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Dolphins GM Jeff Ireland's Stock on the Rise

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Stitches, Apr 12, 2013.

  1. pocoloco

    pocoloco I'm your huckleberry Club Member

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    I know, I know, you guys think that Jeff Ireland started the job sometime yesterday. It's an adorable delusion. Meanwhle I'm looking back at the '08 and -09 drafts and thinking shucks, I can't wait for '13!

    I can't wait for the Tavon Austin "moment" here. The anger, the bitterness, the hate. The dark side will finally triumph.
     
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  2. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Sigh.
     
  3. slickj101

    slickj101 Is Water

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    lol We make the playoffs and don't win in the 1st round and there'll be twice as many of those threads.
     
  4. VanDolPhan

    VanDolPhan Club member Club Member

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    The anger, the bitterness, the hate.......and were just talking about your posts!
     
  5. pocoloco

    pocoloco I'm your huckleberry Club Member

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    [​IMG]
     
  6. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Actually you guys are more like:

    [​IMG]
     
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  7. pocoloco

    pocoloco I'm your huckleberry Club Member

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    Says the internet warrior with 5.6x as many posts as I do over the same time span
     
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  8. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    I think most of the critics of Ireland still like the guy. And, I think most can say he's done some good things. But, the reality is he hasn't won here (The one caveat that backers bring up is that he worked for Parcells). Either way, we'll see how he does.

    I like what he did in Free Agency, but the draft remains to be seen. If we win, he will be golden. If we lose, he won't.

    However, I don't see how his "stock is on the rise" given the draft has yet to happen and next year has yet to take place.
     
  9. NolesNPhinsFan

    NolesNPhinsFan New Member

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  10. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Well that was quick and not at all clichéd.
     
  11. mlb1399

    mlb1399 Well-Known Member

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    This is my stance. He has been average. The problem with average is he isn't good enough to keep and it could get worse. The hardest part about evaluating him is who had the final say when Parcells was in town? I think this year is the defining year for him. He had a lot of money to spend on FA and a lot of draft picks. If this team can't turn the corner and get above .500, he needs to go.
     
  12. Sethdaddy8

    Sethdaddy8 Well-Known Member

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    Where we are right now is tough to measure. I think it will fall on Tannehill and Philbin's shoulders. If coach can get this team to gel and QB to produce, we will be winners. The roster we have, I'm sure swapping Brady and Bellchick in could make it a contender. It's those two guys. They need to do it.

    If we end up hovering around .500 again, we have a problem.
     
  13. xphinfanx

    xphinfanx Stay strong my friends.

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    Watching the poles show how the complainers influence the negative of the situation to many just listen and don't pay attention to the whole picture.
     
  14. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    I have been as critical of Ireland and Ross as anyone on this forum. I gave up my season tickets after 30 years, two years ago because of my frustration with the owner , the GM, and the head coach at the time.

    I missed going to the games and last year I purchased individual game tickets and attended six home games. I decided to purchase season tickets for 2013, with the hope that the Dolphins will finally become a winning team again. I hold no illusions concerning Ireland. I still think he has done a basically lousy job his first five years with the Dolphins. Hopefully the free agents he signed this year, along with the number of draft picks the team has in this draft will turn things around for Ireland and the team.

    I will be happy to credit Ireland if the players he selects in the draft and the players he signed in free agency come in and help turn this organization around. If this doesn't happen, I will be on here demanding Ross fire Ireland.

    I purchase tickets because I have been a fan of the Dolphins since 1966 and I can afford to purchase tickets. I love the atmosphere at the stadium and while I may not be happy with the teams record over the last decade, when it comes to professional football, the Dolphins are the only game in town.

    Ross showed this off season that he is willing to spend the money to upgrade the team. Hopefully the players Ireland signed in free agency will be the major upgrades this team needs to get beyond mediocre and back into the playoffs.

    So I will be happy to once again be a season ticket holder this year, but that will not prevent me from expressing critical comments regarding the Dolphins, if the play on the field doesn't drastically improve from the previous four years. In fact some of the most negative comments I have heard from Dolphin fans in recent years has been at the stadium, when the play of the Dolphins on the field has been inept. I have observed that people who actually pay to attend the games have no problem expressing their displeasure when the Dolphins aren't playing well.
     
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  15. pocoloco

    pocoloco I'm your huckleberry Club Member

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    The darn Polish are always screwing things up
     
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  16. Drowning

    Drowning ONCE MORE UNTO THE BREACH

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    I'm one of them. Disliked Ireland. Not so much now. You fans hoping for some great future must be in your early twenties and all so certain that the world as you know it won't end tomorrow. Good for you. Keep on keepin on. Me? I'm in my late twenties and I'm tired of waiting. Hang your balls out to dry, Ireland. I commend you.

    You pathetic fools spend each offseason planning for 3 years from now. I envy you and mock you in one breath. Life is fleeting, gentlemen. I've been waiting for 3 years now since 1999. I'd rather go out with my balls out to dry. And this is after years of demonizing Ireland, inappropriately.
     
