nd/3rd round pick. You looked at the same clips and saw a 1st round pick. I look at Patterson and don't see sharp cuts or acceleration out of his breaks. I don't see him vary his speed or set up the DB. You, I'm guessing do. I see concerns about whether he'll develop and consider that a big risk, you don't see as big of a risk.

 

IMO Werner and Austin are two of the prospects that are just great fits for Miami. I think he's a natural strong-side DE. I know that many are pushing for us to trade up for both Austin and Eifert, but if we did trade up, Werner and Austin are the two I'd love to get.

 

The point would be to be able to isolate what you mean when you say he is a "raw" player. Sure, people may disagree with it, but at least you'll have backed up your claim. It's a worthy exercise. To do so on the fear that I'll disagree anyway kind of smells like a copout. I'm not usually bashful when it comes to isolating video support when I make a claim about a player. Even knowing full well that people are going to see the same tape and not see the same thing. I suppose it's too much to ask for other people to be the same.

 

I have never posted a video (or even know how). And it's obviously not out of fear of your disagreement since we have disagreed on many prospects. If anything you should know by now that I'm confident in my opinions. I see it as a waste of time when we're going to end up in the same place we already are. And I know you understand football terminology enough to understand what I mean when I say his cuts aren't sharp enough or that he doesn't explode out of his breaks. You understand what it means to vary your speed or otherwise set up the DB. It sounds like a copout to claim you don't know what I mean when I say "raw" since I gave some pretty specific descriptors.

 

I know exactly what those evaluations mean. You've just refused to show any evidence to support those claims. So be it. Guess everyone's gotta just take your word for it, he's "raw". Even though you can't/won't show evidence to support it.

 

I pretty much agree with you here raf. I see similar concerns with Patterson. He has decent size, but they way he's built, his legs look a little lanky and weak. Similar to RG111. Though RG looked dynamic and could run well, it appeared to me that he was one good hit from getting his knee blown out. I see a bit of the same in Cordelle. He also doesn't seem as powerful as some of the other first round picks of the past. A lot of catches I see on film, he is wide open. Doesn't seem to have a lot of power in contact after the catch. He's has good speed and can make some great open field runs and kick returns. He looks like Reggie Bush with the way he runs all over the field, sideline to sideline, trying to make happen. He often does just that, but there are aspects of his game that concern me. I do see some bust potential as a #1 receiver. It's not that I don't like him. He definitely has talent. I would probably go with he X factor in Austin, but I honestly would not want either with the first pick. I don't even think it's that big of a need anymore. There's a bunch of players I would take before either of them. JMO.

 

I'll take the challenge on Patterson with his hands, i know that you think that there arent concerns there but I believe he isn't comfortable, or very good, when the ball is outside his wheelhouse.

Height and weight makes no difference in the open field, I'll take the better speed,vision, sharpness and quicks over that..

I think Tavon has special ability..stuff that doesn't come around that often..I think the recent hype was overdue and predictable.

 

Eifert at #12 would be one of the worst picks from a value perspective in recent memory. He is not an "elite" tight end. He is worthy of a late first or early second round pick. From a value perspective, T.Austin, much like Harvin, is worthy of a #12, because of his rare skillset; specifically his ability to make the big play and be a matchup nightmare. From a value perspective, Patterson is worthy of a #12 pick because of his rare size and speed combination. Nick Buoniconti is principally "banging his drum" about Eifert, because Eifert went to Notre Dame and happens to be one of the better (one of the only) players to come out of the school in recent memory. Star Lotulelei, Warmack, or one of the OTs is also an option at #12, but surely Eifert is not worth taking there.

To summarize, T.Austin, Patterson, Star, Warmack, and the OTs (Fisher + Joeckel + L.Johnson) have elite ability, while Eifert is a rung lower from a skillset standpoint and therefore not as good value at #12.

The way T.Austin stops on a dime and gets a guy to blow by him is special. The fact that he constantly switches the ball to his outside hand denotes a SMART football player. The ability to put it into the 6th gear like a Lamborghini is elite/special. I do not always approve of a player running out of bounds, but with his size as a detriment in that regard he is smart about doing so. The fact that he can line up all over the field is great. The fact that he can actually run out deep is something you do not see from many "slot" receivers. From a value perspective, I would not say it is the best value taking T.Austin at #12, but I would not be opposed to it given what we have on the roster and where he could contribute. People seem to fail to realize that Wallace drawing a safety over and T.Austin having the ability to draw a safety towards the LOS would be a nightmare from a gameplan perspective. You need guys on your team that can run the short routes over the middle and either 1) make people miss or 2) have no fear. You need players that can turn nothing into something; example: 4th and 4 and T.Austin gets a short pass and turns it into 30+ yards. Big plays help teams in so many ways. This guy brings that big play ability and everything I said previously. Big players make big plays in big games. Oklahoma (a very good defense coming into WV) and ranked was a big game and T.Austin did not disappoint. Patterson did not always show up or so they say.

 

Nobody has to take my word for anything. I posted my opinion. It's not even an off the wall opinion. It's an opinion other analysts have put forth as well. People are free to look at any Youtube or other videos they like and draw their own conclusions. In fact, I believe that's what everybody should do. I don't care whether they agree with me or not. I have no need to convince you of my opinion. As I've told you before, "i'm okay with you being wrong".

 

So much for getting either

 

well its official now. Defense/OL with #1 pick, Eifert is the sleeper...... unless attempts to trade picks for a player are what "intrigued" Darlington enough to add hype to our draft.

 

Well we don't have to worry about spending a high pick on a WR. That ship has sailed.

 

Might still spend a high pick on a TE.

 

Official? Just because we signed Gibson does not IMO automatically mean we won't take a WR high in the draft.

 

Give that crush up already. Can you say over-kill ? There's a very small chance we could still give up a kings ransom to climb back into the first for Austin. Even less likely we'd give up 12 for more 2nds to take Austin. It's just not logical with all this money invested there already.

 

I see Austin as a different category than our current WRs. I still see pass rusher or Austin as a our most likely first round pick.

 

Extending Bess is the only way I could see making Austin unlikely

 

Geno Smith had a great pro day so he is pegged into the Top 10 again. This takes one team out of it.

The OTs will be a tough one so I concur a trade up will be necessary.

Many teams are enamored with Cooper, so he could be picked before Warmack. The team most likely to pick a G in the Top 10 is TEN and they signed Levitre so that is not as dire a need (I feel they need two Gs badly so it is still possible).

I see Star Lotulelei having a good chance of falling to #12 due to the heart condition. Bad teams usually have employees on thin ice and many teams in the top 10 will not want to risk their job on a question mark such as Star even if the medical comes back positively.

Trufant, I believe will go in the top of the 2R or possibly late first.

 

Is it ill of me to breathe a sigh of relief that this poll is as close as it is? From the last couple of thread discussions, Austin can run circles around Patterson both literally and metaphorically.

I voted Patterson. I see two talents equal in their own regard- I gotta go with the size.

 

I'm watching the wrong film. Please send. Sincerity, not sarcasm.

 

Worry? Can't speak for any1 else but I was excited about it. Me only? Anyhoo,doesn't make sense now, though (not that that has ever eliminated the possibility [and historically when the Phins are involved- probability]).

 

I think Austin is very much in play regardless of Gibson. Just my opinion.