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Post Draft Power Rankings/Dolphins Drop

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by Phoenician Fan, May 13, 2014.

  1. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    You act as if last year we only improved our team. Our oline fell apart because we didn't replace Long. So yes we vastly improved our WR but then let an even bigger hole open up in our oline, negating all the improvements we made on offense. We've closed those holes on oline. Our offense will be worlds better. Tannehill had two handicapped years, he won't be handicapped this year.

    Soliai for Mitchell is not a big drop off on paper, if at all. We improved our secondary. Jordan & Taylor will come in 100% healthy, that's like another 1st and 2nd rd pick, being added to the team only without the rookie haze.

    On top of all that you added Jarvis Vacuumhands Landry who will be the go to guy for Tannehill.

    Oh and drastically upgraded OC & oline coach.
     
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  2. 13Machine8385

    13Machine8385 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Our screen plays were the worst screen plays in NFL history.
     
  3. VanDolPhan

    VanDolPhan Club member Club Member

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    Ok. You've pretty much proved my point now. Were talking RIGHT tackle day 1 starters and you bring up a guy whose best suited to play inside who might grow into a tackle 2-3 years down the road.

    Guess what we got that shiny toy last offseason. Spent $60 million dollars on it......and oh yah Tannehill doesn't have time because if he doesn't lob up a 60 yarder in 2 seconds he's flat on his ***.

    But then you wanting a slot #3 WR in the first round with all the holes this team has..........well that pretty much sums you up.
     
  4. 13Machine8385

    13Machine8385 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Yep that sums me up. I'm the guy that thinks we reached at #19 and should've taken a player that was the best receiver among his peers last year and showed explosion like our team has NEVER seen.

    I'm the guy that thinks that James, regardless of what YOU think, will have his struggles as a rookie anyway.

    I'm the guy that thinks that we should have signed a FA to play RT until our high upside rookies such as a player like Turner develops.
     
  5. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Eh..I dunno.

    Oakland has had a great off season, and one of the best drafts this year and they even dropped.

    Do I think we will be 24 at end of season next season? No
     
  6. vt_dolfan

    vt_dolfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

    Hey if your right...Ill give ya a pat on the back. Just hope your the guy who has no problem eating crow when hes wrong.
     
    77FinFan likes this.
  7. Limbo

    Limbo Mad Stillz

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    You act as if this year we only improved our team.

    Focusing on the pass pro totally ignored our anemic running game, sub-par run defense, and terrible LB group. This team might be worse on the ground than it was last year because Albert is a meh run blocker, Shelley is not a good run blocker, and James is a rookie who is not a good run blocker. The solution (Moreno) has a history of injury problems, is more of a pass catcher, and was a one-year wonder on one of the greatest offenses of all time who didn't even want him back all that badly. Not getting a thumper MLB and losing our plugger Soliai could hurt our run defense too, which isn't a good thing when every team in our division has a run-first offense. And we're replacing Patterson/Carroll with either someone who was awful last time he was on the field or a guy who has never started in the NFL.

    I'm just saying that filling obvious holes with tons of resources (which we JUST did prior to 2013) does not mean we're definitely going to improve.
     
  8. 13Machine8385

    13Machine8385 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You'll see. If I'm wrong, I will be happy to be wrong if it means we are winning games.
     
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  9. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    You know I said that, right?
     
  10. 13Machine8385

    13Machine8385 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Didn't see you say that anywhere. I was adding to your point. I have all but given up the OL arguments. Every single thing that went wrong last year was apparently because of the OL. Our normally dynamo of an offense went from 27th in scoring in 2012 to 26th in 2013.

    Many of those failed screens were terrible plays. No chance to succeed regardless of OL.
     
  11. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    I act as if we didn't create holes, because we didn't.

    Again, last year we filled a major hole (WRs) yet created an even bigger hole (oline). That didn't happen this year. We filled the biggest hole (oline) and added pieces to other places like LB, WR, DL.

    So I'm not saying we just filled a hole with a ton resources. i'm saying we filled a hole with a ton of resources and didn't create new holes. We still have some minor holes, but we had them last year.
     
  12. Finrunner

    Finrunner Season Ticket Holder

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    Shelley Smith? I'm fairly sure run blocking is his strength. Pass protection would be his weakness. That and experience.

    I want to stay out of your guy's back-and-forth, but I will say this - I certainly think Albert, although maybe not dominant as a run blocker, is a step up from Jonathan Martin or the aging McKinney. Incogs wasn't all that good when he was in last year, and the revolving door after him wasn't either. Depending on if we throw in a rookie (Turner) or a young vet (Thomas, if improved) or sign an aging vet (Wharton?), we may be a little better, the same, or a little worse there. Talent-wise, maybe a push. Pouncey is still Pouncey. Shelley Smith, as a run blocker, I think will be much better than John Jerry, especially as a zone blocker. And while I think pass protection is the better part of James game, I still prefer his younger legs to Clabo's older ones in the running game. I think we'll be better there over the whole season in the run game. So all-in-all, I do think we have better talent to begin with by a bit, with potential as the season goes to increase the disparity.

