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Miami Draft Strategy

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Boomer, Mar 12, 2013.

  1. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Holy shnieikes...lol, that was awesome, thanks Fin
     
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  2. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    I have never been prouder.

    Now post the other one, Grasshopper.
     
  3. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Does it remind you of when your kid finally learned to go potty by himself or tie his own shoes?
     
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  4. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Just b/c we currently have Bess it doesn't mean he fits the vision/requirements of what Ireland & Philbin desire from the position. What if they covet a dynamic, explosive playmaker from the slot who can be used in a variety of ways? What if they want an Xfactor who can help expand the playbook and add an element to the offense we currently don't have? If that's the case we would in fact have a big need in the slot b/c you can't schematically do all those things if you don't have the player to allow such. The element Austin can add might be just the trick Ireland is looking for, and you simply can't substitute it with another player, not unless you draft Denard Robinson and spend the first few years developing him as a receiver just to get him to where Austin currently is.

    Again, I don't see why the slot position is being viewed by some of you as a luxury pick when Austin could conceivably see more touches than any WR/TE we have. To take it a step further I'd argue the role Austin plays in the slot is equal to if not more important than flanker or split end, and I refuse to call a guy a luxury pick when you can scheme part of your offense around him.
     
  5. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    [video=youtube;niAAS8eiO3c]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niAAS8eiO3c[/video]


    I'm a bad *** mother grabber
     
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  6. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Today...today, my boy is a man....
     
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  7. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    [video=youtube;nGeKSiCQkPw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGeKSiCQkPw[/video]

    This is fun
     
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  8. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    DJ is like a kid who opened a new toy on xmas morning, like a GI Joe with a kung fu grip. DJ! Put down the toys and come to the dinner table now, or do I have to get the belt? :shifty:
     
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  9. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Stretch arm strong more like it...and it was a barber strap..lol
     
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  10. Jcouch1021

    Jcouch1021 New Member

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    Does anyone else feel like tavon Austin is getting jammed down your throat? I think we all get that he's a very good player by now. I guess we just have to wait and see if he will be a fin :-)

    peace, love, and Bernard pollard
     
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  11. Jcouch1021

    Jcouch1021 New Member

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    And DJ, you trying to post the video made me crack the **** up... This **** was getting catty in here until that...
     
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  12. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Who do you want at 12, top 3 guys?
     
  13. Jcouch1021

    Jcouch1021 New Member

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    Star, Werner, Johnson. In order. Of course unless we sign a T then Star, Werner, or Carradine, if we sign a DE and T Star, Vaccaro, cooper
     
  14. Jcouch1021

    Jcouch1021 New Member

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    I did want Alex ogle tree for a while...
     
  15. Jcouch1021

    Jcouch1021 New Member

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    Of and Patterson before we signed both Gibson and WallaceWallace
     
  16. RoninFin4

    RoninFin4 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    1) Jarvis Jones
    2) Tavon Austin
    3) Jonathan Cooper
     
  17. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    So your pretty much set at skill players?
     
  18. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    That's where I disagree. Having Bess makes Austin a luxury. We don't need that after signing Wallace and Gibson, and extending Hartline.

    I would rather go with Rhodes or Trufant there, personally.
     
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  19. Jcouch1021

    Jcouch1021 New Member

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    Did I disappoint?
     
  20. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Yes!
     
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  21. Jcouch1021

    Jcouch1021 New Member

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    I know I know Bernard pollard is my hero too :tongue2:
     
  22. Two Tacos

    Two Tacos Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    :yahoo::flag::punk::party::party::party::party::party::party:
     
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  23. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Also, I want to throw out Teo as a possibility. We may not pick him at 12 but I think he could be an option in the draft.
     
  24. Jcouch1021

    Jcouch1021 New Member

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    Agreed I feel like I'd get Wayyyy to much criticism for that idea, but his college numbers won't lie, everything short of his ex dead hooker boy..girlfriend and the bama game, that dude played football.
     
  25. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    The truth is if the Dolphins hadn't tossed $100 million at the WR position already then Austin and Patterson would make really viable targets at 12. Genuinely good prospects. And Austin in particular would be right up Ryan Tannehill's alley as far as giving him a go-to guy at a position/role Tannehill got on with well at A&M with Ryan Swope.

    But the Dolphins took their shot. Account me extraordinarily surprised if this Tavon Austin talk turns out to be more than just frenzy in the wake of having spent so much at the WR position already. I realize there are people inside the building that are convinced the decision makers are after Tavon Austin. But I think they're ultimately wrong.

