You just said human errors will happen, and then tell me to keep blaming the referees? You mean I should keep accepting the human errors for what they are don't you? I don't like to blame the referees, but you can't hide from the fact that they can decide a game. I think soccer and football (P Inerference) are the two sports where the ref can decide the outcome of a game. Funny thing is, they only tool they have is their own discretion. Can't challenge a PI call, and you can't review offsides in soccer. Both I feel should be reviewable to allow the better team to win by giving the referee the ability to make that split second decision in a rational and educated fashion by use of reviews. Thats all.... Every country or team has and will continue to be faced with poor referee decisions that decide the game. I, personally, am fed up with them.
In my opinion against France Donadoni should put Massaro in taking Del Pierio place, Massaro is more agile, can cover more ground, faster and difficult to keep in check, also I would replace Toni which he needs 5 minutes just to turn around for Boriello, is faster, more control and overall a better player.
OK, but if they score one more goal than France, they'd win, and it wouldn't be a draw. To date, both Italy and France sport identical (and unimpressive) 1 goal for and 4 against marks.
Seemed like a matter of time before he left. I wonder if we are still interested in bringing Santa Cruz in to replace him.
Boomer was like this in the FinHeaven world cup thread and the euro qualifying thread. Don't let him get under your skin What was Toni doing in the last 5 minutes going down in the box?? If he stayed on his feet he had a sure goal
We don't think the world is against the Azzurri. We simply stated that there was one awful call today against Italy and one very questionable call that were extremely detrimental to their team and could cost them from qualifying. Because we state that these questionable calls took place, we get the anti-italian posters justifying all those calls that went against Italy. All I've been saying the whole time is this: I call it as I see it: Against Holland the goal seemed to be offside, but I can't complain because they got romped. Against Romania Luca Toni got screwed out of a perfectly good goal. That's not complaining, that's not crying, it's simply stating facts. The refs blew that call.
some more than others... and one nation in particular invented the dive... here's a hint, starts with I ends in Y and they were blue...
If Italy ties with France and Romania loose 3-0 to Holland. Holland would have 9 points - Italy 2 points According to Uefa rule, Italy will go to the next level, thanks to a better coefficient, respect to Romania.
Arsenal believe in Santa to take Adebayor's place. Arsene Wenger is prepared to make a 12 mill bid for Blackburn striker, Roque Santa Cruz to prevent his side falling apart as he contemplates losing Adebayor to AC Milan.
How in the world is giving an opinion suddenly a fact ? And what kind of prescient authority was bestowed upon you to say I call it as I see it, and equate that into fact ? The breaks are the breaks, in life just as in football. Deal with 'em. Whine, stomp, discuss, it won't change one iota. You've got another game coming up, how do you scheme against France, what can you do better, do you bring Gattuso back in the fold, etc. And if saying that corruption runs rampant in Italy makes you anti-Italian, you need to read La Casta. Runaway best seller in Italy last year, written by two Italians, and discussing the privilege and perks Italian politicians have. The worst scandal and costs are at the regional and municipal level, but really, corruption permeates all spheres of Italian society.
Actually, I think Italy will win. I thought the Italians were the better side against Romania, while the French were, I felt, lucky to escape with a point. Of course, if the Netherlands opts to play a bunch of second stringers, it might all be moot.
It would really be daft not to. Why allow France or Italy to stay in the tourney and cause you a possible headache in the semi-final when you can easily let Romania get away with an ugly win and eliminate two potential threats at once? I do suspect, however, that the Dutch aren't going to do the sensible thing and instead kill Romania only to get beaten by Italy in the semis. I'm actually looking forward to the irony involved.
Absolutely agree, considering he's 47 years old, hasn't played club football since '96, and is part of the AC Milan PR department. I would start Cassano in place of Perrotta. The rest is fine. Chiellini was much better, De Rossi should have always started, and Grosso provides width down the left side. For all those discussing Romania's chances of advancing, remember Dorin Goian is suspended against the Netherlands. He's the rock at centre-half, and will be sorely missed, especially on dead ball plays. Not to mention that Robben, Van Persie and Heitinga, in the starting eleven, is about 95 cents on the dollar value.
Pepe's playing very well isn't he. He's outshining Carvalho, which is no mean feat. I just think that lack of an out and out front man is going to end up hurting them. Glad we agree on Bacary and Clichy. I thought you looked a much, much better team last night though. 21 shots is pretty good and you were dominant at times. The Henry lob, the great stretching save from Van Der Saar from Ribery and a penalty that you should have had when Ooijer blocked Thierry's shot......on another day it's a different game. But sometimes you just can't quantify for Robben and Sneijder going Sickcon 5 and scoring two sublime goals. They are so devastating on the break, much as they were against Italy, when you have RVN, VDV, Van Raper, Sneijder, Robben, Kuyt, Enkelaar and Van Bronkhorst all bearing down on goal, especially when you're chasing a game, you're going to get taken apart. I thought you were much more solid at the back. Sagnol was ho hum, but Evra played well. Thuram is showing his age and Coupet is ho hum. But 4-1 wasn't an obvious reflection of the game.
