Thanks for posting this. IMO the horizontal boards are more fun to evaluate than the vertical ones. NFLDraftScout does something similar (block ratings) with individual ratings included on the players.
Nice. I get the comparison because Huff, like Cobb, moves kind of a like a running back. Nice quickness/burst through his cuts, great balance, natural bend, just reminds me a backfield kind of guy. But then when the ball is in the air he's very good at adjusting and positioning like a receiver. Obviously looks like a Chip Kelly kind of player, wouldn't be surprised if that's where he lands.
That's what I was thinking. How could Chip Kelly not be eyeballing this guy as a player that would further help him evolve the offense into what he wants? Although you could argue that Chip looks at Darren Sproles as this kind of player. I think teams with scrambling quarterbacks should be particularly interested in Huff because that's something he looks particularly good at, floating into vacant zones and remaining ready at a moment's notice to receive the ball and transition to RAC. If you're the team drafting Johnny Manziel then surely you would look at a Josh Huff as a good player to install along side him. They could look at him in Seattle.
Oh boy, don't mention that, even though his combine numbers support that he could probably do it. I'm still shocked that that stump of a man is actually 6-1, he looks like he's around 5-11, Eddie "Meat Cleaver" Weaver size.
I'm still shocked that he measured out a hair under 6"1. Maybe it's because he doesn't have much of a neck, as you pointed out. The basic idea was, what do you do with this guy if he's just too short to play DT? I looked at him closely, compared his height relative to other players and I expected him to measure out at 5"10.5-5"11. Anyway, the tape showed stellar movement skills for a big man, and the combine confirmed the speed and agility to play ILB, especially if he dropped 15 lbs or so. First round pick? Yes, but his size still bothers me. Regardless, he's a highly talented and productive player who deserves a 1st rd selection and the millions coming to him. Could be on the high end imo Chicago at #14, but I wonder if they'll want more of a pure run stuffer, who knows. They were just brutalized against the run last year.
I'm not shocked he turned out to be 6'1". He always played like height was not an issue. I'm more surprised he didn't show up with some ludicrous wingspan-to-height ratio because there are times he gets those arms out and they look real long. I've watched for several years a defensive tackle that actually DOES have the size limitations that Aaron Donald was purported to have. But you can't watch tape of Roosevelt Nix (who truly is 5'11" and played around 260) and then watch Aaron Donald and come away thinking they're the same size. That's why 6'1" & 285 lbs made a lot more sense to me.
Speaking of Nix have you heard anything about him? His tape is dominant...but obviously hes too small to play DT. I heard teams were working him out at LB...could be a monster thumper but not sure about his speed/instincts at that position.
This is ridiculous. I get through Kony Ealy's entire season. Near the middle to the end of the season his pass rush rate looks like it's going to be around 8. That's a nice change I think. So, I get to the end of the season.... 361 snaps, 26 hurries, 9 sacks, 1 knockdown, 6 passes defensed PRR = 10.02 PRR+ = 8.59 Are you serious...another one is 10 - that makes Clowney, Ford, and Ealy. How the hell can I write an article when they're all the same....Furthermore, why the hell are they all 10? It's not like I'm sitting over here subconsciously trying to make it 10. I got plenty of varying results from the DTs. Is this just some cruel coincidence? If I chart another player and it comes out 10, I'm just going to give up and acquiesce that I'm doing something wrong.
That's just the way it goes man. Not to sound like a broken record but I truly do believe that James Gayle will break the 10 barrier. On tape it's clear the man is pressuring the quarterback A LOT even if he's not quite sealing it with a sack. Officially he only has 6.0 sacks but the official stats gave him 21 hurries. You and I know those official stats are hardly reliable but the tape I've seen on him suggests the hurries may be understated rather than overstated. Furthermore, he's not a guy that plays every snap unlike some of the guys you did a year ago who were snap leaders (e.g. Werner). Virginia Tech faced 402 pass snaps that I can tell (attempts + sacks) and I would estimate that Gayle probably only played between 65 and 75 percent of them. Maybe 80 percent maximum. It's not that he needed to be subbed out, it's that Frank Beamer's always employed a very active DL rotation. Tyrel Jarrett (#66) ended up in Gayle's LDE position a lot from what I've seen on tape. Additionally I would estimate there had to be about 20 snaps where Gayle dropped back into coverage. So what you have is somewhere between 240 and 300 snaps most likely, with 28 pressures (6.0 official sacks, 7 actual instances of sacking the QB, 21 QB hurries) recorded by the official stat keepers, who are notorious for lowballing the hurry stats. On that point look at Kony Ealy whom you just did. You have him with 27 pressures (hurries plus knockdowns). The official stat books have him with only 7 hurries. You have Jadaveon Clowney with 20 pressures whereas the official stat keeping has only 9 hurries. On the other hand you have Dee Ford with 15 pressures and official stat keeping has him with 17 hurries...so it's conceivable you end up with fewer pressures for Gayle than the 21 hurries official stat keeping has. However I tend to doubt it. They didn't record a single hurry in the UCLA or Miami games...and I feel like I can point to several plays in those games that should be unequivocally considered pressures/knockdowns.
