Some defensive coordinator is disrespecting Tannehill

Playoffs or bust for Tannehill and Philbin. So who will be our next QB and coach? This team has NO shot at making the playoffs! I dare anyone to look at our schedule and show me 9 or 10 wins! Don't like being a Debbie downer here but realisticly see a 4 or 5 win season on our horizon. Patriots twice with Revis ( 2 losses here). Bills twice have improved more than we have and beat us twice with a 3rd string QB. ( 2 losses here) Jets twice, have improved more than us, better RB, options at QB ( split here at best. At Denver, at Lions, at Bears, home against Packers ROLFLMAO! Where are the 9 or 10 wins folks?

 

Whatever. Before last year, all the negative Nancies had us losing to Atlanta, Indy, Cincy, Pats twice, Carolina, N.O., San Diego, and splitting with the other division opponents...equaling 10 losses. Those games went far different, and we came away with 8 losses. I'm not saying I'm happy about 8 losses, but I don't foresee the wheels falling off every year either. There's simply no possible way to say 4 or 5 win season, even if the O line was ALL rookies.

Aside from the obvious changes in personnel, most of which many would say were at least a push or upgrade, the coaching staff looks very different as well. Will Lazor be better than Sherman? I don't see how he can't, unless he just totally locks up. Howzabout that new OL coach that is widely respected and considered in the top few OL coaches in the league? All that and the defense improved more-so than the offense IMO.

Several things are in place to give optimism, along with all the negatives.

And I wouldn't bother taking the time to show you 9 or 10 wins...it'd be a waste of my time, since everybody has their own view of it and you wouldn't agree anyway, but I see 'em....I disagree with 4 of your 9 losses.

 

I think it's kinda inferred that said defensive coordinator believes that there are only four or five QBs worth game-planning for. In every way Tannehill is middle-of-the-pack, except for his potential, which is what we are all clinging to.

Ryan hasn't yet put the team on his back, but he did have four 4th quarter comebacks last year (only brady had more) even tho he was the 3rd worst rated 4th quarter QB (59.2 QBR), so maybe he does have the ability to make something out of nothing.

 

That's a terrible 4Q QBR. Having 4 comebacks isn't a virtue when you're that bad in the 4th.

 

I think if your bad play is why you're going behind in the fourth, then true. However, I'd guess these stats reflect having good games and bad games.

It's interesting that if you lump 4th quarter comebacks and two minute drills together, Ryan is probably a league leader.

 

I pray you are right and I am dead wrong. Love the addition of Lazor but fear that Philbin will tie his hands. Love the new o-line coach also I just don't trust Philbin. Hopefully I am wrong but fear he will resort back to his old ways of leaning on the defense and handcuffing the offense. I LOVE some of our young players just fear the coaches will hold them from growing.

In your mind what record will we need for Philbin to return next year? For me he has to make the playoffs but I feel as though we will have to grade Tannehill based on his growth rather than our record to determine his 2015 future.

 

How in the hell did Philbin "handcuff" the offense? Ireland was the one that spent less than every team in the league on offense. Ireland was the one that refused to upgrade the LT position ignoring Philbin's pleas. Ireland was the one that let our best playmaker in Reggie Bush walk. Our offense relies on heavy TE use, swing and a miss by Ireland on that front. And Ireland was the one that spent 4 of our first 5 picks on defense.

If you want to say Philbin "handcuffed" the offense by relying too much on Tannehill being able to shoulder the load then I would agree. But hopefully that strategy pays off by expediting his learning curve.

 

I hear ya there...I don't have a lot of trust in the HC. And with his comments already made about, "if it don't work, we'll go back" in so many words...I think he's clutching his position to his chest a little too hard.

 

If what don't work? Go back to what? And I must have missed it but what was the actual quote?

 

I would be be the first to agree wth you about Ireland not giving the offense more help, however what I am referring to when I say handcuff is Philbins approach when we have a 3 or 7 point leed. He totally shuts down the offense as though we have a rock star D! He coaches like he is scared the O might make a mistake rather than keeping the pedal to the metal. I would even argue that our line was not nearly as bad as most people think last year. When we as fans know we are running every first and second down and always 3rd and long how in the world is the o-line stand any chance of being productive.

