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Barry Jackson Sports Buzz

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by jim1, Oct 2, 2013.

  1. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    Pro Football Focus ranks Wallace 101 of 103 receivers, and his 176 receiving yards through four games ranks 53rd in the league, behind Davone Bess, four rookies and two Steelers (Jerrico Cotchery and Emmanuel Sanders), among many others. For Wallace, it’s his worst four-game yardage total to start a season, and the third-worst total of any four-game stretch in his career.

    Even with Cameron Wake out, No. 3 overall pick Dion Jordan logged only 23 snaps Monday (he had one quarterback hurry), compared with Olivier Vernon’s 71 (he graded out well) and Derrick Shelby’s 51. Coaches are simply more comfortable using Vernon and Shelby against the run.... Wake and defensive coordinator Kevin Coyle are hopeful about his chances of playing Sunday.

    Read more here: http://miamiherald.typepad.com/sports-buzz/#storylink=cpy
     
  2. mcdave21

    mcdave21 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Unfortunately, Jackson Fails To Mention That Tannehill Simply Doesn't Have Time In The Pocket To Allow The Deep Routes To Develop. Chalk That Up To The Poor Pass Protection. Here's to Hoping Wallace Gets His **** Together.
     
  3. bbqpitlover

    bbqpitlover Well-Known Member

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    Wallace has been a HUGE disappointment
     
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  4. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Qb receiver need to learn to play together, give'em more time...Linebackers are in first year of system, give'em more time, rookies are starting to get reps now, give'em more time.....heyyyyy were three and one while all that sh&$ is happening..
     
  5. maynard

    maynard Who, whom?

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    It hasn't been good. But then again, Wallace is the kind of player that can explode in the next 4 games
     
  6. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    I agree mostly. My problem is Wallace not trying hard like in NO. That's a problem.
     
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  7. mcdave21

    mcdave21 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I Agree With This. Whether He Actually Is Or Not, It Certainly Appears Like He Isn't.
     
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  8. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    You're right, I should probably say, "it appears" he wasn't trying hard. I hope that's all it was.
     
  9. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I didn't see it, what'd you see?
     
  10. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Wallace went full on Ted Ginn in NOLA, including the ball that handcuffed him for a drop ala Ginn on the sidelines a couple of years ago.

    However, unlike most, I think he will is not only worth the $$$, he is also going to be more productive this season.

    History shows newbie Vet Wr combined with Young Qb is going to take awhile to develop as THill just is more comfortable with Bline and Clay atm due to hundreds of shared reps over time.

    That is simple reality, the one time when Wallace was really fed the ball in Indy, he produced fine for THill.
     
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  11. mcdave21

    mcdave21 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I Really Do Hope That This The Case. However, I Can't Understand Why We Don't Just Feed Him Like We Did In Indy. Slants, Drags, Comebacks, Screens. Right Off The Bat To Get Him Involved Early. We Run Those For Hartline.Again This Was Successful Against The Colts. I Think They called One Screen To Wallace Monday. The Corner Came Up Suddenly And Tannehill Correctly Aborted The Play And Wallace Got Called For A Penalty. When A DB Is In Off Man Ten Yards Away, Why Not Quick Throw To Wallace And Let Him Make A Play? He Would Get At Least 5-6 Yards Minimum. A Lot Of Us Kept Waiting For Them To Throw Bush The Ball More Last Year To No Avail. I Hope We Aren't Seeing The Same Thing Happen Here With Wallace.
     
  12. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    Sorry but that is nothing but a sorry excuse for the fact Wallace has not been productive with the Dolphins except for the Colts game. Bess has played with 2 QB's with the Browns and he has more catches than Wallace has playing just with Tannehill. In fact as a rookie with the Steelers, Wallace had plenty of success in his first year with a new QB. It is up to the coaches to create plays for Wallace and Tannehill needs to start throwing and connecting on deep routes to Wallace.


