I think it's really tough to compare the two because they're asked to handle a game different, scheme different, players etc. However.. I would think Nick Foles in Chip Kelly's offense is better than Ryan Tannehill in Joe Philbin's offense. Like I think Tannehill in Philly with Kelly would be much better than Foles here in Miami with Philbin.
I think regardless of surrounding variables you must isolate the qbs play..see what Andrew luck did with his receivers..the Qb drives the scoreboard, players become interchangable when your that great.. Ryan has a long way to go..touch, feel for the rush..reactionary quickness. In fairness to Ryan, he was constricted to use one element of his skillset in the gameplan..the offensive coordinator gave the defense no reason to cover all lengths of the field. In criticizing Ryan, he did not take it upon himself to make plays from the pocket when protection broke down, he did not show the feel and quickness to reset his platform, or, to be any type of natural playmaker.. It's gonna take more than an arm to win a championship...you cannot be a statue in the pocket, you must have foot quickness and upper body maneuverability and peripheral awareness. At this point I only hope a new coordinator will embrace the entire skillset, thus allowing him to engage some other weapons in his repertoire..
Greg Cosell would disagree with you. He's one of the few analysts who watches a ton of film. He comments regularly on the Colin Cowherd ESPN radio show and has made similar observations.
Why? Looking at just the passing components of the QBR, RT would have had the 5th highest passer rating in the league. And conversely Foles would have struggled mightily facing the pressure RT faced.
the great matt barkley looked like shyt because he's a 3rd string rookie playing under a new system. what is your point? he played 6 quarters. who is to say he couldnt have turned it around with a few more games? i said kelly was a great offensive mind, not jesus. if you dont think foles is a product of chip kelly's system, then tell me why he looked like shyt under andy reid's system. thats why they drafted shytty barkley in the first place.
If the coach cannot motivate the team and get his p,ayers to be emotionally ready to compete at the level it takes to close an important football game,then the Qb should have.. How you ask..by letting yourself go a little loco emotionally, and setting the tone with your legs..tell the whole fu@&ing world, your going to do everything possible to get a first down..every play I will play like its the last..not just drop and throw and thats it...your not giving yourself enough options to be successful on any given play..if the throw is there then for sure, trust your arm and make the throw, but your mind when you drop must be able to multitask, you must always have that sense of, if the throw is not there, I must adjust my platform, my body, or run to make a play...
True..with a good to great run game it can make life easier for a qb, I'm trying to figure out how much, and if that difference is good enough to win a championship.
We haven't been a complete team since the Griese era. Marino never had a championship defense. Zack and Jason captained a damn good defense which usually had no real QB/offensive threat...Ricky and Ronnie had Penny for 1 full season but aside from that they played with mediocre starting QBs...Now in the current situation we have pieces all over to make a good team but neither the OFF or D has it's act together fully. Special teams isn't perfect either. Even with Shula as coach and Marino at QB we couldn't win a ring. Yet Brad Johnson can with the Bucs and their ridiculous defense...so we have a long way to go defensively.
u did answer me. u win. a third string rookie qb who played a grand total of 6 quarters couldnt light up the scoreboard.
Why? His team lost and Foles wasn't spectacular but he has a 105 QBR. His YPA were down but NO has the #2 pass defense in the league. I think Foles played really well and scored a go ahead TD with 3 minutes left. Special teams blunder gave the game away. NO played well on defense for sure. As for Foles vs. Tanny it's still too early. After year 4 maybe even 5 we'll have a better idea. Tom Brady was called a caretaker and system QB just a few years ago.
I'm not talking about Wallace, I'm talking about Tannehill. Tannehill has his own job to do, which is why top QBs are paid $20 million/year, because they're expected to hit an acceptable level of those open downfield throws. As far as Wallace is concerned, he's never needed to be a jump ball receiver b/c he didn't have this inaccuracy problem with Roethlisberger. Ben used that 4.28 speed to his advantage rather than underthrowing everything and turning Wallace into a jump ball receiver and wasting every bit of separation Wallace creates with the ball in the air. If the goal was to throw jump balls in tight coverage that stand little chance of being completed, we could've continued throwing them to Hartline. You bring in Wallace so that you DON'T have to throw those. Seriously, what's the f***ing point of signing the game's best vertical speed threat and then have him stop and come back to the QB on the majority of deep throws?! That's taking a guy who's OPEN and suddenly making him UN-OPEN, with the QB flat out handing the cornerback an opportunity to get in on the play!! That's just not acceptable, and it's ridiculous that fans make excuses for this poor QB execution. Wallace now understands he's with a QB who has problems with the deep ball which is why he stated his goal of the offseason is to improve his ability to convert those inaccurate deep throws.
