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Free Agency - OL Targets

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Da 'Fins, Feb 3, 2014.

  1. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    The first challenge in this situation, it seems to me, is convincing a player to come into what may well be a poisoned and uncertain atmosphere. With a HC who essentially has his job on the line and a GM with only a two year deal? That just makes for a disastrous free agency year.

    I also think that the new GM will not feel confident - or have the power - to be aggressive in free agency. So, free agency does not stack up well for Miami or for getting guys they want. The one caveat to all that is if Philbin wants the team to be aggressive and Hickey concurs, Ross is likely to sign-off and they could get after some players. But, many coaches always seem hesitant to think their teams need radical changes at any position. They usually have a bias that says, "We're not as bad as people think when you look at the film." I've looked at the film in several games and I think the OL is as bad as it seems.

    Personally, I think we could see 4 positions replaced on the OL (both OTs and both OGs).

    Among the O-linemen here's a potential top 10 Free Agents:

    1. OT - Jared Veldheer - I think this guy is a stud; great size (6'8, 321). Graded out well at Oakland. I would say 98% chance the Raiders either sign him or franchise him. So, very unlikely. If he were to hit free agency, I'd have a 7-8 year contract on his agent's fax at midnight and ask for a visit. At only 26, a seven year deal would take him to age 33, still young enough to play effective on the OL.

    2. OT - Branden Albert - last year's hot target is now a free agent and should be a target. He will be available so he is a more likely candidate. If Veldheer is not there, I'm all over Albert in the same way. He's a bit older (29) and I would not offer him a 7 year deal - maybe more around a 5 year deal.

    3. OG - Geoff Schwartz - game really picked up in latter half of year and is a big player (6'6, 340) and still young, 27. But, may not fit as well with the scheme that may be in place with the new assistant OL coach from Houston (whom I hope takes over as the main guy - he's clearly a better coach than Turner; certainly more proven).

    4. OT - Eugene Monroe - another player everyone is talking about. I like him but feel he's a bit light for an OT (306). But, he is a LT which is hard to find. He is very young (26) and that is a big plus. Another guy you would give a long term deal to (6-7 years).

    5. OT - Anthony Collins - Not that he's a highly rated OT, imo, but I think he will come a bit cheaper and that makes him a nice target. Hasn't started many games but still has some youth at age 28. Would be an upgrade over any of the OTs from last year on the Dolphins.

    6. OG/OT - Roger Saffold. Mainly played OG last year and that may be his best spot. That the Rams wanted Jake Long as their LT says something about Saffold. He's also a big guy (6'5, 332). The bonus for him is that he's still VERY young for his experience - only 25 (turning 26 this summer). This puts him a bit higher. That young and he still has upside (some guys just come into the league at 24).

    7. OG - Jon Asomoah - teammate to Schwartz (entirely different kind of player at 305). Another very young guy (25 - even younger by a month to Saffold). But, he may fit well with a zone blocking line.

    8. OT - Michael Oher - really more of a RT mold (which we need). He'd be a good signing also. Still young. Has been on a physical team so he could add some to the Dolphins.

    9.G/OT - Roger Saffold. Mainly played OG last year and that may be his best spot. That the Rams wanted Jake Long as their LT says something about Saffold. He's also a big guy (6'5, 332). The bonus for him is that he's still VERY young for his experience - only 25 (turning 26 this summer). This puts him a bit higher

    10. OT - Zach Strief. A RT. Will get a lot of hype as a free agent because his PFF numbers are very good. However, in the few games I saw, I thinkG/OT - Roger Saffold. Mainly played OG last year and that may be his best spot. That the Rams wanted Jake Long as their LT says something about Saffold. He's also a big guy (6'5, 332). The bonus for him is that he's still VERY young for his experience - only 25 (turning 26 this summer). This puts him a bit higher

    Naturally, some of these guys may not come available (most likely Veldheer).


    Personally, I think Miami has to target at least two of these players and sign at least two starters in free agency. Imho.
     
  2. Sumlit

    Sumlit Well-Known Member

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    sports24/7 likes this.
  3. Alex13

    Alex13 Tua Time !!! Club Member

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    you have saffold in twice at #6 and #9 and i hope we stay away from Oher
     
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  4. LI phinfan

    LI phinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I would take a look at Oher as a RT only
     
  5. RevRick

    RevRick Long Haired Leaping Gnome Club Member

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    Also has him inserted at #10.... Must like him..

