Rewatched the buc game.

Other than the pass that was tipped, saving a possible INT...how did he get lucky?

 

I don't agree with that, and aside from Hartline being open and the tip I don't agree with CK either.

I mean you're talking about his "good luck" with no mention of is bad luck. Like Wallace dropping a screen with great blocking and open field ahead of him as well as Wallace being blatantly held on a perfect deep ball.

 

I didn't get to see the game here in Hawaii, but it is scheduled to be on the NFL network later today, so you have given me some things to look for in the game.

I have always had concerns regarding Tannehill's quick decision making. While he appears to be quite intelligent in some aspects of his life. I just don't think he is as intelligent, when it comes to decisions as an NFL QB as many of the starters in the NFL appear to be. Especially the QB's who consistently lead their teams to victories late in games and also lead their teams to the playoffs, year after year.

I read somewhere last year that Tannehill was the type NFL QB who would be good enough to lead his team to 6-9 victories a year, but would probably never develop into the type of QB who gets his team to the playoffs. Hopefully that is not the case, but only time will tell if he can overcome the weaknesses he has at this time.

I also noticed that the Dolphins running game, (based on negative yards gained in the first half) continues to be a problem. I assume this is because the OL is not able to open holes at the line of scrimmage. I will check that out when I see the game later.

I think with a quality OL and quality RB,s supporting him, Tannehill would not have to be forced into so many passing plays. This would limit him having to make so many decisions in the passing game. I just don't think at this time, Tannehill is the type QB who can put a team on his back and carry it to the playoffs, or even to a winning season.

Based on what I read in your comments regarding Tannehill last night. If he plays like that against the Partiots or Bills in the first two games of the season, it is going to be a long day on the field for the Dolphins.

I realize that Tannehill is still trying to adjust to this new offense under Lazor and it is still three weeks before the Patriots game. Hopefully Tannehill , the OL, and the RB's can continue to progress over the next few weeks and throughout the course of the season.

I continue to feel that this is a do or die year for Tannehill. He needs to prove it on the field in 2014, or the Dolphins need to move on from Tannehill, if he doesn't make a big jump in his development this year.

 

Well yeah I want him to find the right guy every play. Being realistic though, you can't extrapolate anything from a single play other than it wasn't a great play.

Personally I look for trends, not individual good/bad plays. If he has five rollouts next game and two or three have the same issue of course it starts to become a concern.

 

i agree, 2 drops which would have made his night even better, that tipped pass was lucky, but like you said, that wallace drop also was set up very nice

 

That rollout was disappointing for sure and the tipped ball was pure luck, but I don't think it's that out of the ordinary early in the game to be missing a "better" option than the one you threw it to. Isn't that the reason you see QBs looking at the aerial pics when they are on the bench? To go over what holes in the D you might have been missing? Not saying he doesn't need to improve decision making as he obviously does, just saying.

 

Really can't say that after these 2 preseason games IMO, we held the Falcons to 84 rushing yards, 2.6 yds/carry and the Bucs to 91 yds, 3.2 yds/carry, granted we didn't play great running teams... I don't have the stats for our first team defense though, and I do think they played worse against the run when facing the opponent's 1st team offense, so there's that...

 

First off there's no reason to go all "other than" on that pass. He throws that interception and he walks away on the night with 2 turnovers in only 1 quarter of play...an 8 turnover per game run rate.

Second I thought he also got a bit lucky on a pass he forced between defenders to Sims rather than taking the easy wide open yards to the back in the flat.

 

Just looking at the games with no stats, I'd be willing to be the 1st team unit did better against Tampa than Atlanta.

 

Agreed, I think our defense overall played a much better game, but we did face an inferior offense this time, including a pretty bad OL.

 

I personally think he's holding back from running in the preseason.. can't have your starting QB rsiking injuries when the game doesn't even count.

 

If we grade "woulda, coulda, shoudas" and luck a lot changes for any QB throughout nfl history. Ryan played a good game to me. Wasnt perfect. He left some yards out there. He got a little lucky. But....thats football. A result is a result.