LOL why, because he actually BEAT his inferior divisional rival in a must-win week 17 game to make the playoffs?...... Why, because he had a 105.0 passer rating against the Saints with 2 TD, 0 INT, and threw what would've been the game-winning TD had Philly's defense held up on the game's final drive? In comparison, Tannehill had just 2 games this year with a higher passer rating.... and only one multiple TD, zero INT game all season. How did Tannehill do today, genius? That's right, we didn't make the playoffs b/c he messed the bed the last 2 weeks against Buffalo and NY with a combined passer rating of 43.5 with 1 lonely TD, 3 INTs, 286 total yards, 44.8% completions, and a bunch of missed plays. Foles needed just 11 games to win 9; Tannehill couldn't do it in 16, nuthugger.
I think if Moore had been starting he'd have hit more deep passes to Wallace. He did pretty well as I recall, throwing deep to Marshall in 2011.
The Saints use a technique on QB sneaks we should adopt. The announcer mentioned it, Collins came in and pushed Brees from behind, sort of like a Rugby scrum.
The thing ya gotta remember is some fans have already anointed Tannehill as the savior Franchise QB even though he really hasn't earned it yet. Sure, other than 1 yr of Pennington, (97.4 QBR) and 1 yr of Moore,(87.1 QBR) he is playing QB better than anyone since Marino, but when one looks at whom he's compared to, it's damning with faint praise. Tannehill is the hope that springs eternal within the human breast and for you to speak critically about his performance...well, it just can't be.
The passing components? It's all passing components. Attempts, Completions, Yards, TDs, Ints. Those are the numbers plugged in, to get the QBR. To say that Tannehill would have posted better stats than Foles if he were the Eagles QB this season amounts to no more than idle speculation.
Really ? They have a better running game.....hmmmmm, who builds a teams running game.....I wonder who ? And there are people still defending our talent procurer....insanity.
No it isn't, there are also sacks, "clutch" plays, win probability, and other such bull****. http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/6833215/explaining-statistics-total-quarterback-rating
I could care less about ESPN's Total QBR. It's not the standard. Passer rating was called quarterback rating, or QBR for short, before ESPN came along and muddled everything up. Until TQBR becomes the standard I'll continue using QBR as the abbreviation for quarterback rating. I know you're just trying to be difficult here, but if you actually do have a problem with it, feel free to suck a bag of eggs.
If deep passes to open receivers is the only measure of accuracy, sure. In my limited time watching Foles, he hasn't had to prove himself on difficult passes. He has a similar game to Joe Flacco but with much better decision making to this point. Sent from my GT-P3110 using Tapatalk
You are referring to the different ESPN formula. The NFL formula does not use those things, and that is the one in which Foles got a 119 this season and Tannehill got an 81.
There is only one formula the NFL uses. Some call it passer rating. Some call it QB Rating. From what I have seen anyway. http://www.primecomputing.com/
Since deep passes, 30 yds +, have one of the lowest comp pcts, to be able to do well on them is an important gauge of accuracy. To Tannehill, based on results, deep passes are a difficult pass.
Do you have access to those numbers minus Wallace? I feel like the deep ball isn't so much his issue, but rather his comfort level and timing with Mike. I'm curious to see if his numbers are better to other WRs.
Good stuff bro. Yeah, I mentioned Vick and Barkley. Those are the only two we have to go on. Vick was not good and Barkley was terrible. He was proven wrong. Hope he gets a nap.
I tried to break it down [and excluded Matt Moore's attempts]. According to SI.com, On deep balls over 40 yards, Tannehill completed 3/15 [20%]. 3/12 to Wallace (1 was the nice play by Wallace for the TD vs Carolina, another was the underthrow in the same game, and I forget the third). 0/3 to everyone else. On downfield passes of 31-40 yards, Tannehill completed 4/17 [23.6%]. 1/2 to Hartline. 1/1 to Gibson. 1/1 to Clay. 1/12 to Wallace. 0/1 to someone else (forget who). It's hard to gauge what Tannehill would've done with more attempts to Hartline, Gibson, and Clay because he was initially 1/2 to Wallace through his first two attempts. On intermediate downfield passes of 21-30 yards, Tannehill completed 4/22 [18.2%]. 2/8 to Wallace. 0/6 to Hartline. 1/3 Matthews. 1/5 to Clay. All combined it's 6/32 to Wallace, 1/9 to Hartline, 2/6 to Clay, 1/3 to Matthews, 1/2 to Gibson. On intermediate throws of 11-20 yards, Tannehill completed 72/143 [50.3%]. 25/49 to Hartline [51%]. 19/39 to Wallace [49%]. 10/18 to Matthews [56%]. 8/17 to Clay [47%]. 5/9 to Gibson [56%]. 2/3 to Egnew [67%]. 0/1 to Sims. 3/7 to Miller, Thomas, Thigpen [43%]. His deep ball & downfield passing need to be worked on, period, b/c it's currently not acceptable... and Zac Taylor needs to be fired asap.
first off, i'm never wrong secondly, you're basing your argument on a guy who played 6 quarters and another guy who has had one good passing season in his entire 10 year career, which was back in 2010. if you dont think foles is a product of chip kelley's system, please explain why he looked like shyt the 2 seasons prior to kelly coming. was it a miracle? because no qb in nfl history has made that type of jump in productivity in such a short amount of time. dont worry, i'll wait...
