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Can we end this stadium debate once and for all?

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Bumrush, Dec 16, 2013.

  1. KB21

    KB21 Almost Never Wrong Club Member

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    Will the stadium structure support moving the stands closer to the field? I think this has been discussed in the past, but I'm thinking that the structure of the stadium was a cause for concern with moving the seats closer to the field.

    The team needs a new stadium, period. They also do not need to do anything that would further diminish the tremendous natural advantage this team has over other teams in the NFL -- the heat in Miami in August and September.
     
  2. Coloradotrv

    Coloradotrv Well-Known Member

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    I think they should either put a roof over the stands as proposed, or use a shell type roof like they have in seattle. Both keep the field open to the elements while keeping most of the fans dry. As much as I personally don't care if it rains on me during a football game, the people that tend to go to Superbowls do.


    That is the other thing that I think JW is missing. This is more than just being about fan comfort and fan noise during games. The NFL will not play another super bowl in Miami until the stadium is either renovated or rebuilt. That economic impact that comes from playing a super bowl in south florida every 4-5 years is huge for the owner and the city. That is the main reason the stadium plans are being pushed.
     
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  3. KB21

    KB21 Almost Never Wrong Club Member

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    Considering the likelyhood that it will snow at this year's superbowl, the NFL can blow chunks on the idea of keeping the fans out of the elements.
     
    Mainge likes this.
  4. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    It makes sense on so many levels..monetarily, culturally,and if done right, with the 12 the man concept at the forefront of the blueprint, a serious competitive advantage for the team that creates exposure and income for both franchises.
     
  5. Section126

    Section126 We are better than you. Luxury Box

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    Yes..the structure can support it...but it is extremely expensive..to the point where it is cheaper to just knock it all down and start over.

    it is not a difficult project, just very expensive to remodel what we have, rather than just "rebuild".
     
  6. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Totally interchangable...totally Phins and canes..and completely built structurally to get the fans closer to the action then any other venue in sports..then you will have a movement, then when you start to see the results that the fans can impact the game, sit back and start counting the millions you will be bringing in because of it..
     
  7. DolfanTom

    DolfanTom Livin' and Dyin' w/ Ryan!

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    Came down for the Charger game this year, and while the place was 2/3 full, it did get loud for key third downs for the Chargers in the fourth. I can only imagine that a full house like Sunday (and even better when they are all Dolfans, or close) can get really loud. In that sense, there is no issue w/ the stadium as is - we can get by.

    BUT

    We can do better, and make the place even louder and more hellacious for teams to visit SoFla. It sounds like - from what I'm reading here - it would be just cheaper to build a new one. So be it - do it Ross! And if we are going to go through the hassle of doing so, make it OB2 like DJ always says. Would be incredible.

    But in the meantime, if this darn team can consistently win, it will be better for now.
     
  8. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Agreed, it doesn't make sense..once again, the top row is what it is, and that is the farthest top row from the field in sports, you would literally have to cut 30/35 feet of the top all the way around, then gut the inside and move everything closer to the field...

    I really would not suggest a Jerry world type of new stadium, one that totally thought of everything except the 12 the man concept, I would spend less money on the structure, completely focus on the proximity and design of the stands in the most unique way possible, sit back and count the freakin cash, and help your two programs rebuild their culture faster than any other scenarios, and just make so many people happy.
     
  9. DolfanTom

    DolfanTom Livin' and Dyin' w/ Ryan!

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    You know another thing (and please keep in mind I'm still all for a new OB2 concept like stadium), JRS has never seen a true Dolphins dynasty, like the 70s, and even the quality of hte early 80's. Sure, there was always Dan Marino, and the Dolphins were competitive, but the Dolphins have never been THE team to beat in the AFC for several years since JRS opened.