    I think we ought to look at all of them, but Eugene Monroe, Asomoah, and Oher in that group could be a good group to gather, along with drafting a couple of decently high OL. Part of me also says to try to sign Mack from the Browns, and shift Pouncey to G... but all I am doing is SWAGging away... We shall soon see what the new GM seems to think to be the best possibilities.

    I just hope that we don't get Columbo Mk. II, III, IV, and V when trying to find four offensive lineman..
     
  6. LI phinfan

    LI phinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    My dream scenario would have Mack at center and Pouncey at guard...I think he would be a great guard and you would have a pro bowl C next to him..Can always dream.
     
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  7. Larryfinfan

    Larryfinfan 17-0...Priceless Club Member

    Don't know about Schwartz...scheme-wise, but I suspect they look at one of the top two guys, Albert or Monroe...after that, each of those guys are a step down...I like Veldheer too, but if we can land one of 3 those guys, then they look at the second tier guys for the RT spot... or re-sign Clabo, who arguably picked up his game later in the season. Also remember that we just re-signed Lance Louis, who was coming off an injury last year, I think ?? There are possibilities out there without having to sign a bona fide LT, but it sure would help.... It's also critical because there is an uncertain future looming over Pouncey, our ONE true good OL...

    Also remember that Oakland has lots of money to spend, so an extension or at worst the tag could hold up Veldheer...
     
  8. CitizenSnips

    CitizenSnips hmm.

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  9. LI phinfan

    LI phinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    A healthy and effective Lance Louis would be a huge help and a cheap solution...When do these moves ever pan out for us?
     
  10. LBsFinest

    LBsFinest Banned

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    give me these two and I'll be a very happy man. and I'm pretty sure the Chiefs run a zone blocking scheme as well, Schwartz was a great fit for them so he should be fine here.
     
  11. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I have just spent a bit of time re-acquainting myself with Anthony Collins at left tackle after having previously studied his tape mostly over the 2010 and 2011 seasons when he played some spot duty here and there at right tackle for the Cincinnati Bengals.

    Just for full disclosure, I was a big fan of his in the 2012 off season. I wanted Miami to sign him as an unrestricted free agent. I was convinced he was more deserving of starting in Cincinnati than the big right tackle they have there Andre Smith who had a rough start to his NFL career and hasn't been known as being a very mentally tough player coming out of Alabama. The Bengals were able to re-sign Collins on a 2 year, $2.5 million deal which was even cheaper than I imagined...but the Dolphins never bit on him.

    I hadn't taken a deeper dive into his work since that 2012 off season. I just took a deeper dive on his 2013 work at LEFT tackle.

    He's every bit the player he was back then, perhaps even better now. He has changed slightly. He doesn't have the same gun powder in his lower body that he used to on a snap for snap basis. He's still got plenty but it's not quite as nimble as it was. What he has instead is improved technique and a lot more physically solid, strong upper body and anchor ability. He has the look of a more mature, weathered player in his prime.

    I watched him every snap of the playoff game against San Diego. He allowed one real pressure/hit that I saw, coming around the outside shoulder...a play which Andy Dalton bailed him out on by throwing the ball for a TD just before he got pummeled on the blind side. You could see Collins going up to Dalton after the play and apologizing/thanking him for saving his bacon. What impressed me is the next time Collins lined up on offense, he pancaked a guy to make up for the gaffe. He didn't really have another bad play like that the whole game. He had one play where he looked like he got beat to the inside but he put the guy on the ground at the quarterback's feet so he wasn't really a threat to take down Dalton (actually would've gotten penalized if he did, per league rules).

    He was actually quite good in run blocking during the game, which I felt the Bengals didn't exploit enough. He's great getting to the second level and walling off linebackers. And pretty good linebackers, too.

