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Michael Sam reveals he is gay

Discussion in 'NFL Draft Forum' started by finyank13, Feb 10, 2014.

  1. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    I am not sure what the big deal is, hell if he drops that is value no?

    CK or the other gurus, lets say he WASN'T gay for one moment, what round do you think he would have went in? Does he have 4-7th round tape because he is gay or because of athletic ability?

     
  2. I don't think he gets past the Dolphins on the 1st day. :shifty:
     
  3. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    Hey if he can ball, I dont care which way he swings....
     
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  4. CaribPhin

    CaribPhin Guest

    Or which way he swings balls.

    Sent from my GT-P3110 using Tapatalk
     
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  5. phinswolverinesrockets

    phinswolverinesrockets If he dies, he dies

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    SEC defensive player of the year....no later than round 3. i could see him going to the steelers or a team with a veteran locker room.
     
  6. SICK

    SICK Lounge Moderator

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    I don't care who he sleeps with monday - saturday.....as long as he can get to the QB on sundays, it shouldnt matter.

    It will matter. But it shouldnt.
     
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  7. invid

    invid Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Wow. Really happy for the guy, that takes courage. I would rather take a guy who knows who he is than one who doesn't.
     
  8. invid

    invid Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Seattle or the Pats will take him and he'll be on a HOF course his first year. That's my guess. He's probably used to the slurs; he's been in locker rooms all of his career obviously. He must either tune them out or Missouri has enough leadership to have removed the f-word completely from locker room banter, I don't see why a PROFESSIONAL football team can't do the same. This will be a major turning point for the NFL.
     
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  9. PerfectTeam

    PerfectTeam Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I found it interesting Jonathan Martin was tweeting to him about it since some of the same rumors are floating around him.
     
  10. Larry Little

    Larry Little Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I think it's interesting that the first player to have the guts and maturity to publicly announce he is gay is collegiate. I hope many gay NFL players follow his lead, so we can move on to a day when whether a player (or any person) is gay or straight is a not an issue.
     
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  11. Larry Little

    Larry Little Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You know... if that is Martin's 'issue', then I hope the guy comes out as gay. If that's what is behind his bizarre behavior, then, I can respect that. If he's secretly gay, and he had issues with Incognito's macho douche-bag routine, I could totally understand that. However, until then, he's just a spineless backstabber to me.
     
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  12. dolphindebby

    dolphindebby Season Ticket Holder Luxury Box

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    If he can help us win games, so what's the problem?
     
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  13. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    The problem is that many teams will view it as a problem.

    They'll take the coward's path and blame it on the "locker room" and the presence of immature players who won't be able to get over the gay player's gayness. Or they'll blame it on the media, claiming that there will be such a media circus surrounding this player that they would be justified for not wanting to bring that kind of distraction to their team. These men who take these excuses would be, in my honest opinion, cowards. However, they exist and in fact are prevalent in the NFL.
     
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  14. PerfectTeam

    PerfectTeam Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Agree completely. I still think the guy is a piece of garbage. It could explain to some degree why he had trouble fitting in if he is in fact gay. Not excusing his behavior at all just saying. It was a tweet that cbs had included in their piece and I just found it interesting is all. Getting back to the thread topic though, I applaud the guy. Like everyone else, if he can win games for us, orientation doesn't matter.
     
  15. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    I don't think this is really a "good" situation from the standpoint of gay people gaining acceptance in the NFL. He's too vulnerable. There's too much plausible deniability for people who wouldn't draft him because of bigotry(Like our GM, probably?) because he's not an established player or a blue-chip prospect. I think there's also a legitimate issue with it creating a distraction that some teams might not actually want.

    Ideally it'd be a blue chip player.
     
  16. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    At the same time I think of the mechanics of the draft and I'm a little intrigued by this whole thing.

    A lot of teams out there, most teams as far as I know, operate very inclusive/exclusive draft boards. Teams really get the draft board down to about 100 to 150 players and exclude the rest of the guys that they don't view to be compatible with their vision for the roster, for whatever reason. This is really the easiest way for General Managers and teams to avoid value trap players, guys you had rated as 3rd rounders and they're still available in the 7th round and yet you're still passing on them for whatever reason. You have them not even on your board, then it looks like you're still drafting your best available players.