    I would love to see what happens to attendance, atmosphere at JRS if the Dolphins - say - grab that mantle going forward and become either what the Pats and Colts were over the past 13 years or so. Would probably be a tough ticket, like they are in Foxboro right now. Oh, Foxboro .... once upon a time, you couldn't give those tickets away. I went there for the Dolphins-Pats finale in '92 when the Pats were 2-14 and, besides about 15K Dolfans, the Pats friends and family were there. Place was at least half empty.

    But now, look what consistent winning has done for them attendance wise, either in the old - and most horrible - stadium, and new!

    If the Dolphins can become THAT team, it will do two things - it will pack JRS and make it a better place, and it will also bring more momentum to build a new place, however that is to get done. So I guess what I'm saying is Just Win Baby!!
     
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  10. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    Everyone always talks about how great the atmosphere is in Seattle and the Dolphins need to build a stadium which will create this same type of excitement and to enhance their chances of getting another SB in South Florida.

    The problem with that thinking is that several Super Bowls have already been held in South Florida and played in Sun Life stadium. Yet, not one Super Bowl has ever been held in Seattle.

    As far as having a roof on the stadium. I have been going to Dolphin games since 1966 and I have never seen any reason to have a roof or any type of covering over the stadium. So what if it is hot and humid in the early part of the season. People living in South Florida are used to this type of weather and shouldn't be complaining about having to spend a few hours in the heat and humidity to watch a Dolphin game. The heat and humidity should be a benefit for the team, just as the cold and snow usually benefit the cold weather teams late in the season.

    I will be moving to Hawaii at the end of January, so my many years as a season ticket holder will also end after the Jets game in two weeks. So what the stadium will end up looking like in the coming years really doesn't matter to me. I do know that if I were still living in South Florida and the next stadium had a roof, I really wouldn't have any interest in going to the games. I have been to the dome stadiums in Houston and New Orleans for Dolphin games and I really hated being in an enclosed stadium. It just didn't feel like football to me. Football was meant to be played in the elements and putting a roof on a stadium takes away from the game, IMO.
     
  11. patcobb

    patcobb Active Member

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    Could not have said it better. I have season tics in the nose bleeds. Section 410. Had an amazing view of Amendola getting the ball punched through his arms and then the game winning interception. Having said that, my section was mostly patriot fans. I loved it. Loved every minute of it. I loved seeing patriot fans pre and post game in packs and taunting them that their reign was over and that we are the future and them having to take it.
     
  12. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Nobody is talking dome..

    Really you don't care what happens when your gone like you said, so no reason to respond to this shallow opinion.
     
  13. Desides

    Desides Well-Known Member

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    To contrast, you can see the action from any seat in that stadium. There are no obstructions.
     
  14. Coloradotrv

    Coloradotrv Well-Known Member

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    Yes super bowls have been held in South Florida. Superbowl 41 was held in the rain, the first superbowl game held in the rain. The commissioner and the "fans" that attended that game were upset. Superbowl 44 was held in Miami and the week started off with torrential rain, bringing up memories of the previous superbowl in Miami. It did not end up raining during the game itself, however the commissioner has said Miami will likely not receive any future superbowls until a roof is added to the stadium and upgrades to bring the "fan" experience into the 21st century are made. The proposed roof is not a dome. It is open on all four sides and over the playing surface. It would keep the rain and the direct sunlight off of the fans. While still insuring the field is humid, hot, and miserable for visiting teams.

    After the snowy disaster that this superbowl will likely be in NY. The game will only be played in domes or stadiums where the "fans" are protected from the elements. That is the reality of it.
     
  15. PhinGeneral

    PhinGeneral PC Texas A&M, Bro Club Member

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    I think the argument is getting mixed here. If people are arguing that a stadium like Seattle's will help procure a SB because of fan excitement, that argument is off base IMO. The NFL really doesn't care about fan excitement that much. The SB will bring its own excitement, even with stands full of corporate tools who couldn't tell a rugby ball from a football. The NFL is all about the amenities like top-notch luxury boxes and stadium clubs, etc.