    The second game I watched was the Indianapolis game because I wanted to see him up against Robert Mathis, who lit up the league this year with sacks. He shut Mathis down. Absolutely shut him down. Mathis went up against him 17 times in pass rush. I didn't see a single success against Collins. And I saw multiple snaps where I felt like Collins did more than just hold the guy at bay or shut down his pass rush, he flat out owned him. A couple times in run blocking he knocked Mathis to the ground. All of this held true for the few occasions Erik Walden, Bjoern Werner or Fili Moala lined up on Collins as well. I saw him get help from a back chipping on Mathis only two times the whole day, and he didn't really need it either time as he'd established control before the back chipped.

    In fact there was a play Mathis got an early start and was flagged for offsides. Didn't matter, Collins was able to hold him up anyway. That is an incredible thing. You give a Robert Mathis a HEAD START, and I'm pretty sure most left tackles in the NFL get beat by him.

    Robert Mathis got 21 sacks in 2013 (PFF's tally), just FYI.

    But again his run blocking stood out. In fact, even more so because Jay Gruden used him creatively. On one play he went with an unbalanced look where he took Collins off left tackle and put a tight end in his place, and had Collins line up all the way on the right perimeter to block for WR Andrew Hawkins on a little screen. Collins erased the defensive back, blocking him straight to the sidelines. That was a nice play because usually a defensive back is going to be so much faster than an offensive tackle that he can get around the guy and impact the screen. Collins has better feet than normal tackles, though. On another play he pulled out on an outside run to the left and a DB ran the alley hard but Collins was able to get out to him on time and keep him from getting to the runner as Bernard ran 10 yards. He executed three play side pull plays like that and was outstanding on all three.

    In fact the whole game he really only had one assignment I felt like he didn't fill very well, on a run play. The whole game and only one time did a guy get his hips into the gap Collins was trying to protect.

    I think what you need to do with Anthony Collins is focus in on him sharply...provided the Bengals don't get to him first.

    Forget about Eugene Monroe, Jared Veldheer, Branden Albert, etc. Don't cast a wide net with offers seeing if one of them bites. Focus in on Collins and make him feel like he's your guy, that you want him specifically, then just go ahead and top the offers out there.

    He's not perfect. If he can be said to have a weakness it still is and always has been (since college) hand use. But it's gotten ridiculously better since back in Kansas.

    He will get beaten just like anyone else. But he's 28 years old, and since he doesn't have a ton of experience and his last contract was a mere $2.5 million over 2 years, the market may try and go cautious on his price tag which to me signals opportunity. Just go out and make it happen. This is a proven NFL player that has been playing well for YEARS and people just haven't noticed. This is your Randy Starks of the offensive line.
     
  12. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    It's like PFF with Ck doing the play by play..

    I dig it.
     
  13. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    And his name is misspelled too. He spells it Rodger Saffold. :yes:
     
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  14. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    NFL.com was apparently wrong about him resigning with Miami. He signed with Colts instead.
     
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  15. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    Aahhh! LOL.

    Was cutting and pasting and decided to move a player or two around and evidently cut him in twice and another out.

    Actually intended to have Strief as 9. At 10:

    10. Charlie Johnson, G Vikings. 8 year vet but started consistently the last 7 (3 at Minnesota). Not a great player but solid. He is also 29.
     
  16. PhinsRDbest

    PhinsRDbest Transform and Transcend

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    the next dimension
    I wonder if a scheme switch/new HC would make Trent Williams available from Washington.?.?.?
     
  17. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    Exactly what I noted in the original:

     
  18. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    Da 'Fins:
    like your list... however, wouldn't rule out the acquisition of a pro-bowl caliber Center, moving Pouncey to LG & re-instating Incognito (with a favorable contract) at RG.
    CK's preview & insight on Anthony Collins at left tackle sounds promising...
    whatever they do, they have to get the offensive line right in the off-season. I think everyone will gel (front office & coaching cadre) & get the job done right this time around. they simply have no alternative.
     
  19. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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    I think it is a huge mistake to continue to completely ignore the character issue especially when it comes to the OL.

    Put yourself in Ross and Philbin's shoes for a moment. Can't you imagine how peeved and annoyed these guys are by now, and the report isn't even due out until Thursday.

    Anybody who doesn't think character is going to be an enormous issuewhen making FA offers this year just isn't in touch with reality.

    The NFL is considering rule changes because of the Dolphin team culture. The Dolphins are being put through a media meat grinder!