    The problem is those draft boards are evidence. There are hard copies. There are people that see the draft boards. There's a paper trail. And now Michael Sam just made it very, very difficult for teams to overtly exclude him from their draft board.

    All it will take is for one person to leak to the media that Sam wasn't even on the draft board and the press will legitimately wonder why since he was SEC Defensive Player of the Year. Being the first openly gay player in NFL history is like the big elephant in the room there. Good luck if you're a team trying to explain why the SEC DPOY wasn't on your draft board in any round.

    And if he actually is forced onto draft boards...then that is where teams could start to feel pressured to draft him as he falls round after round.
     
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  17. CrunchTime

    CrunchTime Administrator Retired Administrator

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    I find it hard to believe that teams will have to explain why they didnt draft someone .Drafting by nature is subjective and not an exact science.He may be worth a 4th round pick to one team and another team may decide that they dont need any more players at the position.How do you quantify bias under those parameters.?
     
  18. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    If the SEC Defensive Player of the Year went completely undrafted and oh by the way he was set to be the first openly gay player in NFL history, then yes absolutely you can expect sweeping investigations into why that happened.

    What I'm saying is if he's off a team's draft board altogether, then that would be an awkward revelation that a team would find difficult to explain after the fact. And his presence on or off the draft board is something that can be attested to by many people in the organization. Or at least, most organizations. I think only half a dozen people in NE actually know what the draft board looks like. Probably for reasons like this.
     
  19. 77FinFan

    77FinFan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Yeah, but he's going to get drafted. Too much talent not to. And I know that you think he will get drafted.
     
  20. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Sam will get drafted.

    There are plenty of NFL cities where drafting Sam would be a net positive, even if he ends up not being able to play.

    For all the talk of distractions, the media coverage would be overwhelmingly positive, as long as the players say the right thing. The coach/GM/ownership group would be hailed as pioneers and the new Branch Rickey's.

    In fact, the publicity would be so good in certain cities it would not shock me to see ownership get invovled and "suggest" the team take him if he falls to the 5th or 6th round. Those picks end up throwaways most of the time anyway
     
  21. Bpk

    Bpk Premium Member Luxury Box

    Calling it : Pete Carroll's Seahawks.
     
  22. Dolphins1Beatles

    Dolphins1Beatles Ziggy Stardust

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    Like they need defensive help! (Actually they might if they lose players to FA) It would be a great place for him though. Seahawks, Patriots, 49ers...a team with a coaching staff that knows how to get the most of their players. I feel like Miami wouldn't know how to use him, like they didn't know how to use Reggie Bush or Dion Jordan.

    He could be another Zach Thomas type player on a team like that.
     
  23. Pauly

    Pauly Season Ticket Holder

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    It is very easy to remove valid candidates from hiring because you look at what their problems are, not what they can do. At a law firm I worked in once my boss came to me to talk about hiring a new fresh out of law school entry level position he was hiring for.
    The candidate with the best academic record by far (she had first class honors, and no other candidate had made it into honors for a single subject) and who had interviewed best had a problem. She was blind, which on the face of it is a pretty big problem for a job that involves reading paperwork. I talked my boss into giving her a shot because she said her computer imaging software was good enough. Turns out that not only was she a brilliant lawyer she was incredibly grateful for our boss giving her a shot and she remained loyal to the firm despite getting headhunted by some very prestigious firms who offered her very big money.

    I think Michael Sam will offer the same kind of value. Not only does he bring his talent and ability to the table, he will will be dedicated and loyal to an organization that accepts him and gives him a fair shot.

    If I were in the NFL my evaluation will be that coming out should improve his draft prospects. This guy is going to be totally dedicated to proving that the gay barrier, or whatever you want to call it, can be crossed. He's going to be a high character, high effort player, and if he is put into a non hostile locker room he is going to be loyal and team oriented. The same way Zach Thomas had to overcome his perceived physical limitations (too slow, too small) and then provided loyalty and dedication to the organization that gave him a legitimate shot.
     
