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On Paper Dion Sims is everything we lack at the TE position.

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Finatic, Apr 27, 2013.

  1. shouright

    shouright Banned

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    Wow, now not only do you know more about me than I do, but you presume to know what everybody else here knows, as well.
     
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  2. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    Here's a more positive opinion as to his deep speed, not that I agree:

    Kiper said tight end Dion Sims “can stretch the deep middle, which is rare for a kid this size. Ryan Tannehill will like his big frame and soft hands and ability he brings in the pass offense.”… Twenty nine of his 36 catches in 2012 went for first downs or touchdowns.

    But evaluators disagree about his blocking skills. McShay said “he’s going to have to improve as a blocker” and Kiper said “I’d like to see him dominate more as a blocker.” But Mayock said: “He and [Cincinnati’s Travis Kelcie] are the two best in-line blocking tight ends in this draft.”…

    Read more here: http://miamiherald.typepad.com/sports-buzz/#storylink=cpy
     
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  3. GMJohnson

    GMJohnson New Member

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    He doesn't play for Notre Dame.

    But he plays like Fasano and Fasano played for Notre Dame so maybe people will be in to it later on.
     
  4. DPlus47

    DPlus47 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You do realize that you are accusing me of doing exactly what you yourself did in this thread, today, right?

    This is funny to me. I hope you know I'm not even mad at you. I cut my teeth around people who were giving each other ---- all day long, so I tend to assume people who dish out ---- are okay with receiving a little. Anyway, this leads me to one example of something I think I can safely assume that most posters here know about you:

    You can dish out the analysis, but you can't take it.

    Maybe my next assumption--that you don't know this about yourself--is faulty. If so, my bad.

    Maybe you are right and I am wrong. Maybe every dichotomy needs to have a perfect solution. Okay. Maybe you know something about all of us while remaining inscrutable yourself. I acknowledge "true objectivity" as a (very useful) fantasy, and maybe when encountering the one person on earth who has actually achieved "true objectivity," it makes sense that I would lose my bearings, standing before someone who lives in some Platonic Aristotelian-Cartesian realm.

    For a slightly different consideration: imagine you and I are sitting in a bar, having a conversation about Fasano and Sims. I say "Sims seems more athletic to me." What happens next?

    Do you immediately jump to "You're assuming that because he's black and you're trapped in a subjective bias?" or do you ask a simple, easy question that keeps the topic to football and out of the psychology textbooks: "Why do you think Sims is a better athlete?"

    Which question do you think shows more respect for the person you're talking to?

    Which question do you think most people on this forum would assume Shouright would ask? Do I even need to ask this question?
     
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  5. shouright

    shouright Banned

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    I say the same thing I did here.
     
  6. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    That what I saw Jim1, not a lumbering Mastrude/Haynos type, but a guy with soft hands and nice catch radius who runs, he does not lumber, down the field.

    He really does remind me of David Martin the way he catches the ball.
     
  7. Finatic

    Finatic I Pay The Iron Price

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    good post but Todd McGay, Fail Kiper jr, and adam shafter's opinions arent worth there weight in semen.
     
  8. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    Who said that he's a lumbering Mastrude/Haynos type? He's got a good skill set, he's athletic, good feet, just not particularly quick or fast. I'm not posting to split hairs- personally I think that comparing him Fasano is not that far off, based on the film I watched. Maybe Sims is a little faster, but not much. Again, Sims ran a 4.75 40 at the combine, Fasano ran 4.74 and 4.71 at his pro day. And yes, combine numbers are usually a bit slower. Just watch the film- I like this guy, all I'm saying is that from what I've seen he's not really the best deep threat or seam buster. What he does appear to be is one of the best all around TEs in the draft, and a very good fit for what we need at the position.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgAoHNx_6VU

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0oKsK8MCHQ
     
  9. Bofin

    Bofin Member

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    by training camp next season, after a year in this conditioning program, i think he'll look good and remind more people of david martin
     
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  10. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Yeah he's got some skills, but one thing I will say is that dude played in my estimate the 270 range, like to see him get that down to 255-260, I think it will improve his get off at the line.
     
  11. jaymoney

    jaymoney it's magic baby

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    That sounds more like Antonio Gates vol.2....Wish!
     
  12. PhinishLine

    PhinishLine Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Ireland projects Sims being closer to 260 than the 280s. Don't know if this changes the initial role we projected for him or not. But still, a 20-25 lb swing is a 20-25 lb swing.
     
  13. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    All I got from this post is that you know a lot about weighing semen.:tongue2:
     
  14. Nappy Roots

    Nappy Roots Well-Known Member

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    Hes most definitely not a 3rd OT.
     
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  15. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    The best inline blocking tight end in the draft was Michael Williams. No contest IMO.
     
  16. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    My guess is that the weight loss could be a very good sign. At the bigger weight Sims appeared to be one heck of a blocker with quick feet and nice hands- a very good, big all around TE. The only weakness that I saw was that he didn't look particularly fast or explosive.

    The point is, take that player Sims at 280 and reduce that to 260-265 and I could see him gain a significant amount of speed and quickness- he's a very good athlete, he was just huge. Make him a little more svelt and he'll run around better, bottom line.

    Sims is my favorite pick of the Dolphins draft, and add a little speed to his power game, soft hands and red zone threat/ability to go up and get the ball, and what you have imo is a great fit for what we need in an all around TE.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgAoHNx_6VU

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0oKsK8MCHQ
     
  17. Finatic

    Finatic I Pay The Iron Price

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    Weighing Semen is crucial. got to make sure yo momma can carry the "load"
     
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  18. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I agree with the evaluator who commented to the Herald that they weren't onto Sims because they had speed concerns.