    I think it will be safe to assume that the Dolphins will be willing to over pay for high character FA's, and especially offensive linemen.

    Look what happened with Mike Wallace. The Dolphins were criticized for years about the WR corps, so under fan and media pressure Ireland signs a mediocre WR to a stupendous 60 million dollar contract.

    The crapstorm and criticism of bullygate is far, far more intense and includes the league office.

    The Dolphins are very likely candidates to out bid anyone for LT Eugene Monroe. He is the prize. Monroe is well known for being an outstanding citizen on and off the field.
    It will be next to impossible for the Ravens to franchise Monroe, and they almost need him to take a substantially lower contract than what the open market would offer him. He would have to want to stay with the Ravens for other reasons.

    Zane Beadles can't run block but his elite pass protection and the fact that he has received awards for community activity and is recognized as another elite character dude will probably get him a substantial offer from the Dolphins to play LG. I don't want him, I want to draft Xavier S'ua-Filo to play LG, just saying...

    The hard truth is that these types of guys may not want to come to Miami unless the new GM can convince FA's and their agents that things are going to be very different in Miami.

    You would have a huge problem trying to have an OL meeting at strip club with a guy like Eugene Monroe.

    This is why I believe if the Dolphins are really going to make a serious move to change team culture and especially that of the OL, they will let all of the FA's walk. They may also put Mike Pouncey on the trade block with Jonathan Martin.

    That is the kind of action that would send a clear message that things are really changing. Then............the Dolphins may have a real shot at some of the smarter FA's with good reputations for being grownups. Guys like Veldheer,Asamoah,Strief,Mack etc.

    If the Dolphins can get high value for Pouncey, I wouldn't be surprised to see him traded, because right now, he is set to be the de facto veteran leader of the Dolphins OL; and Pouncey is a truly great player on his way to many pro bowls IMO, but he is not the veteran leader type you look for to whitewash your culture.

    After what happened on the first play of the Super Bowl Denver might be looking for a pro bowl center to give Peyton the football. Manny Ramirez is a OG. If they lose Beadles they want to move Ramirez back to OG.

    If I were Hickey my top two FA priorities would be LT Monroe/Veldheer and Charles Tillman. I'd let Clemons walk and make Tillman a FS and the new veteran leader and mentor of my young secondary. Charles Tillman just won the NFL's Man OF The Year Award. Tillman is a bonafide turnover machine.

    I would love to see the Dolphins lead the league in defensive turnovers instead of sacks.
     
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  20. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    hubris, pretentious, self-righteous? let's start by defining what character is... then we can begin to judge?
    with all due respect, I really find these attacks on individual character annoying & counter productive. I would think twice before enlisting the services of a murderer, racist or rapist. having said that, the NFL has employed a number of them successfully. matter of fact, some are hall of famers. we're not going to church at a super bowl, we're playing football. judge not, be not judged... enjoy the game.
     
  21. NaboCane

    NaboCane Banned

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    Needing as many as four starters, plus quality depth (including both Tackles), I don't see us being able to afford to splurge much in free agency.

    Where I would focus in free agency instead is on Guards and Centers, and backup types at the Tackle positions. Then I would identify the LT I thought was the best in the draft and do everything to ensure we got him.

    It's not just a situation in which the team can afford to be laissez-faire about the overwhelming need this offseason; we can't just sit at 19 and hope for the best. We need a big win, a can't-lose guy at LT, and with all the other needs, we don't need to be paying $10M a year for that. We need our next franchise LT to come in the draft.

    Get our RT in round 2 or 3, get depth in rounds 3-7; sign three starting-caliber OGs and Cs and experienced backups at LT/RT in free agency, and let them compete in camp.

    And I really do hope we trade Pouncey, and get some return on our investment. He's simply too much of a risk given his character, especially on a team that just went through that 2013 disaster.
     
  22. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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    The Raiders have already made significant efforts to re-sign Veldheer. They were going at it heavy in December.

    It appears the Raiders want to give him a contract commensurate with his body of work, which is not yet elite or top tier.

    Everyone agrees he looks like the real deal and he is expected to be a top ten LT in the years to come but he just hasn't done it quite yet.