  17. finfansince72

    finfansince72 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Its not irrational to be critical of Ireland, its gotten silly when anyone says anything the least bit negative about one of his moves, the namecallers and flame throwers start attacking. Honestly, he's been mediocre at best, and there isn't an argument to be made that he's been a winner here because scoreboards don't lie. Hopefully the spending we've done in the offseason and the draft this year work out because Ireland won't be around to defend or blast if we are a losing team again. When fans are talking about the GM its almost always a bad thing, he's been justifiably criticized by fans and the media.

    I wanted Tannehill, I'm glad he made that move, I like Philbin, and most of our FA moves this year. I think we have a shot at being a good team so hopefully we start winning this year. I think statements attacking critics, basically saying that we don't want to win or we'd be proven wrong is just nonsense and I never get why fans turn into irrational people about things like that. I wanted Ireland to get fired when we cleaned house after the Parcells/Sparano debacle but if our team starts winning I'd be very happy to be proven wrong.
     
  18. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    I've had my complaints as well as my praise for some of his work, but as a whole, I think we often misunderstand the GM's position. Some often think of him being the sole person responsible for the moves made and the results That is simply not true. Yes, his signature is on all the moves and his contract states that he has all control or final decision on all personnel moves, yada, yada, yada, but that, to an extent, is just contractual and legal mumbo jumbo and that's where it ends. It simply doesn't tell the whole picture.

    All GMs usually work with the coaching staff and form a consensus opinion based on the overall philosophy and direction and type of style/scheme that the staff wants to run. Sometimes the GM had a hand in bringing in or signing off on a particular coaching staff. He's not about to bring in a certain staff and then tell that staff that he is going to draft whatever player he likes and the you coaches are just going to have to find a way to make it work. No. Doesn't work that way.

    For example; I think one of the few things one can take away from Hard Knocks was when Ireland and Philbin were discussing Gates. Philbin expressed some concern or doubt about Gates and Ireland had to have some ego and say that Gates has a certain skill set which he isn't yet willing to give up on. Philbin has to give it a chance. They come back after a couple of practices or so and Philbin just emphatically expresses his opinion of Gates and how he can't even run a route, etc. You could tell, at that point, Ireland realizes that Philbin, the coach he signed off on, probably knows a lot more about football than he and if he's so adamant about Gates' ability or lack thereof, he must be right and then Ireland goes along and trades him. I honestly think that's how most decisions are made. I think the final decisions are made at such a small and usually secretive level, that we fans don't have a clue how they came to be and who is responsible, etc, but the GM gets all of the praise or blame because his sig is on the moves and that's where most fans believe it begins and ends.

    I really think that the HC and the staff are usually just as responsible or even more so, for the moves made. The GM gets too much credit, good or bad. It also depends on the type of HC. Sparano was always more of a puppet HC without his own vision and innovative ideas. I think he's a good OL coach and that's his specialty. Nothing more. The good coaches have their own vision. It's like when Cam Cameron, after he was fired, admitted that he was just so overwhelmed with all of the details and aspects that go into being the HC. He didn't realize it would be that way. He just wanted to focus on the Xs and Os and probably more on the offensive side of the ball whilst letting the D-doordinator focus on the D, etc, etc, etc. Coaches like Shula, Walsh, Belicheat, etc, etc, etc have a vision and control over the entire team and organization. Pioli may have looked like a genius whilst working with Belichick, but he somehow doesn't look the the same genius as the Chief's GM. Hey, that HC was fired. What a surprise.

    I think Philbin is in the ilk of those coaches I mentioned. He seems to have a firm grasp and vision for the entire process and responsibilities. Down to worrying about paper wrappers on the field. LOL!

    I think Ireland, being removed from the Parcellian influence, is doing the right thing and showing the right humility and smarts to listen to the right people and work within the consensus and new vision of the entire organization.

    Now, with all of this said. No doubt that a huge factor for Ireland's success going forward will ultimately be on the success or failure of Tanne. He and the staff did a great job of giving Tanne more weapons and that's really all he can do. From here, a lot will lie with Tanne and his progression or lack thereof.

    I have a lot of hope. I think Tanne has the skill set, mentality and coaching to take it to the next level. The off season moves should help him. Now we have a lot of picks for the draft. If they can have a decent draft, the team can really be set up to take it to the next level and have some real success, but again...... a lot is going to lie on Tanne.
     
  19. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Do you believe yourself to live in some sort of dystopian future where you're going to be sent to FEMA camp rendering vats once you hit 30 or something?(If so, you may want to consider checking out POFO, they'd like the cut of your jib there).
     
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  20. ChrisKo

    ChrisKo Season Ticket Holder

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    I represent that remark!!!!!!
     
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  21. DPlus47

    DPlus47 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Ah, someone in his late twenties dispensing wisdom! That's so rare! And such a treat!

    Here's a response from one of the nameless clueless whom you address in your post:

    Somebody at some point told you that football is like life. While that is true in some sense, it is also false in some sense. Every year, football can have 1 winner and 31 losers. Life is not like that, no matter which political/economic/religious martyrdom persuasion guides you. If you feel that life is like that, understand that your financial status isn't the scoreboard.

