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Dolphins A Possible Trade Partner for the 3rd. Overall

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by RonnieLott42, Apr 6, 2013.

  1. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    I've still seen Rhodes name associated with our pick since Grimes was signed. This entire process more than any other year in recent memory looks like folks throwing as many possible names out there as possible, thinking something is bound to stick. Then afterwards they can go back and find the one out of a dozen or so guesses that they got right, and show us all how smart they were. Not saying you, just media and such in general.
     
    Da 'Fins likes this.
  2. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Jesus, he desperately wanted Patrick Turner part deux?

    Please God, let Joe Philbin save Ireland from his own evals.
     
  3. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    It's also a smart way to drive the asking price down from a trade partner like Cleveland if you simply act like you'll trade with someone else if they ask too much.
     
  4. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Yeah, he's one fat fluker.
     
  5. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Exactly. On all fronts.

    What people overlook is that selecting a high LT necessitates either moving back to RT, a spot he played worse at, or having to draft/sign a RT too.

    Why do that?

    Better to focus on getting a RT and letting Martin struggle at LT a he learns... Unless the coaches literally don't trust Martin to keep Tannehill healthy this year.

    In which case we need two tackles.
     
    Boik14 likes this.
  6. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Exactly.

    If OT is THAT big of a need then how could we possibly be better off spending 3 high picks for 1 OT, rather than drafting 3 OT at 3 high picks?
     
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  7. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    Randle is pretty good IMO, would have been a solid pick.
     
  8. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    You do need to factor in roster spots.
     
  9. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    No I don't. There is plenty of flexibility and time to willow down the roster. Roster spots, at draft time, are quite literally the last thing on my worry list.
     
  10. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    Of course there is, but that doesn't mean its the best course of action. I'm not suggesting it is in this case, but it certainly is a factor.
     
  11. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    My point was that IF a person feels OT is such a big need that we'd need to spend 3 high picks on 1 OT, then it makes more sense to stay put and spend those 3 picks on 3 OTs.

    Hell, a lot of these same people would be less willing to spend 3 picks on 1 OT, if we signed Winston. If having Winston means we don't need to spend 3 picks on 1 guy, that means, logically, Winston would have to be worth 3 picks as well. The OT hysteria literally makes no sense at this point.
     
  12. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    Right, my point is that if you draft 3 OTs, then who are you cutting? Is it worth it to end up cutting Jerry or Samuda to make room, rather than only drafting 2? I'm not in favor of trading 3 picks to move up, but sometimes maximizing your resources might entail trading up. Sometimes it may entail trading for future picks. If the Dolphins figure that they only have space for 3 rookies on the roster this season, what should they do?
     
  13. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    It may be worth cutting them. You're asking me to specifically orchestrate a detailed plan for concept that is purely a hypothetical.

    You're like Jerry O'Connell's character in Stand By Me where after the story about the pie eating contest/barf-o-rama you wanna know if Lard *** had to pay to enter the contest.

    If you draft 3 OTs and they are all better than what you have, the decision isn't that hard.
     
  14. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    No, I'm not asking you to orchestrate anything. All I said was that it would be a consideration. The team absolutely should have a firm grasp on who is going to compose the roster this year, and probably for the next 3 years.
     
  15. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    My God, Rueben Randle is not Patrick Turner part anything.
     
  16. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Have you looked closely at Fluker? He doesn't have a gut on him at all. Packed pretty tight for a man weighing over 330 lbs.
     
  17. texanphinatic

    texanphinatic Senior Member

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    This.

    I can definitely see a leak like this being a ploy as others have mentioned to drive down Cleveland's price, or drive down Winston's price, but to trade that many picks for a tackle when we drafted a LT with our #2 last year?
     
  18. ATLFINFAN

    ATLFINFAN Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't understand this point at all. Are you saying because we drafted a LT last year, we should play him even though he suks. This might get our QB killed. If Martin was a bad pick, you don't just suk it up and play him regardless. You fix the mistake with another player.
    I don't want to trade up for anyone, but I have no problem with drafting 2 more OT this year if they think it will help the OL play.
    If they think Johnson is the answer, I can understand WHY they would trade up, I just don't want to burn our picks that way..........but THEY don't care WHAT I want, and rightly so.
     
  19. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    Until he actually plays in the NFL, we have no way of knowing if Johnson will be effective as a LT in the NFL. What we do know after watching Long for the past two years is that, he was merely a very mediocre LT. I don't think the Dolphins will miss him one bit in 2013 and if they choose to draft Johnson, Fisher or Joeckel by trading up to get one of them. I am all for it.
     