    Do you really franchise a player based on potential?? Veldheer actually graded out poorly last year. Yes, the injury, but still. How much do you pay a guy based mostly on potential??

    Veldheer says he wants to stay in Oakland. I don't believe that for a second. I think the league counsels all FA's to be positive about their current team and say stuff like that. It's BS more often than not.

    If I were betting on the outcome I would have to go with him hitting the open market. On the hand, Menelik Watson didn't show anything really. If they did franchise him, it would be a desperation move, and as young as this team is and the fact that they have high draft picks again, they know they aren't playing for the Lombardi trophy anytime soon, they may let him walk and spend the FA money on younger players at other positions and draft a LT.

    Veldheer will be 27 in June. http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2014/2/3/5375124/jared-veldheer-contract-free-agent-raiders

    Don't get me wrong, I believe in the guy. I'd give him a big multi-year deal in a heartbeat. I think he still has upside.
     
  23. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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    What the hell are you talking about?

    The Dolphins team culture is being put on trial in the media court. This is a sports franchise for crying out loud. This is a business. It's about selling tickets. Without ticket sales Ross can kiss his *** goodbye.

    They will do what they deem necessary to clean up their image and get the league office and the media off their back so that they can get back to selling the product.

    Which is Dolphins Football!!

    They will do everything they can to eliminate the ignominy and move on with making money.

    If that means acquiring players who don't use drugs and hang out in strip clubs then they will do it, and not because they are judging anybody or having football church, but because they want to make money.

    You make money in business by improving the image of your product.

    Richie Incognito and Jonathan Martin are bad for business. Those associated with them, whether guilty of anything or not are tainted.
     
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  24. the 23rd

    the 23rd a.k.a. Rio

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    hubris!
     
  25. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    There's a bit of a question of scheme which will influence the kind of players the team gets in free agency.

    Bill Lazor ran a mixed blocking scheme in Virginia, running pretty much all of the classic run plays. There was a lot of pulling, trapping, and play-action where a guard kicked out and pass-blocked the edge defender. It isn't just a single pulling guard like with some teams either, he had both the LG and RG pulling, and saw some Tackle pulls as well. But then Philbin has been a zone guy, and if there's Chip Kelly influence that's also going to be more zone-oriented.

    Mobility is going to be a big factor regardless, but even mobile guys might not have great experience doing one thing or the other, and they might not be particularly good at it.

    I think there's also a consideration of moving Mike Pouncey to Guard if they end up playing a more man-oriented than zone-oriented scheme.
     
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  26. CitizenSnips

    CitizenSnips hmm.

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    Pro bowlers are good for business. Mike pounces is that.
     
  27. MikeHoncho

    MikeHoncho -=| Censored |=-

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    Would it be possible to sign... everyone on that list?
     
  28. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Beadles' Pass Blocking Efficiency rating was only a 95.4 and he ranked 39th among guards who played at least 50% of their team's offensive snaps. Hell, John Jerry was a much more efficient pass blocker last season. He had a PBE of 97 and ranked 12th. The guard we need to go after to shore up pass blocking is Asamoah. He was 7th with a 97.4 PBE.
    The tackles I'd prefer are either Monroe, Collins or Albert. Collins had the best PBE of any OT last season.

    Tillman would be a fine addition at safety, it's just too bad it would have to be at the expense of Clemons rather than Jones. Jones is another case of Ireland handing a big contract that was questionably deserved.
     
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  29. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    I just don't think you can bank on a long term LT in the draft at #19. When you look at team needs 1-18, almost every one of them have OL as one of their top 1-2-3 needs. Many of them #1. That leads teams to reach. And, unfortunately, Miami has no fuel going into this draft. Though I do get your philosophy and tend to agree in a vacuum.

    There should be 2-3-4 decent LT's available in free agency - including Alberts and the guy from Cinci. I think one of those two (unless you bank on Veldheer coming clean) would do and wouldn't break the bank. Obviously, if an LT you really believe in is available in the draft even after signing one of those guys, you draft him and shift the vet to RT (or start that guy out at RT and plan to shift him to LT later).

    I do like concentrating on interior because of cap reasons. But, I think you could land one of those and then still get one of the vet LTs at a not unreasonable price.