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  24. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Sams stock has moved up for me, because of his intangibles..

    He's a fierce competitor, displays great leadership qualities, and is the kind of person I'm looking for character wise for this team playing in this city playing in that stadium..

    He's exactly the kind of player we need on our team and in our locker room.
     
  25. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    Especially if he hires an attorney..... or has a prominent one take on his case b/c of the sheer notoriety of it. He could sue the league for discrimination [essentially not hiring an individual b/c of his sexual orientation] and use the history of the SEC's DPOY draft status and trusted outside scouting services to get a judge to sign off on it, no? Once that happens I'm guessing they'd subpoena the records of all 32 teams- every bit of their draft stuff [scouting reports, draft boards, you name it] and then depose execs and scouts from every team or as many as it took until someone spilled the beans, which would eventually happen.

    If teams are smart [which I hope they aren't in this case], they put him on their board in like the 6th round to establish plausible deniability. Personally, I hope he gets drafted and makes everyone else look like idiots for passing on him. People talk about the locker room chaos this could cause for the team that drafts Sam, but what happens when they're on the field and his defensive tackle next to him hears an offensive lineman offering up some crude tasteless comments, especially if they involve his teammate as well? Will it be another Remember the Titans where they all bond together as they rally around their teammate's persecution? Perhaps they gain a sympathetic understanding of the type of courage it took Sam to come out and they develop a strong sense of respect for him b/c of it? Could you imagine if he went to the Lions and Suh heard some offensive guard make a reference about the two of them in the showers together? I believe Suh would try to create an injury timeout on the following play.
     
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  26. Like it or not openly gay men present a problem in the locker room. I have no problem with a team opting to pass on a player based on them being gay.
     
  27. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    what's interesting about that notion is, if it were a gorgeous female kicker we're talking about, and players were asked about how they'd feel about sharing the locker room & showers with her, well- we know what that answer would be. So more than likely they'd have no problem sharing it with someone of the opposite sex whom most of them would find attractive but when the shoe is on the other foot and it comes to sharing it with someone of the same sex who they fear might find them attractive or view them as a piece of meat instead, it would cause a problem.
     
  28. finyank13

    finyank13 Reality Check

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    Gil Bryant didn't have in in his Top 100 SENIORS, nevermind overall.....

    I smell something fishy....
     
  29. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    Agreed.
     
  30. MikeHoncho

    MikeHoncho -=| Censored |=-

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    Does it make one a terrorist to have initially skimmed the thread title to mistakedly read "Uncle Sam reveals he is gay"?
    :crapstrom:

    Apologies in advance.
     
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  31. Mrtree

    Mrtree Juan Huron's agent

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    I always found that whole "I want you!" poster to be a little creepy.
     

  32. That is sort of what my point was. You can not tell heterosexual males that it is inappropriate for them to feel uncomfortable being naked in front of openly gay men and at the same time tell them it is completely appropriate for women to be uncomfortable being naked around heterosexual males. Showers, bathrooms, locker rooms are private places that are meant for people to feel safe from sexual relations. ..


    I'm sure I will catch hell for saying this but...

    Gay people need to accept that while they deserve equal rights they are not entitled to special considerations from everyone else just to accommodate they're lifestyle. Now I fully expect a bunch of accusations about me being a homophobic bigot or some such nonsense because I believe in everyone following the same social etiquette.
     
  33. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    What problem did Michael Sam cause for Missouri exactly when they went 11-2, reached the SEC Championship game, and he was co-SEC Defensive Player of the Year?
     
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  34. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Your statement is homophobic.

    You might not mean it to be, but it is.

    If the locker room is so "private" then why do these clowns run around naked, snap towels at each other and play slap a** constantly? Seems to me if you're so modest, and so worried about being seen naked, you'd take care to not run around naked in the locker room.

    I am sure it is possible to remain relatively modest in such a situation.