 

If Lazors high speed offense doesn't take off fast we will go back to last years offense. Translation Lazor you have no shot Philbin misses Mike Sherman already!

 

To paraphrase, well try it for now but it's a double edge sword that interferes with other things and well just have to see.

Translation - what he said.

If Lazors offense works that means Philbin's philosophy failed. Of
Course he's going to be reluctant. And if Lazor moves on do you have confidence Philbin will hire the right person again.

 

This is a terrible perception that Philbin has developing here if not true, he needs to rephrase the answer, the perception is philbin has publicly stated that if this new motion offense doesn't work effiently he's going back to something, what that is I'm not clear of...'is that how it should be?

There's so many ways to go with that.

As a fan, I'm not clear as to what offense he would refer back to.

Why are you publicly saying things like that, what do you mean, are you sure you want your players to hear that.

Why are we not clear of your plan, or what you specifically said, idk seems a bit unusual?

 

I think you're mistaking an inept bad offense (cough cough Tannehill) with conservative coaching. Mark my words, if we ever get the chance to run up the score (and I think it could happen this season), we will.

 

I don't think your paraphrasing is accurate, what he said was we'll use motion if and when it suits us. It was a literal simple answer without the hidden devious undertone that some of you have invented. This Philbin-Lazor rift is pure biased speculation based on nothing in my humble opinion.

Its kind of nonsensical too seeing as Philbin was the one that wanted, courted and hired Lazor just a few months ago.

 

No, No. Sleep is not for *******! Sleep is what happens after *******! I wished I had 4 more hours in the day when that was what I was after!

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap20...-rodgers-tops-preseason-list-of-nfls-best-qbs



I know. It's an nfl.com puff piece. I'd agree with the ranking of RT. Borderline franchise sounds about right. He seems to be in the company I'd expect

 

Wilson has been better than Luck by every measure except for where he was selected, I would interchange the two or at least have them on the same level but to have Luck ranked a tier above discredits the whole article.

 

I'm in general agreement with the piece. Finally someone looking objectively at Matt Ryan's performance

I did forget about the aerial attack concern with Seattle at the end of last year. Russell went 6 games throwing 1 or less TDs in a row. Some might label that ... caretaker/manager. I'm hoping that doesn't happen again (at least it was at the end of the year and the first two games of the playoffs).

 

Running the football from the Qb position has innate qualities that make the play successful, the reason I'm adamant about getting Ryan on the run as much as possible is because he hasn't shown those innate qualities himself, yet I know he has some athleticism, he's just needs his *** in motion before they kick in.

 

Designed runs or scrambling? Huge difference. Maybe a bit of both. I don't ever see Ryan being Andrew Luck or Big Ben in scrambling ability. Those two are just so good with instincts and then strength to shed would be tacklers.

 

Agreed, I don't think he has the innate sense to be an effective scrambling Qb, not someone who consistently is gonna make plays in that fashion, every once in a while you get a couple but there usually after he's forced out of the pocket and gets lucky, there's no initiative or precision with his decision making on his part in that dept,so that's why I say there is a lack of instinct there.

That being said, I know the dude can run, and I know he's exceptional running and throwing..funny how the best thing the Qb can do from a skillset perspective, wasn't even exploited by his coordinator, makes me angry thinking about it, anyways, Designed runs, and rollouts, and read option is the only way to engage a part of this qbs skillset.

So as his staff, They should be able to see the lack of instincts from the pocket, and at the same time, be able to see how lethal he has been on the run to both sides, how really good things seems to happen when he runs the read option, and incorporate as much as possible into the gameplan.

 

I think it was his first designed run of the season against the Saints he had a nice gain and finished it with a stiff arm. The stiff arm was probably the reason we were reluctant to do any more of it, had he been smart enough to scamper out of bounds or slide sacrificing a yard or two instead of his body we might have done it more.

Not sure why we didn't roll out more though, the roll outs are a good way to help the o-line even though they limit the offense somewhat.