    At the least - two starters in free agency need to be brought in and you have to go after an O-linemen in either round 1 or 2. I can see waiting for round 2 if you feel good about free agency and if there are several OTs (even RTs) available at #19 and you see a big play player at 19 at a different position.

    I don't like keeping Pouncey - and in that respect I agree with your sentiments. But, if he is your only bonafide starter … man, it is a tough situation to try to trade the guy at this point.

    And, if you do put him on the trading block - what are you going to get for him? Based on his play you might get a late first or early 2nd but given that every person in China will know you are trading him because of the situation that came out of the Martin-Incognito fiasco, his stock will drop. I think they are stuck with him but I also think they need to sit him down and let him know - he's on the precipice of destroying his career. And, the league may do something to him as well. Don't know what they can do with those texts.
     
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  30. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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    Yup, like I said, my choice for LG in 2014 is Xavier S'ua-Filo, but somebody would have to come up with a good nickname and quick.

    I think it is plausible that one of the teams picking early that is expected to draft a QB may draft Clowney,Matthews or even Mack; and then turn around and trade up into the 1st round,hopefully to the #19 position, and then draft their QB, who slid out of the top half of the draft.

    Then the Dolphins could draft S'ua-Filo with an early 2nd rounder while acquiring an early 3rd and 6th.
     
  31. RoninFin4

    RoninFin4 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Just some quick targets I'd have for free agency:

    Donald Brown - RB - Colts
    Ben Tate - RB - Texans
    John Conner - FB - Giants
    Jacoby Ford - WR/KR - Raiders
    Branden Albert - T - Chiefs
    Anthony Collins - T - Bengals
    Breno Giacomini - T - Seahawks*
    Wade Smith - G - Texans
    Shelley Smith - G - Rams
    Willie Colon - G - Jets*
    Evan Dietrich-Smith - G/C - Packers*
    Michael Bennett - DE - Seahawks
    Clinton McDonald - DT - Seahawks
    Linval Joseph - DT - Giants
    Colin Cole - DT - Panthers
    Sam Shields - CB - Packers
    Tarell Brown - CB - 49ers

    Obviously, I doubt Miami signs not even half of these players, but those would be the guys I'd look at if I were Dennis Hickey. Other than Sam Shields and maybe Branden Albert I don't think there's any "bank breakers" in that bunch. If I was willing to splurge a little bit, I'd probably add Maurice Jones-Drew to the list.

    The OL with the * denote that I have them on the list depending on scheme. Those guys - Giacomini, Colon, and Dietrich-Smith are probably best suited for a power/man blocking scheme, which if that's what Bill Lazor brings, then they fit. Otherwise, I probably wouldn't steer toward those guys; maybe you could make a case for Giacomini.
     
  32. Phoenician Fan

    Phoenician Fan Well-Known Member

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    Packers seem to have a knack for keeping their good players. Weird, if you ask me. I grew up in weather like that, but I had the good sense to move to Phoenix. I don't know why all those guys over the years have signed team friendly deals with the Pack. They must have something going on there.

    Maybe Dietrich-Smith will get away.

    First time I have seen anyone else consider Jacoby Ford. If he can get healthy he is one of the more exciting return guys in the league, and when used correctly can get some serious RAC yardage.
     
  33. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Read that he was on the radio expressing that he's not happy about the raiders lack of urgency
     
  34. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    The player I think Miami needs to prioritize is Anthony Collins. He can play left or right tackle. You probably want him on the left side since he's such a reliable player and the position is so important. But having him leaves you with OPTIONS in the draft. If a tackle falls to your 19th overall pick that you really, really like...you can take him. If not, not that big of a deal as you have a guy that can play left tackle really well in the long term. Essentially he can complement multiple draft strategies which is a good thing.

    Though he is older at 33 years old, you could also target Jordan Gross for many of the same reasons. He has pro experience playing right tackle as well as left tackle. He was an excellent right tackle and he's become an excellent left tackle. If you draft a stud that you initially feel like should play right tackle but eventually you're going to want to move to left tackle, Gross can complement that effort (provided he shows enough longevity).

