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OTA thread

Discussion in 'Miami Dolphins Forum' started by SICK, May 27, 2014.

  1. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    and that is the one caveat that keeps me from lashing out with vitriol, I do not know if the process of teathering him will benefit him longterm.
     
  2. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    With Dion Jordan, I am just happy to have the potential of having another defensive playmaker on the team.
     
  3. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    If you don't think Nate Garner(or for that matter anyone you project to be on a gameday roster) can't beat what McKinnie gave you last season, they shouldn't be on the roster. McKinnie's performance last year wasn't good, and that's before you give the dice another roll on his age and dog**** work ethic.
     
  4. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Thatta boy Coyle, put yourself on the line, you talk like that you better be getting him all over the field.
     
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  5. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    http://espn.go.com/blog/afceast/post/_/id/70479/dolphins-ota-notes-mike-wallace-shines
     
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  6. VanDolPhan

    VanDolPhan Club member Club Member

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    Shelley Smith not helping my fears about his work in progress pass protection. That keeps up for long (even against Starks) and that could open the door to a Thomas/Turner pairing at guard.
     
  7. RoninFin4

    RoninFin4 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    [​IMG]

    Photos from OTAs here: http://www.miamidolphins.com/multim...2cc16c8a#8d9b7cce-66d9-4941-855b-a5bd0ee96848

    One thing I think that is a bit confusing with this whole "LB Switch" thing, is that the media keeps labeling Dannell Ellerbe as the strongside LB. While I believe they're correct that he's lining up on the same side as the TE is, I think he's performing the role that Philip Wheeler did in 2013, and Kevin Burnett did in 2012, which essentially is more of a coverage LB; which is one thing Ellerbe was [decently] effective at last year. I think Philip Wheeler's going to be the guy that ends up on the line of scrimmage essentially performing the SAM LB duties that Koa Misi has done in the past, even if he's on the weakside of a defense (see above picture) - Wheeler's the OLB crouched with the visor on the far side.

    One of these days, I'll get a post up here about Jack Dooley's "Eagle Defense" which has some underlying concepts that seem to be shining through in the Kevin Coyle defense, most notably because Cameron Wake is on the defense's left side (i.e. usually opposite a TE). I'll try to work on it this week(end); perhaps I can make a defensive preview thread liked I did in 2012.
     
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  8. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    Agreed. Just what I was thinking. You judge the quality of the pick based on where he was drafted. But, you judge Jordan just on his usefulness to the team. He's a football player at this point. You may hold onto such a player based on his 1st round draft position (he was a first rounder no matter what). But, let's just see what he can do.

    It's interesting that he was at 248 last year. He looked as big or bigger than JT ever did (who probably went at 240 most of his career). I love that comparison above with Clowney. Of course, at 265, he likely does not run a 4.53 40.

    Still, I don't see how you keep him off the field with his length and quickness. He needs to be on the field as often as possible rushing the passer.
     
  9. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Defenses are in nickel so often it's hard to get up the motivation for this type of thing anyway. Nickel defense is the base defense nowadays. What we think of as a base defense is becoming a specialty package.
     
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  10. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    I believe Dion Jordan said he was 260 lbs last year. He probably meant at this time last year, when he checked into OTAs and such.
     
  11. Deerless Dice

    Deerless Dice Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    And still no pictures of the new and improved Dion Jordan. Had to disable Ghostery to even see the pictures on Chrome, C'mon miamidolphins.com, do you really need 25 trackers running on a photo album?
     
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  12. RoninFin4

    RoninFin4 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Point taken. But it excites me just as I feel like this change, while subtle, is going to get more mileage out of Philip Wheeler and Dannell Ellerbe. How much that is, obviously, remains to be seen.
     
  13. 77FinFan

    77FinFan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Ryan Shazier says hello.
     
  14. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    What I would like to hear more from the practice observers is which two linebackers seem to stay on the field in nickel packages.

    Last time around I heard it was actually Wheeler and Misi which I think would surprise some folks.

    If that's the case then overall I think you would say that while Wheeler drew much of the fan ire last year it was Ellerbe who disappointed the coaches more. That wouldn't shock me at all. I kept saying that while Wheeler pretty much was the guy they should have known him to be, with the same strengths they imagined as well as many of the weaknesses, it was Dannell Ellerbe who showed up as something completely different than they thought when they acquired him.
     
  15. MonstBlitz

    MonstBlitz Nobody's Fart Catcher

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    I can't wait to hear what DJ has to say about Knowshon Moreno looking "Thicker". :lol:
     
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  16. Dol-Fan Dupree

    Dol-Fan Dupree Tank? Who is Tank? I am Guy Incognito.

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    I remember Ellerbe trying to cover Sproles. Might as well been nobody covering Sproles. The result would have been the same.
     
  17. 77FinFan

    77FinFan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Yeah, that's not encouraging.
     
