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Philbin as a coach of the year candidate.

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by His'nBeatYour'n, Dec 18, 2013.

  1. His'nBeatYour'n

    His'nBeatYour'n Glass Ceiling Repairman

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    There has been a lot of national media speculation about Philbin being a good candidate for COY.

    I'm curious what those of us who actually follow this team year round think of the job Philbin has done helping this team weather the Incognito Martin storm. Is it enough to consider him a coach of the year candidate?

    I'm not interested in whether he is a more qualified candidate than a Reid, Arians, or Belichick. I'm curious what you think of Philbin being considered at all.

    I think Philbin's leadership and credibility as a mild no-nonsense Dungy-type, has helped the team. But it also defines the National media perception of him.

    Has he done enough with the other half of coaching, X's and O's, to be considered?

    Would this team (who played hard for Sparano) have folded under another coach?

    Is the locker room leadership itself being overlooked?

    Did Ryan Tannehill and Brian Hartline standing up to the media help?

    Would this team have imploded with Dansby, Bush, and Burnett in that locker room?

    Does Philbin deserve credit for setting the tone by jettisoning those leaders, plus guys like Marshall and Ochocinco?

    Is the coach of the year hype just as overblown as the Incognito Martin drama was in the first place?

    What do you think? Does he truly belong in the conversation?
     
  2. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    No, I don't think Philbin deserves to be in that conversation at all. This isn't a particularly well-coached team- Pretty much every aspect of "coaching" has been done pretty poorly at some point or another, and there are some pretty consistent problems year-round that haven't really been mitigated very well.

    Giving Philbin credit for handling the Incognito thing is baffling and misguided. The fact that it happened in his roster is a huge black mark, and I don't really understand why people treat it like it was something that was handled well- It wasn't. I don't think realistically there was any chance that the team could implode based on it, and frankly losing to the Buccaneers and then going back to business as usual is closer to the worst-case scenario than it was the best.

    Tony Sparano was much more deserving of coach of the year in 2008, to put it in proper context.
     
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  3. Sethdaddy8

    Sethdaddy8 Well-Known Member

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    I think Andy Reid has this locked up .
     
  4. rafael

    rafael Well-Known Member

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    I think Philbin deserves to be in the conversation. He faced a really tough situation and was able to keep the team together. I think the Xs and Os have been a mixed bag. They came out flat against Tampa, which was horrid, but have generally been prepared. There were great halftime adjustments the first three games and then they were bad for a stretch. I've certainly questioned his use (and non-use) of some players, but I do think he's starting to learn some of the player's strengths and taking advantage of them. I don't think he deserves COY, but should be considered. I also think that he's improving as a coach and can be among the best in the very near future.
     
  5. P h i N s A N i T y

    P h i N s A N i T y My Porpoise in Life

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    Yeah, he's done one of the best jobs this year IMO. Reid, Rivera are the other options. I expected 9-10 wins this year, but not while navigating through that **** show we endured. We've been down to the wire every loss but one also. While there have been points where I have been unhappy with coaching, ( mainly play calling, schemes, etc. ) I think we've been a well coached team and it shows... Least penalized team in the league, winning record for a perennially mediocre team facing new adversaties. Coach done pretty darn good so far, the decision hinges on these last two, and we can really open eyes should we get to the playoffs.
     
  6. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    What exactly did they have to overcome with the Incognito/Martin situation?

    There was no split or factionalism in the locker room. You didn't have active players under any sort of serious scrutiny. There have been no on-going developments which result in this being brought back up into the spotlight. There's no further bombshell, other than the initial one(of which the most direct, obvious effects appear to have resulted in the team ****ting the bed badly vs. the Bucs).
     
  7. Alex13

    Alex13 Tua Time !!! Club Member

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    look what happened to you in the last few weeks/months....once you were one of the few supporters of this team, recently you are just the opposite...wtf happened ?
     
  8. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    There are a few positives with this staff. Gameplans have actually been good IMO. They've managed to develop a few players as well. But there were times (not recently) where I thought the team didn't appear to be playing as hard as they could - TB being the primary example.

    I don't think he should be in the consideration this season, but if the team performs next season like it has since the Cincinnati game, then I think he could be in the running.
     
  9. xphinfanx

    xphinfanx Stay strong my friends.

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    The media, the fans, and two starting OLinemen disappearing after already having problems with your young QB being sacked as much as anyone and your team running into consecutive losses after starting the season good for a start.
     
  10. His'nBeatYour'n

    His'nBeatYour'n Glass Ceiling Repairman

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    I'll play some Devils advocate. I'm skeptical about Philbin overall. But overcoming this fiasco was the result of strong leadership. Whether it was all him or not, I am doubtful. And ultimately, I believe, that "not blowing the whole season" doesn't qualify you for coach of the year.

    However.

    They overcame unprecedented intense media scrutiny and distractions. An event like they went through opens the cracks for anyone within the organization or locker room to leverage their own agenda.

