That is part of player development, and considering how much better Olivier Vernon, Nolan Carroll, Jimmy Wilson, Charles Clay, and Rishard Matthews are this year than they were last year, this is by far the best player development coaching staff this team has had since the Shula days. But, you still don't coach the skill into the player. You coach the technique, and that allows the player's natural skill level to come out. Players that don't have a natural skill level, there is no amount of technique that will make them more skillful.
How do you compare what Bush did last yr to anything our running backs did this yr. It's the point coach wanted Bush gone and went with worse talent. Seems as if his evaluating is off a bit......oh no wait....Its always Irelands fault.....we get it
You are clearly not willing to give the head coach the same context that you want to give Jeff Ireland for some reason. For instance, you say that Joe was behind the trading of Brandon Marshall. There is absolutely no evidence to support this, while there is good evidence that supports the idea that the Dolphins had been discussing a trade of Brandon Marshall since that season ended, before Joe was ever hired. Heck, Joe didn't even go to the Senior Bowl when he was hired. He was busy putting together a staff. Joe Philbin was hired on January 20th. Brandon Marshall was traded on March 14th. Do you seriously think without having any discussion previously that Jeff Ireland was able to wrangle out a deal less than a month and a half after the head coach was hired simply due to the coach's desire to not have that type of character on his team? The trade was even in the works before the night club incident. With Vontae Davis, Jeff Ireland took the call about a trade with the Colts. He asked Joe his opinion, and Joe told him that he didn't think Vontae had the work ethic to fulfill his potential in Miami. There is no evidence that Joe Philbin went to Jeff Ireland and told him that he no longer wanted Vontae Davis on the team. There is also no evidence that Joe went to Jeff and demanded that Karlos Dansby be replaced.
Dansby playing better in Arizona is no indictment of our coaching staff either. Dansby was here through two coaching regimes and played at about the same level through both. He was neither better or worse playing under Philbin and Coyle than he was under Sparano and Nolan, IMO. He is obviously a better fit for the defense Arizona plays and is surrounded by more talent, as he was when he played for Arizona prior to his time in Miami.
Yeah. I'm sure Joe Philbin went to Jeff Ireland and told him to not offer Reggie Bush a contract. http://www.prideofdetroit.com/2013/3/20/4126608/reggie-bush-joe-philbin-lions Yeah. That screams to me that Joe Philbin didn't want to resign Reggie Bush.
But I'm sure Ross knows what Ireland's responsibilities are. And since he and not the fans makes the decision that's what matters. All the self-serving speculation about what players Ireland "forced" on to Philbin is moot. As is the simplistic idea that the title means the buck stops there. That may matter if the goal is make someone pay, but if bringing in good players is the goal then it would matter if the coach and GM were collaborating. Since everybody agrees that having the coach and GM work together is a good thing and that we'd want the next GM to work with Philbin then it would obviously matter going forward what recommendations Philbin made. IMO it is almost a given that those FAs pursued right out of the gate were the ones the coaches reviewed tape on and specifically wanted targeted (Wallace, Ellerbe and Wheeler).
Philbin had plenty of time as the new head coach to evaluate the game and behavior patterns of Brandon Marshall..why the hell would Ireland trade for the guy then trade the guy for less then what he gave up..that was a Philbin call all the way imo..especially with the comments before we ever took the field as to what type of receivers he wants in this offense.. Philbin was talking sh&$ about VD behind closed doors to anyone who would listen..it was obvious he had no respect for the player. Why would Ireland get rid of bush, what did he ever do to Ireland but make him look like he made a good acquisition. I've seen and heard from multiple coaches on offense talk about a style of runner that they preferred after last season ended..it matched up all to well with the whole negative yards on runs distaste. Your last paragraph doesn't make a whole lot of sense but I'll try.. He did have a chance to evaluate both Marshall and Davis to make a decision on some players he didn't want here..coaches watch film in the offseason of every player on their roster, they know what their comfortable heading into the season and where there not.. Just because players like Dansby and bush didn't shut it done is more of a credit to them, and adds more clarity as to why Ireland would NOT want to get rid of those guys, and more clarity that Philbin initiated a new direction on both players.. Why in the world would jeff Ireland want to get rid of Reggie and Karlos and Brandon and Vontae?? O reasons from a GM perspective who aquired them in the first place.