  18. cuchulainn

    cuchulainn Táin Bó Cúailnge Club Member

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    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 1m
    "@NateBaumann1: How is our receiving corps compared to last year at this time of year?"» a lot deeper than any year I've covered the Phins

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 1m
    "@J_Broscio: Tannehill grade?"» I'd give him a solid B. Lazor is cracking that whip & I see improvement, but he's good in red zone already

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 3m
    "@MehmetKaleci1: how are the o line prospects looking so far?"» no pads, no assessment. Sorry. Play play stuff without pads.

    Armando Salguero @ArmandoSalguero · 2h
    DC Kevin Coyle on Koa Misi to MLB: "I can't commit today that it's a done deal but I like what we're seeing."


     
  19. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    That part was probably predictable based on Baltimore tape. He always showed good sideline-to-sideline range in Baltimore which is where he excelled in the coverage duties Miami mostly gave him in 2013. But I think alen1 pointed out that Dean Pees really made an effort to protect him in coverage schematically and you could see on tape that if he had to cover any amount of vertical depth he was lost.

    The part where I think Miami could have buyer's remorse is when they bought Ellerbe from Baltimore they kept talking about what an "attacking" linebacker he was, and they specifically cited his blitz success.

    I remember when Heath Evans went on the finsiders, he said middle pressure was how you beat Tom Brady rather than edge pressure. I think Jesse replied that's why we got an upgrade on our blitzing from Karlos Dansby to Dannell Ellerbe. But Heath called it straight out, he said I'm not sure why you think a 6'1" & 228 lbs guy is going to move the needle as a blitzer for you. And he was right. The blitz success in Baltimore was more scheme related than anything.

    In Miami, Dannell Ellerbe was an utter failure as this "attacking" linebacker that he was supposed to be. He was actually even a little better in coverage than I thought he'd be, but he wasn't anywhere near this attacking/blitzing/playmaking guy that the team hyped when they signed him.
     
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  20. cuchulainn

    cuchulainn Táin Bó Cúailnge Club Member

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    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 21s
    It is too early for me to say what the Dolphins offense will be, do. Pace was never faster than OTA, camp of 2012. And that offense sucked.

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 58s
    "@Sharfin67: So far do you like what you see of Lazor's offense» don't know about the offense, but I like his in your face approach.

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 4m
    "@Finishtop: Will young team have mental and physical tools to handle up tempo Lazor O this year?"» great question. It is A LOT to grasp.

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 5m
    "@Coach_TreyMead: people act like Wallace had a bad yr last year. Career high in yards?"» Wallace himself would tell you he was disappointed

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 6m
    "@Johnston2424: if jenkins outplays wheeler is he a possible cap casualty?"» NO. Wheeler has $5M GUARANTEED to him this season.Hook or crook

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 7m
    "@Big_Kahuna66: Rooting for Binns. Does he look like he has his quickness back?"» no. But he keeps making plays. Avg day today though.

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 8m
    "@dannyhesford: Anything to worry about with Grimes or just Wallace's day?"» I've NEVER seen Grimes struggle until today. Iron sharpens iron

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 9m
    "@joseph_mello: How's Misi as ILB? Has been vocal out there?"» I heard him today manning up, directing traffic. Eye opener for me.

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 10m
    "@glh205: who looks like best option for #2 TE behind Clay?"» it is Sims, but every TE is being used in many ways. Very confusing for me.

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 12m
    Notice I didn't say Koa Misi is playing better. I just said his standing, status has improved. He's the man with the juice on D now.

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 12m
    "@jlong013: who do u think has made the biggest leap of any player since end of last season?"» Koa Misi His standing with team is higher now

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 13m
    "@KeithFCollins: How has Walt Aikens looked in coverage?"» WHO? Haven't seen him once. I don't check for rookies. Sorry.

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 15m
    "@Finishtop: Was Wallace's good showing today down to scheme, bad coverage» he didn't score on motions or schemes. Just beat Grimes BAD. SMH

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 17m
    "@JamesZicari: your biggest position concern early in the offseason?"» only one thing really matters. How much Tannehill improves

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 17m
    "@OteroGetsDINERO: top 3 performers in OTA's today?"» Mike Wallace, Jimmy Wilson (INT) and Tannehill. Red zone day so plenty scoring.

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 18m
    "@Uncle_Chuck13: Wallace looks a little bigger is that true?"» No. Same size as last year.

    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 19m
    "@drwscout: What under the radar battles are heating up?"» I don't think Lamar Miller is handing Knowshon Moreno the starting RB job
     
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  21. Da 'Fins

    Da 'Fins Season Ticket Holder Staff Member Club Member

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    Was it Ellerbe who lost playing time to Jenkins last year or Wheeler?

    Jenkins seemed to flash some decent potential at the end of the year. I'd like to see some real competition there (with either Ellerbe or Wheeler).
     
  22. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Wheeler, but it was really only one game (W15: NE) and the genie went back in the bottle the following weeks so who knows why they had Jenkins doing that in that particular game.