Thoughts on Jarvis Landry? Got his 40 time down to high 4.5 - low 4.6 range at his pro day after running 4.7 at the combine. Probably needs to bulk up some to play the style he does, but the kid is tough in traffic, nice hands, pretty crisp routes though he probably doesn't get the consistent separation you want to see. Could see him slipping some with how he measured (5'11, slow 40) and with the depth of this class.
Interesting question. I believe that Morgan Moses could play left tackle. Just as I believe Zack Martin could play left tackle. But I'm more certain Morgan Moses can play right tackle than I am Zack Martin. After Matthews, Robinson and Lewan, I'd say it's probably Moses, Martin, Billy Turner, Cyrus Kouandjio and Cornelius Lucas. After that, it's a good distance down to the next set of potential left tackles...which IMO would be Antonio Richardson, Joel Bitonio and potentially Matt Patchan (still have more work to do on him.
The problem is he's just not a very rare player, IMO. His best quality is his hands, like catcher's mitts. But he's not an Anquan Boldin so I'm not sure what the upside you're really fighting for is with him and there are a bunch of guys in this draft you could plug in as slot receivers that have good hands and are athletically even more compelling. I mean bottom line to me is how do I take him over Sammy Watkins, Mike Evans, Allen Robinson, Brandin Cooks, Marqise Lee, Bruce Ellington, Odell Beckham, Robert Herron, Davante Adams, Donte Moncrief, Josh Huff, Jordan Matthews or Devin Street? I'm not even sure I'd think very hard about that. I might start having to think a bit harder when it comes to Jarvis Landry versus Martavis Bryant, Paul Richardson, L'Damian Washington or Quincy Enunwa.
Alright - numbers on Anthony Barr (finally not 10!): 275 snaps, 11 hurries, 9 sacks, 2 knockdowns, 0 PDs PRR = 12.5, PRR+ = 12.5 Clearly a decent chunk of Barr's production came from his sacks and if you're looking for a guy with consistent hurry production - Barr isn't it as he was averaging less than 1 hurry a game. When he got sacks and hurries, they were quick and well executed, but it seemed like when he got beat he was really beat. He does have a solid arsenal of pass rush moves especially the spin move back inside. However, I felt like too often he sabotaged his own efforts. There's be plays where I was sure he was going to beat his man outside and I'd be ready to tally a hurry and he'd cut back inside (or spin) for no reason. Maybe he felt as if he was going to get too wide (which did happen often when his momentum got the best of him), but I thought he could have had more pressures. Despite dropping a decent amount into coverage, he still racked up 275 snaps which is right about where you'd expect for a pass rushing linebacker like him.
I feel like the most efficient defensive ends and pass rushers in this class are probably the ones being rated in the 2nd thru 4th rounds like Scott Crichton, Marcus Smith, Kareem Martin, Demarcus Lawrence, Kyle Van Noy and James Gayle...and then you have guys like Kony Ealy, Anthony Barr and Dee Ford rated in the 1st round and they've not been getting to the passer as efficiently. Your findings WILL have an affect on my position rankings. I'm dead serious when I call this position the most moneyball-ish position in the sport. The efficiency matters a lot.
I'm on James Gayle now. Before I started, if I were a bookie, I might have taken your bet that Gayle would have the second highest pass rush rate behind only Donald. I don't think I'd take that bet anymore after getting through 3 games. Hey, things could change - but so far his ability to put pressure on the QB is impressive. Sort of reminds me of Alex Okafor last year, both got the QB all the time but no one ever gave them hype.
James Gayle 265 snaps, 20 hurries, 7 sacks, 4 knockdowns, 1 PD PRR = 8.55, PRR+ = 8.28 Really started off great at the beginning of the season, thought he faded a bit down the last 3-4 games only racking up maybe a sack and one hurry a game. He did rack up a ton of pressures in the end of the UVA game. For some reason, I felt like a majority of his sacks and pressures came near the end of the game. Don't know if his opponents were getting worn down and he was taking advantage of them or what. His PRR of 8.5 isn't Aaron Donald ridiculous, but it still beats Clowney and gang by a decent amount. That 250-270 snap count seems to be the sweet spot for the majority of these rotational pass rushers in college. By the way Chris, your guy Jack Tyler looked pretty good. All over the place pressuring the QB, getting his hands in the passing lanes, great closing speed. Pretty impressive.
Glad to see he's taken the lead at DE. But 8.55 may not be good enough to hold it against the likes of Marcus Smith, Scott Crichton and Kareem Martin! Thanks for including him.
I hear Kelvin Benjamin skipped out on a private workout with an NFL coach who made a "special trip" to go work him out. Benjamin said he was just too tired.