Thing is, it doesn't matter if I'd seen the Toni goal or not, the Italian mentality - and God knows, I've followed Italian football since the early 1980's - is tto roll out the woe is me, someone did us an injustice line. I've subsequently seen the Toni offside goal and it was clearly a bad decision. But there have been 4 or 5 bad decisions in this tournament that haven't gone teams ways. Only the Italians can turn whinging into an Olympic sport. I absolutely don't think there was any refereeing involvement in how South Korea knocked out Italy. Frankly if Christian Vieri takes two gilt egded chances in that game late on, then it's null and void anyway. To intonate that there was is pretty tawdry. As for the "my hatred of Italy".....brilliant. Someone disagrees with you, must mean they clearly hate Italy. It's like most of the Bush loving, war mongering, global warming? What Global Warming brigade that hang out in the poltical forum. Have the audacity to slag off Bush or American foreign policy and all of a sudden you "hate America". Absolutely ludicrous. If you don't think that Italian society is corrupt, then you're mad. I would advise you to read Tobias Jones' award winning The Dark Heart of Italy. I'm not sure Cannavaro would have done anything about Holland's goals. Speed of foot has never been Fabio's strength, good as he is and the lightning breaks for the 2nd and 3rd goals probably wouldn't have been stopped by a back four consisting of Bobby Moore and Franco Baresi at centre half, Gordon Banks or Dino Zoff in goal, and Carlos Alberto and Clodoaldo at fullback. You just can't legislate for stuff like that. What other calls went against Italy in the Romania game? And if you say the penalty, then you lose all credibility. Panucci has his man in a neck lock and pulls him to the ground. That counts as statutory rape in 27 states. I'm not sure why Austrians would be calling "fix" when it was an obvious penalty. Perhaps they don't watch a lot of football. I applaud the Italian teams of the past three decades. Spain 82 will live long in the memory; Brazil/Italy; Marco Tardelli, Paolo Rossi. Italia '90 and the Marco Pantani lookalike that was Schillachi, etc. etc. I think Andrea Pirlo is one of the best midfielders of the past decade. Et cetera. But to continually accuse that the fix is in really doesn't make you look good. There is no fix.
If Eduardo was fit, I'd say Croatia has a great chance to get to the final. I just can't see Olic and Krancjar getting a lot of change out of Pepe and Carvalho. But if Germany knock the Portugese out, then I can see Croatia repeating the job on the Germans.
Boomer was like what? Telling the truth? Or trying to quash the "it's a fix, UEFA hate Italy thing" that you boys have going on? Come on.....you're not buying that anymore than I am.
Yep, started off with a plan, had a lull after the Kuyt goal, and closed out the first half very well. Then, the fresh legs of Robben, and Van Persie were too much for an old Sagnol, and Thuram in the second tier. Still, only cosmetic changes are to be made against Italy. Start with Gomis who isn't ready, even as a sub, instead give Benzema some time off the bench, he was only the best player in le Championnat. Ribery was, as usual, a pleasure to behold as well. I'm torn about Malouda, because of the few options on that left side. He's a one trick pony, but we're limited on the left. Govou was his active self on the right, just a shame he doesn't have a touch on the ball. Agreed about Coupet, Evra, Thuram Sagnol. A coaching mistake was not instructing Govou and Sagnol to reduce the gap after Robben came on. They're devastating on the break, so you have to tighten the screws in terms of spacing, and it stretched like birth marks in the second half. Then again, as you said, you're chasing a game, so it's inevitable. On another day, it's another game, yep. Raring for Spain-Sweden.
Football is a game where it's best served not to stop and start and fanny around to see whether people were onside or offside. It's a cliche, but these things even themselves out. If you remove the element of human error, then you're removing part of the joy of football which is this; discussing the whys and wherefores of goals that never were and penalties that should have been. Italy have been unlucky with the RVN goal and the Toni non goal. But they got raped by the Dutch and Toni goal or not, were still a remarkable Buffon save away from drawing 2-2 even if Toni's goal had counted.
I thought the Italians looked a better side. What they lack is a quality player to play up alongside Toni who is so strong, so good in the air. The balance was better in midfield and as you say Chiellini was much better than Barzagli and Matarazzi. But against France, I'm not sure they can play 3 at the back. Henry's pace and movement will be too much for Materazzi. They'll likely play Chiellini and Panucci at centre back and revert back to a flat back 4.
I thought Govou added a threat. Would like to see Henry and Benzema up top. Ribery is still the key. Great point about the inability to be compact - how can you leave such gaps with holding midfielders? But it finished 4-1 to Holland and could EASILY have been 4-1 to France. I'm also looking forward to seeing Spain again. Hoping that Fernando gets on the score sheet.