    And some players might be uncomfortable, but that is their problem, not Sam's. He hasn't done anything wrong and his simple pressence cannot hurt anyone. In the 50's plenty of white people were uncomfortable sharing a school or a water fountain with blacks. Guess what, those people were wrong.

    And quite frankly, why the hell are these locker rooms sticking with the open shower thing anyway? It isn't prison. Put up some dividers. Make everybody more comfortable gay or straight
     
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  35. ToddPhin

    ToddPhin Premium Member Luxury Box Club Member

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    I understand what you're saying, but let me ask you this- what if, instead of a gay male, it were a heterosexual female and the majority of the team were strongly unattracted to her? Do you think the team would be in dismay about sharing a locker room with her even though they'd know she likes guys?

    It's nothing more than doing what's needed to expand beyond one's comfort zone, b/c being naked around a known gay male isn't something guys consciously have had experience with, so they haven't had a chance to mentally adjust to it yet. It's similar to the adjustment most guys go through in dorms, sleeping quarters, or locker rooms for the first time when they're forced to be naked around or shower in each others presence.

    We had communal showers at Clemson. I remember my first week in the dorms when I'd shower at odd hours just so I could do it alone w/o any other dudes around me. Then by the middle of the semester you're in it carrying on conversations like it ain't no thang but a chicken wang, playing jokes on each other, dishing out ice baths while someone's washing his hair, stealing clothes and towels and leaving behind women's garments as the only option to wear down the hall back to their dorm room. :lol: I'd be an idiot to assume none of those guys were gay. Growing up in summer baseball league and through American Legion, one of my teammate friends was gay [I didn't know it at the time but found out later in college]. We played in a few tournaments around the state, shared hotel rooms, and even shared beds one time b/c it was 4 guys to a room, and I don't recall waking up with a sore backend or him making any passes at me. It was a common theme among the teammates to smack each other's asses hard during practice, in the dugout, or through the hallways in school just playing around, and knowing now in hindsight that one of those guys actually happened to be gay, shared a locker room with me, smacked my *** like the rest, and shared a hotel room with me, it doesn't bother me in the least. He was just being one of the guys just like the rest of us were. If I had to be put in that same situation again but this time being aware he's gay, I wouldn't have a problem with it at all, and I certainly wouldn't want him to feel persecuted or feel like he couldn't be one of the guys just b/c of his sexual orientation.

    There are already gay males in the NFL showering with the rest of them, so any player acting ignorant to that fact doesn't change the fact that they're ALREADY sharing a locker room and showering with gay men. Who in the NFL has had any bad encounters b/c of it? I don't recall hearing about any player being raped or inappropriately touched. I know for me, when I was on the football or baseball field or in the locker room before and after games, I wasn't thinking about p****y. I was focused on the game. Plus I'm guessing a gay male in the NFL could probably pull as much *** off the field as his heart desired [no pun intended] without a desire to dip into the organization's ink.
     
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  36. I agree that closed shower stalls and changing areas would seem like a reasonable compromise to accomadate peoples comfort. I would have no objection to that if teams decided to go that route.
     
  37. Just as a matter of perspective lets say I was a openly heterosexual male cheerleader do you think the female cheerleaders on my squad should get over their uncomfortness and welcome my presence in the shower and changing area. Would you tell them they should get over their modesty and accept me being there? Is that not the same thing we are demanding from heterosexual males?
     
  38. schmolioot

    schmolioot Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    It's not the same at all.

    Male and female cheerleaders have separate locker rooms which every man and woman uses.

    No one is singled out.

    In your example, you want to bar a man from a men's locker room, not because he did something wrong, but because his mere presence makes someone else uncomfortable.

    That's completely wrong. You are punishing the gay man for nothing other than being gay and having the gall to tell people about it. If other guys are that uncomfortable that is their problem and they are the ones who should take measures to ease their own discomfort.

    Shower at a different time. Stand far away from him.

    Many options
     
  39. finfansince72

    finfansince72 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You do realize this is basically illegal and certainly immoral right? Right? I mean seriously? You do realize this right?
     
  40. finfansince72

    finfansince72 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    He did dress colorfully...just sayin....
     

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