  20. Hellion

    Hellion Crash Club Member

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    Here and there
    As i dont understand yours. Martin played in 4 games as a LT correct? 4 games after playing 12 at RT. A rookie...if coaches determined after 4 games that a rookie was junk and gave up on him then alot of HOFers wouldnt be...he was a rookie, is it possible that the coaching staff adentified alot of his weekeness at LT and are working on them with him?

    Or do we throw the baby out with the bath water.
     
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  21. Claymore95

    Claymore95 Working on it... Club Member

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    And, if we trade up to draft Johnson and he sucks as a rookie (he is fairly new to the position), do we then trade up again next year for another LT? You can't just throw Martin out the door because he wasn't a great LT in his rookie season.
     
  22. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    While it is a possibility the coaching are working on improving Martin's weaknesses at the LT position. It is also very possible that they don't think he can play the LT position in the NFL and that is why they were willing to try and sign a very mediocre Jake Long to a multi-year contract, for far more than he is worth at this time.

    I guess we will all know in a few weeks what the Dolphins think of Martin as an NFL LT. If they draft another position in the first round, perhaps this will mean that they have confidence Martin can do the job. If they trade up to take one of the three top LT's in this draft, that will show that they don't have confidence in Martin as the Dolphins LT.

    Fortunately the draft is just a few weeks away and we will all be able to see what positions Ireland and the coaching staff have targeted as their biggest areas of need.
     
  23. 54Fins

    54Fins "In Gase we trust"

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    over there

    I wish the FO knew this before they drafted him so high.
     
  24. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    should not to move up for a LT

    if one of the three fall @ 12, not a problem
     
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  25. CANDolphan

    CANDolphan Well-Known Member

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    Duane Brown wouldn't be in the league if you judged by his rookie season and now he's one of the best LTs in the NFL
     
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  26. texanphinatic

    texanphinatic Senior Member

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    Moving up for Lane Johnson is an admission that Martin was a failure. After John Jerry was a failure, after we let Long leave. Id rather take my chances without giving up extra.
     
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  27. invid

    invid Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    A Jonathan Martin first year criticism after a post about Duane Brown, interesting.
     
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  28. Hellion

    Hellion Crash Club Member

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    Here and there
    I agree with a lot of your post, but the bolded part is an argument that's been floating around for sometime now, yes they tried to sign JL, yes he is a better LT as of now and signing him would have kept the tackles in place, but yet he signed with St. Louis, if he was that important and valuable Miami would have signed him, they knew the offer the rams had on the table and chose to let him walk.

    But it's also very possible that they believe Martin can do the job, hence trying to sign Winston to play RT..

    But yeah I agree with the "we will find out in a few weeks" or if they do sign Winston prior. The issue I had with the other post it the assumption that he sucks because of a difficult rookie year at a position he isn't used to playing (RT) then being moved to LT for four games and assuming he would play lights out or even well. There is no doubt he needs to workout and get stronger and work on his technique. I just don't see the point in saying he sucks and has zero ability to improve. He wasn't a blue chip prospect, he was a second round talent. Let him develop before crucifying him is what I am saying.
     
  29. Hellion

    Hellion Crash Club Member

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    I wish I knew the lottery numbers before they announced them. :lol:
     
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  30. Drowning

    Drowning ONCE MORE UNTO THE BREACH

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    You CAN'T have a struggling left tackle when you are trying to grow a future hall of fame QB. Geesh. For as much genius as there is on this forum, and there is a surplus, some of you out-smart yourselves.

    Do I want to sell the farm for one? He'll no. But some of these posts; move Martin to LT, find a tackle in a later round- gentlemen- come on.

    If you can switch positions up for our early 2 this year, a late pick and a 3 next year that can turn to a 2 if expectations are met, pull the trigger.

    The future of our beloved franchise, of any beloved franchise, lives and dies at QB. We got ourselves a good one. Better nature him correctly.

    Such is the reason that as much as I can't find reason for Austin, I'd be thrilled. God save the queen and crown her Ryan Tannehill.
     
    pocoloco likes this.
  31. ILDolPhan

    ILDolPhan New Member

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    I'm new to this forum and this is my first post, so please keep that in mind when responding to this post. J Martin wasn't exactly up for the Pro Bowl last year, but not too many rookies were. I can't remember who said that he left a year early (probably Coach Shaw), but that would explain some of the early struggles and the need to get stronger which he supposedly is doing. I will have a tough time handling things April 25th if we trade up to draft an OL. This is not where the NFL is headed and we need to accept and acclimate our team to the passing league it's become. By no means am I comfortable with J Martin at LT and ...fill in the blank at RT, but you cannot spend and/or trade draft picks to acquire another offensive tackle to deplete your draft class. Wrong year to do it. 12th spot in this particular draft seems to be a tough spot to be in, however, we can become a perennial playoff team IMO if Miami successfully acquires quality players with a majority (whether moving up or down AFTER pick 12) of our draft picks. On a side note, does anyone know how to start a new paragraph? Could just be the Bud Black Crown I had visiting with me for the Blues game...
     