    I would consider taking a FLIER on J'Marcus Webb as a developmental right tackle. The guy has plenty of skins on his wall which counts for something. You know he can go out there and play football on Sunday. He's spent two of his four years at right tackle, two of his four years at left tackle. He was awful his rookie year at right tackle, got slightly better at left tackle his second year, was better at left in his third year but Chicago went another direction (understandable, I'd have never had him at left tackle to begin with), and the Vikings scooped him up and played him at right tackle. He was OK there. Just OK. I've watched the tape. Nothing I would write home to mama about.

    The thing that intrigues me about him as a cheap developmental flier is his physical potential. He's 6 feet, 7.5 inches and 335 pounds. Because of his frame, he carries the weight very well. He ran a 5.28 at that size coming out so the guy is a tremenous athlete for that size. On tape there's a fluid and natural quality to his ability to move, I can see why evaluators have been drawn to the guy. The combination of his frame and feet make him the kind of guy who could be an All Pro. But that's where the good stuff ends because he doesn't win hand battles enough, doesn't anticipate and read leverage quickly enough, and often you come away feeling he wasn't aggressive enough. That's why he was a 7th rounder. Thing is, he's like 25 or 26 years old and sometimes these OLs just keep getting better the more you teach them and the more experience they get...especially if they're coming through the way he did from West Texas A&M after flunking out of Texas (was a Parade All-American as a recruit).

    Let's not kid ourselves about what he is, but if you really believe in the teaching ability of the new OL coach we just picked up from the Houston Texans then I think he's the perfect guy to take a cheap flier on and see if he can develop. You know he'll play solid football if pressed into action, and maybe one day you get even better than solid football out of him.
     
  35. MIASportsFan

    MIASportsFan New Member

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    Sign Albert to start, resign McKinnie as a back up. Draft a RT in the first round. Draft guards in the 2nd and 4th rounds. Sign another guard.
     
  36. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    I dunno, I seriously don't think it will particularly difficult to fix the oline to the point that we're playoff suitable.

    I think we can bring in one excellent player and then some average players then fix some of our playcalling/schemes and we'd get a vastly improved unit.

    Hell, just the fact the GM is going to listen to the coach about the oline should be a huge improvement.
     
  37. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    I can't think of an OT that we could realistically draft at #19 who who start at LT over Anthony Collins. That would include Lewan, Kouandjio, Moses and Martin. Lewan would slide into RT as a rookie with Collins on board, ditto Kouandjio and Moses, and Martin could play Guard off the bat or RT. Of that rookie group, Martin comes with the least amount of LT concerns imo- I can't really imagine the others coming in as rookies and starting over Collins at LT.

    As to J'Marcus Webb- he sucks. Large underachiever, minimal effort guy and probably football IQ as well. Baby Huey in cleats, a QB killer, coach killer and GM killer. No wonder Culter blew up at him, Webb just isn't that good and he doesn't try nearly hard enough. A big, big pass on J"Marcus Webb, that would be a step in the wrong direction, flier or not. Bears fans hated that guy, and for good reason
     
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  38. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    I like the draft flexibility of signing a free agent who can handle either RT or LT. That is especially important this year with uncertainty among the OTs coming out and with only one pick in each round - there's a lot less maneuverability.
     
  39. 77FinFan

    77FinFan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I'm all about a proven commodity over a draft pick any day of the week.
     
  40. jim1

    jim1 New Member

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    We need both, the whole group is in chaos except for Pouncey. McKinnie and Clabo are not only questionable but they're unsigned, no depth there especially with Yeatman having blown his knee out, Garner is adequate, Brenner is subpar, Jerry is Jerry, and that's not a good thing. No starters except for Pouncey, no depth and Dallas Thomas sucks. Rebuild is not a question, it's a mandate and a necessity.

    Albert, Monroe or Collins would be a good start, but the FO darn well better draft some OL. Still have my eye on Trai Turner and Brandon Collins at OG, and I'm still fine with Kouandjio, Lewan or Martin at #19, if they prove to be RTs that's fine with me. I like Morgan Moses but I'm still not sure if he's worth the #19 pick- a lot of size and talent but not as good as Martin and not the physical presence that Lewan and Koundjio provide- he strikes me as a little more passive than those two. Kouandjio, for example- he's more of a physical presence a la Greg Robinson, just not as good of an athlete. Robinson is athletically, as Les Brown might be prone to say, redic.
     

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