You think that quote is any different then any other coaches quote about a departing player...to use that surface level comment shows me more blindness.
Because he is a moron? Remember, this moron is the one that traded for Marshall in the first place, knowing full well the baggage that he brought. He didn't learn his lesson, as he gave a big money contract to Mike Wallace this offseason. The guy is one of the worst GM's in all of sports.
lol..I'm not defending that he is a good GM, I'm defending someone who I believe started into and inherited thereafter a poor situation as it relates to the normal GM getting a job, and trying to place blame as accurately as possible.. I know there is a few things that piss you off about him, but really my main concern when it comes to that position is all about ability to evaluate talent..for me it's not like a player playing the right way, if my GM is a dick sometimes but is good at the main task I can live with it..for example, Dez Bryant is such a douchbag I really don't care what the GM said to him, because the player was probably so stupid in the interview the GM had no choice. So I'm just trying to figure out who he is responsible for and add it up at the end of this year.. At the same time, I'm trying to figure out if this coaching staff is the right one long term.. I'm watching this bowl game with bridgewater against the canes, and bridewater is bootlegging on a lot of plays because he can go either way and square..Ryan Tannehill can do that even more effortlessly than teddy, and yet it disappears out of the gameplan for two three game stretches.. You say the coaches are coaching this poor roster to achieve more than their capable of...I don't agree with that..I think there have been games where the talent was enough to win..
Exactly how is the situation that he took over and inherited any different from what most GM's encountered? He took over a team that had won 9 games three seasons prior to his taking over. The team had 6-7 win talent and underachieved to a 1-15 record in the prior season. That 2007 season is the only season in this span of mediocrity that anyone can objectively say that the team did not live up to the talent it had. Jeff Ireland inherited a 6 win talent team, and he has built that team in 6 years into a 7-8 win talent team.
Ah so everyone should just agree to disagree and be very polite about it...until they disagree with you. In that case they're biased, blind, and basing their opinions off nothing. That sounds about right.
Yep I can do that to. Philbin gave up on him. Ireland promptly traded him. http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1411216-is-reggie-bush-in-joe-philbins-doghouse
Wait, what..Jeff Ireland in the context that you have judged him inherited a 1 and 15 team with a chosen coach, chosen not by him, he had an executive above him that was hired by an owner to buy the groceries, who also left him with said lame duck coach..it was everything but the normal situation for a new GM accepting a position.
are you really trying to tell me that Ireland was responsible for getting rid of Dansby, Bush, Marshall, Davis.?, and your telling me that Jake long didn't want to be here because of Ireland?...taking into account how those players were all aquired. If you are, then I stand by what I said..your distaste for the GM has clouded your judgement..criticize him all you want for the other stuff, but those five players were aquired by that GM..and really showed nothing from a performance standpoint to justify a GM wanting to get rid of..
Ireland didn't trade him. He left as a free agent. Personally, I don't see what the big deal is here. The Dolphins thought they had an emerging star with Lamar Miller and declined to offer Bush what he wanted. I'd say that's probably more on Ireland but Philbin might just be culpable as well. But a Bleacher Report article which speculates on Reggie being in Philbin's dog house at one point last season doesn't prove a whole lot.