    On the field, the guy's not fast. He's not explosive. He's not that agile. He doesn't have great run after catch skills at all. He's just...big. And at the NFL level he's not even necessarily got that advantage in size after the catch the way he did in college.

    Soft hands, I'll give you that. Plucks the ball away from his frame when necessary.

    Blocking with him is more about potential than reality, I think...which is the disconnect you sense from evaluators.
     
  19. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I agree, when I watched him I saw nothing in terms of get off at the line, however, playing at 280 can bog you down..

    I have to get over losing the best prospect since Gronkowski, I have to get over that Eifert is going to be a star, I've got to keep thinking about Dion Jordan, and that this Simms move was necessary and provides some depth at the position that was sorely lacking.
     
  20. Zeke0123

    Zeke0123 message board ******* Club Member

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    well Ireland said he liked what he saw after the season was over and he got down around 260...he said something along the lines of him seeing a guy that could "move around a little bit"...so maybe it was weight that had him look plodding.
     
  21. FinNasty

    FinNasty Alabama don’t want this... Staff Member Club Member

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    As far as the speed/explosiveness, do you think losing 20-25lbs since his playing weight as has been reported will help in that regard? Or do you just not think he has what it takes physically/athletically?
     
  22. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    "Move around a little bit" is not how I like my new draft picks to be described.
     
  23. Duss

    Duss Season Ticket Holder

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    O just hope he doesnt end up being a irelnd TE

    Nalbone
    Clay
    Egnew
     
  24. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Not just Eifert though. Kelce has such a nasty demeanor to him, with much better RAC skills and he actually puts paid to that blocking potential on the field. He knows how to present himself to the quarterback more quickly and consistently than Sims. He's faster. He's more explosive. He's got just as soft and consistent hands. And then you've got McDonald who as Jim Harbaugh said will remind you of Iron Mike Ditka, he's such a hard-nosed guy. But he also has this fantastic smoothness to him after the catch, the most polished after-catch tight end in the draft. I put he and Sims next to one another in terms of blocking potential.
     
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  25. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    If you don't see it, you don't see it. Maybe losing some weight suddenly changes him but until you actually see it on the field, how do you really know? This is not a guy that could show off his new slimmer fit during All Star practices or the game. Watching him run drills isn't going to tell you how he's going to be after the catch.
     
  26. FinNasty

    FinNasty Alabama don’t want this... Staff Member Club Member

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    Also CK, does this guy have good red zone skills? Former basketball player is always promising in that regard, but I don't know a ton about him.
     
  27. FinNasty

    FinNasty Alabama don’t want this... Staff Member Club Member

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    No of course. I was just wondering if you thought it seemed like weight was one of the bigger things holding back his speed/quickness... or whether you think it more just had to do with a lack of athleticism.
     
  28. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    Awesome. Stop ck. You're getting me all excited.
     
  29. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    if you really want to get excited Sceeto, watch Jon martins reps at left tackle against the niners and tell me everything is gonna be ok if he just adds strength..lol
     
  30. Sceeto

    Sceeto Well-Known Member

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    :pointlol: I remember seeing him get completely and embarrassingly pancaked enough when he was on the right side.
     
  31. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    Just throwing this out there, but imagine a RZ package of Keller, Sims & ......Dion Jordan.
     
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  32. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    He'll be a target in the red zone because he's pretty big and has a smooth way of catching the football, pretty good hands. I don't imagine a special red zone target, no better than Fasano for example (and maybe not quite as good as him).
     
  33. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    It's funny you mention that because Jordan was indeed part of some of Oregon's red zone packages. I believe he scored four 2-point conversions during his career. I don't know if all of them were as a wildcat QB but I know I've seen one or two of them and he did it as a wildcat.
     
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  34. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    If you want to get excited about this draft just watch a lot of Dion Jordan. And then watch some more. Maybe spice in some Mike Gilislee.
     
  35. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    I will honestly be upset if he's not used in our offense. He was recruited as a TE/WR by Oregon.
     
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  36. FinNasty

    FinNasty Alabama don’t want this... Staff Member Club Member

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    So, from the sound of it, you don't really see this guy ever playing much of a role in our passing offense...
     
  37. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    From watching so many Oregon games I have a new prospect I want on this team, like real bad, Colt Lyeria..what a fu&$in beast CK..it seems like me and you have been talking about the position for three years wanting to get this guy, or that guy, and we never get our guys..

    I sometimes worry about our GM and the ability to evaluate the position..the players he has passed up on is obvious, the belief in Les brown scares the crap out of me.
     
  38. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    We could have drafted Kelce instead of Taylor, then Logan Ryan instead of Thomas, and David Bakhtiari instead of Sims. Would that have made for a better overall haul? IMO, yes.
     
  39. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    A role. Not a heavy role. Like you said, he becomes more relevant in the red zone.
     
  40. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Well, what do I know. I actually liked the Egnew pick. Didn't like Egnew as much as Fleener and Allen, and saw a BIG drop off in talent after those two, but I still had Egnew as my #3 tight end that year.

    This year was such a better year for tight ends and to come away with Dion Sims is (to me) disappointing. But who knows. Dion Sims could be the next Ben Coates. Nothing is ever certain.
     

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