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who knows if that fumble happens if that pick happens though

 

We're talking about only 1 quarter of play here. Having a fumble lost and then throwing what probably should've been an interception in only 1 quarter of play is bad.

I know people are going to focus on the holding on that deep ball to Wallace but I think that's a red herring. It's something for the fans to get all upset about but not really something that affected the play as much as people think it did. The ball missed Wallace by a good two yards. There wasn't even an appreciable change in Wallace's speed. Wallace lost speed because he had to jerk to the right to adjust on a ball that wasn't where he hoped it would be. That was well BEFORE the freeze frame that shows the moment the DB exerted pulling force on Wallace's jersey. It's pretty much physically impossible for that tug to have cost Wallace 6 feet of speed considering he never even breaks stride. You know, cuz physics.

The reality of why that play fell incomplete is Wallace gained inside leverage on the corner and so he steered toward the numbers to maximize his advantage, while Tannehill was thinking deep fade so he's throwing toward the sidelines. Tannehill was throwing to a spot and Wallace was trying to get open against his man, and the two had a miscommunication. That's not bad luck. If the DB never tugs on Wallace's jersey that ball is still incomplete.

 

He's responsible for his decision making, not necessarily the result. He had poor decisions out there. If you're constantly grading the result and not the execution or decision-making, you're going to end up with a lot of wrong evaluations.

 

that fumble was the first play of the 2nd quarter though

 

I don't agree that it didn't break his stride at all. I've watched it over and over, of course changing direction changes your speed because you've diverted it between two directions. The ball may have been ahead of his feet by two yards but it didn't miss his outstretched arms by two yards. Also even if you figure ten yards to take about one second, its pretty obvious that without the tug he could have covered an addition maximum of two yards (and I believe it to be less).

 

First off...your reason is not mine, and vice versa, so please, besides the 1 lucky pass...where was all the luck? I don't see it.

On the pass to Sims he had a completion throwing within his capability. How is that luck dude?

Please show how that is getting "lucky in a lot of ways."

8 per game rate...sure...'cuz that's guaranteed to happen.

EVERY player that commits a turnover is on a particular per-game rate when it happens...1 T/O = 4 per game rate...does that mean they all have 4 and should be benched?

 

I can.

After watching the two games Live, I saw us unable to contain Doug Martin (4 ypc) & we had a difficult time against the Falcons. Jacquizz Rodgers had some nice gains on us too. That Doug Martin decency came off a week in which many were talking about the Bucs having the worst O-Line & OGs in football.

I thought we got better last night once we mixed and matched our LBs, with Tripp & McCain getting some looks.

 

Xbox Gold just awarded you gamer points for "Master of Pedantry"

 

i'm more of a playstation guy

 

Ah ok so two turnovers in one quarter ain't no thang. Gotcha. Noted.

 

I think you're pretty spot on with this.

I was watching the game and the roll-out kept waiting for him to hit Hartline. He even had his TE early & Wallace early if he made the quick decision. It was a nice play call and had multiple options available if the reads were right.

I'll say this in Tannehill's defense. He is able to get away with throws due to his arm strength (that throw to Sims and even that tipped to Matthews I'm not so sure it wouldn't have been fit in to Sims - would he have caught? would he have been wrecked? was it the best decision?).

But as you said, those are random plays, but are a strong correlation to those games that you leave you asking, "WTF is Tannehill doing?" (i.e. Bills x2, Jets, etc. in 2013)

 

Quit changing the subject dude...

Point is, you said, "lucky in a lot of ways" but you can't back it up. Overstated, simple as that.

But keep deflecting though...it's all good.

Edit: Where did I say two turnovers was no thang? First off there was only one, secondly the other was a possible. There's no guarantee it even gets intercepted...high probability, granted. Your whole basis there is on "ifs" and "shoulda coulda." IF Wallace didn't get derailed by some minor bumpage, we're all talking about the great TD.

 

If you look at the video Fin-D posted, you can see at 13 seconds that the grab forces him to stumble and take a half step. He had already changed direction previous to that.

Also like it was said, any turnover in one quarter of play gives you a terrible TO rate per game if extrapolated. You can't do that, it makes no sense. I'm supposed to believe that Ryan would have turned the ball over 8 times had he played the full game? That is so ridiculous it isn't even funny.

