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What do you think played the biggest role in the loss?

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by MonstBlitz, Oct 20, 2013.

Biggest reason for the loss?

  1. Offensive Line - (Clabo)

    35.7%
  2. Offensive Playcalling

    17.3%
  3. Turnovers - (pick 6)

    44.9%
  4. Missed Field Goal

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. 3rd down defense

    2.0%
  1. 77FinFan

    77FinFan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Turnover, but not sure that fumble can really be blamed on Tanny. In my mind that is two game losing plays by Clabo at the end of a game; this one and Baltimore. Hell, seems like Clabo would have more luck slowing them down by trying to lay down in front of them.
     
  2. CitizenSnips

    CitizenSnips hmm.

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    BS. We were up 21-20 with the ball in their territory. All that matters is we were winning when Clabo lost the game. The rest is noise.

    It's literally the same thing as Dan Carpenters missed kicks against the Jets. Yeah other **** happened, but you know what, if one guy did his ****ing job, we'd have won.
     
    PhinsRDbest likes this.
  3. TooGoodForDez

    TooGoodForDez Deion Sanders for GM

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    That's right, I remember that too, and he sucked and he was no longer soon after.
     
  4. PhinsRDbest

    PhinsRDbest Transform and Transcend

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    the next dimension
    Tannehill overcame his mistakes, Clabo did not
     
  5. Ludacris

    Ludacris Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Tannehill's 2 picks were deflating. The pick 6 was similar to things you saw him do at Texas A&M. He sometimes reads the corner breaking onto the ball and jumping the route incorrectly. He gets way too ambitious in trying to squeeze the ball when you have good athletes at corner who can play at those balls....Dumb mistake. The other pick he threw was when he threw a floater to Hartline to the endzone in coverage. It was either a dumb throw or bad ball placement. He had 2 wide open underneath options which were easy first down throws on 3rd on 5 inside the Bills 20 yard line. Clabo F'd up towards the end...We need a new RT badly...heck we needed one ages ago like I freaking demanded!!!!
     
  6. Eop05

    Eop05 Junior Member Club Member

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    Tannehill should and will shoulder much of the blame. Lots of plays left on the field, and that's not even counting those 2 horrendous INTs.

    Clabo was awful......again. I don't see how he keeps his job as the starting RT next week.

    In what ways was the playcalling bad? Execution was much more of the problem. But coming out of the bye week, this is surely on the coaches at least a little bit. Isn't it supposed to be their job to put the players in position to execute properly. These were execution mistakes we see on Thursday night football games. Not something we should be seeing with an extra week to implement a game plan.....at home....against a below average defense
     
  7. NY Finatic

    NY Finatic New Member

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    Yes the turnovers......but we had a chance to overcome the turnovers, but the OL had Tanney running for his life, hurrying throws and taking more sacks. Its a disgrace, and we just wasted a good 3-0 start. Our running game still sucks as well. Trying to find some good out of all this, but I just don't see it right now. Its still early, but geez.......I don't have a good feeling about the season now.
     
  8. unifiedtheory

    unifiedtheory Sub Pending Luxury Box

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    Turnovers hurt, but they were overcome.

    Playcalling killed us, late.

    Offensive line killed us, late.

    Third down defense has been **** since week one.

    Missed field goal is what it is, it was a long attempt.
     
    PhinsRDbest likes this.
  9. muscle979

    muscle979 Season Ticket Holder

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    Clearly it was the turnovers, whoever you want to blame those on. Without those it's probably a fairly comfortable win.
     
    Stitches likes this.
  10. Ludacris

    Ludacris Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    When you know you can't run the ball to win the game, that's heartbreaking.
     
  11. Destroyer

    Destroyer There for every play.

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    Bills scored 10 of their 23 points because of turnovers.
     
  12. TooGoodForDez

    TooGoodForDez Deion Sanders for GM

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    How were they over come? We lost and the offense did not outscore the Bills.
     
  13. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    He dug the team out of the hole he created?

    Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk
     
  14. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    Eli Manning has built an entire career doing such a thing.
     
  15. Paul 13

    Paul 13 Chaotic Neutral & Unstable Genius Staff Member

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    bull ****... we took the lead carrying the ball 6 times for 30 yards on our last touchdown drive. We could run the ball, Sherman inexplicably got away from being balanced WITH the lead. The root cause is play calling in the 4th quarter.
     
    MikeHoncho likes this.
  16. Paul 13

    Paul 13 Chaotic Neutral & Unstable Genius Staff Member

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    Not to say Tannehill isn't immune to blame though.
     
  17. Ludacris

    Ludacris Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I agree...Sherman should have stuck with the run but it's also worrying when the OC has zero confidence to get yards on the ground when the Bills changed to an 8 man front. In fact I wasn't too sure either but I would have tried to force the issue anyway strategically...and that's without the benefit of hindsight.
     