Exactly, touché with the surface level retort. Reggie bush was one of the first free agents signed by Ireland when Parcells cowarded out...he became a thousand yard back..set a great example off the field.. Why can't folks just admit that the coach wanted a new identity then what was in his leadership council..lol
Then why did he take the job? The Dolphins could have done what Ron Wolf had recommended and hired Scott McCloughan or John Schnieder, and the team would have been much better off. The team would have been better off had they done what I wanted and hired Tom Heckert Jr. Instead, Bill Parcells brought in someone that he had brought up in his philosophy and believed in said philosophy. Jeff Ireland wasn't the the lone wolf in the organization that dissented against Parcells. Take the Jake Long pick. Bill Parcells wanted Chris Long with that pick, but Jeff and Tony wanted Jake Long. Bill gave them a window to negotiate with Jake Long, and if they didn't get a contract, they were to start talking with Chris Long's representation. Bill did not overrule Jeff on that pick. Jeff wanted Jake Long, and Jake Long was drafted. Jeff wasn't drug kicking and screaming to this job. He took the job because he believed in Parcells, and per his typical personality, when he started catching heat after Parcells left, he blamed Parcells's philosophy as one that was outdated. Jeff is all about self preservation, and he doesn't care who he throws under the bus as long as he can deflect blame from himself. This is why I say Jeff has no integrity, and he has used the media to attempt to convince the fan base that Joe Philbin has more blame than he does for the issues this team has. You win with good people, and Jeff Ireland is not a good person.
im not your enemy, I don't hate you, I don't talk bad about you, that's what I'm talking about in that post, I hate when posters that I respect say extremely mean things about other posters t I respect... just cause I think your clouded on this topic doesn't mean I don't respect you.
Albert Breer took an in depth look into the power structure of all 32 teams not too long ago. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap10...harge-bill-belichicks-savvy-clear-in-afc-east Now, there may be some that try to say Breer just made this up. Well, he's one of the NFL's better investigative reporters. He's right up there with Jeff Darlington. I doubt he just threw this together without researching it. He clearly states that Jeff Ireland has all the power over the 53 man roster and personnel. Dawn Aponte is nothing more than the contract negotiator and cap manager. She has no say in who gets signed. Her job is to try and structure the contract of the player Jeff Ireland wants and make it fit into the league mandated salary cap. Joe Philbin's job is to coach that talent. The problem we have is that the talent Jeff Ireland has brought in does not fit the vision Joe Philbin has for the roster, from a technical standpoint and a character standpoint. Now, I think Jeff's biggest issue with evaluating talent is that he really struggles to evaluate players that do not fit "the prototype" standards that Bill Parcells set. Joe Philbin's vision isn't set on the Parcells prototype as much as it is set on having players with intelligence and explosiveness. There is a disconnect here, and too many are blaming it on the coaching staff. The other issue with Jeff is that he tries to act like his mentor Parcells, but he doesn't have the clout that Parcells has. So, he doesn't get away with being a prick the way Parcells does.
How many f'ing excuses does an executive get? The problem with Jeff Ireland is he isn't horrible enough to fire but he's also not good enough to keep. He's had 6 years to build a roster and 6 years in, we still have major holes in our roster. The upgrade at LB has been an epic failure and what he did to our OL borders on criminal, at least from the battery RTH has taken. On top of all that, he's dug his own grave by being a jackass. The incident with the fan was completely unprofessional as well as the Dez Bryant issue. The Incognito brought a lot of embarrassment and negative attention to the Dolphins. He ignored the wishes of Philbin and to me, that is the death knell.
I struggle with both sides of this argument. I firnly believed that we needed to give Ireland time out from under Parcels to see what he was really about.. he has done some nice things and missed on a few things, I think no more than any other GM in the league. but... the point I can't get past is the state of the O line since he has been here. with the O line guru Sparano as head coach I would have thought it would have been a strong point. Philbin and Sherman (regardless of what others currently think of him) are offensive minded and proven. yet... our biggest issue is the continuing decline of the one area we have been stacked at with coaching. the only comon denominator is the man who gets the talent the coaches need. I think six years is more than enough.
I understand the criticism, but I'm arguing specific points about specific players, if we go 9 and 7 and make playoffs it becomes a harder decision for me personally.
Aaaaaaaaaaaaannnnnddd... the clock starts until Jeffyboy's next career as a DL Scout for some cold-weather team. Or managing a Chili's in Minnesota.
A lot of folks said that if we made the playoffs, Jeffy should be okay for another season. And I swear to god, I'll never understand that failure to grasp the consistent, continued failure in roster-building attributable to him and him only the past three years, in favor of coming out on the right side of an arbitrary set of circumstances—out of the team's control—and that's IF THEY WON. Mystifying.