    It's the fans that want the atmosphere to be like Seattle's.
     
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  16. Coloradotrv

    Coloradotrv Well-Known Member

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    Exactly

    SB "fans" want to be protected from the elements and watch a game in a place with the latest tech and best amenities

    Real Fans want a better atmosphere. Could care less about the amenities. On this board at least, it seems most people just want the stadium to be closer to the field. Keep the great sight lines just bring the seats in.
     
  17. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    The reality is that the NFL uses the Super Bowl as an opportunity to take care of the sponsors that provide them their billions in revenue. Executives of Fortune 500 companies aren't going to be impressed by crowd noise and a loud stadium.
     
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  18. sandcastle

    sandcastle Active Member

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    There's an interesting concept for the Qatar World Cup that might be a good fit for the Dolphins -- an artificial cloud blimp. http://cnn.com/video/?/video/tech/2011/03/25/sot.wc.qatar.cloud.robots.cnn

    Comfort from the sun was one the first issues Ross raised and I wouldn't be surprised that it's been identified as a major issue. The SF Giants doubled their attendance, which has been helped by not having to bring a winter coat to the game as one had to do with their old stadium. Likewise, comfort is probably affecting Dolphins attendance as the sunniest seats are purchased by new, lukewarm and visiting fans and their game day experience provides little incentive to buy tickets again.
     
  19. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    The reason why the Super Bowl ain't coming back is because they want an awning on the roof and some more amenities..so either you upgrade to fit, or you take yourself out of the loop..

    All JW cares about is his own personal viewing ship lol..that opinion is far from what were discussing, it's more about what we need to do to get the Super Bowl back instead of losing money on it not being here and how that averages out in the long run if investment is made by the community..

    The 12 the man concept is another topic, and is a brilliant movement for the reasoning behind building a new one for two programs..

    If folks can understand how the venue and it's architecture directly correlates with the 12th man movement, then they should be able to understand how many levels that movement could help two separate programs make money, and help the team win games...thus even-ing out the costs of a new structure..

    Now if you combine both topics, and build a new one like I'm talking about here, then you accomplish EVERYTHING....the Super Bowl rotation is back, two programs cultures get a true 12th man venue built to spec , the money starts to come in thru increased ticket sales, merchandise, exposure of the uniquely built structure, and most importantly, how it aids the team winning games.

    It's a win win win..there is no risk..

    It's a ridiculously obviousl investment opp that none of the suits around here can conceptualize..

    If you disagree, please tell me the risks of what I just described?

    It's a homerun investment, especially when you can subtract the costs of the renovations and add that to the new venue..

    Your really talking about an extra 4 to 500 mill..
     
    Unlucky 13 likes this.
  20. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    Well DJ, at least I have been going to the games for years. I happened to go back and look at the Patriot- Dolphin thread when I got home from the game this past week. While reading through the comments, I noticed that you were posting during the game. That would appear to mean that even though you are listed as a season ticket holder, you didn't go to the game this past weekend.

    I find it strange that you would complain about the atmosphere in the stadium and yet you don't brother to show up for the game. Perhaps if you and many others who complain about the overall atmosphere at the stadium and the lack of crowd noise actually attended the games in person, the noise level would be much louder.

    As far as my comment that I won't care what the stadium is like when I move from South Florida. I have told you many times that I see absolutely nothing wrong with the stadium the way it is right now. Yet if they decide to renovate it or even build a new stadium once I am no longer living here, why would it matter to me? I will always be a Dolphin fan, even if they were playing in a high school stadium. But I will be living over 5000 miles away and I doubt if I will ever travel back to Miami to watch another game once we move away. I'm sure I will travel to a Dolphin game on the West Coast from time to time, but I won't fly to Miami for another game.