    Regarding the LB's, I just don't see them as an upgrade over Dansby and Burnett. They aren't as strong against the run as Dansby and Burnett and they certainly aren't any better in pass coverage. Other than maybe being a little faster, I think Dansby and Burnett are both better NFL LB's.

    I think the rookies are all big question marks, except for Sturgis. Sims had one big catch against the Falcons, but hasn't produced much else in the past four games. We have no idea if Taylor and Davis can effectively play CB in the NFL. Perhaps one or both of them will eventually turn out to be okay, but neither of them have been healthy enough or good enough to have any kind of positive impact after the first quarter of the season.

    Jordan remains the biggest question mark. As high as he was selected, you had to expect him to come in and have an immediate impact for the defense. First off he was still recovering from an injury and now that he is healthy, the coaches don't feel comfortable enough in his ability to stop the run. He also has been handled fairly easily by the OT's he has faced in the first four games.

    You are right, the Dolphins are 3-1 and that is certainly the one major positive in this situation. I still don't see them being better than 8-8 once the season is over. I just think that there are far too many weaknesses on this team for them to be a legitimate playoff contender this year.
     
  13. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    The int and the two drops.
     
  14. Finrunner

    Finrunner Season Ticket Holder

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    Mike Wallace probably deserves his own thread... but I'd rather not dump on him too badly at this point.

    Philbin mentioned that he had seven targets. That's not bad for a WR like Wallace. He's not necessarily a high-target guy. I don't think he can complain with how many times he was thrown to. It was his hometown. He was playing against Lewis. He had every reason to come up big.

    I guess I am wondering if the drop on the long pass affected the rest of the game for him. Did he sulk afterward? Yeah, he had to slow up a little on the pass, and the DB (Lewis) was close, but the defender didn't affect the ball or his arms, really, and the ball slipped right thru Wallace's elbows. Overall, I thought it was a pretty good throw (not great - he should have been led more, but still good) by Tannehill. Coming in and hailed as a "one-trick pony" by some folks (not that I necessarily buy that, but I do think it is where he's the most viable threat), this was supposed to be his one trick. These are the passes he's supposed to catch. He still made a couple of catches after that, and I don't look at all the film, so I don't know how he ran his routes after that pass. However, the one route where Tannehill threw it as an "in-route" it looked like Wallace just quit on the route. Tannehill thought Wallace would keep going, but Wallace just slowed up. He didn't make a definite stop like he had found space and was open, he just kind of "lazied" up. Costly.

    If someone else knows better, they can correct me. However, if he was supposed to run a definite in-route like Tannehill threw, and he quit on the route, then that's going to lead to trust issues between quarterback and receiver. And to me, that IS one of the biggest issues coming out of this game. Wallace is an investment, and it's not how he plays over four games as much as it is on how he plays over four years. But, his routes need improving, in my opinion. He needs to play harder and smarter and more focused. Over the next few weeks and over the next few years, he needs to be improving and becoming a better all-around WR. He's a threat and does a lot to help the offense by his presence, but he also needs to produce. He could have produced a lot more than he did Monday Night. The plays were there for him. He didn't make them.

    Hopefully, next time...
     
  15. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    Causing a pressure that allowed an interception to seal the Atlanta game was not an immediate impact?
     
  16. Onehondo

    Onehondo Senior Member Club Member

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    Its going to take repetitions for Wallace and Tannehill to develop chemistry. In order for Tannehill and Wallace to get repetitions in game action its going to require Tannehill to have a little time to look off his target and not to staredown or lock onto his receiver. He is not getting that time and it is keeping Wallace and Tannehill from developing chemistry together the way we hoped that they would. It will happen but it will just take longer than we hoped.
     