    In a way, having money is like having salary cap room, which makes life like football, in a sense. Nietszche said he could never believe in a God that can't dance. I'll agree with that and add: I could never believe in a God that can't tolerate contradiction and paradox. (I use neuter pronouns for God because I don't claim to know what's between God's legs).

    You're tired of waiting for a winning team in your late twenties? Wait another 15-20 years and see how you feel then. Maybe you'll start to see football as a game that can only add to your life, no matter the results. I'm glad Ireland is going for it this year, but I don't want to see this every year; I'd like the team to be built so that from now on, one or two free agents a year is all they'll need. However, I don't expect this and nobody owes it to me; my support for this team is not a referendum, nor am I a one-man social movement. I just watch and see how it turns out every year.

    You want to tell everyone that life is fleeting. That's true in some sense, and it's also false in some sense. William Burroughs used to believe in an evil species of bird that steals time away from people when they're not paying attention. There is much truth in his belief, even though the evil birds are metaphorical.

    You want life to be less fleeting? Pay more attention. The more you notice (down to each inhale and exhale), the more you can notice. The more you do, the more you can do. And keep your balls in your pants, unless you're absolutely sure that everyone in your company is okay with seeing your balls.
     
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  22. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    For once, we totally agree.
     
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  23. Desides

    Desides Well-Known Member

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    I don't understand the idea that Ireland has turned anything around. In which season did his roster perform this purported turnaround? If all it took for your opinion of Ireland's job performance to change was signing one specific wide receiver, then you didn't have much conviction about the topic in the first place.

    I like certain moves that have been made so far. I dislike others. I intensely dislike that certain moves have not been made at all. He needs four years of winning seasons just to even out the last four years of losing seasons. Playoffs still appear to be a bridge too far even in a weakened AFC. Overall, I still think Ireland should be fired.

    It actually is true. The talent acquisition buck stops with him. The title of general manager bears that responsibility.
     
  24. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    Nah. No offense D, but I already explained in more detail why that's too simplistic.
     
  25. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I understand that. But he also had a decent utilization percentage, 4% higher than Brian Hartline. It isn't just volume. Higher than Davone Bess. Double teamed. With 11 TDs. With absolutely no other receiver on the team.

    It's not just volume.
     
  26. slickj101

    slickj101 Is Water

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    Again, where was that in Miami? Surely he dropped plenty of them here. Top 5 WR's don't really have back to back seasons like he did here.
     
  27. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    It's Miami, duh.

    I'm not a fan of the trade to bring him here. I didn't necessarily think he was top 5 (and I wanted Vincent Jackson). But he had over 1,000 yards each year with Chad Henne throwing it. Cutler for all his faults can be a much more prolific passer than Henne.

    Randy Moss had 3 mediocre seasons (two really bad seasons wrapped around a mediocre) and he's top 5 all time.
     
  28. slickj101

    slickj101 Is Water

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    Sure Cutler is better but that still doesn't account for all the TDs that hit him in the hands/face.

    Moss has zero to do w the argument when people are trying to say BM is currently a top 5 WR.

    I'm not gonna argue the ranking stuff any more but people are really trying hard to overrate BM here, imo.
     
  29. ASOT

    ASOT New Member

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    Overall his reign has been one of mediocrity at best. But I do sense something in the air this year and maybe he has turned a corner. He still needs to land at least one playmaker in this draft.
     
  30. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Ahem.

    Just saying.
     
  31. slickj101

    slickj101 Is Water

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    CURRENTLY. I don't think Moss is currently more than a 5th WR on any team he manages to sign with.
     
  32. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I'm not trying to belabor this point but you used the argument that top 5 wrs don't usually have mediocre back to back seasons. You didn't say anything about current, past or present. You said top 5 WRs. Period. Check your quote.

    I showed you an example of a top 3 all time having 3 mediocre seasons, two of them terrible seasons.

    That's all. His mediocre two years here were still fairly good and were better stats wise than Larry Fitz. QB play definitely affects these guys. I think less of BM than a lot, but he's pretty damn good.
     
  33. slickj101

    slickj101 Is Water

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    The guy is a shell of his former self so I don't even see the point in counting it. It's not like BM has had some great career that's finally winding down. He's supposedly a top 5 WR in his prime according to some.

    Key words: Stats wise, which again is a great example of volume not making up for actual talent. I'm gonna guess Fitz hasn't dropped anywhere near the amount of TDs.
     
  34. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Fitzgerald caught a total of 45% of passes thrown his way last year. BM over 60%. Those are not all drops but still. The year before Fitzy was at 52%, lower than BM. The year before that, 52% again. I wish I could go back.

    Brandon has caught more passes thrown his way through the last 3 years that Fitzgerald has. Fitz has much better hands, but for whatever reason, his catch percentage is very low. I'm attributing this mostly to the QB throwing the ball, but less than 50% is really low.

    I argue with those saying BM is top 3. Top 5? I won't agree, but I won't vehemently oppose either. I like higher YPC players personally.
     

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