    The Dolphins do a good job talking a big game about how they're filling so many needs in free agency that they're putting themselves in position to take the best available player regardless of position, but that's the biggest line of bull I've ever heard out of this front office and trust me they've fed us some big ones before. They're walking into this draft with desperate needs at both corner and offensive tackle. Until they address those positions significantly, those are the players they're looking at for the 12 pick.
     
  26. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't know how he would fit this defense, though. Maybe others will know better. But to me he seems like a pure MLB who can play well here.
     
  27. Frumundah Finnatic

    Frumundah Finnatic U Mad Miami?

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    As much as I would like to see us draft Tavon Austin, we have 4 big needs that cannot be ignored early in the draft.

    2CBs
    1 OT
    and a pass rushing DE.

    However I'd be thrilled if Ireland pulled the trigger, it would be worth the loss of Bess.
     
  28. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    that's assuming Ireland & Philbin think as little about the slot position as you do and actually want a traditional guy like Bess for the job. If instead they prefer an Xfactor type who opens up the playbook, provides greater scheme flexibility, and offers greater big play ability, then obviously Bess doesn't come close to cutting it. Like I said, if they have a specific vision in mind that only a guy like Tavon can fill, then having Bess doesn't mean a thing in regards to Austin, nor does it make Austin a luxury; it makes him a necessity.

    why so? which one of them is our starting slot receiver of the future?

    WADR I think this is hypocrital b/c in accordance with your Tavon Austin argument, using a 1st on cornerback, hybrid linebacker, or DE are all luxuries b/c we already have guys occupying those positions. It would go something like this: we have 3 corners who have started so Rhodes & Trufant would be a luxury; we have Misi so Jarvis Jones is a luxury; we have Wake & Odrick starting at end so Werner is a luxury.

    If a player makes the offense more unpredictable, tougher to scheme against, and more difficult to defend, then he's not a luxury; he's an asset.
     
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  29. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You can make a case for those three, especially Johnson, Carradine and Vaccaro is too soon for me, I think there is good value later for those skillsets.

    I think why it feels like we're talking a lot about Austin is because of what were trying to accomplish offensively, which is figuring how to score touchdowns because of our suckitude, and, identifying the best offensive skill players early in the process in Austin/Eifert, of course that's just my opinion, some will throw Cordarelle in there, but I think it's becoming more of the consensus that Austin and Eifert are leading offensive candidates, if we go offense that is..

    I think the drop off from both Eifert and Austin in their particular skillsets is why they move up for me, I don't want to lose out on one of them because I think I Can make it up later in the 2nd or 3rd..their too good of players.
     
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  30. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    It's hard for me to call Dend a big need, when we have two young 1st and 3rd rounders in Odrick and Vern..

    Also,I'm not sure the value will be there at corner at 12, especially when there is very good depth at the position.

    And it's quite possible the three best tackles will be off the board.
     
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  31. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    I think you can go both ways with this. I think you can run with it your way (which logically has merit), and I think you could also say Ireland must really be serious about upgrading Tannehill's surrounding cast b/c of the dollar investment put into in FA, so perhaps he'll be equally as serious about addressing the slot position as he has been with the perimeter and TE. If Ireland is this gung-ho about addressing WR/TE then I don't see why he would want to stop 3/4 the way through the process and leave the slot unaddressed; not to mention Gibson & Bess likely aren't in the long term plans, and I don't think Ireland would be satisfied with just Wallace, Hartline, and Matthews as the long term solution.

    Look at this chronologically. Even though FA comes before the draft it's quite possible Austin has been in the plans for a while now considering Ireland has been scouting WVU (likely for Austin) long before Wallace & Gibson hit the open market, and we still have Tavon set up for a private workout after having already inked Wallace & Gibson. Many fans look at it as, "we added Wallace & Gibson so there's no need for Austin", when it could be the other way around, that Austin has been the desired guy and Ireland used FA to build complimentary pieces around him & Tannehill as a part of one supreme vision.
     
  32. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    Post of the week.

    You want their draft strategy? Simple. They have nobody at Tackle and Cornerback.
     
  33. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    That's if Ireland and Philbin feel that way about the slot position. They might not. They may feel Bess is good for the position.

    Adding Austin is a luxury because we just signed Wallace, Hartline and Gibson. We don't need to spend the 12th overall pick on a slot receiver.