You think so? Truth to be told, I wasn't overly impressed by Crotia. Germany was playing its worst game since Löw took over and they still came dangerously close to a draw because they didn't capitalize on glaring weaknesses at the German side. They could and should have abused Jansen a lot more during the first half (Löw made a beginner's mistake by not pulling him out after 20 minutes), for instance. They were in a position to put the game away very early but instead were quite content with their 1-0 lead. Similar thing in their first game against Austria. In both games it worked because their opponents were hapless (and still both games got close to a draw) but I can't fathom Germany being that hapless a second time. Usually, we tend to play pretty well the next couple of games after getting our butts kicked for playing like pompous idiots every now and then.
Man, I'm rooting for Holland... How good have they looked in these first two games against two solid teams?? Winning the group of death. Now I just hope they don't get too full of themselves, I suspect they won't, and I'm picking them to win it all... Van Der Sar will end up being the tourney MVP because eventually he'll be tested to the max. Their offensive build up has been spectacular...
Well, he was tested quite a bit yesterday; the French had some chances and had some decent shots. He was lucky that Henry didn't bury that one in the second half where he had all sorts of real estate to put the ball, and lobbed it over the net.
As has been noted elsewhere, the Dutch second team is probably good enough to beat Romania, but what I wonder is whether one loses their edge by taking a game off. The Dutch have their killer instinct sharped to a deadly point. Is it worth risking that loss of momentum for the return of having Italy and France out of the tournament? Remember that the upside of that strategy probably means playing Spain in the semifinals. And whatever their history as chokers, this Spanish team is playing extremely well. I agree with your larger point about the refs and Italian soccer, but was this truly necessary? Please don't make me start lacing my posts with anti-Obama potshots.
Unbelievable! What a terrible misplay by Hanson on that play. Nice play by Villa to not give up on that ball. They're saying Spain hasn't clinched Group D, but it's hard to craft a reasonable scenario where they wouldn't win it. I guess if Greece beats Russia then Spain, the Greeks would take the group.
There you go again, responding only to what conveniences you. THE FIX WAS IN FOR THE SPAIN KOREA GAME. And if you don't agree that the refs were on Korea's side that game, then you musn't have watched it. I'm done arguing with you. You're Bias towards Italy is extremely ridiculous and it distorts your vision of the games. And yeah, sure I lose all credibility with calling Panucci's foul in the box questionable. How dare I call such a thing questionable....please man. And I never said the fix was in for the Romania game. Let me state this again: The ref got the call wrong against Luca Toni. That may have cost Italy the game and from qualification. No fix mentioned. Just a bad call that went against the Italians, which therefore screwed them. Whether it was on purpose or not is IRRELEVANT. And BTW it wasn't even close to offsides. You think your word is gospel and how dare anyone else say something to disagree with you. And please if you could next time, read my whole post and don't just pick and choose which points you'd like to refute.
So you don't believe that Italy going up 1-0 change the whole complexion of the game? The part of the quote I bolded is a terrible argument. Italy going up 1-0 probably changes the whole game where those 2 goals by Romania and Italy in the 55 and 56 minutes probably don't take place in the same manner. Who knows, maybe Romania opens up the field more and leave more space at the back for Italy to go up 2-0. You never know what takes place, but you do know one thing. Italy going into Halftime 1-0 changes the whole complexion of the game.
That was the worst German performance I've seen in a long time, but suddenly Klose looks old, Lehman looks a liability and I'm so not sold on that combo of Metzelder and Mertesacker. Hopefully Jansen will be 'rested' for his own good as much as anyone elses. But Croatia know they can beat them, know they can defend well and they're technically a very good side.
Phil, what has Obama got to do with anything? If you truly think anything that I said about GWB is incorrect, please feel free to PM me and we'll talk.
This is why I don't try and debate Boomer about Italian soccer. This is one of his FinHeaven posts from the World Cup Originally Posted by Boomer Easy to see why the entire Italian squad play in Serie A. It's the only major league gay enough for such a bunch of whining pansies to survive in. Most people hate that Italian side more than any other. Dirty cheating cowardly, hateful *****. I sincerely hope they are eliminated in true comedy style once again. Ahn scoring in Korea was a moment of genuine world unity as everyone laughed at the diving *****. We need more of that spirit. May they have an aircrash whilst heading home.
I can't believe it's not 0-0. What on earth was the Greek keeper (I won't even try to spell his name) thinking?!?
Mate, you're losing your credibility along with your mind. You're off again on some great rant about fixing games. There are NO FIXED GAMES in major tournaments. For someone who claims I don't read your posts, you did a pretty good job of ignoring 95% of mine, including the bit about NOT being anti-Italian, which is simply a convenient way of you trying to mke yourself feel better. If you truly think the Pannuci penalty was questionable, then these must be the first games of football you've ever seen in your life. Or you're confusing WWE with Euro 2008.