    Therefore it won't matter to me personally what is done to this stadium in the future. I have told you before that I hope you get your wish for an upgrade to the stadium. Hopefully these upgrades will be enough that you will actually want to attend games at the stadium, instead of sitting at home and watching your team play before thousands of empty seats.
     
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  21. Stitches

    Stitches ThePhin's Biggest Killjoy Luxury Box

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    I'm pretty sure that is a reflection of post count (or join date maybe?), but I could be wrong.
     
  22. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    Actually I sit in section 143, which isn't that close to the end zone. I'm glad to read that I am not the only plus 60 year old getting up and cheering on big plays. I do wear shorts to the games, but I quit wearing LOGO shirts a long time ago. A comfortable golf shirt with a Dolphin logo is about as far as I go today.
     
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  23. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    You are probably right, but I was just surprised to see that he wasn't at the game after complaining so much about the lack of noise in the stadium. Perhaps DJ has moved out of South Florida since he joined this forum and that is why he doesn't attend games anymore. I hope that is the case.
     
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  24. JPPT1974

    JPPT1974 2022 Mother's Day and May Flowers!

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    Need to either get a new stadium. Or need to have a like $500M renovation of it. Sooner rather than later! It is twenty-six years old!
     
  25. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    Simms said the stadium PA and sound system was the loudest he's heard, not the fans LOL.

    Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk
     
  26. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Post Hard, Post Often Club Member

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    Weren't closer seats part of the last proposal? Couldn't they just adjust seat heights to change the slope of the viewing angles???

    Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk
     
  27. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    jw, because I live in Cali and can't make the games like you can doesn't mean jack in this conversation , you really don't understand where I'm coming from on these topics, you keep saying the same thing.."you don't see anything wrong with the building, you love the heat beating on you, you love the rain, you don't care if Goodell comes back with the Super Bowl, you would watch your team in a parking lot"... I get that my friend, but you are in the minority and imo you don't understand what a new inspired unique venue like what I'm talking about can do for a culture, economy, and the teams involved, I say that with no disrespect, just that we've had this convo a million times, and we both never see each other's side, so lets just drop it.
     
  28. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I figured as much, but no one would of believed me though so I kept it quiet..folks want to believe we can make a difference and our building is the same as others, just that it's missing some people...they couldn't be further from the reality of the situation.

    I watch the fans very closely, when I'm at the game and when I'm not, the first three quarters was terrible, but once again it's not all their fault..that's what happens when you feel that kind of distance between you and the action..

    Sun life like JW says is a fine place to watch a game, it's real comfortable, you see the field, the field is beautiful, you don't have any rowdy fans, no one screaming in your ear or standing in your way obstructing your view.

    If thats what you want, to appease that type of fan, that keep it as is..if you wanna make a difference in the game, in the economy, in the culture, and just the complete excitement of getting your fanbase and team connected on game day to the level where it can actually affect the opponent negatively, it will never happen as is..
     
  29. jw3102

    jw3102 season ticket holder

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    Your right, we just have a different perspective on the stadium. I certainly respect your point of view and your arguments concerning the need for a new or renovated stadium, I just feel differently than you do on this issue. So I agree that we both should just agree to disagree and limit our discussions to other things related to the Dolphins in the future and not even worry about discussing the stadium. Whatever is going to happen in regards to the stadium will happen and since you now live in California and I'll soon live in Hawaii, it will be up to those fans in South Florida to determine the future of the stadium.

    I wasn't aware you lived so far from South Florida. Since you are listed as a season ticket holder, I assumed you still lived in the area. Sorry if my comments about you not attending games offended you. I figured you lived here and just weren't attending games because of your unhappiness with the stadium. I guess I have just encounters far too many, so called Dolphin fans, who do live in South Florida, yet they NEVER attend any games. For the most part, these are people who have the financial resources to attend games, but they would rather sit home and watch the games and then complain about the lack of people at the games. I'm happy to see that you are not one of these people.