This is my first year of charting them, last year I dealt with the STATS data (which I'm not ever sure I was dealing with exactly right data, their system was extremely hard to parse out pass rush from total pass snaps, what sacks they included as pressures). It seems like it's extremely hard to maintain a pass rush rate under 8. Players really have to dominate consistently and can't afford to have a streak of snaps or games where they don't get near the QB. In a way it makes Donald's achievement of around 6.5 even more impressive. He was just a disruptive force across the board. I'd be surprised if any of the upcoming guys were better than 8.5 significantly. Kareem Martin is up next, so we'll see.
I can't be sure as I was Gayle but I think guys like Martin, Crichton and Smith may also end up below 10. Of course Larry Webster is at a lower level of ball so no dice there.
Kareem Martin may end up being a great pass rusher, but I really want him to play small forward for an NBA team. With his ridiculously long 35" arms and solid vert/broad jump, he could be a nightmare defensively. His bio says he played basketball in high school, but can't find anymore about him doing so. Too bad.
In terms on draft value absolutely. I'd be upset if we drafted a RB in round 2 or 3. Roll with Moreno and hope Miller and be groomed to take over next season. I wouldn't mind a RB in rounds 6 or 7 though just because I'm not really sold on Thomas.
And Kareem Martin takes the lead for now. 333 snaps, 23 hurries, 12 sacks, 4 knockdowns, 2 PD PRR = 8.33, PRR+ = 7.93 LDE : 7.5, Interior: 7.61, RDE: 10.1 Can I just reiterate how much I love Martin's frame/long arms. Man, he looks like a beast out there. Notable in the stats above is that he was so successful rushing from the interior, essentially doing as well on the interior as he did at LDE. I think that gives him the most versatility out of anyone I've looked at so far. Everyone's talking about Kony Ealy kicking inside and pass rushing from there, but Martin with his frame and ability would seem to have even more value doing so than Ealy. The distribution of rushing slightly favored LDE, but it was pretty even across the board with 120, 99, 111 snaps respectively. In total he took 333 snaps which is more than most rushers in this class and shows he can take the workload. Personally, I think I became a big fan of Martin. Hes not bending around the edge like some others, but he has the power to put tackles on their *** and solid moves to get inside using his length. Demarcus Lawrence next.
I've been waffling on which DEs to put behind Kony Ealy. Scott Crichton, Kareem Martin, Marcus Smith and James Gayle have each had the honor.
Cornelius Lucas is a beast. I've been focusing on his work against whichever respectable pass rushers he may have faced in 2013 and he easily controlled all of them. He thoroughly dominated both Jackson Jeffcoat and Cedric Reed, both of whom look like NFL players. He also dominated Will Clarke of West Virginia, who will be drafted this year. I'm watching him against Charles Tapper and Eric Striker now and it's more of the same although it should be noted Tapper is getting the better of Lucas in run defense. Incidentally, Tyler Lockett is really, really good.
His kickslide and lateral movement remind me of George Foreman's boxing footwork late in his career- not a whole lot going on but very efficient. On top of that Lucas is indeed a beast, he'll engulf some DE's in the pros. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bQLwJ5BiEZ8
I've been talking about Gator Hoskins of Marshall for a long time. I wish he were getting more publicity. He's 6'2" & 253 lbs. He ran a 4.73 at his pro day which is decent but I actually think he runs faster if he weren't trying to bulk up so much. The 36.5" vertical and 9'8" broad jumps were both excellent. On the field he moves like a wide receiver. He's got that kind of balance, flexibility and agility at full speed. He's also a nice RAC player. The NFL is looking for mismatch players they can line up in the slot and he's one of them. [video=youtube;LA7ASYOdHxs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LA7ASYOdHxs[/video] [video=youtube;sMswzIC9sr4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=sMswzIC9sr4[/video]
I know I've mentioned this on Twitter and CK talked about it earlier in the thread (a while back), but I'm so confused about Cody Latimer hype. Especially since people are talking about him in the first round... The only thing people can tell me about him is that he's big and relatively fast in his timed speed. No one seems to be able to give me a better explanation for why he's getting discussion in the first round. I can't chart him because there aren't enough Indiana games on the internet, but from the 4-5 games I watched, I'd guess he's a 5-6 yards after the catch player - nothing special. His catch radius is solid, but let's be honest it's not Allen Robinson or close to anyone else elite. Thought a lot of his catches deep came finding holes in zone coverage rather than beating his man one on one. Even then, his 15 YPC (no clue how many targets for YPA) is pretty average. He does have solid hands, I don't think I saw him drop a ball in the 4-5 games I watched. But the way we're talking about him in the end of the first as a H/W/S guy makes him sound like Cord Patterson, which is laughable. A video below for those who haven't seen him [video=youtube;0_1V0C1FfmU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_1V0C1FfmU[/video]
I can't say I have a full big board or have every player ranked with a grade, I just don't have time for that. But if I had to put a quick grade on him - 3rd-4th round. I'd prefer someone with at least one dynamic trait in rounds 1-2, not sure I see that with Latimer.