    But, as has been mentioned before, it's tough to judge the line player-by-player, because with O-lines, the sum should end up a little better than its parts. Last year, it wasn't. In my opinion, if the coaching staff can find a line they like early and just let that one develop cohesion, then I think we can be miles better than last year. I think in Training Camp last year, the coaches saw problems early with Martin having his lunch handed to him by Olivier Vernon. Sliding protections can only do so much, and Richie had a down year even when he was playing. Clabo started the first half horribly, and Jerry was so-so at best. They were trying Dallas Thomas everywhere, after having been quoted as saying he'd be playing on the left side of the line just after drafting him. He never found a home Then, Jerry got hurt. The whole "bullying affair" happened. And we signed McKinney. And it got worse more than better after the first few games. I'm not sure how much of that was Coach Turner's fault, but I'm crossing my fingers (and kind of really believe) Benton has these guys more cohesive and better coached by mid-season than what we saw last year. Even with all the line switching last year, we still won our first four games. That'll be hard to duplicate, but if Benton does his job and the young guys blossom, we could be much better over 16 games than we were last year, just in running the ball.
     
  13. Fin D

    Fin D Sigh

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    I said our screens were horrible and I said why.

    Our offense was horrible the year before last year becau8se we had no explosive talent and only two receivers able to catch a ball. We fixed that last year but created massive holes in the oline. We have a solid WR corp and a solid oline. This year our offense will jump.
     
  14. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You have to have athletic lineman to run that stuff..Clabo belongs in a wheelchair, Jerry is a fat ***, Martin sucks ***.
     
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  15. brandon27

    brandon27 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    :lol: So wait, we actually addressed our biggest weakness in the OL, and we drop in some lame power rankings? Wow... first of all, that almost makes sense... secondly... why do I care about a power ranking post draft, when these kids haven't even stepped on the field? Oh wait... I dont.

    The Texans however jumped up 6, and they still don't have a QB. That makes tons of sense too. Maybe theyll convert Clowney or Watt to qb...

    Talk about a pointless article.
     
  16. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    but their better overall lineman limbo, all four.

    That's a big deal..Moreno is better...healthy finnegan is better than Carroll, linebacker crew is what it is, but I have high hopes for Jordan Tripp. hopefully Coyle makes Dion play the Leo role when Vern is on the field.
     
    Fin D likes this.
  17. 13Machine8385

    13Machine8385 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Fair enough. I would argue that our WR corp is not as solid as you might think and it's a little too soon to say that an OL with 4 new starters and 2 rookies is "solid", but they will gel as the season progresses imo.

    Most of my faith in our team this season is in Lazor's new scheme and our new OL coach.
     
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  18. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    I think it depends how highly you think of our draft picks. I'm very very very high on James and he was the one guy I wanted to walk away from this draft with. So I feel safe day one at RT.

    I loved Turner too but I think we will see ups and downs at first with him.

    I think the key will be getting both extended preseason reps.
     
  19. VanDolPhan

    VanDolPhan Club member Club Member

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    Heh you know how I feel about Turner. When that kids light finally turns on and things slow down for him he could be my most favorite guard since Jamie Nails.

    James I am growing to love. KB21 posted a gif of him pulling off this combo block where he blocks the DE and jams him inside to where the guard picks him up and immediately switches to the blitzing corner and sends him flying 3-4 yards away. Thing of beauty. It's not easy to see an NFL tackle make that sort of play and that kid is pulling it off in college.
     
  20. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Head coach is still a buffoon though ;)
     
  21. jdang307

    jdang307 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Plugging 5 guys together who were all solid individually doesn't make your oline better automatically. Look at what happened when we brought in Clabo. Let's hope the oline gel and does become a solid unit.
     
  22. RevRick

    RevRick Long Haired Leaping Gnome Club Member

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    Nope... not if it meant that the QB is pulling grass out of his supporter!

    This is a team game. No one is running routes against the air in a place where the QB has all the time he needs to set up and pass. The Biguglies on the other team are trying to plant him - literally! They can do so with no to very little help from the LB corps and get away with it - which means that you have a lot of people dropping into lanes, bumping into playmakers before 5 yards, and double teaming the 'playmaker.' If the pass does get off in time, being double teamed usually means that the 'playmaker' is not the first target - unless the ball is being forced, which means that two of the three bad things that can happen when a ball is passed have a higher probability of being the outcome. So, even if the ball is not intercepted, but only blocked, that means that the 'playmaker' has run a long wind sprint for nothing. Since the only other 'playmaker' currently on the Dolphins seems to feel that actually going up and fighting for the football is beneath his dignity, or it might ruin his nail polish - nothing much happens in that area either. Fewer plays made and more sacks not stopped - big L again!