    Any player who wasn't/isn't buying in to what Philbin has been selling, could have used the controversy to turn around to the other players and say "see, I told you about Philbin." Some surely did, but they were likely in the minority.

    The distrust as rookies and other young players were complaining about the hazing, specifically $30,000 dinners to reporters.

    Coaches and staff panicking and taking an every man for himself, cover your *** approach to the rest of the season.

    They've withstood immense public pressure to "clean up their own backyard" and managed to only scapegoat the guy who left immature voice mails, and sexually assaulted a golf charity volunteer. The same suspended player that everyone in the locker room wants to see come back.

    I think there were plenty of opportunities for a full blown mutiny. I'm impressed by their ability to stick together. I am merely skeptical about giving Philbin too much credit for that
     
  11. BigDogsHunt

    BigDogsHunt Enough talk...prove it!

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    John Madden (doesnt actually have a vote) gave him the nod over Reid.
     
  12. cdnfinfan

    cdnfinfan New Member

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    why should reid automatically get it ??

    I don't get that thinking. on paper it looks like they kind of made a big turnaround with him(their record) but really they had SIX pro bowlers last year.

    they clearly had good players, but they just couldn't win games. I'm not gonna say Reid DOESN'T deserve it, but I don't think he should have it locked up.
    and I certainly think that Philbin SHOULD be in the running as well.

    Maybe Alex Smith should be a lock for MVP as well huh?
     
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  13. TooGoodForDez

    TooGoodForDez Deion Sanders for GM

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    Absolutely deserves coach of the year consideration. IMO Andy Reid deserves the award. But Philbin maximized the talent on the roster to the fullest.
     
  14. His'nBeatYour'n

    His'nBeatYour'n Glass Ceiling Repairman

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    Even Dion Jordan and Mike Wallace?
     
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  15. muscle979

    muscle979 Season Ticket Holder

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    If they finish 10-6 Reid will be his only serious competition.
     
  16. TooGoodForDez

    TooGoodForDez Deion Sanders for GM

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    Yup, Look at Wallace's 2012 contract year with Big Ben as the primary target.
    As far as Jordan, Philbin may not have maximized playing time for every individual player, but he maximized production at positions given what talent was available for the positions. Vernon has performed well.
     
  17. Desides

    Desides Well-Known Member

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    Most of what you describe here is PR, not coaching.
     
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  18. xphinfanx

    xphinfanx Stay strong my friends.

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    Positive thought.
    [​IMG]
     
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  19. xphinfanx

    xphinfanx Stay strong my friends.

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    The coach had to deal with it all. Not something that just fixes itself or goes away.

    Edit: Good thing the coach had enough depth to fill in the holes and pull of some wins.
     
  20. CitizenSnips

    CitizenSnips hmm.

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    Good thing it's a pr award. Otherwise belicheck deserves it by a mile.

    I'd like to see chip Kelly personally. I think it's really impressive how he stepped in and really did something new in the nfl that a lot of people said couldn't be done.
     
  21. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't think there was anything unprecedented about this. Hell, it's not even the biggest NFL scandal of this year:

    http://www.google.com/trends/explore#q=aaron hernandez, richie incognito, jonathan martin&cmpt=q


    I don't think any of that was all that likely. At this point it's still unclear who is culpable or vulnerable to repercussion outside of Incognito, and the quick appointment of an independent investigation(which has nothing to do with Philbin) has quelled a lot of the potential issues.
     
  22. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    That's two more names far more deserving than Philbin this year.
     
  23. Fin-Omenal

    Fin-Omenal Initiated

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    Philbin is a serious candidate for the honor and deservedly so.

    It gets old coming on here and reading the same group of people *****ing about a WR that has changed the dynamic of this offense, and a coach that has turned a truckload of turmoil, into a team fighting for eachother.

    A lot of half assed pathetic "Dolphins fans" around here.
     
  24. PhinFan1968

    PhinFan1968 To 2020, and BEYOND! Club Member

    Fixed.
     
  25. His'nBeatYour'n

    His'nBeatYour'n Glass Ceiling Repairman

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    The Hernandez issue was a purely off the field issue. The "bullying" scandal called into question everyone within the organization and actually became a bigger national news story as it involved "bullying" and racism* which the national media cares about more than homicide, sadly. Unprecedented.
    *edit - Use of the N-word, not racism.

    Once the national media focused on it, the sports media bent over backwards to admonish the Dolphins who were left to defend locker room culture all by themselves.

    None of this is coach of the year material IMHO, but the fact that the locker room didn't fracture under all the pressure is remarkable.

    I think what quelled the issues was the day all the players spoke up and defended themselves. It gave the sports media something tangible to defend, it gave them some of the other side of the story, and began to expose Martin as being a complete hypocrite.
     
  26. BigDogsHunt

    BigDogsHunt Enough talk...prove it!