    It's not hypocritical to think we need Werner, Jones or Trufant. They are needs. Two of them for pass rushing and one for the secondary. We didn't address those needs during the FA. Now Werner will be nickel pass rusher at first. So, he's not that significant a need. Likewise with Jones. But Trufant/Rhodes are.
     
  34. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I could swear I read something very specific in the wake of the Gibson signing that said that Joe Philbin doesn't even like the concept of slot and perimeter players, he wants every wide receiver to be able to do every job. I don't know what about that screams Tavon Austin to so many people but I still don't see this happening.
     
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  35. Anonymous

    Anonymous Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Likewise.

    I have to ask you about Teo. Would you be In favor of him at 12? Today is his Pro Day, I believe. It will be a big day for him.
     
  36. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Very true, but if that were true I doubt Ireland spends 3 games watching him this year, sends 3 scouts to WVU's pro day, and have Tavon scheduled for a private workout. It's already been mentioned that we want to get faster & more explosive on offense and that we're not done yet; it's been mentioned that we want to implement more read-option/pistol stuff IIRC, and it's already known how much Ireland apparently wanted Harvin in 2009. Even if they do feel Bess is good for the position, which I highly doubt, they wont after the season ends b/c they already have too much financially invested in WR to re-sign him.

    That's your opinion, which I respectfully disagree with. Again, which one of those guys is starting in the slot moving forward? You seem to lump all receivers into one category where as I treat the slot as its own position considering it's a different animal. You might treat the position that has the potential to lead the receiving corps in targets & touches as a luxury, but I don't, so agree to disagree.

    It is hypocritical of you to think it's ok to want to upgrade those other positions and add a situational player when you call addressing the slot a luxury. Do we actually have a need for Werner? No, we don't. We finished 7th in sacks last year, have an elite pass rusher (just like we have a top receiver in Wallace), and added a couple of the best blitzing linebackers in the game. Davone Bess is no better a slot receiver than Marshall & Patterson are corners and Misi is a hybrid linebacker, which makes it hypocritical of you to call Tavon a luxury but Trufant & Jones a need IMO. Trufant and Jones aren't needs BTW; cornerback is a need, and there's an abundance of good ones in the 2nd & 3rd round. Give me the combination of Tavon Austin & Jordan Poyer over Swope & Trufant any day of the week; it's not even close IMO.
     
  37. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    If you want the draft strategy, we have 5 picks in the first 3 rounds so there's no dire need to take a corner in the 1st, and if Martin is slated at LT there's no need to overdraft a right tackle at 12 when the top 3 guys will already be off the board. :p
     
  38. CANDolphan

    CANDolphan Well-Known Member

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    That screams Patterson to me but I know I'm in the minority on this site with that thought.
     
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  39. CANDolphan

    CANDolphan Well-Known Member

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    I'm all for getting Austin @ #12 but man I have to flat out disagree with this. Both the eye ball test and the advanced metrics disagree with this.
     
  40. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I like Manti Te'o quite a bit. Always have and I've always said this Lennay Kekua stuff would not change my opinion of him one iota. I was a little surprised he didn't run better in Indy because he shows really good range as a linebacker IMO. I don't think the 40 matters as much as the range he shows on the field though. There are a lot of fans of Alec Ogletree out there and I think most of them would agree a 4.7 in the 40 doesn't really describe his range on the field very well.

    The problem here is similar to the Tavon Austin thing. The Dolphins took their shot here. They've allocated $12 million per year to two linebackers, both of whom will be three down guys in order to justify the money spent. You can't have three true linebackers all be true three down players. It just doesn't work schematically. The third linebacker is destined to be a two down creature, and there's no way the Dolphins will allocate the 12 overall pick to such a player.

    The exception I made was with Jarvis Jones and that is because he could be a three down player. He could play an outside linebacker spot while Ellerbe mans the middle and Wheeler takes the other outside spot, and that would be your base defense. Then in nickel he would come down to the line of scrimmage and rush the passer opposite Cameron Wake. Whether he puts his hand down on the ground or starts from an up position is inconsequential because his role in that personnel package would essentially be a defensive end.

    Manti Te'o is not that kind of player. He's not a pass rusher. Nor are Phil Wheeler or Dannell Ellerbe, no matter what everyone is getting excited about with respect to some kind of trivial (IMO) pass rush ratings for linebackers via PFF. That's not who either of them are. They're linebackers, and so is Manti Te'o. Jarvis Jones is a pass rusher first and a linebacker second.

    So the short answer to your question is no I don't see Manti Te'o even being a possibility at 42 overall let alone 12 overall.
     

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