  18. Kingtut561

    Kingtut561 New Member

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    Play calling! Very questionable play calling early, basically through out the whole game. we need to run the ball more and stop trying to be fancy(Sherman).
     
  19. Kingtut561

    Kingtut561 New Member

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    lol
     
  20. rtl1334

    rtl1334 New Member

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    What I see with this offence is that the o-line severely limits the playbook. Defences know we cannot pass protect so they rush with 4 or 5 and get the kind of pressure teams usually get with heavy blitzes. The trade of here however is that 6 or 7 are dropped into coverage. In essence, our poor pass protection turns every defence we face into the early 2000's Buccaneers (who next to never blitzed but always got heavy pressure).

    Beyond that, we have no screen game to speak of. We have no designed rollouts in the playbook. We have no play-action game. For much of this you need an athletic o-line and a consistent running game. These are plays that are gimmes for most teams that boosts the QBs numbers and lead to easy points.

    You mean to tell me Tannehill couldn't hit Sproles for those gimme 200 yards?
     
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  21. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    I'd say Sherman played a big role. His tendencies. his vanilla offense. his lack of unpredictability. passing when we should be running to milk the clock.
     
    finyank13 likes this.
  22. Lloyd Heilbrunn

    Lloyd Heilbrunn Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You saved me some typing...
     
  23. MAFishFan

    MAFishFan Team Tannehill

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    The heat. Move those games back to 4pm.
     
  24. GMJohnson

    GMJohnson New Member

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    Not arguing your point but the Bills were in a Bear front, our chances of getting positive yards via the run were pretty slim. The decision boiled down to either running some clock and punting or going for the kill. Can't say I blame them for trying to end the game there , if we were up 4 then yeah, punt em down and make em go the length of the field but w a 1 pt lead it's different.

    What I don't like is that they didn't pay Williams his proper respect. Gotta chip him or roll away, something.
     
  25. NewJerseyDolphinsFan

    NewJerseyDolphinsFan New Member

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    In no particular order


    1. Coaching- The play calling was really bad late in the game. It is clear to me that Mike Sherman doesn’t like to run the ball. Now whether that is because he doesn’t trust his runners, his blocking, or personal preference to pass we clearly need to be more balanced on offense. We started off really well running the ball with a lot of success however late in the game we went away from the run. Tannehill’s 4[SUP]th[/SUP] quarter fumble should have never happened because a pass should never have been called. I also think it was obvious Clabo should have been benched after the Ravens game yet he was left in and gave up the sack on the final fumble.
    2. Tyson Clabo – While I don’t want to continue to beat up on the guy since it is way to easy, clearly this guy shouldn’t be starting, he really shouldn’t even be in the league right now. I blame the coaches more for this than Clabo because they are the ones who put him out there. Nate Garner isn’t a superstar but he has to be a little better than this. Will Yeatman has been on the team since 2011, if he isn’t better than Clabo why is he even on the team?
    3. Ryan Tannehill- I like Tannehill, I really do. I think he has a ton of talent and can make a lot of plays other quarterbacks can’t make, he also has a really bad o line as well. However, he makes some real boneheaded plays from time to time. He has clearly shown he has a fumbling problem and he is still throwing to many ints. If Tannehill wants to take the next step he has to cut down on some of these mistakes.
    4. Jeff Ireland – This like Clabo is way too easy but I just have to say it. I am not going to analysis his draft picks but what I am going to do is point out some of the talent he clearly let get away. Wouldn’t this team be a little bit better with Reggie Bush, Anthony Fasano, Devon Bess, and “gulp” Brandon Marshall? All 4 talented players were let go for either nothing or way lower than the value they brought the team. The first 3 also would have come at a very reasonable price. We got nothing even remotely in value back for these 4 and it is really hurting us. I realize the playmakers aren’t the problem however maybe if we kept these 4 instead of paying Mike Wallace’s ridiculous salary maybe we could have signed some decent online, Branden Albert maybe. Maybe we could have resigned Sean Smith, who didn’t really command anything crazy and used the Jamar Taylor 2[SUP]nd[/SUP] on Albert. People complain a lot about Ireland’s drafting ability, and while yes it isn’t great, it also isn't bad. Irelands’s main problem the past few years is the fact that we have let talented players go and have got little in return for them.
     
  26. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    well, to play devil's advocate, if they're not gonna give Clabo help on Mario then I don't see the rationale in "going for the kill" and risking exactly the type of thing that happened to us when we could've, at worst case scenario, pinned Buffalo deep and let our defense go for the kill against a rookie QB who was consistently harassed all game. If Lewis can beat our defense then we'd deserve to lose. That's the scenario I would've preferred rather than risk beating ourselves when we know our QB protection has been an issue. IMO there should be context involved with going for the throat. With a 1 point lead I'd rather force Buffalo's inexperienced QB to earn it than risk giving the game away.
     