  17. mcdave21

    mcdave21 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Based On Our Overall Play Thus Far, We'd Have To Have Either A Major Meltdown Or Major Injuries To Go 5-7 The Rest Of The Way. I Think You May Had The Wrong Perception Of This Rookie Class. I Don't Think Any Of Them Were Projected To Be Starters On This Team Besides Sturgis. These Guys Were Drafted With The Future In Mind. I ThInk It's Expected For Taylor And Davis To Be #2 And #3 Dbs Next Year So You Can Cut PattersonS 5.5 Mil Salary That He Would Be Owed. Jordan May Take Vernons Spot By Next Year. And So On And So Forth.
     
  18. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    It is really hard to read what you write.
     
  19. mcdave21

    mcdave21 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I Know. My Apologies. My Flipping Phone Capitalizes Every Word I Type On Here. Drives Me Insane.
     
  20. Finrunner

    Finrunner Season Ticket Holder

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    It Makes You Unique!!!
     
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  21. mcdave21

    mcdave21 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Lol
     
  22. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    I expect more than one play in four games from the player that was suppose to be the best defensive player in the 2013 draft. Where was he on Monday night when the Dolphins had zero pass rush from the outside against the Saints?
     
  23. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    He did have pressure in 20 plays and covered Graham pretty good one play.

    2013 was a really bad draft at the top. Jordan is playing pretty much as I expected at this point. He has a way to go, however he has the athletism and the drive. His career is not going to be judged on his first four games.
     
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  24. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    I have waited for six seasons with Ireland as the teams GM. Now you say I have to wait another year for this team to start using their draft picks to replace Vernon, (a 2012 draft pick), and Patterson, (a player picked up off the trash pile in 2012). As far as I am concerned, the future is now. We have been building for the future since 2009 and I's not sure we are headed in the right direction.
     
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  25. cuchulainn

    cuchulainn Táin Bó Cúailnge Club Member

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    We're 3-1 and off to our best start in a decade and you're "not sure we are headed in the right direction"? lol...
     
  26. cuchulainn

    cuchulainn Táin Bó Cúailnge Club Member

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    Three separate things there... Philbin slowly integrates rookies. He did it last season and he is doing it this season. DJordan had shoulder surgery and they have been cautious with his return and getting him snaps.

    The Saints moved to a quick passing/screens offense in the MNF game to neutralize our pass rush. Their fans made several comments about them not playing their usual game. Brees had been put down 10 times heading into the game and they weren't going to take a chance trying to play a vertical passing game against us as they feared our pass rush. That was not a negative reflection on Jordan or our pass rush, rather it showed respect.
     
  27. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Exactly. He's as likely to have 30 catches or so over the next 4 games, as he is to have repeat of the last 4.
     
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  28. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Yeah, the 3rd overall pick should be playing immediately at an All Pro level right out of the gate, or he is a bust.
     
  29. padre31

    padre31 Premium Member Luxury Box

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    Big picture is 2 of those 3 wins could be against rivals for playoff spots in December.

    That is why all things being equal, beating the Ravens matters more than losing or winning vs the Saints.
     
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  30. PhillyPhin

    PhillyPhin Banned

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    Certainly true, can't judge a guy 4 games into his career. Though, about a year ago, was it you who said we need to give Odrick at least 3 years? There are a lot of screen names similar to yours, I apologize if it wasn't you. The point is, we've all heard that line many times, give them "time" which I wholeheartedly agree with if the person we are giving time is surrounded by 3,4 pro bowlers so the team WINS while said player grows, no one will mind. On the other hand if we are losing while player does not reach his 1st round potential, such as the track record with this GM. That's where things get dicey.

    At this point, i'm not worried about Dion Jordans progress, I simply want the starters to continue to beat up opposing QBs and play Run D the way they did against NO. The day after game 16 we can go back and criticize the selection of Dion Jordan, not now.
     
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  31. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    You do not have to wait.
     
  32. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    Jared Odrick is playing at a high-level, and coming into his own. He is a great example of why you can't judge guys early.
     
  33. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I think the thing with Mike Wallace is that Miami is likely to have to make some sort of decision about him based on this season. He has what is essentially a two-year deal, but if he continues performing like he has they need to look into finding(drafting) a replacement this off-season.
     