    After January, you and I will be in the same situation. I will be living so far away that I won't be attending games in Miami anymore. I don't know what part of California you live in but perhaps you and I will someday end up in the same stadium watching the Dolphins when they play one of the teams located in California. I have previously attended Dolphin games in San Francisco, Oakland, and San Diego and hope to again, once we move to Hawaii. My Daughter, her husband, and our two grandsons will be living in Seattle soon and I'm sure my wife and I will be visiting them often. So hopefully I'll be able to attend a game when the Dolphins visit the Seahawks in the coming years.

    Enjoy the game this week and hopefully the Dolphins will go up to Buffalo and win against an inferior opponent.
     
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  30. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    The structure can hold up and be molded for further strengthening but there is only so much that can be done to move the seats forward. The angle will not be nearly as sharp as it should be. Not perfect but good enough. Thats not for the noise so much as it would be to let the fans have a really good view of the game. It can keep them interested more than interested in just drinking.

    A new stadium aint happening. Period.


    But as it is now, it gets plenty loud. The view is just to distant.
     
  31. Hellion

    Hellion Crash Club Member

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    Here and there
    The fact remains is the NFL wants Super Bowls in Miami, Ross wants SB's in Miami, the networks want SB's in Miami as I am sure local businesses do, what Miami Dolphin fans want or think is irrelevant. So when you put multi billion dollar corporations into the same mind set then something will eventually get done. Saying there is zero chance is ridiculous.
     
  32. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    There is 0 chance of a new stadium at this time and within the near future. No matter what you think.
     
  33. Hellion

    Hellion Crash Club Member

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    Here and there
    OK Mayor
     
  34. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    Im just stating how it is. You don't have to agree but its correct. Nio big companies are going to invest because they can spend pennies to the dollar and have any stadium named after their product.

    The only help will be private investors and only so much will be given by the NFL. They have a limit.

    But thats not even why it wont happen. The Dolphins were purchased for 250,000,000 dollars more than the teams estimated worth, by Ross, so he could also own the stadium. So tell me why the hell he would even consider a new stadium?

    It's renovate or nothing.
     
  35. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    I listened to that and I thought he was talking about the Colts venue. He said that Seattle and NO do the same thing. Turn the speakers up to full blast.
     
  36. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box

    That would mean luxury boxes would have to be redone or emliminated. That being the one thing the owner wants to keep in any stadium.

    A new stadium could be built for nearly the cost of proper renovations but it would have to be as simple as it gets and about 65,000 seats.
     
  37. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Private investment..yup, that what were talking about here..great oppurtunity for some private investors.
     
  38. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    http://www.nfl.com/qs/2020/week-1.jsp. No we cannot end this stadium debate thing..

    Quote..."the future of the NFL is smaller more INTIMATE stadiums designed for enhanced fan experience"


    Remember our debate on the word "intimate". You'd made fun of it...Looks like someone is listening to my ridiculous theories, to bad our suits don't seem to understand the disadvantage sunlife provides their own pockets and two of their hometown franchises..

    Build the freakin thing now..

    Fan performance, competition between fanbases based on performance and game participation will be the side story, intimate stadiums, fan energy impacting the opponent, is how you will get fans back in the stadium, not freakin wifi access, big screens, and hand held devices to watch your fantasy league..unbelievable.

    This future, could of been our future, a long *** time ago..no one listened to me then, lets hope someone does now.
     
  39. Ozzy

    Ozzy Premium Member Luxury Box


    Goddam right I made fun of it. The NFL is not meant to have their fans get intimate with the team during games. Its meant to be rowdy.

    Now instead of patting yourself on the back for this bs dont forget to admit that it was me who said the stadium needs to be much smaller.
     
  40. Bumrush

    Bumrush Stable Genius Club Member

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    What's the point of having a stadium when the product is dogsh*t.

    Once again we have proven why a new stadium would be a waste of money. I wouldn't spend a dollar of taxpayer money when people are starving on the street to support this supposed product.
     

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