  27. mroz

    mroz Fix the OL Club Member

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    Couple of things... on point 1. a pass play wasnt called a run play was called and THill changed the play at the line.
    on point 4. There is no way that the Fins would be better of with the four players you mentioned then they are now. Not even close... people may not realize this but the FIns have score 20 or more points every game this season... one of a handful of teams that has done so. Also, someone should just slap the piss out of you for suggesting that the Fins should have resigned S Smith.
     
  28. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    If you think it's the playcalling, I have a doozy for you. A quote from our coach. Yogi Berra.

    http://sports.yahoo.com/news/5-things-know-bills-win-075016059--nfl.html
     
  29. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    Sure, I guess you can make an argument that play calling was a factor. But do you really think the play calling was a bigger factor than 3 turnovers? 1 for a pick 6, 1 in the red zone, and another that put the opposition in FG range down by only a point? I'd love to hear your argument for why play calling was a bigger problem than the turnovers.
     
  30. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    After the first two picks but with the lead, our win probability was 72%. It's against logic to say "well take away 7 of their 23 points" because you then have no idea what happens in that scenario. Take away Fred Jackson running in a touchdown is equally poor reasoning.

    What we do know is that before the fumble we win this game 3 out of 4 times. You can't retroactively assign greater weight to particular plays when they weren't statistically significant in the loss. That's looking at a stat sheet and picking out what usually leads to a loss without context. The weird part is we all watched the game and know the chronology of events.

    I don't expect anyone to do statistical analysis on the game but 72% probability tells me that the culprit was the fumble. Who to blame that on is another story.

    Sent from my GT-P3110 using Tapatalk
     
  31. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    While there is some truth to that you also cannot not say the game is not significantly different for the better if you don't gift wrap 7 points for the opposition. Buffalo had a very difficult time manufacturing points against Miami's defense yesterday. If they don't get a very easy 7 points to start the game or at any point for that matter, it's highly unlikely they win. I understand the game takes a different trajectory if different things happen, but for you to go the opposite extreme of what I'm saying and say the pick six wasn't statistically significant in the loss completely ignores every statistic about losing the turnover battle.
     
  32. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    The point is I can't say anything definitively "if" x didn't occur. I'm not going against "every statistic about losing the turnover battle.". You're assigning equal weight to events regardless of chronology. This depth of analysis could be done by reading the box score without watching the game.

    The statistic of win probability factors them in and lo and behold we had a 72% probability of winning. Other events after them including 3 touchdowns and stronger defensive play were much more significant.

    Taking raw numbers without watching the game, turnovers are great for predicting who lost. But taking into account the timing of events, these factors have variable importance. We're not predicting who lost, we're assigning a reason for a loss and the single most statistically significant event we have is the fumble. The 72% probability has already shown us that in the scope of this game, the picks were insignificant.

    The three turnovers help to make a larger point about turnovers in the NFL but on the micro scale of a game, the timing of a turnover is much more important than the turnover itself.

    Sent from my GT-P3110 using Tapatalk
     
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  33. btdickey99

    btdickey99 New Member

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    And to mention to some of you who this Clabo is to blame for this loss, Tannehill threw for 51%. Thats on Tannehill, not anyone else. Does Clabo suck, yea. Is he to blame, no
     
  34. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    Completion percentage is not that strongly correlated to winning. Last night Luck threw for 55% and a few weeks ago Wilson threw 52%. Both wins. Four incompletions came after we were down. The game was basically lost at that point.

    Sent from my GT-P3110 using Tapatalk
     
  35. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    Tannehill's inefficiency was more important to this loss than the two picks. He's just not prolific enough at this stage of his career to overcome inefficiency. I think this was his first career 3 touchdown game and +2 in the TD to INT ratio is not good enough.

    Sent from my GT-P3110 using Tapatalk
     
  36. gafinfan

    gafinfan gunner Club Member

    Does Sherman have a role in all of this, of course, please tell me how you can separate RT from Sherman? These 2 have been in each others heads for 5 plus seasons. RT still has the same issues as he did at A&M and Sherman is covering those weaknesses now just as he did then.
     
  37. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    Miami lost by 2 points. Had Miami / Tannehill not spotted them 7 they likely have at least a 4 point lead at the end of the game. Meaning they are running the ball and clock instead of feeling extra pressure to get a first down when in the "3 minute offense" situation. I get what you are saying to a certain extent but I just cannot understand how you can say the pick 6 was not significant in the outcome of the game.

    It sounds like we agree that turnovers played the biggest impact. We just disagree about how significant each specific turnover was.
     
    CaribPhin likes this.
  38. ExplosionsInDaSky

    ExplosionsInDaSky Well-Known Member

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    What was the biggest factor in the loss? Tannehill threw two picks (one for six points) and fumbled the ball. Turnovers were the difference in my opinion. We should have waxed that Bills team and we didn't.
     
  39. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    Not sure if serious?
     
  40. unluckyluciano

    unluckyluciano For My Hero JetsSuck

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    if you say "he should run here" wouldn't that make him predictable?
     

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