    If, on the other hand, the gamble plays out in our favor and the RT does play up to expectation, if Turner manages to handle one of the guard spots and Smith the other in at least average fashion, and Pouncey keeps things going the right way for the time being - the Quarterback might just possibly have that .5 second more to make the slightly more accurate throw and MAKE THE PLAY!


    To paraphrase an old Coach I have watched coach more games than most people have been around to watch - "It all starts in the trenches. If you lose there, you lose the game!"
     
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  23. 13Machine8385

    13Machine8385 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Let me start off by saying that I mostly agree. But while the trenches are important, it was not necessary to take one so early when so many high end playmakers were on the board. I have argued this point so many times and in so many ways. I just don't know what else to say about it.

    I just think we could have built the line in rounds 3-5, signed a UFA and came out of the draft in pretty good shape on the OL.......and still have Cooks. Our offense really needed a player like that to compete with the big boys.

    When we went to the Super Bowl 30 years ago, our offense was #1 in scoring offense. I just want to get back there and I don't think drafting Right Tackles instead of dynamic, explosive playmakers is the way to do it. It's not that I don't think OL is important, it's that I think it's easier to fill RG and RT using UFA and mid round picks. Use the early picks on elite athletes that put the ball in the endzone.
     
  24. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    I'd say there is about 15% chance Cooks is a stud WR and an 85% chance that James is a very very good RT.

    We made the correct choice.
     
  25. 13Machine8385

    13Machine8385 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    There is a 100% chance that James had better be a very very good RT to take him #19 overall in one of the deepest drafts in years.

    Sounds like you are pretty low on Cooks. The Saints aren't.
     
  26. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    There isn't a 100% chance on any prospect. The closest I've ever been to 100% sure is Calvin Johnson when he came out.

    I think Cooks can contribute but I don't think he will ever be a #1 or a #2. He will be an explosive #3 at best in the right system IMO. As for the Saints, they have hit and missed in the draft just like everyone else. Just because they have had success as a team doesn't mean they have been great in the draft. One Drew Brees goes a long way.
     
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  27. Aquafin

    Aquafin New Member

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    the poor house
    I am going to ask this question , why in hell do some of you guys buy into the if we are ranked low we will do better . that stat is so misguided . when Sparano and the Tuna took over they released our better offensive players and outsiders could see this while this fanbase put their heads in the sand and were pretending that we were becoming a dynasty .

    we have been addressing the oline ever since Saban left at some point we need to get some stud players at TE , RB, WR, AND DE, DB AND LINEBACKERS.

    Miami doesn't draft wisely and that is a bad omen . Case in point , Detroit went out and Got tight end Brandon Pettigrew , Calvin Johnson and two other wide receivers. then they address their defensive line . where as Miami in that time span have been addressing oline , oline , and oline then they signed Reggie Bush while Miami drafted Lamar Miller and Daniel Thomas sure Detroit hasn't had much success but the they are great on one side of the ball where as Miami was creating more holes while Detroit was attempting to fill in those holes .


    if you look at Don Shula 's draft except his last five years he had at least 3 really good running backs 2 decent to good tightends, and at least 3 wide receivers that were good.

    Don Shula' s worst wide receiver corp was better then Sparanos and Philbin's best wr corp.


    bottom line Miami doesn't go for the throat with players like they used to. until we go after more then one offensive skill player we wont be making any playoff appearances.
     
  28. 13Machine8385

    13Machine8385 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Prototypical #1 WRs are usually big bodied players that can get off of the line, run the entire route tree, and have an ability to both catch balls in traffic and separate. Cooks lacks the size of a true #1 but does everything else well and is pretty strong for his size. He's not CJ, AJ Green, Julio Jones, Demarius Thomas, Dez Bryant, Brandon Marshall, or Larry Fitz. But maybe he could be more like a Welker, Steve Smith, TY Hilton, Antonio Brown, DeSean Jackson, or Randall Cobb. He can still be dominant. To say he can't be a #2 is a stretch.

    Calvin Johnson was rated the #1 WR prospect by almost every draft site since his freshman season. Then he ran a 4.3 at the combine. Slam dunk. Really not a reach to say that he would succeed.
     
  29. RevRick

    RevRick Long Haired Leaping Gnome Club Member

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    We should mention the names: Charles Rodgers, Peter Warrick, Mike Williams.... All rated explosive players, IIRC..
     
  30. Alex44

    Alex44 Boshosaurus Rex

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    I never said it was a reach. I said he's the closest I've ever seen to a 100% slam dunk.
     
  31. 13Machine8385

    13Machine8385 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Rogers was a beast but had other issues with health and character. Williams was not exactly explosive (4.6 player). Warrick did not test well at the combine. I think he ran a 4.74.

    I'm talking about a guy that was the best WR in college football last year that also blew the combine up with his skill set. Rare explosiveness and change of direction ability.
     
  32. 13Machine8385

    13Machine8385 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Got it.... I see what you meant now. Good point by the way :pointlol:
     

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