Making way too much of a preseason game.

Will Davis should/could have had an INT. Does that mean he will pick off four passes a game?

 

From a coaches standpoint, I would agree because you are charged with the constant development of your resources.A coach should always be assessing ways to improve. I think from a fan standpoint, you are setting yourself your self up for perpetual dissatisfaction. There is enough broken with our team without having to assess what didn't even happen. I just like to take small victories as they come. Ryan Tannehill isnt Tom Brady, Andrew Luck, or Russell Wilson. Id love him to be. But hes not right now and im fine with that. At least hes not Geno Smith.

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I was there too, I was very very high up had a good view of everything. Tannehill missed the TD to Hartline, NO DOUBT.

 

Yes, he got lucky in a lot of ways. He could have walked out of that game with his offense having scored no touchdowns, possibly not even having scored any field goals if the Buccaneers don't completely blow a coverage on Laron Landry. He could have walked out of there with two turnovers in only one quarter. He could have walked out of there with yet another deep miss to Wallace if the DB didn't distract everyone by tugging a bit on the jersey, which was not the reason that play went incomplete but now all the fans and media will pretend it is. Put it all together, he could have walked out of there with a borderline disastrous one quarter performance. Because that was the quality of his decision-making during the game. But he didn't, so he got lucky in a lot of ways.

 

thats a lot of ifs with not giving credit why it happened imo, that pass to landry was a nice fake to the RB and fooled the LB's completely, i would not call that blown coverage, also even mike wallace in his interview said he got hold a little on the shoulder pad and that the ball was perfect and he would have been there, he called it a great throw, we never will find out if that tipped pass would have been picked if the fumble would have happened, actually he could have loked a lot better if wallace catches that screen

 

It's these STRETCHES in particular that have me concerned. It's one thing if he has a brain fart once in a while but he has a tendency to have one and then follow up with more. He had the brain fart with the third down play where he lucked out that Matthews ran the wrong route and ended up catching a deflected ball. That's fine. Sh-t happens. But what disappointed me is he followed that up like two plays later rolling out with Hartline directly in his sight lines for what could have been a TD and he just froze on it. Kept running and eventually forced the pass to Wallace. Then he followed up with a couple more questionable decisions forcing the ball to this guy or that instead of taking what the defense gave him. Then he fumbled the ball away.

That's the thing I don't like about the decision-making, the fact they seem to come in bunches.

Nobody's convicting anyone of a crime or declaring him a bust. But I see some people here can't stand to see anything he does criticized.

 

Yeah you can definitely see it on the broadcast but I think it looked just a little bit more egregious from a bird's eye view in the stands.

Quarterbacks miss open guys. It happens. What I didn't like about it was that it came during a poor stretch for him, and I don't like that because in particular something he's been guilty of since college is having poor stretches rather than the occasional random mistake.

 

I see your point...but you got to realize you've said stuff in this thread that if anyone else had said......you'd be all over them ;p

You guys (and I'm talking both sides folks!) get way to defensive in these discussions.

Edit: By the way shouldn't we all be a hell of a lot more concerned about the running game right now. Finally get some semblance of a solid passing game.........and we can't freaking run the ball. Can we at least do both at least average?

 

After reading local media comments this morning, which I take with a grain of salt, can we still say McCain, Tripp, Anthony Johnson, and Fede have made this roster? I don't want to see Freeny on the roster and McCain taken off waivers, or keeping Francis when Johnson has outperformed him, or listening to some dumb a** comment from Hickey about how they believed they could get any one of these guys on the practice squad.

 

Wow...not buying it, sorry. And he DID walk out of that game with his offense having scored no touchdowns...did we watch the same game? And a blown coverage? Really dude? Do those not happen all the time? Whole game must be all luck.

Too many "ifs" that are a normal part of the game for me. So he's lucky he had an incompletion to Wallace? The contact slowed him down, it's evident on the film, too bad we'll never know what would've happened if it'd been clean coverage.

He coulda been carted off the field with a tri-injury to his knee...all kindsa lucky.