    Earlier in the year (W07: BUF) Jelani Jenkins also received increased playing time but that was because Dannell Ellerbe missed the game and so they replaced Ellerbe with a combination of Trusnik (base packages) and Jenkins (nickel packages).

    My guess is if they find they can't trust Misi to stay on the field 100% of the time, that's the approach they'll take again...and Misi will play like Trusnik did in that game.
     
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  23. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Man I don't trust Ellerbe in coverage past 10 yards
     
  24. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Ryan Shazier is not 6'6 255 lbs.
     
  25. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Evidently Jelani Jenkins was taking 1st team reps over Dannell Ellerbe today.
     
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  26. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    Can't find a pic of his ***...a running back getting fat, last back I got on about that was Ronnie brown, it was a glaring tell that his career was going downhill fast..
     
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  27. Limbo

    Limbo Mad Stillz

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    Music to my ears. This is a matter of time. I think he's going to show and cover well enough that the staff will feel like they have to find snaps for him and rotate someone out. Jenkins is in for a big step up this year, imo.
     
  28. ckparrothead

    ckparrothead Draft Forum Moderator Luxury Box

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    Not expecting much out of Jelani Jenkins. I think it's more damning of Dannell Ellerbe. There have been a number of red flags this off season that point to the coaches/front office people being more disappointed in Ellerbe than Wheeler.

    It won't just be Jenkins they try and put ahead of Ellerbe in various packages. I think it'll be Jordan Tripp as well. Eventually.
     
  29. phinswolverinesrockets

    phinswolverinesrockets If he dies, he dies

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    Just some thoughts on the LB debate that was going on earlier:

    In 2012, Phillip Wheeler was great for the Raiders. He graded out as PFF’s sixth-best 4-3 OLB and second-best 4-3 OLB in the pass rush, as he compiled 30 total QBP (three sacks) in 134 pass rush snaps, getting to the QB on 22 percent of his pass rush snaps.
    In 2013, with the Phins, PFF ranks him as the worst OLB in the league.
    https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/03/13/fantasy-reaction-philip-wheeler-signs-with-miami/

    In 2012, Darnelle Ellerbe was great for the Ravens. He graded out as PFF's 13th best ILB.
    In 2013, with the Phins, PFF ranks him as the 50th best ILB.
    http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/2014-03-03/sports/fl-dolphins-notes-0304-20140303_1_dannell-ellerbe-koa-misi-jelani-jenkins

    Both PFF and Rotoworld had Ellerbe and Wheeler listed as the top 2 free agent LBs when we signed them. I was very excited when we signed them, especially after watching Ellerbe just destroy everyone in the playoffs and Super Bowl.

    What i'm trying to say is: The talent is there, they are both proven players in other systems. Maybe we need to adapt to their strengths and not the other way around. All of this shuffling LBs around to other spots means nothing to me unless you are using the players at their strengths. I know that i sound like a broken record by now, but I must say it again....the problem with this team isn't talent, it's coaching. Coyle needs to step up his game. He has plenty to work with.

    Just my 2 cents.
     
  30. phinswolverinesrockets

    phinswolverinesrockets If he dies, he dies

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    [​IMG]

    This was Eddie Lacy at training camp last year. Fat as hell. He had a pretty good year last season. Moreno will get it together. I'm not worried. RBs tend to put on pounds in the offseason.
     
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  31. scotty_irnbru

    scotty_irnbru Well-Known Member

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    I agree entirely, the SB run for him was excellent, he was highly rated. I agree, the coaching needs to make better use of the talent. That's been the case with LBs, RBs, and Tannehill.
     
  32. 77FinFan

    77FinFan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    237 to 248, big difference on height, but Shazier was better in almost all measureables. Just being a devil's advocate.
     
  33. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Is that the same Wallace whose been constantly vilified here in recent months? Must be a typo. Walker couldn't have meant Wallace. I've been assured by the cognoscenti around here, that this Wallace character is a one trick pony who pretty much sucks.
     
  34. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    Exaggeration.
     
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  35. pocoloco

    pocoloco I'm your huckleberry Club Member

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    Omar Kelly @OmarKelly · 1m
    "@NateBaumann1: Ryan Tannehill just threw a football over that mountain
     
  36. MrClean

    MrClean Inglourious Basterd Club Member

    The two best off season acquisitions IMO.
     
  37. Disgustipate

    Disgustipate Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    If he's willing to put in the effort and the coaching staff is able to come up with concessions to do what he's good at without damaging the rest of the offense, absolutely. 2010-level play from Wallace would be phenomenal, it's just that there isn't a whole lot of reason to hold your breath for it.
     
  38. DPlus47

    DPlus47 Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    He looks like a lineman in that pic!
     
  39. CrunchTime

    CrunchTime Administrator Retired Administrator

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  40. djphinfan

    djphinfan Season Ticket Holder Club Member

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    You cannot discount the height and length, that's the point, that's what makes his movement skills so special, he can do it effortlessly and smoothly at over 6'6, and those extra inches will cover space in copious amounts.
     

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