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    Frankly with the pariah mentality of the media....its really the Wins that quelled it...moved it to a story that they OVERCAME....if LOSSES piled up, the crap would still be piling up.
     
  27. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You'd have to basically start screaming and wet yourself to display any more of a total inability to intellectually cope with ideas you don't like at this point.

    PS- I'm a way better Dolphins fan than you are.
     
  28. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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  29. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't see how this isn't just as off the field. If involved multiple players, sure.

    It was way less of an "Dolphins vs. the World" thing than that, I think. There was a lot of people whom defended it as business as usual, it was pretty terrible.
     
  30. P h i N s A N i T y

    P h i N s A N i T y My Porpoise in Life

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    Your saying that fiasco should have had no effect on the coaches ability to prepare ? Knowing that everyone had to take time out their preparations to answer to media, investigators, etc. ? Hmmmm. Ps.... Your not a better fan than any of us... Especially not with this whole anti Philbin agenda. Pretty lowsy actually. Sounding like a Firelander digging for negatives in appositive topic about our coach who really is in the running for COTY !
     
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  31. His'nBeatYour'n

    His'nBeatYour'n Glass Ceiling Repairman

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    Hey! I resent that.

    This is the first time I've complained about Wallace. And honestly, it is mostly in the context of criticizing Philbin for not "maximizing" his talent.

    IMHO, if you're primarily going to use him as a deep ball decoy without the ability to hit the deep ball, you might as well have just kept Clyde Gates, signed Ted Ginn, or Darius Heyward-Bay.

    They've utilized him much more creatively lately, but if they were truly maximizing his talent, they'd have been doing this all along.
     
  32. Fin-Omenal

    Fin-Omenal Initiated

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    Nice deflection. Fact is you can call it what you want, but the few who insist on taking a negative approach then have the arrogance to claim they are just "realists" are the same group that doesn't deserve to enjoy this run.

    Your own insecurities have forced you to try and set yourself up for a win-win situation with this team. Part of you is happy when we win, the other part feels vindicated when we don't.

    If someone thinks Tannehill is not a franchise QB yet? That's their opinion, if they think Wallace has sucked? That's their opinion. But when it is the same jerkoffs who on a daily basis are negative about a team that has won 3 straight and has a very good chance to exceed everyone's expectations...to me you become a pathetic excuse for a fan.

    We all have our gripes about the team in some area or another, but to harp on every negative topic you can get your hands on is a joke. Are YOU one of those guys??? Dunno.

    And save it, you can claim to be a better fan than whoever you choose...it's unmeasurable and childish. Frankly something a pessimistic/self proclaimed realist would do. Enjoy subconsciously rooting for the Bills this week. :up:
     
  33. Fin-Omenal

    Fin-Omenal Initiated

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    While I disagree, I can respect an opinion like that.
     
  34. P h i N s A N i T y

    P h i N s A N i T y My Porpoise in Life

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    Who the hell have the chefs, igles beaten anyway ? Prob not Indy, Cincy, NE, Or any teams of that caliber.
     
  35. Fame

    Fame Well-Known Member

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    We are not a well coached team and we are spectacularly slow adapting to change. How can he possibly be coach of the year?
     
  36. His'nBeatYour'n

    His'nBeatYour'n Glass Ceiling Repairman

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    I don't know if that's really true.

    There was a point at which we all believed new crap was going to leak out every other day. It was a feeding frenzy.

    Anyone within the organization who was truly disgruntled could have leaked anything about anyone. Perhaps winning made people within the organization focus on the big football picture.

    However I think the stories dried up because the claims of utter disfunction were as unfounded as the "bullying" story was overblown.
     
  37. Fin-Omenal

    Fin-Omenal Initiated

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    Please elaborate on how we are not well coached.
     
  38. His'nBeatYour'n

    His'nBeatYour'n Glass Ceiling Repairman

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    I don't know how to explain the difference between the Hernandez murder and the "bullying" scandal if you can't already see it yourself. They're not the same and both were unprecedented.

    There were those within the sports media who took the opposing view, but few if any defended the Dolphins locker room specifically.

    Bottom line for me. Anyone with an axe to grind within the Dolphins organization had a golden opportunity to throw their grievances into the feeding frenzy.
    The "bullying" scandal was bull****. But the pressure it created on everyone within the organization from the owner on down to the locker room, would have exposed weak leadership. It didn't. But I still don't think that makes Joe Philbin coach of the year.
     
  39. P h i N s A N i T y

    P h i N s A N i T y My Porpoise in Life

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    Results, it's what matters...... If Miami finishes 10-6 he's sure to be considered.
     
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  40. His'nBeatYour'n

    His'nBeatYour'n Glass Ceiling Repairman

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    Respect is mutual. But where do you disagree?

    Just curious. (and arrogantly astounded that anyone would question my rock solid arguments)
     
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