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  32. texanphinatic

    texanphinatic Senior Member

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    Actually no - I am all for letting Martin start at LT, that's what we damn well drafted him for. What I am saying is, if we trade up for Johnson, Ireland is admitting he failed at the Martin pick, and previously the Jerry pick, and one can argue the Long pick. I don't really feel comfortable having him throwing 3-4 picks for a LT with that record, highly rated or no. Martin was highly rated, let's give him a shot. Hopefully he does turn in a Brown type upswing, that is what I want, not to spend a buttload of picks taking someone that will never touch the ball.
     
  33. Lee2000

    Lee2000 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Is the skill level of the three OTs worth giving up one or two potential players for the roster? 3 for 1? To me, that player would need to be close to elite for me to give up 2 likely roster guys.
     
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  34. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I think you misread his post.
     
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  35. HULKFish

    HULKFish Artist and Scribe

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    Mike Mayock just made me a believer... He says Joeckel, Fisher, and Johnson all three are potential all pros with as much upside, if NOT MORE than Joe Thomas! He also said that Johnson has the most natural ability of the three. If that is the case, I say lets do it! I trust his opinions more than any other...
     
  36. Gitrdone

    Gitrdone New Member

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    If he is there at 12 sure, moving up for him? No, we have more holes that need to be filled. What if we are moving up for a DL?
     
  37. Larryfinfan

    Larryfinfan 17-0...Priceless Club Member

    First, welcome to the board...

    Second, I think most folks will be upset if we let Long go (although my personal opinion is that he wanted to leave) and turn around and spend extra resources for an OT (left or right).... While my personal opinion, like yours is that we have multiple holes to fill and may even need to double down on certain positions in this draft and therefore, expending three draft picks to get one player is not what we should be doing. However, if they do this, with any of the three guys in question (Joekel, Johnson, Fisher) they will be upgrading the OL tremendously and all are worth moving up for. As to where the NFL is headed, I think you misunderstand who is behind things this year. If this were two years ago, I can understand your reasoning. But this is Philbin's team and I believe we will be selecting based on who he wants. This would not be a Quitcellian move, although the position is one he'd have had us trading up for. This will be a move predicated on what Philbin needs in his OL. Because of that, should this come to fruition, I'd accept it...

    BTW, just use your enter key to move to the next line and create a paragraph or careful on the Bud Blacks...hehehe

    Either way, we got your message...
     
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  38. Larryfinfan

    Larryfinfan 17-0...Priceless Club Member

    Nah, that's blaspheme, forget what I said about the Bud Blacks....drink up....
     
  39. invid

    invid Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    That's assuming they've given up on Martin playing RT as well, which I'm not going to write off yet. When they interviewed Philbin at the team meetings he said something along the lines of, "There's a lot of things that can happen yet." To say he is a failure because they might move him back to the right side (and I know you never said that) is too early. Gotta see how this plays out. Lane Johnson can also play the right side, but would I move up for a RT? Absolutely not, and I'm with you on that respect.If we do move up to 3, I'm inclined to believe they are targeting Floyd or Milliner.
     
  40. ILDolPhan

    ILDolPhan New Member

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    I see what you're saying about Philbin's team now and the switch in philosophy to his type of players (i.e. more athletic lineman instead of road graders). I've heard some draft analysts say that this is not a draft where you want to be in the top 10. Instead, rounds 2 & 3 will hold the most value. If that's true (and it sure seems to be that way), then I'd be less than thrilled with trading 1 or 2 of those value picks to get another Joe Thomas type player that does not score touchdowns for you. I realize the importance of needing to protect your QB, but Philbin is supposed to have a good eye for o-line being an ex-coach there. Plus he's always stressing the coaches ability to develop their players.

    The enter key worked!! Maybe I didn't have enter key privileges on my first post, or the Black Crowns were playing a factor or both.

    Personally, I wouldn't mind see a OT in the 2nd or 3rd Rd where you can manipulate the board to get their desired player. I've heard the Armstead kid is a "GB type of lineman". I could see him as a potential target in the 2nd if they don't move up in the 1st. That allows you to take the best available player of need @ 12 per their horizontal draft board. If that means Austin or Patterson or Eifert for the 1st pick (all tend to find the endzone), then I think I'd be ok with that and so would Tannehill.
     

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