  34. GMJohnson

    GMJohnson New Member

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    Odrick's been good since he got here IMO. It's not his fault they put him at DE when he's naturally a DT. It'd be like saying OMG Pouncey is the worst OLB I've ever seen, cant believe we spent a first rounder on him...
     
  35. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    He also got hurt his first year.
     
  36. Tin Indian

    Tin Indian Rockin' The Bottom End Club Member

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    Most of this thread is nonsense. The one glaring issue that has to be fixed NOW is the pass blocking and pass protection schemes. That gets fixed and it takes care of Tannehill to Wallace problems and reduces turnovers.

    Any other complaints are small potatoes.
     
  37. RoninFin4

    RoninFin4 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I think he fit well for how they used him as a 3-4 DE, and last year as an oversized "closed end". The problem last year is that neither Koa Misi or Olivier Vernon could consistently/effectively rush the passer coming off that edge next to Odrick. That's why I wanted Jarvis Jones and was excited to have Dion Jordan.

    However, we've not seen that combination yet this year, and I think ultimately Miami's D is better with Soliai, Odrick, and Starks on the field at the same time - we saw that some Monday night.

    For whatever reason, they seem to not want to play Jordan off the edge, which is puzzling, and the re-signing of Koa Misi, while worthy, muddies the waters more.

    Regardless, I think the overall defense would improve using Olivier Vernon less. He should be a situational player, not a starter. I think of Dion Jordan were playing Misi's spot, you could still generate enough pass-rush to play Odrick, Soliai, and Starks at the same time; like last year. Especially with Jordan's ability to drop into zones and with the blitzing abilities of Ellerbe and Wheeler.

    I'd like to see that combo used more. Perhaps they will adjust during the bye. My hunch is that Jordan's limited snaps are a precaution stemming from missing so much camp. They can still use Misi as well and leave room for rotational snaps for Shelby and Vernon.
     
  38. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    I say we find a way to draft Allen Robinson if he goes pro. :shifty:
     
  39. PhillyPhin

    PhillyPhin Banned

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    Jared Odrick played defensive tackle in a 4-3 front in his four years at Penn State. He earned a first-round grade for his disruptive capabilities, logging 20.5 tackles for loss and 11.5 sacks in his final two years as a starter and showing improvement throughout his college career.
    The Dolphins, however, drafted him to be a 3-4 defensive end. That stunted his growth, as did a broken foot that ended his rookie season. Then, the team brought in defensive coordinator Kevin Coyle, whose preferences and tendencies lie with the 4-3 front. The team plugged Odrick in at right defensive end in the 4-3 front last year, and the results were shaky at best.
    There was some debate over whether he was a better fit as a 3-4 defensive end or a 4-3 defensive tackle. Most anyone would have agreed, and still do, that he's not fit to be a 4-3 defensive end. It's nothing against him, it's just not his skill set.
    Even three years after the fact, the jury is still out on Odrick. He's shown the talent to play at the NFL level, but he's not being utilized as he probably should—Odrick logged five of his six sacks as a defensive tackle in 2012. If the Dolphins begin plugging him in at defensive tackle a bit more, they could be pleased with the results.

    Grade: C+
     
  40. RoninFin4

    RoninFin4 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Therein lies the rub. As good as Odrick's been as a DT this year, Paul Soliai and Randy Starks have both been better. Miami, thus far, has gone away from as using as many pseudo 3-4 and bear fronts than they did last year in favor of trying to get something out of Olivier Vernon as a pass-rusher. I believe Miami's better off using Odrick as that 3-4 type DE and having Koa Misi/Dion Jordan as the OLB on that same side; we just haven't seen it yet. I think OV is a solid player, but he should be used situationally or in sub packages only, IMO. I think not having size at that DE spot has hurt the integrity of the defense, especially when defending the outside run. Whether that's just a phase or a full-blown trend remains to be seen; but I think Miami's got some wrong pieces in the wrong places in terms of personnel and how they could/should be used.
     
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