 

I thought someone posted a stat in 2012 his rookie year, showing terrible numbers when on the move and throwing. Did he improve on that in 2013? That might explain why they were gun shy in 2013.

 

No sir, I don't need the stats to know he was excellent when on the move in any capacity..I would bet money he was efficient and very productive in this dept in Both years..

 

Anyways I don't see anything wrong with that quote from the DC, seems accurate to me so far in his career.

 

It was the opposite... Tannehill was better then every AFC East quarterback in 2012 when rolling out the pocket...

http://espn.go.com/blog/afceast/post/_/id/60300/ryan-tannehill-excels-outside-the-pocket

 

How does that compare with the league though? Comparing him against Mark Sanchez, Tom Brady, & Ryan Fitzpatrick when talking about roll outs isn't exactly the top of the food chain..

I assume that Tannehill is good at rollouts, but I also remember reading something (PFF maybe) that stated he was OK, not horrible but not great.

 

PFF graded him the the 3rd best in the NFL last season behind CKap and Wilson while noting that his Adjusted Depth of Target was far above average and their ADOT, which means lesser %.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2014/06/04/qbs-in-focus-drop-back-rollout-scramble/




He was graded 4th best on Scrambles...

 

Thanks Cooch, PFF backs it up..

Just let that set in for a sec, now think of how many games went by where we saw 0 freakin roll outs, or a measly 1 roll out games..

Sherman was a asshat..piss me off

 

This is the key thing....Sherman. He and the oline were the problem. Tannehill is not the problem. Philbin is not the problem.

The fact that Philbin had a blind spot with Sherman should be no more an indictment of him, then Shula's blind spot with Olivadatti.

 

Philbin is the problem, he hired him.

Shula did go to the playoffs and had teams that looked to be contenders for the Superbowl with Olivadatti.

Even if it is a blind spot, so far Philbin hasn't done anything to prove that he isn't part of the problem.

 

Olivadatti was as bad at his job as Sherman was at his. We were held back by Olivadatti. The main difference is Olivadtti's reign of terror lasted for a really long time, Sherman's didn't and Philbin had a legit reason to have a blind spot with Sherm, Shula did not with Olivadatti.

 

Philbin made Sherman worse by wanting him to abandon the run.

 

Our line couldn't block, our best offensive talent was with the passing game. You act like we could have ran just fine.

 

Ya know some folks point out that Lamar had a 4.0 average and that's a positive sign for him moving forward, maybe that has something to do with the team running the football on non running downs and situations, I think if there was a stat for average when we wanted to run, it will be piss *** bad..

Basically we couldn't run the football when we needed to so we got some yards when they weren't looking..

So when someone brings that up about Lamar and his average may wanna think twice.

 

You just explained why you need to stick with the run game even when it isn't working too well and why Philbin absolutely was the problem. Philbin didn't have a blind spot for Sherman, Sherman ran exactly what Philbin wanted.

It's as if Philbin and Sherman aren't on record on this exact subject.

Does that sound like Sherman making the call to abandon the run, or Philbin? You'd have to have the thickest blinders on to believe Philbin had a blind spot re: Sherman, and it was Sherman making these calls. It is unequivocally Philbin who directed the offense so. I mean, these are the words from his own mouth.

 

A commitment to the run would still have helped. Plus the run blocking was much better than the pass blocking. Plus pass rushing is so much easier if you have the quarterback have a 3 or 5 step drop most of the half.

 

Philbin finished the season on a real bad note, you don't get beat like that, in your house, with that on the line, and not be under heat for the first half of your third season.

I mean he's got to get the team to play good ball out the gate, bad ending last Season (those two performances were not just talent related) combined with slow start, bottom line, not much wiggle room, if any, and I don't think that's outrageous expectations to have, it's his third year, I don't judge based on numbers, just how hard and enthusiastic his players play..need to See that early.

I hope his methods and style will pay off..

Let me ask you a question, do you think he needs to get on the horn with Coughlin.?

Also, from what you can tell,do you think he has the ability to show compassion with his players and their families ?, without knowing the man, what kind of man do we have ?

the closer I get to the season, and the more information and analysis of the Players personalities I'm gathering, I actually think we will..